Is the Loughner Mug Shot Fake?

Originally posted by PeoriaAZ
This is a very good question, it is obvious that this cat was a nut, but the odd thing is the whole, him claiming to be under some kind of mind control, to some that seems absolutely insane, but I'm not sure if you have ever heard of a man named Charles Sclund (I'll have to double check the spelling on that) cause I knew him as Chuck, he has a very interesting story, and if you do know who I'm talking about then you what I mean, anyways I knew the man personally he was a patron at my mother's bar, and one of my best friends in the world worked for him, but he was a strong believer in the capability of the government, or agentcies realitive to, to preform such actions, but anyways off the subject of the topic, but has anyone seen the video, where he is supposedly walking through the campus of the Pima Community College, I believe is an ABSOLUTE SHAM!!! He never shows himself in the footage. So I don't doubt for a second that the mugshot is also a counterfiet, Anyone else seen the video at Pima CC??? share your thoughts please if you have

HAS ANYONE SEEN THE VIDEO OF Loughner WALKING THE CAMPUS OF pIMA cOMMUNITY cOLLEGE, THE ONE THAT NEVER SHOWS HIS FACE?? I want to hear what you think please

Originally posted by PeoriaAZ

HAS ANYONE SEEN THE VIDEO OF Loughner WALKING THE CAMPUS OF pIMA cOMMUNITY cOLLEGE, THE ONE THAT NEVER SHOWS HIS FACE?? I want to hear what you think please

You mean this one?



We never see him and an officer of the college Police says he recognized him in a window reflection. His voice could have been dubbed, using a voice synthesizer which renders perfectly his vocal spectrum. There is absolutely no way anyone can say in good faith it was him. The only one declaring so does this not because he witnessed him doing it, but from a ghost reflection which I can't even find on the video. Let me know if you do.

GS

reply to post by Getsmart

You can see his reflection in the library door though it is only a split second and in no way could you identify him from that?
I don't see how this video shows a dangerous supposition to this guy? The people on the video shouting, ranting and raving, will they be targetted by the authorities as they could be construed as like Jared?
This video is like hundreds I have seen on students protesting about their education being dumbed down and the fees being to high for poor students to attain in the current political climate throughout the world.

Originally posted by Getsmart
The only one declaring so does this not because he witnessed him doing it, but from a ghost reflection which I can't even find on the video. Let me know if you do.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/35ccb3fc98b2.png[/atsimg]

Wow, seems pretty easy to find for someone with deductive powers. I AM NOT claiming this brief image is JL but just providing as a reference. In fact, the section where he is briefly visible in the video seems to show the reflection walking off while the camera is still pointed at bookstore door. Check THAT out if you are looking to discredit the video as it is "smoking gun" IMO. I am working on a few other things and don't have time to sub clip and slo mo that section. It is bizarre to say the least.

The reflection we see here in the video from the school, seems to be a very skinny guy.
Alleged Jared was said to be skinny and 23 yrs old.

They guy in the mugshot looks quite heavy (i d say at least 50kg more than the guy in the video).
As well he looks older than 30.

And the cop did identify the alleged shooter from this 1 second long reflection, where the guy has both arms and a video camera in front of his face ?

This raises a lot of questions.

Notify as well, that the Jared videos are from last year, and i doubt he packed 50 kg in less than a year.

Not to move us into a tangent, the actual identification of Jared Loughner as the person with the YouTube account is not established, and it isn't known that he is the one who made up those videos or wrote those texts. There is nowhere in there a single element enabling his personal identification. The only thing it is based upon is that the account says his name right at the top.


I find this actually to mean that it is probably NOT his account. Jared was not a stupid person, and he had his own suspicions about the debatable good intentions of The Powers That Be. Just like most people here at ATS who have issues with any number of problems in today's society. That is why we all post anonymously. It is also why ATS will of its own unilateral choice quickly deletes any personal information ATS members post regarding their identity or their coordinates. It is very unwise and Jared would therefore probably not have posted his name to his Real Name on his YouTube page as seen on some screenshots.


Then we get a dubious "formal identification" by a Campus police officer. Add to this a falsified or at the very least image processed Mugshot picture presented as the Official Release photo of the culprit and we have just cause for not believing much of anything regarding this case.


Now, to return to our analysis of the Giffords shooting itself, there are still a number of odd and unusual elements which make me wonder if former Vice-Presidential Candidate and perhaps forthcoming Presidential hopeful Sarah Palin wasn't close to the mark when she let slip our her remark about Blood Libel.


I already explained in a simplified way what this was, and it is very important to realize that this would NOT correspond to any type of Jewish practice, and has nothing to do with Judaism, so let us not confuse this issue with antisemitism or with any form of prejudice or persecution. This is strictly in the line of examining the various aspects of the Giffords shooting, and if there were an Irish connection, I would pursue it just as diligently. Actually, as I noted earlier, there might also be an Irish Catholic connection, which would be interesting to examine, possibly in line with the Jesuit influence? A wild card, we'll see if anything pans out on that front, but at this time there seems to be some leads on the Zionist trail.


As I mentioned before Blood Libel is a several hundred years old term used in Northern and Eastern European accusations against the Jewish community, and this was most unfortunate, because Jews were themselves victims throughout history of a "Stealth" sect gone underground after King David took over Jerusalem and founded Judea, the land of the Jews. Prior to this it was a Canaanite city where the Saturn worshipers performed human sacrifice to their pagan God. At this time they went underground, and hid among the Jewish society perpetrating against them crimes including perhaps the worst: placing on the shoulders of innocent Jews the guilt of their misdeeds.


So what I outline here is not about per se Blood Letting, which is a misnomer as it refers to unfair accusations against innocent Jews in past centuries, it is about the several millennia old human sacrifice practices of a Zionist sect of Canaanite pagans who over the centuries have hidden among the Jewish community, among the Royal Families such as the Saxe Coburg Gotha among others, among the Venitian Black Nobility, and among the Illuminati Bloodlines. It is a SECT which uses Black Magick, satanic rituals, Kaballistic astrology and numerology and an abundance of esoteric symbolism and rites, which defy the imagination yet unify these individuals into a strong network today constituting our Global Power Elite.


What does this have to do with the Giffords shooting? A lot if you consider that the presence on that location of a child born on 9/11 possibly had symbolic significance for this group, who had already presumably sacrificed to their god Saturn or Satan several thousand people in the Twin Towers the day she was born. Here is the testimony of the person who without solicitation and of her own initiative approached this child and convinced her to come to that event in which she may well have been ritually sacrificed.


CLICK HERE for the Video - it will play after a short ad


We can legitimately choose to weigh her words for a hidden message. She states:

"So I said "Alright, Christina, let's do the math !" Christina did math. "How many Senators do we have? Hold that number ! How Many Representatives do we have? Add that number ! Hold that number. Let's add the President and the Vice-President. You got that number ? That's the number of people who make the laws that tell us how we live here in America today. And you are going to get to shake her hand."

She immediately follows this statement with a broad Hand Slap like "swatting a Mosquito" and says gravely: "GUNSHOT". She was referring to the first shot which went through Gabrielle Giffords' brain. Some may attribute this to story telling style, but I happen to find their alleged conversation strange and unusual, given that Suzi Hileman's account places it at the exact time leading to the Shooting of Representative GIffords. It itemizes in full listing all legislative bodies, mathematically adding each and every person with law making power, all methodically added together and lumped into the same basket: those with law making authority, in the instants preceding a Political Hit against a dissident law maker, Representative Gabrielle Giffords.


If you forget this happened in the United States of America and transpose the events to, say, a Latin American dictatorship, what conclusions would you come to? It would be obvious this was a HIT and that that was a clear threat message to all not so stupid as to not understand. But then you think, "This is the United States of America, we don't have bad people like that doing terrible things, we're a democracy." But are we? When our lawmakers are being INTIMIDATED if not ASSASSINATED for doing the job we have entrusted them to do by our democratic votes? Clearly somebody doesn't want the USA to be a democracy.


We know that Gabrielle Giffords had recently pushed through the US Congress a bill which apparently brought her reprisals in the form a a Murder Hit. She gained congressional funding of some $600 Million to increase border patrols at the permeable borders South of Tucson, the location where the CIA imports drugs into the USA. We can expect that it was for this very reason that she was TARGETED by the Republican Party with SNIPER Gun-Sight Cross-Hairs, to make sure that all the other members of the Congress and the Senate got the picture.


My personal conclusion is that Suzi Hileman is a Zionist MK Ultra operative who took Christina to be Ritually Sacrificed. Keep in mind that many of the children ritually sacrificed in private settings, in cellars and basements, are brought by people they trust, unaware of their impending doom. In so doing Suzi Hileman is also delivering to all political opponents of her fellow Zionists a fairly clear threat message. All Congressmen and Senators, the U.S. President and the Vice-President will, without hesitation, be assassinated if they don't bow to their authority. "Look, we'll even kill a nine year old girl, so don't mess with us! Pass OUR laws, or you're squashed like a Mosquito."


Christina Green’s Neighbor: ‘It Was My Job to Bring Her Home’


The above article misrepresents this testimony signifying that it was Christina who was asking her questions, when Suzi Hileman, the only surviving participant of that conversations relates it as under her own initiative and control.. Her testimony has some other disturbing aspects, such as her apparent good health despite 3 bullet wounds which were described by the press as "critical" only a few days earlier, and including her saying "It was my job to bring her home to her mom and dad." Since when is that a JOB? She was a neighbor, not an employee of the Greens. Is she saying that she was sent on a job to take Christina there? In case we're on to her, is she pretending that her mission was not a one way trip? That she wasn't in on Christina's sacrificial murder?


Here is a link to thread in another forum which is already 28 pages long. It discusses Suzi Hiliman's MK-Ultra connections. This is alarming because it places somebody with Mind Control antecedents at the crime scene where we presume an MK-Ultra Mind Controlled Manchurian Candidate did shooting, whether Jared Loughner or somebody else.


Susan Hileman who took the 9-yr-old Christina Green to see Gabby in AZ. MK-ULTRA!


This is also cause for concern because it connects CIA Mind Control Programmed Assassin Programs with a Zionist Agenda including the ritual sacrifice of children. Oh, but wait. I almost forgot, that's what the Station Chief for the Los Angeles FBI said that the CIA does: The CIA kidnaps and supplies the Zionist Elite with children for sex magick snuff films and satanic child sacrifice blood drinking ceremonies.


If you are considering that this couldn't be because there's no way all the armies of journalists and investigative teams would have made declarations to this effect, then that does spell a world I also wished we lived in, as it would make our task in life far easier. All it would take is to live a decent life and all would be fine. Yet today to be a decent person living life as clean as a whistle is not enough. What do you think of those who did so, on the outskirts of Dachau and Buchenwald? They were doing good to those whom they met with, and not minding what didn't concern them. But didn't it? If we are here in a Conspiracy Forum it is because of just that, we have noticed that "something smells rotten in the Kingdom of Denmark", to quote Shakespeare. For we are not the first nor the last to sniff out such combinations of special interests which plot, deceive and usurp power.


For a small glimpse of the fact that we are in a continuity of manipulation by the press, here is a quote of John Swinton who was eight years Editor in Chief of the New York Sun and for some ten years Editor in Chief of the New York Times, throughout the Civil War. He made this statement some 130 years ago in 1880, when invited by the assembled New York City press corps, at a diner where he was guest of honor. One of the guests proposed a toast the "The Independence of the Press" which elicited this reply:

"There is no such thing, at this date of the world's history, in America, as an independent press. You know it and I know it."

"There is not one of you who dares to write your honest opinions, and if you did, you know beforehand that it would never appear in print. I am paid weekly for keeping my honest opinion out of the paper I am connected with. Others of you are paid similar salaries for similar things, and any of you who would be so foolish as to write honest opinions would be out on the streets looking for another job. If I allowed my honest opinions to appear in one issue of my paper, before twenty-four hours my occupation would be gone."

"The business of the journalists is to destroy the truth, to lie outright, to pervert, to vilify, to fawn at the feet of mammon, and to sell his country and his race for his daily bread. You know it and I know it, and what folly is this toasting an independent press?"

"We are the tools and vassals of rich men behind the scenes. We are the jumping jacks, they pull the strings and we dance. Our talents, our possibilities and our lives are all the property of other men. We are intellectual prostitutes."

In case you aren't familiar with the word mammon, fallen in disuse, it is the personification of Greed as a deity, implying "dishonest gain". Yet today the press has "devolved" into a shell function, used in order to place complicit intelligence operatives or spineless propagandists at the beck and call of a dictated editorial line, such as John Swinton described. Thanks to this we today find huge amounts of valid information on the Internet from people whose profession is not in that realm, because The press has become an Information Extinguisher.


I sincerely wish that there was no implication of any party leading to the first degree murder of an innocent young girl as victim of a ritual sacrifice. However all indications seem to point to this, and the direct complicity of the Police force and the FBI investigating this crime cannot be discounted unless they get into motion and prove that they are doing the task they are paid for, and for which they have taken an oath with its consequences if betrayed.. We should apply whatever pressure is necessary so that each and every investigating officer knows they are in the public eye and the we are judging their positions to pursue the matter without complacency.


GS

Originally posted by flyingviolet
I found some more pics not sure if they're of the real Jared...

Here's the link to Politicol News w/pics

This is very strange indeed...

I posted this link on this thread too: mugshots and photos of Jared Loughner don't match

God...it seems like from all the pics I've seen of him, there are two different people that just don't really even look alike.

Does ANYONE know if there are pictures from the actual event? I'm just trying to figure out if he went to the event with his head/brows shaved or they did that after he was arrested... which would be unusual (I mean, MAYBE the head...but the brows!?)

But if you read the literature on schizophrenia, one of the odd symptoms you might see from time to time is the person will shave off all their body hair (legs, arms, pits, brows, head, etc.) **kind of like terrorists on a mission, shaves off his beard and body hair.

Originally posted by 08051962
But if you read the literature on schizophrenia, one of the odd symptoms you might see from time to time is the person will shave off all their body hair (legs, arms, pits, brows, head, etc.) **kind of like terrorists on a mission, shaves off his beard and body hair.

Research actually shows that they alter their appearance as a form of detachment. So when they look in the mirror they see someone other than themselves. Your terrorist theory traits I believe relates to religious beliefs, but I could be mistaken on that.

Thus far, the authorities have kept images under wraps and footage of the actual attack (surveillance video) has not been released to public. I'm not aware if it has been determined if he shaved his own head prior to attack or that was done in jail.

Originally posted by Moose318
Wheres the moles int he other pictures?

Who says they're moles? He's clearly JUST shaved in that picture, perhaps it's dried specks of blood from shaving too hard against the grain? You don't get Schick Quatros and Gillette Fusions in jail.

reply to post by Tgautier13


The nose, I would attribute to age, having watched the nose of my teenage son change in the last year or so. Dilated pupils? I think we all know one good reason that could be! He wasn't acting with a clear head for some reason or another. Eyes darker, could be from mood - I and several family members are like that. All looks like the same guy to me, though he's seriously creepy in the mug shot.

Originally posted by Ear-Responsible

Originally posted by Moose318
Wheres the moles int he other pictures?

Who says they're moles? He's clearly JUST shaved in that picture, perhaps it's dried specks of blood from shaving too hard against the grain? You don't get Schick Quatros and Gillette Fusions in jail.

Ok I feel dumb now haha. Obviously this is a mugshot taken directly after the event took place. Therefore, no jailhouse razors would have been used before this pic was taken, he could have shaved at home I suppose. That, or, it's a victims dried blood splatter :/

Originally posted by Ear-Responsible

Originally posted by Ear-Responsible

Originally posted by Moose318
Wheres the moles int he other pictures?

Who says they're moles? He's clearly JUST shaved in that picture, perhaps it's dried specks of blood from shaving too hard against the grain? You don't get Schick Quatros and Gillette Fusions in jail.

Ok I feel dumb now haha. Obviously this is a mugshot taken directly after the event took place. Therefore, no jailhouse razors would have been used before this pic was taken, he could have shaved at home I suppose. That, or, it's a victims dried blood splatter :/

edit on 28-1-2011 by Ear-Responsible because: (no reason given)

Yes, I recall when this story first broke I heard once or twice that Gifford was shot at close range.
(how close!?)
Also, I wonder, was she the first one to be shot?

reply to post by Gom3z


You know what.. your right. There are no moles in his old picture.. and his newest one has moles. Notice the shape of his right pupil in the mug shot . I would like someone to explain that one

Edit: Heh, should have read more the thread, moles have explained. But the eye hasn't!

reply to post by cenpuppie


it has

So, finally some more news on the case:

Legal Battle Over Tucson Defendant Jared Loughner's 'Real' Mug Shot
s/www.politicsdaily.com... legal-battle-over-tucson-defendant-jared-loughners-real-mug-s/

Bullet point version of the article:

But it turns out that the Loughner "mug shot" photo the world has come to know wasn't his official post-arrest booking photo. Those were taken by federal authorities, not the county sheriff's department,

Defense counsel, in turn, sought help from Judge Burns after learning that someone -- exactly who is not yet known-- filed a request for the release of the photos under the Freedom of Information Act, ..

Another thing that just popped in my mind: interestin that the "official" mugshot we discuss here has no ID-number, as they usually have. (normally prisoner wears a board with his id-number in a mugshot)

So the mugshot is not the "real" one AND it's obviously photoshopped. Why should it be the real alleged murder ? Still more questions than answers.

Am I the only one out here who thinks this whole event NEVER HAPPENED????? That Loughner is not real and Giffords was never shot. Am I the only one who sees parallels to LEE Harvey Oswald and Jared LEE Loughner and JFK, the last public official to be shot in the head?

Why have we not seen any other photo of Loughner? Or for that matter Giffords who is recovering beautifully from a shot through the brain at close range. Why has Loughner only been charged with attempted murder when there are 6 people dead!

The whole story is complete BS but no one cares anymore because we have moved on to other stories.

Originally posted by gwynned
Am I the only one out here who thinks this whole event NEVER HAPPENED????? That Loughner is not real and Giffords was never shot. Am I the only one who sees parallels to LEE Harvey Oswald and Jared LEE Loughner and JFK, the last public official to be shot in the head?

Why have we not seen any other photo of Loughner? Or for that matter Giffords who is recovering beautifully from a shot through the brain at close range. Why has Loughner only been charged with attempted murder when there are 6 people dead!

Hi Gwynned,


No, you are by far not alone. However at ATS this doesn't seem to have gained as much grip as elsewhere. This forum has grown more mainstream over the years, and this section doesn't seem to be one where as much speculative thinking or political conviction is brought to the table. That might be why you aren't getting an echo to your theory.


I for one second the idea that Giffords may well have never been shot. After all, there is no footage of this event, little if any testimony, no pictures or film showing her since this event other than a fully covered body on a stretcher, with even the head covered which is far from customary, or the occasional glimpse at a wrist or forearm "said to be hers". All we see is one of the Kelly Twins hanging out in a hospital room or some goon-looking doctors with military backgrounds standing by when they aren't making bizarre public declarations.


Why would the simulate such an event? Heck if I know. I can only venture a guess. It could be to distract us from larger more important issues. It could also be to prep her as a shoe in as the next first Female President or Vice-President. It could also be to use her position to put into place a doppelganger, a fake Giffords who will to the bidding of our Masters when she used to refuse. This means she might have been killed but we're awaiting the arrival of her replacement, a surgically altered coached double or even a grown programmed clone using her own DNA. Any discrepancies with the original, or incoherence and modified behavior could be passed off as a loss of memory loss due to brain damage. We'll see what we conclude when she officially re-emerges and is unveiled to the public as modern heroin with a lofty political destiny..


Regarding whether anything actually happened, who knows? The meeting was announced only one day ahead of time, probably a first ever for any form of political meeting where the public is invited to meet their representative. Also how could Jared Loughner - last seen in the desert - or any other potential suspect have even have been prepared to perpetrate a mass shooting which the Police declared was highly prepared well in advance? There is conflicting testimony from various sources of how events allegedly unfolded, and very implausible testimony from a number of the alleged surviving victims.


Then we have a trumped up suspect who denounced Mind Control, alleged victims who are professionals of CIA Mind Control at Cornell's Human Ecology Department and a shipper's rifle found on the rooftop which may have been used to kill Judge Roll which don't fit into the acts of accusation. Add to this fake mug shots, refusal to release further mugshots, a zest of outer space with a pair of NASA Twin Astronauts and the CIA's implication in importing drugs from South America through the border Giffords was trying to Shut Down and we're really into a very complicated jig.


Can we believe anything the Media has told us? Of course not. We'll just have to figure out we've been taken for fools, tared and feathered, run up the river without a paddle and turned into patsies. The joke is on us and we've only ourselves to blame for believing anything that the news sources have fed us as gospel, it is naught but mass propaganda meant to poison our minds to the truth and detract from the murder of an honest Judge and to keep drugs flowing into the USA unhampered.


GS

Thanks, Get smart. Nice to feel like I'm not completely alone and/or crazy as my friends think. I've been on the Icke forum and they've dropped it as well, so I haven't found anywhere where this matter is being discussed.

It's logical to assume that the PTB are behind this and to speculate on their motives. But what if THEY are not behind it. After all, it's so sloppy, or one might suggest farcical if you've watched Loughner's Youtube videos. Why the farce? Is it possible that someone else is behind it? Someone with a sense of humor (after all that mugshot reminds one of The Joker.) Perhaps a more benevolent force seeking to expose the media for the liars they are?

Is it possible? And if it is, who is it? What is their objective? When will they reveal the illusion?

reply to post by Getsmart


Id like to take this opportunity to say thnx for all the research you have done . I've read every post on this thread and you have gone into some deep issues .

Ive been bumping and posting in 3 JL threads ,
but now I have met you i will share my thoughts with you .

In 2008 JL was refused entry to the army but according to certain sources it was because of a marijuana habit he confessed too -
Indeed, Army officials say Loughner passed a urinalysis designed to detect drug use.
"He didn't fail a drug test — he admitted to excessive drug use," an Army official says.
The confession was so clear that the military had no choice.
"He admitted that he smoked marijuana to such an extent that we said, 'No, thank you.' We're not going to accept a habitual drug abuser into the Army

,NOTE He actually passed the aptitude test !- .........
the Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery, a 90-minute test that measures language and math skills. It ensures that the test taker is smart enough to sign up, and it pinpoints his or her strengths, which can help in choosing military jobs. Once Loughner passed that test,.....
www.time.com...



Yet 3 years later were led to believe hes a whacko nut who orchestrated the shootings typical "lone wolf " style ?

Have you researched JL's parents ? Certain neighbours have serious issues with the father Randy .

Please keep up the good work!
I support your right to research 100 %

Originally posted by Getsmart....
"....a shipper's rifle found on the rooftop which may have been used to kill Judge Roll..."

A rifle found on a roof? What is your source for that?

-----------

There was some early info that the shooter was a Afghan war vet. Interestingly, the first person in line to talk to Giffords was a US Army (vet? soldier? contractor?), who gave a couple of reasons for coming:

mobile.azstarnet.com...
Matthew Laos, 43, was the first person in line at the event. He came to talk to her about his U.S. Army assignment and show her an award he had received. "I was proud to show her the award."

politics.blogs.foxnews.com...
Laos told Fox News he met with Gabe Zimmerman, one of Gifford's staff members Friday.
"Gabe encouraged me to come by her 'Congress on the Corner' because he knew that I was interested in passing along a piece of information about her most recent legislation. I wanted to express my support for her," said Laos.

Here is some info on his background. I wonder if his job in personnel may have brought him into contact with potential recruit Jared Loughner.

www.linkedin.com...
Human Resources Officer at United States Army Reserve
United States Army Reserve
1995 — 2010 (15 years)

One more thing:

politics.blogs.foxnews.com...
Laos then got a chance to meet with Congresswoman Giffords and took a picture with her. He left just a short time before the shooting.
(oddly, he took off so fast he didn't hear any of the shooting)

You would think a photo taken just minutes before the shooting would be of interest to the public--why hasn't the media tried to get ahold of it?