Are professional sports predetermined?

Hello, all.

As an observer of ATS for a couple of years now, I figured it was time for a membership to voice some opinions/viewpoints that I have had for awhile. While this is my first thread, it will by no means be my last. To get right to it...

I'm sitting at home in California watching the Patriots/Jets divisional playoff game and it got me to thinking about the timing of some recent sports championships. Specifically, the New England Patriots right after 9/11. How about New Orleans Saints right after Katrina. The New York Yankees after 9/11. This is just to name a couple. It seems that when this country has some kind of tragedy or event, our sports team for the affected region rises to the occasion. Like it's a script from Hollywood, it would appear that everyone loves a comeback.

Let's face it, it could be pure coincidence but as this site preaches, deny ignorance.

ShawnJ

honestly i could believe it because earlier today during the highlights of the game the wrong clip was showed and the clip was of the jets and the steelers and the jets are winning there game so far and the steelers won there game so the jets n steelers will play next week i found it very weird 0_O

reply to post by darkpassenger23


I thought the Steelers lost?

oops, no, you're right. wishful thinking on my part I guess

but..go Jets!

oh and for the record, I think fight fixing may go on occasionally. And we all know that refs can be crooked as *snip*, but as for a whole pro sports team throwing a game?, hasn't happened that I know of in 90+ yrs

reply to post by Electric Crown


No, they beat Baltimore yesterday. It's just one of those things that has always seemed a little to obvious...I mean think about it, how much money could one make if they knew these things? Why wouldn't tptb orchestrate these things? They would.

Originally posted by ShawnJ
reply to post by Electric Crown

 

No, they beat Baltimore yesterday. It's just one of those things that has always seemed a little to obvious...I mean think about it, how much money could one make if they knew these things? Why wouldn't tptb orchestrate these things? They would.

yeah but I think that if it does happen nowadays then it has to be between the refs, the owners and the bookies.

I mean, I don't think the Pats would've thrown away a perfect season on purpose do you?

I have known a couple of "bookmakers" in Indianapolis who were unrelated and both were successful and I asked them what was the secret to picking winners. They both said know people on the inside. I said oh like get injury reports etc? Both said same thing no! Know who decides the winners. They said its all an entertainment racket. I have a hard time believing its all controlled. I mean wouldn't that have sold more books for Jose Canseco than who is banging 'roids? Having said that I have often wondered the exact same thing, though.

i have been thinking about sports and there role within in society alot at the moment but have always struggled to put down something which appears so simple to me in my mind by here go's

i can only talk about sports in the uk as that is where i am from and what i know, i don't believe sport is predetermined (apart from a few fixers) it has to be up to the individual teams to win otherwise people would lose interest.

The real reasons that sports are so popular is to control the masses, its the biggest distraction of all, think about what do the majority of people talk about it's sport wether it be football, cricket,rugby etc while people are talking about their local team they aren't talking about increased taxes, wars etc well if this the case then why don't football season go on all year round. because the break in the season allows the public to be whipped up into a feverpitch (pun intended) who's going where whos going up whos going down etc this is the way they keep interest so now you have heavily taxed repressed people with nothing to look forward but their team winning which compounds the situation so these people now tell their children to be good at sport so they can have flash cars and nice houses etc instead of learnig at school and getting a real job (nothing against athletes) have you also noticed how dividing sport is in england you will literaly be killed if you walk into a pub with the wrong team strip on

sorry if that is confusing i am still getting the angles down in my head and plan on doing a thread on this

reply to post by ShawnJ


I have always thought there was a possibility. It's there for your entertainment. It's a huge cash cow. If it wasn't exciting, people wouldn't watch. I would say follow the money and judge from there.

Maybe sometimes.. but think about it.. if a 'fixed' game is tied with 2 minutes left (talking nfl) the qb still has to make a great throw, and the receiver has to make the catch. or, if it is nba, a buzzer beater still has to be made. these things may be easy for pros but under pressure they are very difficult. what about mixed martial arts? the actual fighting itself may not be fixed but the judging may be, in some situations.

I think they are predetermined because a team that goes to the Playoffs brings in so much more money for their city, and that can mean alot in this economy. Take a look at the last 10 years and notice how the Playoffs and such does make their rounds to a whole bunch of different cities.

The incident that made me 100% sure that at least some of it is scripted was the whole Curt Schilling bloody sock fiasco. I unfortunately have a very painful life and when I saw Curt's sock "bloody" I was the first to say, "That ain't real blood." The truth came out a few years after in someone's book (I forgot who at the moment).

I would say that yes, things are scripted for ratings, there's no doubt about that. Just think of how Schilling's bloody sock was the talk of the town for days on end.

I think alot of things are scripted, not just sports -like 99% of all of those "reality" shows are scripted --especially all of the paranormal ones. Notice how they ALWAYS film in the dark. They do that because it's more scary than filming in the daytime. I mean how stupid do they think the viewers are? Like ghosts only come out at night time. Yeah, ok. By the way, a couple producers of a paranormal show did in fact say they're fake --they have to rely on the viewers fear of the dark to make the show work.

So, you peel an onion and you see the layers, in all of their fake glory. Although, I'd love to see some of the cashola they rake in from all of that glory.

It's sad because if they would just leave well enough alone they'd soon realize that life itself will write the best blockbuster of all time.

One other thing I just remembered...I watched someone interview Bob Costas, and I remember him saying something to the effect that he left news broadcasting to join the sports journalism world because it was one of the last places where the truth can't be spun. Basically it was what you see is what you get and I guess he sleeps at night. I think sometimes or for the most part people like sports for that very reason. Politicians leave a bad taste in our mouths and everybody everywhere is getting real sick of the lies and their "PR" tactics and sports gvies a us a straightforward break from the filth of news and politics. I knew Dwight Freeney in Indy well and he was a very standup guy with a very faithbased lifestyle i cant imagine him never giving it his all for a genuine win. IMHO

Originally posted by OneNationUnder
I think they are predetermined because a team that goes to the Playoffs brings in so much more money for their city, and that can mean alot in this economy. Take a look at the last 10 years and notice how the Playoffs and such does make their rounds to a whole bunch of different cities.

The incident that made me 100% sure that at least some of it is scripted was the whole Curt Schilling bloody sock fiasco. I unfortunately have a very painful life and when I saw Curt's sock "bloody" I was the first to say, "That ain't real blood." The truth came out a few years after in someone's book (I forgot who at the moment).

I would say that yes, things are scripted for ratings, there's no doubt about that. Just think of how Schilling's bloody sock was the talk of the town for days on end.

I think alot of things are scripted, not just sports -like 99% of all of those "reality" shows are scripted --especially all of the paranormal ones. Notice how they ALWAYS film in the dark. They do that because it's more scary than filming in the daytime. I mean how stupid do they think the viewers are? Like ghosts only come out at night time. Yeah, ok. By the way, a couple producers of a paranormal show did in fact say they're fake --they have to rely on the viewers fear of the dark to make the show work.

So, you peel an onion and you see the layers, in all of their fake glory. Although, I'd love to see some of the cashola they rake in from all of that glory.

It's sad because if they would just leave well enough alone they'd soon realize that life itself will write the best blockbuster of all time.

how do u script live events though? yeah, WWE can be scripted because there is no real time limit, so if one makes an error it can be covered.. but if the lakers are 'supposed' to win in the final seconds with a 3 pointer and he (kobe) misses then what? A GOOD 3 point shooter shoots barely above 50% at best.

reply to post by ReadyPower


It's more about giving a team a chance to win, I would say. Methodical steps in a game that paves the way for victory. You will never be able to get 100% assurance that a team will win but if a certain team is given opportunities, the likeliness of a victory increases exponentially.

dude.dude.dude

Oh my how I've been waiting for someone else to bring this up.. I really know it in my gut.

for years (age 13-32) i was a fanatic for football and basketball college and pro alike.. fantasy pools, betting pools at work, jerseys, typical dude stuff.. then it happened!!! seriously, i know this sounds like a setup but its not..

the game that did it was when the Seahawks played in the super bowl.. it was so obvious please watch it somewhere and you'll definitely see it..
then it clicked.. Madden and all the others people routinely say "holding happens on every play" i wish i had a dollar every time i heard this on sundays, thursdays, and mondays.. you gotta know what i mean..
then watch the Seahawks superbowl. every big play was called back for petty calls..Holmgren even said something about it..

dude I haven't been ab;e to watch sports since, and now i say thank god for opening my eyes ans closing my wallet.. that game was so in your face a sham the most blatant example i ever saw.

reply to post by rebeldog

I'm going to agree with you about the holding calls, not specifically on the Seahawks superbowl game (I did see it), but in all football games. It really does appear that the refs decide how often and on which team and play they will throw the flag for holding. Speculation on whether it has anything to do with the line on the game, or the momentum carried by one team and the refs getting caught up in it, or the refs having a personal dislike of certain players or teams or coaches, or they have been bribed, really opens it up for debate.

Last year after the superbowl, I watched a replay of the coaches and players miked during the game. I remember how it stood out to me that the refs told the coaches 'we are just going to let your teams play the game'. There really weren't too many flags thrown in that game.

So I have to say that these refs are a big factor in the outcome of football games.

reply to post by ShawnJ


the other GLARING EXAMPLE!!!!! i just remembered..

the sixers/lakers final!!! game one iverson was killing the lakers and shockingly won.. then tyroone lue was put on him.. look closely you will see how he had a hold of iversons jersey almost nonstop the entire series. he committed at least 40 uncalled fouls every game..

i was a in the Coast Guard at the time and our telecom/comms guys replayed game 2 aND WE COUNTED 40 SOMETHING fouls just by tyronne lue against iverson...

reply to post by ShawnJ


If you microwave someone, they will be able to run less efficent, and get tried easy. None of you people know, microwaving someone will make it harder for them to breath and be efficent in running, that is needed in football.

I think alex ferguson(man utd) and mourinho(real madrid) do this at home games on away dressing rooms.

Just imagine being goal keeper and your brain is scrambled, how do you think in goal, with that weapon being used on you?

I think that some are, but probably the minority of them. As other have mentioned, boxing or mma would probably be the easiest to fix out of the recognized sports.

Of course, "pro wrestling" is predetermined about 99.9999% of the time.

reply to post by Frogs


I think every team in the english premier league is using non lethel weapons to stop there opponants. Every club in the el, uses weapons on each other i reckon. The money involved and the weapons are quite cheap and all clubs must know police and military people that know about such stuff.

I never watch mma, boxing, or ufc as these should be banned, so i have no clue on them. Why humans watch stuff like that is amazing to me.

If it happened the same year I could see it. But it was a few years before the Saints one. Most major cities are gonna have major events. The chances of their team winning are pretty good. Just coincidence and nothing more.