Assange Fears Gitmo and The Chair

Originally posted by lnr42
If Manning can be locked up without due process

Manning is active duty military. He's subject to the UCMJ. Apples and oranges.

I'm sympathetic to Assange, even though I think talk of a gitmo detention and death penalty is absurd, and was absolutely used to illicit an emotional reaction from the public. Manning should have realized, if caught, he would pay a very heavy price for leaking classified documents. Where hasn't he been afforded due process ? Because he's not walking the street waiting for his general courts martial ? Dude wanted to be a martyr and he got his wish. He'll probably spend most of his adult life in prison. Hope it was worth it for him.

For those wanting more sources than those linked in the OP.

The Guardian - WikiLeaks: Julian Assange 'faces execution or Guantánamo detention

Assange's legal team argue that there is a similar likelihood that the US would subsequently seek his extradition "and/or illegal rendition", "where there will be a real risk of him being detained at Guantánamo Bay or elsewhere".

"Indeed, if Mr Assange were rendered to the USA, without assurances that the death penalty would not be carried out, there is a real risk that he could be made subject to the death penalty. It is well known that prominent figures have implied, if not stated outright, that Mr Assange should be executed."

In case The Guardian isn't ok - the actual skeleton defense presented in court is below in PDF format

Assange Skeleton Argument (PDF presented court)

The text quoted above is not only from the Guardian - it can also be found on page 34 of the linked pdf document.

Originally posted by exactmad
He can even make up a cable and sheeple will just follow believe everything he say. "His on the public's side" in the public's eye Obama aren't in the public side in the public's eye.

That is what the newpapers and news channels do, not Wikileaks. There sources are researched and referenced. It is a shame other media outlets dont followe suit...

kx

More important here is that the cables will continue to be released. Assange is simply a figurehead, someone for the mentally deficient US legal system to pin this on. So long as the information comes out that's really all that matters. I truly hope that the content and level of damage far outreaches what has currently been revealed. The US will get Assange at some point but it won't matter, not one damn bit and that's a good thing.

brill

Originally posted by Xcathdra
I see Assange is now using specific terminology to once again make the world feel sorry for him. This is evident by his invocation of being scared to go to the US because he doesnt want to go to Gitmo, and is afraid he will be charged with treason, and that he will be executed.

Your premise is based on a news reporters prejudiced interpretation. Unless you can source this quote directly from Assange, your post is baseless.

I would estimate by the actions I have seen that Assange fears nothing because he embodies truth and righteousness. Many people don't like to hear that news because they are part of the darkside and they know once it is all exposed, they will go down with it.

eta: the other sources linked by the frog poster also are interpretations and speculations from legal teams, etc. Nowhere does it say that Assange himself says he "fears" this. Your title is misleading and your posted is slanted.

Originally posted by purplemer

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by exactmad
Perhaps his our savior the messiah who all the sheeple will follow

Funny enough he does fit the description of the Anti Christ.. A person who has a fololwing, great oratory style who will persuade the masses to follow him under the guise of freedom.

This is not about freedom it is about truth and justice my friend... do you know the difference.....
if comments like the above are the zenith of your opinion then really i am wasting my words on you.


hey yep maybe he is the anti christ and yep mb you are the zorgon from the blob nebulae

kx

My comment was to point out the coincedence about Assange, his rise and the manner he gains public support to that of the prophecies of the last Antichrist and the manner he gains followers.

If you want to read into my comments thats your issue not mine.

reply to post by GogoVicMorrow


If you would open your eyes and do some research instead of gladly being handfed his propoganda you will see a lot of news agencys are talking about what I posted, up to and including his own lawyer making comments that the Gitmo, Treason and execution comments are part of his legal strategy.

BBC News - Assange and the US

Assange lawyer says he could end up at Guantanom bay if sent to Sweden

Lawyer for Assange says he could face death penalty if sent to US

Assange fears US indightment - Al Jazerera


I posted the article because it shows the length Assange is willing to go in an effort to distort the facts. The invocation of Gitmo and Death are pruposely being used in an effort to poke european authorities and push their mindset back to the Days of Bush.

Its a legal strategy as his lawyer has stated and is deisgned to play off emotions, and not facts,

I do find it intrsting that I point this out, and you do not research of your own and instead attack my post, and then my ocmments, and then me personally, while dissmissing the source of the article. I have listed articles above from all over the world, including the BBC, US Media, Reuters, Al-Jezeera, CNN etc on the offchance you find some self motiviation and do research on your own, instead of being told what to think.

Originally posted by riiver

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by exactmad
Perhaps his our savior the messiah who all the sheeple will follow

Funny enough he does fit the description of the Anti Christ.. A person who has a fololwing, great oratory style who will persuade the masses to follow him under the guise of freedom.

...sounds a lot like Obama, doesn't it?

Lol I thought we would give the Obama theory a rest and go with Assange, since it talks about Oratory style, and a person who claims to have the truth and the masses following, only to be duped in the end.

Change we an beleive in or Releasing classified info to stop 2 wars, embarass the US then being a whiny btch becuase he could be prosecutred for it... Tkae your choice

Originally posted by purplemer

Originally posted by exactmad
He can even make up a cable and sheeple will just follow believe everything he say. "His on the public's side" in the public's eye Obama aren't in the public side in the public's eye.

That is what the newpapers and news channels do, not Wikileaks. There sources are researched and referenced. It is a shame other media outlets dont followe suit...

kx

The info Assange is releasing is not researched and it is not a full picture either. I have tried to explain this several times and its either being ignored because it casts doubt on Assange, or because people simply do not understand how classified information works and how its filed.

I will try one more time.

Classifications and how they work

ClearanceDepending on the level of classification there are different rules controlling the level of clearance needed to view such information, and how it must be stored, transmitted, and destroyed. Additionally, access is restricted on a "need to know" basis. Simply possessing a clearance does not automatically authorize the individual to view all material classified at that level or below that level. The individual must present a legitimate "need to know" in addition to the proper level of clearance.

[edit] Compartmented informationIn addition to the general risk-based classification levels above, often there are additional constraints on access, such as (in the U.S.) Special Intelligence (SI), which protects intelligence sources and methods, No Foreign dissemination (NOFORN), which restricts dissemination to U.S. nationals, and Originator Controlled dissemination (ORCON), which ensures that the originator can track possessors of the information. Documents in some compartments are marked with specific "code words" in addition to the classification level.

If you have an intelligence document put together by the CIA that references key areas, say the fictional country of Tercrapistan, their Airforce, support of Kerplakistans war in the area against another country, and their governments fondness of hersheys chocolate, you will find the document is incomplete.

The information about the airforce comes from one source, say the Defense intelligence Agency, where only limited pertinent information is given, The NRO has the information about the ongoing support of the country at war, and the State Department talking about the hershey candy addiction.

All of these departments will share baisc info with the CIA to put the report together. What you will find in the CIA report is references to the NRO, DIA, State Department if a person with clearance and has a need to know can access the more in depoth report that pertains to the section they are wanting.

The leaked documents from wiki are an overview, and absent other information, its an incomplete picture.

Originally posted by brill
More important here is that the cables will continue to be released. Assange is simply a figurehead, someone for the mentally deficient US legal system to pin this on. So long as the information comes out that's really all that matters. I truly hope that the content and level of damage far outreaches what has currently been revealed. The US will get Assange at some point but it won't matter, not one damn bit and that's a good thing.

brill

And for all those people who dont think revenge is the motivating factor should rethink that view, as the post here supports that theory.

reply to post by Alethea


As I said to the other person, if you guys would open your eyes and look, you will find the info. I have linked several more reports that cover the OS, ranging from BBC, CNN, to Al Jezeera. What is sad is the elvel of support people give Assange while doing absolutely no research on their own.

An article comes out that questions Assanges motives, and you guys immidiately discount the source, as one person did because it was from Fox News. It took 40 seconds to find multiple sources discussing what Assnage and his lawyer said.

The rereason people dont do this research is why? Because they will find info that contradicts a view on Assange? or because there is a blind hatred towards the US and anything, regardless of verifiability or truthfullness, is to be believed at all cost?

As typical in other threads that call Assange out, there is a Blind, almost cult like following of him.

My Post, with supporting documents, covered theri legal strategy, and I gave my opinion as to what I think that strategy is. Instead of debating the topic, I am personally attacked and the sourece discounted because its from foxnews. I used the title of the source as we are required to do. The opinion is slanted and is misleading is your problem. If you actually take soe time to read and comprehend the other articles linked you will find where Assanges lawyer has stated whats being talked about, including the video footage that covers it.

Is it really that hard for you to accept Assange might not be the innocent God you guys have grown to worship?

The hypocrisy is thick...

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by brill
More important here is that the cables will continue to be released. Assange is simply a figurehead, someone for the mentally deficient US legal system to pin this on. So long as the information comes out that's really all that matters. I truly hope that the content and level of damage far outreaches what has currently been revealed. The US will get Assange at some point but it won't matter, not one damn bit and that's a good thing.

brill

And for all those people who dont think revenge is the motivating factor should rethink that view, as the post here supports that theory.

Its only viewed as revenge by those who do not see the big picture. His motives are questioned here and rightfully anyone in that situation is going to do everything they can because the legal arm of the US seems to know no boundaries. That in itself is flawed as the US does not govern this planet and never will. Fact is anyone in that situation is going to use the legal system in any way they can. What is sadly missed by those who impose US foreign policy is that they do not see any harm in their actions, they simply do what they know best and that's to control the damage and continue with the same attitude. It's the same attitude that for me personally sheds very little sympathy when the US struggles, in fact I actual enjoy seeing the old bag wince.

Assange's actions are needed and I hope many many more follow in this footsteps. He's not the messiah nor is he some type of revolutionary. He has his problems but the fact remains his intentions or should I say the intentions of Wikipedia are welcome.

Even if he is taken down, the genie is out of the bottle.

brill

reply to post by brill


Right...

Assange is a narcissistic person who also suffers from megalomania.

Now he is attempting to use the shooting in Arizona to gain support for his cause by jumping on the band wagon that inciting hate speech is what Sarah Palin and Huckabee are doing to him. This guy has no conceisnce or ethics, and will do whatever, and use whomever he can, to his own personal advantage.

This guy is manipulative and only cares about himself. He is attempting to place himself back in the spotlight by making these comments and accusations, at which point it will not matter what the media asks him, his answers will be using words like rendition, US, death, treason, Gitmo and any other links he can mkae in an effort to sway judges not to send him back to sweden, where he is accused of sexual misconduct.

For someone who demands people be held to standards and rule of law, he apparently does not feel the need to hold himself to that same standard.

The comparison you are looking for by the way is from the book Animal Farm:

All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by brill

 

Right...

Assange is a narcissistic person who also suffers from megalomania.

Now he is attempting to use the shooting in Arizona to gain support for his cause by jumping on the band wagon that inciting hate speech is what Sarah Palin and Huckabee are doing to him. This guy has no conceisnce or ethics, and will do whatever, and use whomever he can, to his own personal advantage.

This guy is manipulative and only cares about himself. He is attempting to place himself back in the spotlight by making these comments and accusations, at which point it will not matter what the media asks him, his answers will be using words like rendition, US, death, treason, Gitmo and any other links he can mkae in an effort to sway judges not to send him back to sweden, where he is accused of sexual misconduct.

For someone who demands people be held to standards and rule of law, he apparently does not feel the need to hold himself to that same standard.

The comparison you are looking for by the way is from the book Animal Farm:

All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others.

edit on 12-1-2011 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

Here's the difference. Assange is just a messenger. Your assumptions and personal opinion on Assange are fine, but they are yours and like my opinion of him are irrelevant. The Arizona shooting is irrelevant in the scope of what Wikileaks is doing and that is exposing the truth. If he jumps on the bandwagon good for him, doesn't change the reality of the factual content of the cables.

His head could be made of ketchup and he rides a unicorn to work, who cares, its the cables, their content and the fact that the US doesn't like its dirty laundry aired. The same goes for any government and I certainly anticipate that the likes of China, Russia, the UK, Japan and all other big players are exposed.

You seem preoccupied or borderline obsessed with portraying Assange in ways that quite frankly do not matter. It's a distraction at best.

brill

Too many variables are involved to consider whether Assange will be Killed off. He has made himself a public figure that I do not think has worked out in his favor.
Unfortunately, his releases have been neither world shaking nor ground breaking. For all his intentions he made a grave mistake. He has not made his "life" bomb proof. His work will be forgotten soon as the next story rears its head. This week it was the shooting of a congresswoman in the USA next week could be the death of 5 million Iranians. Who knows. Assange, to me, signed his own death warrant when he thought releasing this type of info under his own name would be smart.
No crusader throughout history (Or is that DC comics) has his real identity smeared across the media outlets.
Now, there is barely any talk of Assange even on ATS.

reply to post by brill


and as a messenger, he can be charged and tried in court, just as the jouranlist were for the pentagon papers incident.

He is the one who invoked Arizona, check out the assange wants to arrest palin and huckabee. The media release from his is posted there.

You seem preoccupied or borderline obsessed with portraying Assange in ways that quite frankly do not matter. It's a distraction at best.

A simple catch all argument that ignores fact and attempts to play off his actions as nothing significant.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by brill

 

and as a messenger, he can be charged and tried in court, just as the jouranlist were for the pentagon papers incident.
He is the one who invoked Arizona, check out the assange wants to arrest palin and huckabee. The media release from his is posted there.

I did read the article thank you. Yes he invoked it I don't disagree on your point, I thought I made that clear.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
A simple catch all argument that ignores fact and attempts to play off his actions as nothing significant.

Well sure but I could easily say the same for your assumptions and comments, again not the point. I think you are largely ignoring the key fact of what Wikileaks is and their objective. Your needles stuck on the same song, perhaps mine is as well. I never disputed Assange's action I completely agree with you that his tactics and strategy at this point are a last ditch effort on his part. Assange will disappear into the abyss but so long as the Wikileaks of this world prevail that's what is more relevant. I think we're done here, at least I am.

Just to add....this is the type of post that I hope to see more of.

Assange / China

brill

reply to post by brill


Not at all... The problem present is Assange and his ability to break the law and how his followers scream the opposite. They defend Assange not because they beleive he is innocent, but because tthey feel they have a right to the classified information he is releasing, which they dont.

Assange invoked Arizona in an effort to garner edia attention towards himself and wikileaks.
Assange has invoked the 9/11 mantra and tied it to Seden in an effort to play off peoples emotions and not the facts evident in that case.
Assange demands people be held accountible for breaking the law, while at the exact same time claiming he is above the law by doing anything he can to discredit anyone that present information to the contrary.

The difference between my needle and your needle, is mine has been conistant and is based on fact, by the information present and Assnages own actions.

Your needle is skipping, depending on the argument being made. Jumping between arguments, ignoring fact and replacing it with absolutely worthless information.

The facts surrounding Assange speak for themselves, and no amount of obfuscation on your part will not change that outcome.