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Was Zeus a bigamist?

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posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 12:33 PM
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Am I the only one that has ever tried to draw the line between the cave Zeus came out of, the cave involved in the worship of Mithra, and Plato's cave?




posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by Havick007
reply to post by WalterRatlos
 


Waaaiit a sec, i stopped readin as soon as you contradicted yourself....

You said and i quote '' i am not talking about the mythical God Zeus, but i am talking about the Mythical God Zeus....

Sorry i'm confused, look i'm not trying to put ur thread down but i dont get the point of this thread. Instead of going through the bushes and making us confused just come and say your thoughts.. yeah


What is your premise, your thoery and your conclusion?

Read again, and you may find that I said and I quote:

No, I am not talking about the mythical God, Zues; I am talking about the mythical God, Zeus, however.

So, Zues was a spelling error, so I thought I would mentioned that I am not talking about Zues, but about Zeus. Still mythical, of course. See, you must not have even noticed your spelling error, because now you quote me using the correct spelling for Zeus. Ok, nevermind move on, nothing to see here.
As to the purpose or the point of this thread, I think I already stated it perfectly clear; to discuss something of interest to me with fellow humans who might also interested to discuss this matter. My premise is: As we all know Zeus was married to his sister Hera. My question regarding this is: it is also well-known that according to the Oracle of Dodoni, in North-Western Greece, which was the oldest oracle in ancient Greece, he was married to the goddess Dione (or Dioni) and they were said to live in the roots of the sacred oak tree there. So, was Zeus a bigamist? My conclusion: I haven't reached it yet, but sofar I have learnt a lot of things, like Hera was his 7th wife, however Dione is nowhere listed under the previous six. So, yeah, he was a bigamist. There is of course a quite simple explanation that the invading Greek tribes just took over the place from the Pelasgians who used to worship the goddess there and to facilitate the assimilation process they just married the Pelasgians' goddess to their chief God and christened her Dione in the process. It's just a local, minor change to religious tradition, albeit an interesting one.



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 12:42 PM
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Originally posted by hadriana
Am I the only one that has ever tried to draw the line between the cave Zeus came out of, the cave involved in the worship of Mithra, and Plato's cave?

Probably not, but it's news to me anyway. I don't know much about Mithra except that his followers had a rival religion during the times of the first Christians. And I haven't read Plato's cave nor do I know what it is about generally. The cave Zeus came out of hiding was either on Crete or some place in Asia Minor.



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 12:51 PM
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Originally posted by WalterRatlos
I suppose Khemetians are the ancient Egypts during the Hellenistic rule?


Khemet was the name of "Egypt" before Khemet was overrun by foreign peoples.



Originally posted by WalterRatlos
And I am kind of offended that you suggest that the ancient Greeks during the Hellenistic period were degenerating or that their successors eventually did. I'm not sure what you are talking about here, but if you mean the conquest, it was the work of amilitary genius, namely Alexander the Great, King of Macedons, and among his teachers was the philosopher Aristotle.


The Greeks obviously ended up eventually degenerating, as things like violence and homosexuality started to become the "norm" there.

Anyhow, Aristotle was an Initiate and his writings are good, although I doubt that Aristotle ever surpassed Pythagoras and Plato (for more on this topic, see the writings of Thomas Taylor). And Alexander the "Great" apparently was an Initiate at one time as well. But unfortunately Alexander (Sikander) let his pride get the best of him and he ended up falling into a state of barbarism:




"Many centuries afterward the Emerald was discovered--according to one version, by an Arabian initiate; according to another, by Alexander the Great, King of Macedon. By means of the power of this Emerald, upon which were the mysterious inscriptions of the Thrice Great Hermes--thirteen sentences in all--Alexander conquered all the then known world.

"Not having conquered himself, however, he ultimately failed.

"Regardless of his glory and power, the prophecies of the talking trees were fulfilled, and Alexander was cut down in the midst of his triumph."

- The Secret Teachings of All Ages by Manly P. Hall 33º


"So, a simple man like Diogenes who lived in a barrel even threw out Alexander the Great."

- Treatise of Revolutionary Psychology by Samael Aun Weor




Originally posted by WalterRatlos
What Occult Thruths?


See the Orphic Mysteries referred to in my first post in this thread.

The Thunderbolt of Zeus would be related to the Vajra of Indra in the Hindu and Buddhist teachings.

Anyway, in which books is it written that the Eleusinian Mysteries were a "scam"?



edit on 17-1-2011 by Tamahu because: edited quote



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 01:08 PM
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Originally posted by hadriana
Am I the only one that has ever tried to draw the line between the cave Zeus came out of, the cave involved in the worship of Mithra, and Plato's cave?



Such an idea is worthy of reflection.



Plato: The Allegory of the Cave


The above link that I've posted earlier in this thread–which contains references to the works of the British Platonist Thomas Taylor–explains Plato's Allegory of the Cave in relation to the Four States of Consciousness:



Eikasia, Pistis, Dianoia, and Nous.




edit on 17-1-2011 by Tamahu because: edited text



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 01:32 PM
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Originally posted by WalterRatlos

Originally posted by hadriana
Am I the only one that has ever tried to draw the line between the cave Zeus came out of, the cave involved in the worship of Mithra, and Plato's cave?

Probably not, but it's news to me anyway. I don't know much about Mithra except that his followers had a rival religion during the times of the first Christians. And I haven't read Plato's cave nor do I know what it is about generally. The cave Zeus came out of hiding was either on Crete or some place in Asia Minor.


Well those two - the cave that Zeus was hidden away in, and Plato's cave, HAVE been connected by the ancient Greeks. No one much talks about that anymore.

There's this idea, in all of them, that one is born into darkness IN the earth, and that when one 'matures' in some way - for Zeus, physically, for Plato's cavedwellers it was more an intellectual enlightenment, and for the followers of Mithra it was part of their initiation in which they gained access to the mysteries. There's so much smbolism in each - the idea of being born in the earth and nurtured in the womb that is the earth, but, that when one is ready, one CAN step into the light, and 'come into their own'...'meet their destiny'...'evolve.'



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 01:43 PM
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Originally posted by Tamahu
Khemet was the name of "Egypt" before Khemet was overrun by foreign peoples.

Ok, thanks for clarifying that.

Originally posted by Tamahu
The Greeks obviously ended up eventually degenerating, as things like violence and homosexuality started to become the "norm" there.

That is a strange view you have there! Homosexuality or better said bisexuality was always in high demand in Greece even during the height of it's glory or even especially then. I could agree that violence is a degenerating factor, in the sense that if you resort always to violence to solve a problem you degenerate to a lower state of existence, nearer to the animal kingdom (not that man has any right to exclude himself from the animal kingdom, as Freud said quite eloquently.), but homosexuality is natural; it is natural even among our cousins from the ape family. No, what happened is that the Greeks did not degenerate, they were just conquered by a superior nation, Rome. The same way that they had conquered Egypt.

Originally posted by Tamahu
Anyhow, Aristotle was an Initiate and his writings are good, although I doubt that Aristotle ever surpassed Pythagoras and Plato (for more on this topic, see the writings of Thomas Taylor). And Alexander the "Great" apparently was an Initiate at one time as well. But unfortunately Alexander let his pride get the best of him and he ended up falling into a state of barbarism:

Aristotle was an Initiate of whom, where and when? Well, Pythagoras was more of mathematician and music scientist, but if someone was an Inititiate it was him. He initiated his pupils and forbid them to talk about his philosophy in public. Plato was, like Aristotle, a pupil of Socrates. Socrates was a follower of the oral tradition, meaning he never wrote anything down, but his pupils did, mostly Plato. They were both worthy successors to Socrates.

I am not sure about Alexander himself, but his mother was an initiate and high-priestess of a mystery cult somewhere on an Island in the Northern Agean See. No, he did not fall into barbarism, unless you want to argue that war is barbarism which is fine by me; his campaigns and his effort to forge a new nation through assimilation of all conquered people with the ruling Macedonians and Greeks are a testament to that. He either died of natural courses or he was murdered, because the generals were sick and tired of marching, killing and looting. Interestingly enough, it is rumored that his mother provided the gift for the deed. They wanted to divide what they had already conquered and retire to enjoy life again. It is rumored that after the ill-fated campaign to India, where his army had to face Elephants for the first time and did not fare that well against them, he had plans to turn north towards today Russia.

Originally posted by Tamahu

"Many centuries afterward the Emerald was discovered--according to one version, by an Arabian initiate; according to another, by Alexander the Great, King of Macedon. By means of the power of this Emerald, upon which were the mysterious inscriptions of the Thrice Great Hermes--thirteen sentences in all--Alexander conquered all the then known world.

Nice myth, but absolutely no basis in reality whatsoever. Alexander the Great conquered the world through his military genius and by brute force and due to superior weapons and superior weapons training and strategy (the phalanx, was a superb strategy that survived for 300 years, till the Romans came along with even more superior strategies, weapons and weapons training.)

Originally posted by Tamahu

"Not having conquered himself, however, he ultimately failed.

"Regardless of his glory and power, the prophecies of the talking trees were fulfilled, and Alexander was cut down in the midst of his triumph." - The Secret Teachings of All Ages by Manly P. Hall 33º

I don't know of any talking trees prophecies concerning Alexander. I know of the Gordian Knot however and the prophecy that whoever could loosen it would rule Asia. Alexander undid the knot with a swing of his sword. The same way he conquered almost the whole known world back then. I like that one better: nice moral, if you cannot solve a problem with your brain, just hack through it. That was sarcasm by the way.

Originally posted by Tamahu

"A humble man like Diogenes threw out Alexander the Great.

"This is something that not everyone can do; is it not so?" - Treatise of Revolutionary Psychology by Samael Aun Weor

Amazing aint it? Diogenes is my favorite philosopher, founder of the Cynical school. And contrary to the story with the Emerald Tablet, it is quite propable that it happened that way.

Originally posted by Tamahu
The Thunderbolt of Zeus would be related to the Vajra of Indra in the Hindu and Buddhist teachings.
Also, in which books is it written that the Eleusinian Mysteries were a "scam"?

Could be, but according to mythology his bolts were made either by Hephaestus or one of the Titans. That they were a scam, is my personal interpretation. It is well documented however that the things I described did indeed happen that way. Wouldn't you say, that if I let you fast for days, which already weakens the body, then subject you to hallucinogenic substances and then lead you through a maze where statues of Gods and deceased people are appearing in the mist via hydraulic mechanisms, that it is an elaborate religious scam? As for an exact source, I have one in mind, but I have no idea if I can find it, because all my books are packed up in cartons and packed away. Anyway, it was a book by a German scientist writing about Cannabis and there were some chapters in there dedicated to the use during ancient times for recreational and mystical/religious purposes. He states that they have found both at the Oracle of Delphi and in the Mysterie of Eleusis ruins Cannabis residues and corns. I'll see if I can find it one of these days, but you have to understand that I am not very fond of going through numerous cartons right now just to find that book.
edit on 17/1/2011 by WalterRatlos because: Grammar and spelling

edit on 17/1/2011 by WalterRatlos because: Grammar and spelling



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:00 PM
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Originally posted by hadriana
Well those two - the cave that Zeus was hidden away in, and Plato's cave, HAVE been connected by the ancient Greeks. No one much talks about that anymore.

Please, do tell, how did the ancient Greeks connect them? IMHO, there is a decisive difference in the cave Zeus was brought up: it was his hideout and his refuge to escape being devoured by his father Cronos. I'm really not sure right now, but I believe the myth states that he was spirited there to be hidden not born there. I could be wrong though.

Originally posted by hadriana
There's this idea, in all of them, that one is born into darkness IN the earth, and that when one 'matures' in some way - for Zeus, physically, for Plato's cavedwellers it was more an intellectual enlightenment, and for the followers of Mithra it was part of their initiation in which they gained access to the mysteries. There's so much smbolism in each - the idea of being born in the earth and nurtured in the womb that is the earth, but, that when one is ready, one CAN step into the light, and 'come into their own'...'meet their destiny'...'evolve.'

Well, Zeus was definitely not born in darkness in the earth, if he was born on mount Olympus, seat of the Olympian Gods. And he would not need to achieve intellectual enlightenment; he was a God. For Zeus, the cave was hideout for a while until the time cane to overthrow the cruel father.
edit on 17/1/2011 by WalterRatlos because: Grammar and spelling



posted on Jan, 20 2011 @ 07:07 AM
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Originally posted by Tamahu
Anyway, in which books is it written that the Eleusinian Mysteries were a "scam"?

Hans-Georg Behr: Von Hanf ist die Rede: Kultur und Politik einer Droge (Talking about Hemp: Culture and politics of a drug) It has a chapter on the history of the drug and mentions both use in the Delphi Oracle and during the Eleusis Mysteries.



posted on Feb, 2 2011 @ 01:04 PM
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I'd intended on replying here a long time ago, and then got sidetracked and forgot about this thread for a while.... Anyway I can only address a couple things for now, however I would like to post here again sometime soon as to address other points you've brought up.


reply to post by WalterRatlos
 


As interesting as that book might be, what makes you believe that the author has reconstructed an accurate enough account of the Eleusinian Mysteries in order for his book to be worthy enough of basing an overall conclusion on it?

And about the homosexuality thing, let's keep in mind that the Initiatic Schools are here to teach us how go beyond our animal nature. It might be "natural" for apes to use their sexual energy in an erratic manner, but a Human Being is one who controls their sexual energy. Controlling one's sexual energy is not to be confused with suppression, the latter of which is taught by the Roman Catholic church.

Transmutation is the Key for entering real Initiation. And when we study Alchemy and Kabbalah, we can see that the Greeks (meaning the ones who were Adepts of Suprasexuality), encoded this into their mythologies.


This is why a Gnostic Instructor once said:


"We do not follow the path of the orangutan."






"We follow the Path of the Razor's Edge!"





edit on 2-2-2011 by Tamahu because: edited text



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