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How to Defeat a Westboro Baptist Chruch Member's Propaganda

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posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 10:49 AM
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I am sure everyone here is familiar with the Westboro Baptist Church and their ravings and protests – and just as equally upset at the grotesque manner in which they spread their propaganda.

As a Christian, I am deeply upset at their antics and the ill reputation they are giving to Christianity to those who are ignorant of the religion.

I have decided to put forward a teaching to you all in how to properly defend against these people, in a way that is biblical and peaceful; although many of us would like to take up violence against these people. I tell you now that violence only begets more violence and that’s exactly what the people of this church desire to happen.

If you open your Bibles to the book of First Corinthians, chapter eight, you will discover an interesting situation that began at the church of Corinth regarding “unclean meat”. I am going to paraphrase this story, but I encourage you to read the story for yourself to get a grander scope of the teaching.

Beginning with verse one, Paul takes on an argument that has divided the adolescent church regarding meat, which was being eaten, that had been sacrificed to idols. Some members of the church claimed that it was sinful to eat of this meat, while others did not see any wrong in eating the meat.

In verse four Paul says, “As concerning the eating of meat that has been sacrificed to idols, we know that an idol is truly nothing in this world, and that there is no other God but the one we serve, and one Lord, who is Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.”

Then, directing his speech to the entire congregation says, “But meat does not determine our relationship with God, for neither if we eat the meat, we are better; neither, if we eat it not we are the worse.

What Paul is saying here is that meat is just meat – and because we know there are no other Gods then it is ok to eat the meat, because we know that the meat was not truly sacrificed to an idol, because that idol is not real (just a figment of imagination). So, why let it go to waste when you can make a good meal on it?

Furthermore, Paul continues by saying, “But, take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours becomes a stumbling block to the weak of spirit, who believe eating of the meat to be a sin, and it causes them to fall away from the faith. So, therefore, it would be better for you to not eat the meat, so that they may continue in their walk with the Lord without stumbling.”

So, let us compare the situation of the Westboro Baptist Church to the young church of Corinth.

They believe what they are doing is right, although it is unbiblical and actually condemned when we are told not to judge anyone… ever.

It is, however, biblical to not offend someone who is weak in spirit – causing them to stumble in their walk with God or to lose any desire to know the Lord.

Even Christ said, regarding those that cause “little ones” to sin, that it would be better for them to tie a stone around their neck and be cast into the sea.
~Luke 17:2

So, how then is it biblical or Godly for these people to protest a funeral or any other thing, which causes a “little one” to fall?

I would like to invite others to give their arguments against the Westboro Baptist Church aswell, and put together an arsenal against theim and their false doctrine – finding ways to combat them biblically and silence them.




posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 10:57 AM
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Good thread... well thought out.

I am not Christain but am married to one and have many friends of many religions.

These Westboro people upset me, anything that can be used to stop them and make them think and hopefully to change the views of the younger children would be amazing.

Do you think once Fred Phelps has passed away the rest of them will have the rubbish washed from their eyes and see what horrors they have practised?

Do you not have hate laws in the USA?



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 11:06 AM
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Who gives these people the money they need to travel around?????
I LOVE to see the show of support that often comes to keep them at a distance.
I hope a few thousand show up to surround them at that poor 9 year olds funeral.
My whole heart to her family!!!



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 11:10 AM
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Do you think once Fred Phelps has passed away the rest of them will have the rubbish washed from their eyes and see what horrors they have practised?

Do you not have hate laws in the USA?


Hitler is dead – yet there are still Nazi’s out there spreading propaganda. No, I do not think the thought patterns will die with him. You indoctrinate the young and they will spread the ideas further.

They are practicing their right of free speech.

But free speech only protects until slander enters the picture. These people are slandering others, which is NOT protected under our laws.

It is beyond me why the government is not arresting them for slander, which is illegal.


Who gives these people the money they need to travel around?????
I LOVE to see the show of support that often comes to keep them at a distance.
I hope a few thousand show up to surround them at that poor 9 year olds funeral.
My whole heart to her family!!!


They are lawyers and people of the such – with that comes money.



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 11:10 AM
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reply to post by MentorsRiddle
 


You make good points, well thought out and valid. As you say, the actions of the Westboro Church are not Christian, and do not line up with the Bible and the teachings of Jesus.

You make a good argument and there are others that could be made as well. I did a quick search just now and there are several Christian theologians out there that tear gaping holes in the Phelps views of Scripture.

I can't imagine that Westboro has not seen some of these. I cannot imagine that some members of the clergy have not pointed out directly to them that their actions are not in line Christianity.

I think they do know - I just don't think they care. Its really more cult than church.



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 11:11 AM
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This was one of the better threads posted to honour one of our fallen, little Christina Taylor Greene, amongst the many more tasteless threads on ATS

www.abovetopsecret.com...

If those who are lazy to click on that thread, I, an insignificant nobody, will immodestly repost what I had posted to reply to this thread's OP on evil man who hid behind the cloak to religion and freedom of speech to espouse his evils against humanity, and at an innocent child at that:-

This is the most gut wrenching out of the whole violent affair. A young innocent girl caught up the violence of adult political madness, deprived of her life prematuredly by a matured adult, for no crime other than to be standing there, participating in an innocent show of connectivity between the political leader and the masses.

She was born on 9/11.She and others whom were born on that day truly represented the HOPE of America, and the continuation of american courage, the blood of the brave founding fathers, for when there was despair, confusion and turmoil, hope came from such babies first cry, that life had continued, must continue and will continue no matter what comes. It is them that we live, and it is them that gave us all hope and courage to dispel our fears to continue on.

Today, even though as we despair over the senseless murder, confused, greatly saddened, and saw with horror how a bullet tore apart hope in the form of that precious little girl, do know that hope never died. No bullet can ever destroy ideals. The flesh may be destroyed, but the spirit is alive. It only makes that ideal grow stronger, for no one will let hope die.

And in that hope, will the rememberance of Christina Taylor grow in our hearts, to courageously face tomorrows, to make it better for others yet to come, and never to allow another child be harmed, as little Christina had been harmed. They are our hope, courage, future and will to battle against tyranny and their deceptions in any form for a better tomorrow.

Rest in peace, dear Christina. Your spirit of hope will continue to live on in all of us, never forgotten.....


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posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 11:20 AM
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If the Bible it taken as guidance, I think we might as well look in the Old Testament. Eye for an eye, you know. Go to funerals of Westboro members and let them know what you think. "God is catching up with you".



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 11:27 AM
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Jesus on marriage:

All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs by men: and there be some eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it. (KJV: Matt 19:11-12.)


There is no pressure to marry or take a wife.
Jesus discusses physical "eunuchs", and men who are born that way.
I think in the first case He speaks of gay men.
Not only did HE know of gay men, He also describes that they were not marriage (to women) material, and that their state was inborn (as increasingly seems the case).
Unlike Moses (before) or St Paul (after) He firstly describes it as a state, rather than an illegal/sinful act.
Fantastic!

He also says in Matt that every sin can be forgiven, except for the sin of pharisees.
Now what was their sin?
They used holy books as legalistic law books, and pulled out the "sins" that suited them.
That is also what cults do. (Note the amount of lawyers in the Phelps clan.)
They play "god" - they don't see "God" as a mystery, and a journey of understanding.



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 11:41 AM
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Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
This was one of the better threads posted to honour one of our fallen, little Christina Taylor Greene, amongst the many more tasteless threads on ATS

www.abovetopsecret.com...

If those who are lazy to click on that thread, I, an insignificant nobody, will immodestly repost what I had posted to reply to this thread's OP on evil man who hid behind the cloak to religion and freedom of speech to espouse his evils against humanity, and at an innocent child at that:-

This is the most gut wrenching out of the whole violent affair. A young innocent girl caught up the violence of adult political madness, deprived of her life prematuredly by a matured adult, for no crime other than to be standing there, participating in an innocent show of connectivity between the political leader and the masses.

She was born on 9/11.She and others whom were born on that day truly represented the HOPE of America, and the continuation of american courage, the blood of the brave founding fathers, for when there was despair, confusion and turmoil, hope came from such babies first cry, that life had continued, must continue and will continue no matter what comes. It is them that we live, and it is them that gave us all hope and courage to dispel our fears to continue on.

Today, even though as we despair over the senseless murder, confused, greatly saddened, and saw with horror how a bullet tore apart hope in the form of that precious little girl, do know that hope never died. No bullet can ever destroy ideals. The flesh may be destroyed, but the spirit is alive. It only makes that ideal grow stronger, for no one will let hope die.

And in that hope, will the rememberance of Christina Taylor grow in our hearts, to courageously face tomorrows, to make it better for others yet to come, and never to allow another child be harmed, as little Christina had been harmed. They are our hope, courage, future and will to battle against tyranny and their deceptions in any form for a better tomorrow.

Rest in peace, dear Christina. Your spirit of hope will continue to live on in all of us, never forgotten.....


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Thank you for your tribute and keeping this in perspective.
When her father said she was special - it is so clearly so that she was.
Some are more so then others and she was.
I hope there is support in great numbers to refute this group on the day her family and loved ones gather to say goodbye.



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 11:43 AM
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reply to post by MentorsRiddle
 


Halfoldman got a star from me!

To MentorsRiddle

You are doing an honorable and decent thing. I gave up on Xtianity decades ago. The inherent weakness in your OP, I feel is that the infinite level of Bible interpretations. A knowledgeable Bible basher ( is what I would call anyone that disagrees with your humanitarian stance) would counter you sensible attitude with more bible-based arguments.

My appraoch would be to simply appeal on the basis of compassion and and humanitarianism. It beggars belief that people would dare picket a child's funeral and is unbelievable that people of god would do this.

Best wishes

T



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 12:19 PM
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Tiger,

I don’t believe you can appeal to the compassionate or humanitarian side of individuals who are devoid of compassion or humanitarisim.

These people are sick in the head and have been given the nourishment of lies, which has corrupted their minds.

They are blinded by misguided faith and only truth – regarding their own religion – can set them free.

That’s just my opinion – I understand that I may be wrong.

Regards,

Mentor



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 01:09 PM
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They play "god" - they don't see "God" as a mystery, and a journey of understanding


Love this line



posted on Jan, 16 2011 @ 10:30 PM
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Perhaps firstly one should ask Pastor Phelps where Jesus ever mentioned "pastors".
He appointed no such people, nor gave them any right to assume power over others.
Apart from the initial Apostles, He appointed no man over another.



posted on Apr, 5 2014 @ 09:01 AM
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reply to post by MentorsRiddle
 

Good attempt, however, I haven't really seen a good Biblical argument that would stand up to them. While I agree with you, the argument about eating meat offered to idols wont fly from their perspective. The only way to help them, is to provide solid, consistent, biblically supported textual arguments that they understand. Remember, these folks are very well versed in the bible, many of whom are lawyers with 8+ years of formal graduate education and very keen linguistic training. This is way more than the average Christian, including ministers. I seriously think that if we can show biblical evidence that they are wrong, then they will actually listen. Unfortunately, I have not seen one biblically based argument that is strong enough to counter them. If you have something, bring it on. Let do the right thing, and help them. Otherwise, frankly, biblically based fundamentalist Christianity is on its way out.



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