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How can the IRS legally assume the collection for a mortgage lender???

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posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:05 PM
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without going into specifics:

I just got a letter from the IRS which demanded
payment for the remaining balance of what was
left owed on my house repossession.

Since when is the IRS a collecting agency
for repossessed home mortgages ???

Well I guess since I don't have any real property
for them to take. I guess I'll be heading off to
that FEMA Camp rather shortly. boondock saint
will be a prisoner just cuz he lost his health and
became disabled and couldn't pay his home mortgage.
What a [snip] up system we have.

I would like to get mail from you guys here at ATS.
Please keep me updated on current events.
Will have to get used to a prison cell I guess.

best wishes if I no longer get to post on ATS.

and NO I'm not planning on going off the deep end
and doing something stupid or mentally unstable.
Actually being in prison might be a good thing,
I will have access to healthcare I do not have
at present.




posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:14 PM
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that's right folks

I no longer owe the mortgage lender

I owe the IRS

that's funny cuz I never remember signing
any paperwork for a loan from the IRS.



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:17 PM
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Because the IRS is merely the US collection arm of the international banking cartel. It IS the bank you owe.



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:19 PM
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Originally posted by erumisato
Because the IRS is merely the US collection arm of the international banking cartel. It IS the bank you owe.

the mortgage lender is not even
mentioned in this letter.



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:32 PM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


if you can explain more maby we
can help
do you owe the irs?
xploder



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:37 PM
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Originally posted by XPLodER
reply to post by boondock-saint
 


if you can explain more maby we
can help
do you owe the irs?
xploder

No, I do not owe the IRS anything.
I file my taxes every year and most yrs
get a refund back.

The amount owed on this letter from the
IRS is exactly the same amount that the
mortgage lender sent me a few months ago.

The demand for payment a few months ago
came from the mortgage lender. The one I got
today came from the IRS. Both for the same
amount. So my question is how did the IRS
get involved? Did they buy off the bad debt
from the mortgage lender?

what else do u want to know?



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:42 PM
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Sounds more like you need a tax attorney.



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:42 PM
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Make sure it is legitimate.
If necessary call the IRS.
It might be a scam letter
that only looks like it is
from the IRS.



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:45 PM
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Originally posted by boondock-saint
without going into specifics:

and NO I'm not planning on going off the deep end
and doing something stupid or mentally unstable.
Actually being in prison might be a good thing,
I will have access to healthcare I do not have
at present.


I understand your point but fail to realize how defense of one's property could be considered stupid and/or mentally unstable....especially when the IRS is involved. Then again, my thought processes revolve around liberty rather than serfdom. (As do yours based on my recollection of your posts)

I do understand where you are coming from so please don't take my comments as flippant nor as derogatory. I'm guessing that I am within four months of your situation...

An offshore corporation (IRS) acting on behest of an offshore bank (Federal Reserve) with the illusion that both are government entities should be shown for the fraud that they are but may not be done so in the short term. Rest assured, eventually their fraud will see the light of day.

I trust things will work out for you since I enjoy your posts and would miss reading them.

Since we both live in NC, maybe we will touch base one day.


edit on 16-1-2011 by bozzchem because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:45 PM
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Originally posted by Neopan100
Sounds more like you need a tax attorney.

tax attorney???
this has nothing to do with taxes.
this is a mortgage repossession
and the remaining balance owed
after the house was repossessed.



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:47 PM
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Originally posted by bozzchem
I trust things will work out for you since I enjoy your posts and would miss reading them.

well that is really kind to say. thanks
u made me smile



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:50 PM
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Originally posted by bozzchem
Since we both live in NC, maybe we will touch base one day.

I'm over near the coast
bout half way between Bragg
and Myrtle Beach.



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:53 PM
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Give this place a look and see if they can help.

I can't speak for them personally but I will certainly contact them prior to my other options.

Free to Prosper



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:54 PM
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Originally posted by boondock-saint

Originally posted by bozzchem
Since we both live in NC, maybe we will touch base one day.

I'm over near the coast
bout half way between Bragg
and Myrtle Beach.


I'm north of Raleigh so we're probably about 3 hours apart based on what you've stated. Depending on if I'm on my bike or in my car determines the time it takes me to reach the coast.

Either way, U2U me if there is anything I can do to help....if there is...I will.
edit on 16-1-2011 by bozzchem because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 03:57 PM
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Originally posted by mike_trivisonno
Make sure it is legitimate.
If necessary call the IRS.
It might be a scam letter
that only looks like it is
from the IRS.

its weird u mention that.
the phone number listed
on that letter was 888-552-3897.
I did an internet search for that
number and came up empty.
The letter came from a Dallas Tx
address and I could not find an IRS
location in Dallas TX.

Is this a scam letter by the
mortgage lender ???
they are the only ones
who knew how much the
mortgage was ???????



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 04:00 PM
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Originally posted by bozzchem
Either way, U2U me if there is anything I can do to help....if there is...I will.

thanks bro
but nothing right now



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 04:02 PM
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Something stinks and I did my sock laundry yesterday. Call IRS and verify if this is an authentic notice. If so, don't argue. Thank them, and immediately start screaming to the media.

The IRS acting as a collection agent for a private corp is ten kinds of shady.


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 04:03 PM
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Originally posted by boondock-saint

Originally posted by bozzchem
Either way, U2U me if there is anything I can do to help....if there is...I will.

thanks bro
but nothing right now


I understand.

S/F hoping your post gets the attention it deserves.

If you need anything...let me know and I'll see what I can do.



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 04:08 PM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


You may want to read this link for more info which I found in a google search:

www.irs.gov...=174034,00.html
or here if the link doesn't work:

"Home Foreclosure and Debt Cancellation"

Update Dec. 11, 2008 — The Mortgage Forgiveness Debt Relief Act of 2007 generally allows taxpayers to exclude income from the discharge of debt on their principal residence. Debt reduced through mortgage restructuring, as well as mortgage debt forgiven in connection with a foreclosure, qualify for this relief.

This provision applies to debt forgiven in calendar years 2007 through 2012. Up to $2 million of forgiven debt is eligible for this exclusion ($1 million if married filing separately). The exclusion doesn’t apply if the discharge is due to services performed for the lender or any other reason not directly related to a decline in the home’s value or the taxpayer’s financial condition.

The amount excluded reduces the taxpayer’s cost basis in the home. More details. Further information, including detailed examples, can also be found in Publication 4681, Canceled Debts, Foreclosures, Repossessions, and Abandonments.

The questions and answers, below, are based on the law prior to the passage of the Mortgage Forgiveness Debt Relief Act of 2007.

1. What is Cancellation of Debt?

If you borrow money from a commercial lender and the lender later cancels or forgives the debt, you may have to include the cancelled amount in income for tax purposes, depending on the circumstances. When you borrowed the money you were not required to include the loan proceeds in income because you had an obligation to repay the lender. When that obligation is subsequently forgiven, the amount you received as loan proceeds is reportable as income because you no longer have an obligation to repay the lender. The lender is usually required to report the amount of the canceled debt to you and the IRS on a Form 1099-C, Cancellation of Debt.

Here’s a very simplified example. You borrow $10,000 and default on the loan after paying back $2,000. If the lender is unable to collect the remaining debt from you, there is a cancellation of debt of $8,000, which generally is taxable income to you.


2. Is Cancellation of Debt income always taxable?

Not always. There are some exceptions. The most common situations when cancellation of debt income is not taxable involve:

Bankruptcy: Debts discharged through bankruptcy are not considered taxable income.
Insolvency: If you are insolvent when the debt is cancelled, some or all of the cancelled debt may not be taxable to you.You are insolvent when your total debts are more than the fair market value of your total assets.Insolvency can be fairly complex to determine and the assistance of a tax professional is recommended if you believe you qualify for this exception.
Certain farm debts:If you incurred the debt directly in operation of a farm, more than half your income from the prior three years was from farming, and the loan was owed to a person or agency regularly engaged in lending, your cancelled debt is generally not considered taxable income.The rules applicable to farmers are complex and the assistance of a tax professional is recommended if you believe you qualify for this exception.
Non-recourse loans:A non-recourse loan is a loan for which the lender’s only remedy in case of default is to repossess the property being financed or used as collateral.That is, the lender cannot pursue you personally in case of default.Forgiveness of a non-recourse loan resulting from a foreclosure does not result in cancellation of debt income.However, it may result in other tax consequences, as discussed in Question 3 below.


3. I lost my home through foreclosure. Are there tax consequences?

There are two possible consequences you must consider:

Taxable cancellation of debt income.(Note: As stated above, cancellation of debt income is not taxable in the case of non-recourse loans.)
A reportable gain from the disposition of the home (because foreclosures are treated like sales for tax purposes).(Note: Often some or all of the gain from the sale of a personal residence qualifies for exclusion from income.)
Use the following steps to compute the income to be reported from a foreclosure:

Step 1 - Figuring Cancellation of Debt Income (Note: For non-recourse loans, skip this section. You have no income from cancellation of debt.)

1. Enter the total amount of the debt immediately prior to the foreclosure.___________
2. Enter the fair market value of the property from Form 1099-C, box 7. ___________
3. Subtract line 2 from line 1.If less than zero, enter zero.___________


The amount on line 3 will generally equal the amount shown in box 2 of Form 1099-C. This amount is taxable unless you meet one of the exceptions in question 2. Enter it on line 21, Other Income, of your Form 1040.

Step 2 – Figuring Gain from Foreclosure

4. Enter the fair market value of the property foreclosed.For non-recourse loans, enter the amount of the debt immediately prior to the foreclosure ________
5. Enter your adjusted basis in the property.(Usually your purchase price plus the cost of any major improvements.) ____________
6. Subtract line 5 from line 4. If less than zero, enter zero.

The amount on line 6 is your gain from the foreclosure of your home. If you have owned and used the home as your principal residence for periods totaling at least two years during the five year period ending on the date of the foreclosure, you may exclude up to $250,000 (up to $500,000 for married couples filing a joint return) from income. If you do not qualify for this exclusion, or your gain exceeds $250,000 ($500,000 for married couples filing a joint return), report the taxable amount on Schedule D, Capital Gains and Losses.



4. I lost money on the foreclosure of my home. Can I claim a loss on my tax return?

No. Losses from the sale or foreclosure of personal property are not deductible.


5. Can you provide examples?

A borrower bought a home in August 2005 and lived in it until it was taken through foreclosure in September 2007. The original purchase price was $170,000, the home is worth $200,000 at foreclosure, and the mortgage debt canceled at foreclosure is $220,000. At the time of the foreclosure, the borrower is insolvent, with liabilities (mortgage, credit cards, car loans and other debts) totaling $250,000 and assets totaling $230,000.

The borrower figures income from the foreclosure as follows:

Use the following steps to compute the income to be reported from a foreclosure:

Step 1 - Figuring Cancellation of Debt Income (Note: For non-recourse loans, skip this section. You have no income from cancellation of debt.)

1. Enter the total amount of the debt immediately prior to the foreclosure.___$220,000__
2. Enter the fair market value of the property from Form 1099-C, box 7. ___$200,000__
3. Subtract line 2 from line 1.If less than zero, enter zero.___$20,000__

The amount on line 3 will generally equal the amount shown in box 2 of Form 1099-C. This amount is taxable unless you meet one of the exceptions in question 2. Enter it on line 21, Other Income, of your Form 1040.

Step 2 – Figuring Gain from Foreclosure

4. Enter the fair market value of the property foreclosed.For non-recourse loans, enter the amount of the debt immediately prior to the foreclosure. __$200,000__
5. Enter your adjusted basis in the property.(Usually your purchase price plus the cost of any major improvements.) ___$170,000__
6. Subtract line 5 from line 4.If less than zero, enter zero.___$30,000__


The amount on line 6 is your gain from the foreclosure of your home. If you have owned and used the home as your principal residence for periods totaling at least two years during the five year period ending on the date of the foreclosure, you may exclude up to $250,000 (up to $500,000 for married couples filing a joint return) from income. If you do not qualify for this exclusion, or your gain exceeds $250,000 ($500,000 for married couples filing a joint return), report the taxable amount on Schedule D, Capital Gains and Losses.

In this situation, the borrower has a tax-free home-sale gain of $30,000 ($200,000 minus $170,000), because they owned and lived in their home as a principal residence for at least two years. Ordinarily, the borrower would also have taxable debt-forgiveness income of $20,000 ($220,000 minus $200,000). But since the borrower’s liabilities exceed assets by $20,000 ($250,000 minus $230,000) there is no tax on the canceled debt.

Other examples can be found in IRS Publication 544, Sales and Other Dispositions of Assets, under the section “Foreclosures and Repossessions”.



6. I don’t agree with the information on the Form 1099-C. What should I do?

Contact the lender. The lender should issue a corrected form if the information is determined to be incorrect. Retain all records related to the purchase of your home and all related debt.



7. I received a notice from the IRS on this. What should I do?

The IRS urges borrowers with questions to call the phone number shown on the notice. The IRS also urges borrowers who wind up owing additional tax and are unable to pay it in full to use the installment agreement form, normally included with the notice, to request a payment agreement with the agency.





In some cases, you may qualify for free or low-cost assistance from a Low Income Taxpayer Clinic (LITC). LITCs are independent organizations that represent low income taxpayers in tax disputes with the IRS. Find information on an LITCs in your area.





edit on 16-1-2011 by manta78 because: (no reason given)

edit on 16-1-2011 by manta78 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 04:10 PM
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Originally posted by netwarrior
Something stinks and I did my sock laundry yesterday. Call IRS and verify if this is an authentic notice. If so, don't argue. Thank them, and immediately start screaming to the media.

The IRS acting as a collection agent for a private corp is ten kinds of shady.


best I can figure right now it's one of 2 scenarios.

1) The mortgage lender sold out the remaining mortgage debt
to the IRS or a government entity. Which stinks to high heaven.

2) It is a scam by the mortgage lender to scare me into
paying off this debt whereas they just make it look like
a letter from the IRS. Which in my opinion is fraud
on the part of the mortgage lender.



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