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Hey China, why are you so worked up about an Independant Taiwan

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posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 12:49 AM
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Originally posted by FredT
No that is the difference. Amerca is made up of many groups of people. In diversity there is strength. Hawiian people are Amercians. America is not a race it is a concept based on freedom.... If your censors allow it, yiou should take a look at our constitution and Bill of Rights. You might learn something.


You think Taiwanese is a race, different from Chinese?




posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 03:07 AM
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olimu.com...

Article on China by John Derbyshire



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 03:20 AM
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Originally posted by zcheng

Originally posted by FredT
You think Taiwanese is a race, different from Chinese?


No, but they are a different people. You may share a common past, but the people of Taiwan are different. They grew up in a different system, with different values. That is like saying that all Arab's are Arab's. But there are profound differences between people in the Arab world. They may all come from a same racial background, but they are totally different. Same difference here.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 03:34 AM
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No, but they are a different people. You may share a common past, but the people of Taiwan are different. They grew up in a different system, with different values. That is like saying that all Arab's are Arab's. But there are profound differences between people in the Arab world. They may all come from a same racial background, but they are totally different. Same difference here.


You're right that the Taiwanese are a different people. Race isn't the only factor in distinguishing peoples. Look at the Serbs and Croats. Even Americans and Englishmen.

As for the Arabs, they really don't even come from the same racial background. Lebanese (Levantine/"Canaanite") and Yemenis (Arabian) and Moroccans (North African) look very little alike, they only unity is the Arabic language, which displays such variety in colloquial form that very distant people can hardly understand one another unless speaking in standard Arabic. The variety is much more pronounced than any in the English-speaking world.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 03:40 AM
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As for the Arabs, they really don't even come from the same racial background. Lebanese (Levantine/"Canaanite") and Yemenis (Arabian) and Moroccans (North African) look very little alike, they only unity is the Arabic language,


You make an excellent point. Exactly what Im trying to impress on Zcheng. Hawaians are Americans. But not all Americans are Hawaiians. Its sometimes hard to fathom the melting pot as we like to call it here in the States. We recently had a debate discussing the differences between the US and the Roman Empire at the height of thier respective powers. One huge difference was the "melting pot". Everyone brings thier unique skills , experiences, and background to the pot. Diversity will always be stronger over the long haul. Thats one reason why America will not go the way of the Roman Empire



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 08:24 AM
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Originally posted by FredT

Originally posted by FredT
You think Taiwanese is a race, different from Chinese?


No, but they are a different people. You may share a common past, but the people of Taiwan are different. They grew up in a different system, with different values. That is like saying that all Arab's are Arab's. But there are profound differences between people in the Arab world. They may all come from a same racial background, but they are totally different. Same difference here.


Glad you recoginize that Taiwanese were Chinese in history.

We are under different political system, but we are in the same China, speak the same language Chinese. If Taiwan seeks formal Independence, they will face the wraith of 1.3 Billion Chinese. Those do not want to be Chinese should leave Taiwan, because Taiwan belongs to All Chinese.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 08:30 AM
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Originally posted by Eastern_Diamondback
olimu.com...

Article on China by John Derbyshire


9/11 is the Reichstag Fire of US. Iraq is the Poland of WW2. The world people which one the new Nazi threat to the World.

Patriot Act is the beginning of Gestapo. What about Patriot Act 2?

John Derbyshire, may think it is China, but the world thinks it is U......S.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 08:40 AM
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Originally posted by Eastern_Diamondback



No, but they are a different people. You may share a common past, but the people of Taiwan are different. They grew up in a different system, with different values. That is like saying that all Arab's are Arab's. But there are profound differences between people in the Arab world. They may all come from a same racial background, but they are totally different. Same difference here.


You're right that the Taiwanese are a different people. Race isn't the only factor in distinguishing peoples. Look at the Serbs and Croats. Even Americans and Englishmen.

As for the Arabs, they really don't even come from the same racial background. Lebanese (Levantine/"Canaanite") and Yemenis (Arabian) and Moroccans (North African) look very little alike, they only unity is the Arabic language, which displays such variety in colloquial form that very distant people can hardly understand one another unless speaking in standard Arabic. The variety is much more pronounced than any in the English-speaking world.


It is because of UK domination in Arab that created so many nations for divide and conquor. The Arabs do not have the luck to have a great leader like our Mao Zedong.

I do see some possibility. It is just time before US is repelled from Iraq by Heroic Iraq Freedom Fighter. When that happens, the Arabs will get their inspiration to get rid of West installed dictators, and become unified.

US/UK are trying the same thing to weak China. You can also see the same in India and Pakistan.

Was not there a independence war fought between US and UK? Why Colonialists want to get rid of UK? Was not it mainly for high Tax UK levied.

Similarly, Taiwan will never gain independence without War. Even if China fail the first time, China will come back again. You will see perpetual war, until Taiwan is back to China.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 08:41 AM
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Originally posted by zcheng
Glad you recoginize that Taiwanese were Chinese in history.
We are under different political system, but we are in the same China, speak the same language Chinese. If Taiwan seeks formal Independence, they will face the wraith of 1.3 Billion Chinese. Those do not want to be Chinese should leave Taiwan, because Taiwan belongs to All Chinese.


Note I said "may". The nationalist were fleeing the brutal murderous communist who were taking over thier country. No doubt they chose not to take part in the cultural revolution and great leap backwards. However, Taiwan as an island has its own history, its own people now. No doubt you have heard of the American revolution. Once the Brits realized we were not going to cave in, they reformed thier systems and evetually became on of our greatest allies. You have that chance. But with this contiued rehtoric about 1.3 billion angry CHinese, who do you think you are convincing? Perhaps you and your leadership are ready, but I doubt that the entire population of CHina is as brainwashed with propaganda as you.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 09:27 AM
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Originally posted by FredT
Once the Brits realized we were not going to cave in, they reformed thier systems and evetually became on of our greatest allies. You have that chance. But with this contiued rehtoric about 1.3 billion angry CHinese, who do you think you are convincing? Perhaps you and your leadership are ready, but I doubt that the entire population of CHina is as brainwashed with propaganda as you.


I do not need to convince anyone. I show the evidence or fact. Whether you like it or not is not my problem.

brainwashed you are in thinking Taiwan is a nation. It is only a self-governed region. Singapore is a nation, though the majority are of Chinese origin.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 09:48 AM
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Originally posted by zcheng
I do not need to convince anyone. I show the evidence or fact. Whether you like it or not is not my problem.
brainwashed you are in thinking Taiwan is a nation. It is only a self-governed region. Singapore is a nation, though the majority are of Chinese origin.


Taiwan is a nation-state by the clasic definition
Has space or territory which has internationally recognized boundaries (boundary disputes are OK).
Has people who live there on an ongoing basis.
Has economic activity and an organized economy. A country regulates foreign and domestic trade and issues money.
Has the power of social engineering, such as education.
Has a transportation system for moving goods and people.
Has a government which provides public services and police power.
Has sovereignty. No other State should have power over the country's territory.
Has external recognition. A country has been "voted into the club" by other countries.
All that remains is for the United States of America to officially recognize Taiwan. What evidence of 1.3 billion angry Chinese have you shown me. Certainly not your canned text comming out of some propaganda manual



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 09:58 AM
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Originally posted by FredT
Taiwan is a nation-state by the clasic definition
All that remains is for the United States of America to officially recognize Taiwan. What evidence of 1.3 billion angry Chinese have you shown me. Certainly not your canned text comming out of some propaganda manual


Glad, you know US has not recoginize Taiwan as a nation yet. Who recognize Taiwan as a nation, and why?

The fury of 1.3 billion will be shown for all to see, when the ReUnification war begin. Just wait and see.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 10:32 AM
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I think I've said before that China attacking Taiwan would be like a dog attacking a porcupine. The dog might win, the porcupine might die, but the dog is going to be in A LOT of pain, and won't be up for a fight if any of the other dogs in the neighborhood decide they want his bowl of dog food.

FredT, I admire your persistance but you are beating your head against the wall of Chinese Communist Ideology and Nationalist Pride.

I have always maintaned that China wouldn't break the Peace and would gradually westernize itself, but our communist friend and his oft repeated 1.3 billion Chinese People threats makes me wonder if they are as far along as I had hoped.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 10:56 AM
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Originally posted by zcheng


Glad, you know US has not recoginize Taiwan as a nation yet. Who recognize Taiwan as a nation, and why?

The fury of 1.3 billion will be shown for all to see, when the ReUnification war begin. Just wait and see.




china is going to get ripped an new asshole. and if they use nukes well then its bye bye peoples rebuplic. china has to worry about the 2 biggest and best militaries bearing dwon on it from 2 directions, russia and the united states. germany sure as hell didnt win a 2 front war, id like to see china do it.


and the fury of 1.3 billion people. maybe just the fury of the military. theres so many pro demoracy underground movements that once the # hits the fan china will probally come crashing down from the inside.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 12:07 PM
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Originally posted by KrazyIvan

Originally posted by zcheng


Glad, you know US has not recoginize Taiwan as a nation yet. Who recognize Taiwan as a nation, and why?

The fury of 1.3 billion will be shown for all to see, when the ReUnification war begin. Just wait and see.




china is going to get ripped an new asshole. and if they use nukes well then its bye bye peoples rebuplic. china has to worry about the 2 biggest and best militaries bearing dwon on it from 2 directions, russia and the united states. germany sure as hell didnt win a 2 front war, id like to see china do it.

Who said China want to attack Russia or Russia attack China. There is great cooperation between Russia and China. Both are bullied by US. I see that two combine forces together to face off US. I guess US can face the two giants at the same time.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 12:10 PM
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Originally posted by Ambient Sound
I think I've said before that China attacking Taiwan would be like a dog attacking a porcupine. The dog might win, the porcupine might die, but the dog is going to be in A LOT of pain, and won't be up for a fight if any of the other dogs in the neighborhood decide they want his bowl of dog food.


Why just US meddling in Taiwan Strait? We can see whether China is a weak dog or a giant dragon.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 12:57 PM
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Originally posted by zcheng
The fury of 1.3 billion will be shown for all to see, when the ReUnification war begin. Just wait and see.


Dude you sound like a bad science fiction movie. The ReUnification war. Phuleeeze. The fury of 1.3 billion will shown.......


First Came Tibet



Then Came Tienneman



And now Zcheng and his Bloodthirsty 1.3 Billion Chinese eye Taiwan



In the "Re-Unification WAR!!!!!


Zcheng and his braniwashed Comrads are comming soon to your independant country to Rape, pillage, and burn you down to the bedrock

You sound right out of a comic book
You remind me of a small dog. BARK BARK BARK BARK BARK, all noise and no bite



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 01:05 PM
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Originally posted by FredT
You sound right out of a comic book
You remind me of a small dog. BARK BARK BARK BARK BARK, all noise and no bite


I only see you bark and bashing.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 01:29 PM
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Anyone ever wonder how the Chinese built the Great wall of
China? It was built before America was even born. Every nation
has it's ups and downs but if everyone respected one another
we would have a much happier world.

China was once the super power of the world......this was before
almost any other nation was on the planet. Respect people...respect.



posted on Jul, 15 2004 @ 03:17 PM
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Egypt was a super power before China.

You imply that because Taiwan is right off the coast of China that it is part of China. There are a lot of countries off the coast of China.

You imply just by the people speaking Chinese that it is part of China. There are a lot of countries with a Chinese speaking population.

You imply that 1.3 billion equates to victory. There has never been a time in history where brawn has won over brains.

You also imply that by scaring countries like Taiwan that should tremble by the words and just become part of China. Sounds like a communist of totalitarian way of thinking to me.

You seem to also want people to believe that you're chatting from China. There is no way they allow this site to be viewed in China because it's to independant in thouht. If several people talk about the China/Taiwan situation or one person talks about the China/Taiwan situation, it all sounds the same: like someone totally brainwashed and forced to believe what a communistic or totalitarian government wants them to believe or say. I bet there is no room for descent from the China reunification arguement. I'm willing to bet you have no choice but to believe what you're shovelling because you believe you're being a loyal chinese and a loyal chinese is believing whatever the governmnet wants you to believe no matter what you believe.

Reunification with Taiwan seems to be just a rallying point to keep the gerneral population from the truth that at some point, the population combined with aradable land and inadequate resources may be a bigger problem then caring about, "oh my gosh, we must unify with Taiwan."



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