The Very Definition of Lost Freedoms

reply to post by Sovaka


Seems to me planning to bomb their school qualifies as intent to cause harm. How do you know that they weren't planning anything unless you investigate the matter with possible criminal charges if they were (Like the article says).

And what? These kids have zero imagination and can't come up with a fictitious school to use? It HAS to be their own school?

Reply to post by whatukno

Here, here! Guilty until proven innocent! Especially with those damn children.
They're born evil you know. Evil.


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Can't entirely blame the kids for making maps like that though. I know of some real world buildings or other locations, which when considering their layout, would actually make some rather fun maps. (Plenty of hiding places, interesting placement of stairs, etc.) Not to mention it would be more fun when played with others also familiar with the buildings, such that calling out tactics based on locations becomes easy. It doesn't mean I'd care to ransack the place causing mayhem or whatever in the real world.

The "bombs" are probably the result of a game mechanic for a particular style of gameplay, much like capture the flag. I wouldn't be too surprised if their maps also had various ammo stashes and med-kits in certain key areas as well.

I suppose some people are too paranoid these days. I guess in some cases if planning a game based on real world locations, perhaps talking to the authorities in advance and even inviting them to your servers might defuse some of their fears about it being part of some crazy plot. If you can show that it's fun without any ulterior motives, then they should have less reason to worry. Right?

Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by Sovaka

 

Seems to me planning to bomb their school qualifies as intent to cause harm.

And you seem to believe that this proof is the making of a game map?
If so, then the cause for Freedom and Liberty has lost another voice.

Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by Sovaka

 

Seems to me planning to bomb their school qualifies as intent to cause harm. How do you know that they weren't planning anything unless you investigate the matter with possible criminal charges if they were (Like the article says).

This is getting ridiculous, IMHO. Cant you see an obvious huge difference between making a map of school bombing for a computer game, and planning to bomb the school?

No, wait, I got it now:

We should expell every kid that plays shooters on the pc with friends, because obviously he is guilty of planning to shoot his friends.

We should prosecute every movie director that uses real locations, persons, or events for an action movie, because obviously he/she is guilty of planning to attack these places/people.

reply to post by Maslo


I see, so we should wait till they actually blow up the school, that way we can blame the school for not doing anything even though all the warning signs were there.



Reporter: "Weren't the kids involved seen planning this bombing weeks in advance?"

Administrator: "Yes, but we didn't want to seem overbearing."

Reporter: "But 137 kids and faculty died in the blast, don't you think you could have done something?"

Oh yea, much better ending.

Originally posted by whatukno


Or do we investigate the matter and find out for certain if something is really up or if it's nothing to worry about.

Of course, I am all for appropiate investigation, there is nothing bad about prevention. But the point of this thread is that kids are already being punished, even tough they have done nothing wrong:

Video game or not, the five students will still be punished for terroristic threatening, with punishment including suspensions and the recommendation that the children be placed in an alternative school.

Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by Maslo

 

I see, so we should wait till they actually blow up the school, that way we can blame the school for not doing anything even though all the warning signs were there.

Reporter: "Weren't the kids involved seen planning this bombing weeks in advance?"

Administrator: "Yes, but we didn't want to seem overbearing."

Reporter: "But 137 kids and faculty died in the blast, don't you think you could have done something?"

Oh yea, much better ending.

The right course of action would be to investigate possible bombing, but punish the kids only if they are found guilty of trying to bomb their school. Which is obviously not true, because they were making a map for a video game..

reply to post by Maslo

The right course of action would be to investigate possible bombing, but punish the kids only if they are found guilty of trying to bomb their school. Which is obviously not true, because they were making a map for a video game.

So, that's gonna be the standard excuse now? "Oh no, it's for a video game!"

"It's not a REAL bomb, we are just LARPing."

Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by Maslo

 

The right course of action would be to investigate possible bombing, but punish the kids only if they are found guilty of trying to bomb their school. Which is obviously not true, because they were making a map for a video game.

So, that's gonna be the standard excuse now? "Oh no, it's for a video game!"

"It's not a REAL bomb, we are just LARPing."

What are you on about? If the school staff or even police are incapable of determining whether someone is trying to BOMB the school with REAL bomb, or just making a map for a computer game, then with such an incompetent law enforcement we may as well give up to terrorists...

Yeah, what about LARPing? Are we gonna make that illegal, too?

reply to post by whatukno


You have to draw the line somewhere... Otherwise we may as well all just hand over the keys to our bodies.
Give up all remaining Freedoms and Liberties just to make a few paranoid people feel safe.

There is a huge difference between planning to bomb a school and just mapping out a building in a glorified 3D engine.
That difference would be of course all the materials to assemble a bomb found in the kids lockers/homes.
THEN you can worry and THEN you can punish.

Too many preemptive strikes for the sake of "safety".

Soon you will be thanking your saviours for enacting a "Thought Crime Act 2011", that would allow them to throw you in gaol for life for thinking.

reply to post by Sovaka


So wait for them to actually blow something up and then wonder how we didn't stop it. Good plan.

Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by Sovaka

 

So wait for them to actually blow something up and then wonder how we didn't stop it. Good plan.

You are just trolling now. There is nothing wrong with investigating possible bombing threat, I guess we can all agree with that. The difference is that those kids are being punished even tough they did not actually plan to bomb the school. Do you understand?

reply to post by whatukno


How can they blow a school up without any bomb or explosive material? I didnt know 3D models were explosive these days.. Is it some new DirectX 11 feature?

I am all for reasonable preventive laws, but there must actually be a reason to think something is endangered with sufficient probability for the law to step in. A bunch of kids modelling their school in a CS map, which they obviously did just for fun and not because they are Al-quaeda sleepers of what, that is NOT a reason to worry.

Just curious, have you played CoD: Modern Warfare 2? Should the developers also be prosecuted as suspected terrorists for the scene at the Airport?

www.destructoid.com...

reply to post by Maslo


Are you sure? How can you be sure from one article what these kids were actually planing?

Maybe, just maybe, the reason such a harsh punishment was dolled out to these kids was because something more was afoot than just a simple CGI game simulation.

Sounds to me from the article that there was. IF it were just a game these kids were constructing, I seriously doubt that the school district or the police would go to such measures.

And as far as explosives go, in any normal household there are many many different explosives that can be manufactured within a few hours from everyday household chemicals.

Given enough time a prisoner in a jail can make an explosive powerful enough to blow the steel door off of his cell. Using just raisins as an accelerant.

I think there is way more to this story than is being let out otherwise, this wouldn't be a story at all. As others have pointed out they have made models of familiar buildings themselves and have shared them online with no ill effects from law enforcement.

I think the reason is, that those who have used actual settings for their games REALLY don't have any ill intent in mind and it's obvious.

reply to post by Sovaka


well said, i couldn't hav said it better myself..wait a minute, im a narcissist, i don't think that came out right

Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by Maslo

 

Are you sure? How can you be sure from one article what these kids were actually planing?

Maybe, just maybe, the reason such a harsh punishment was dolled out to these kids was because something more was afoot than just a simple CGI game simulation.

Sounds to me from the article that there was. IF it were just a game these kids were constructing, I seriously doubt that the school district or the police would go to such measures.

And as far as explosives go, in any normal household there are many many different explosives that can be manufactured within a few hours from everyday household chemicals.

Given enough time a prisoner in a jail can make an explosive powerful enough to blow the steel door off of his cell. Using just raisins as an accelerant.

I think there is way more to this story than is being let out otherwise, this wouldn't be a story at all. As others have pointed out they have made models of familiar buildings themselves and have shared them online with no ill effects from law enforcement.

I think the reason is, that those who have used actual settings for their games REALLY don't have any ill intent in mind and it's obvious.

I have based my opinion on what was written in the article:

The map was discovered by a teacher Thursday morning, said Lauren Roberts, the district’s public information officer. The district used dogs to search the school and found no bombs. Officers also searched the children’s homes and found nothing.
There was no indication of a date for any plan, Roberts said, and it is believed that the children — all sixth graders — may have been simulating a fantasy video game.
Each child’s name was on the paper, she said. “We don’t believe there was any means to carry this out,” she said. “But the fact that they put it in writing — we’re going to take this kind of thing seriously, whether they’re joking or not.”

Do you have any other source that states that the kids really were going to bomb the school? If they were, then the punishment is appropiate. But that is not the case here.

And this is certainly enough to make a story about, no need for actual bombing threat to be present, the topic is interesting on its own. Also, it is enough for police to investigate, because the accusation is quite a serious one. The only thing I disagree with is that the kids were punished for nothing. If anything, they deserve an A in computer science.

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Just a game people, only a game.