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NEWS: China Warns Condoleezza Rice About Taiwan

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posted on Jul, 19 2004 @ 10:57 PM
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Originally posted by zcheng

For the relationship US and China, the understanding of American people for Chinese people is urgently needed. Most Chinese people have great admiration for US for her strength, innovation, and institutions. Chinese people are furious when talking about US bullying China in issues like supporting Taiwan independence, bombing of Embassy.



Why should we have to understand the Chinese people? It isn't like they have any say in what happens in China.

It is China who is bullying Taiwan. The bombing of the embassy was an accident, however, it was China who deliberately downed a US recon plane operating legally in international waters.




posted on Jul, 19 2004 @ 11:16 PM
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Originally posted by ludahai
It is China who is bullying Taiwan. The bombing of the embassy was an accident, however, it was China who deliberately downed a US recon plane operating legally in international waters.


This is the point I have been trying to hammer home to ZCheng adn his cabal. China is the one with all the treats not the other way around.
BTW, I don't think that the bombing of the Chinese embassy was an accident. I think it was done to send a message to China that feeding information to Milosivich could be hazardous. I have not been able to prove it, but that is my feeling.

Im also mixed on the downing of the Aries recon plane. The J-7 pilot was a whack job that would tape his e-mail address on the canopy of his plane hoping other pilots would email him. Its easy to see how he could have accidently hit the P-3 because of his poor piloting skills. Its the conduct of the ChiComs after the accident that pisses me off.


Dx2

posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 12:18 AM
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I highly doubt in my lifetime or even in my childrens lifetime will we see the united states and china or the united states and any other "non-terrorist" nation duke it out with nuclear weapons. To do so would be detrimental to both nations international relationships. Neither country would win. No war involving nuclear weapons can be won. Go watch "wargames" Should be rerun on TBS sometime soon. That's not even mentioning the significant environmental impact that would be sustained from the "numerous" atomic detonations.

Forget about slinging mud....lets forget for now...tibet, native americans, and all other bullsh@t perpetrated by either one of these two nations and try and focus on what should be done. From what i've read the united states and china have come a long way in their relationship together....even with the bit of progression made, a lot more needs to be done. Both countries need to focus on working together and creating beneficial solutions to their problems, not bullying each other into submission.

Diplomacy is far more powerful than all the bombs in the world.



posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 08:26 AM
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Originally posted by Dx2
Both countries need to focus on working together and creating beneficial solutions to their problems, not bullying each other into submission.
Diplomacy is far more powerful than all the bombs in the world.


Exactly. That is also why I posting here, to point out that war between the two great nations should be avoided.

There are too many US people like FredT, Westpoint23 think US is powerful enough to beat anyone, while leaving US intact. Yes, for countries like Iraq, Panama, Afganistan, but absolutely not for countries like Russia, China, probably also not for North Korea.



posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 08:33 AM
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Originally posted by ludahai
Why should we have to understand the Chinese people? It isn't like they have any say in what happens in China.

Because if you do not understand, US people will mindlessly support hostility against China. In Case of War, US people and Chinese people will face each other in the battlefield. China has no intention to threat US, but China has every will to defend Chinese interest like Taiwan. Taiwan not only belongs people in Taiwan, but also belongs to All Chinese people in Mainland China.

Taiwan is part of China, though self governed now. If you are so thirsty of blood, join the fight when it comes.



posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 12:46 PM
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Originally posted by zcheng

Originally posted by Dx2
Both countries need to focus on working together and creating beneficial solutions to their problems, not bullying each other into submission.
Diplomacy is far more powerful than all the bombs in the world.


Exactly. That is also why I posting here, to point out that war between the two great nations should be avoided.

There are too many US people like FredT, Westpoint23 think US is powerful enough to beat anyone, while leaving US intact. Yes, for countries like Iraq, Panama, Afganistan, but absolutely not for countries like Russia, China, probably also not for North Korea.



North Korea they cant do anything to the US even if they have a nuclear bomb and this is a big if a nuclear bomb is a very different thing from an ICBM and even if they did have an ICBM and this is an even bigger IF we can shoot it down. And if north Korea launches an ICBM at the US they will be blown in an alternate dimension and there will be a big crater glowing where North Korea once was. And wars with china or Russia if it goes nuclear every country will be destroyed not just the US.


Dx2

posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 09:08 PM
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The U.S. isn't really worried about North Korea making any hostile actions. It would seem they are more worried about the proliferation of these weapons amongst terrorist groups. North Korea might sell an atomic device to let's say Al Qaeda. They then might smuggle this device into a densely populated city, such as N.Y.C. Checkout: "The Sum of All Fears" Fantastic flick with a plot not unlike this.


The North Korean government isn't about to do something to obliterate itself...The only people who are willing to make a first-strike attack on the United States are terrorists who would prefer death. Not NK, not China, not Russia. No semi-civilized nation wants that kind of war.

That country faces enormous problems, financially and otherwise. They're mainly trying to squeeze some aide out of Washington. In return they shutdown their Uranium enrichment facility. The problem is that the U.S. doesn't want to negotiate with a country that makes threats of this nature. Both countries want to play hardball and be the one making the calls...which is why talks continually breakdown.

Another issue was about ballistic missiles........North Korea has several types of ballistic missiles in their arsenal. Scuds purchased from USSR, Nodong-1, Nodong-2, Taepodong-1, Taepodong-2. The Taepodong-2 is an ICBM class missile with a range of +3500 miles. Besides...even if they didn't have these home-brewed missiles....how hard do you think it would be for them to purchase some from the Russians or one of the many former soviet nations?

No matter....like I said before. North Korea isn't going to attack the United States. North Korea will sell their weapons to a terrorist organization that will use them to attack the United States.

These are the issues that need to be discussed.


Dx2

posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 09:34 PM
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Another aspect could possibly be just like with India and Pakistan. Those two countries are being taken much more seriously in international summits now that they have gone nuclear. Maybe the North Korean government seeks the same sort of respect....my hunch: it's a little bit of both.



posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 09:42 PM
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The two main threats the US has is China and India mostly because of their population numbers. China has the largest military in the world but that does not concern the US all too much because they have no way to move those troops to the US fast enough...China has it own problems and is struggling with itself and the fact that the majority of their pop is older people...remember the limit on children they could have...well that little population plan back fired and now they are waiting it out..China is a sleeping giant who is waiting to attack at the perfect time sometime in the future...China is our greatest enemy....


Dx2

posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 10:20 PM
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Terrorism is the biggest threat.


Dx2

posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 10:24 PM
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The only possible way I see China and India threatening anything is if you look at it in context of the world and the environment. Populations in those two countries are a scary thing. Without some sort of restriction on childbirth I can see carrying capacity being demolished and the planet plunging into a nasty era of famine and plague. This however applies to every country...the U.S. included.



posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 11:02 PM
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Originally posted by Dx2
No matter....like I said before. North Korea isn't going to attack the United States. North Korea will sell their weapons to a terrorist organization that will use them to attack the United States.


What about the scenario that PTB sets off a nuke in a mid-sized US city, then blame on Al-Queda, and point to source to North Korea? There are rumors in the Internet about such nuke attack.

How will US react, How will US people react?

We know it was done before so PTB could set off the schedule of PNAC. Will they get away with it again? I think they can, with so many US people blindly following their mass media propaganda and their idiotic leaders.



posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 11:04 PM
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Originally posted by Dx2
Without some sort of restriction on childbirth I can see carrying capacity being demolished and the planet plunging into a nasty era of famine and plague. This however applies to every country...the U.S. included.

Why US is continually attacking birth control policy in China? I do hope the policy will be more flexible in near future.



posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 11:27 PM
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Originally posted by zcheng
Why US is continually attacking birth control policy in China? I do hope the policy will be more flexible in near future.


Is it true that any extra children that do not get aborted are "terminated" right after the birthing process. The questions about your birthing policy stem from the fact that are ruthlessly enforced. This with the obsession of first born sons leads to the grapic pictures of the baby in the gutter we debated back and forth on several threads.

While China does need to rein in her population (India is in a similar boat) what people object to is the draconian methods used by your government. But this is now waaaaaay off topic. Lets get back to the matter of your countires agression against Taiwan


Dx2

posted on Jul, 20 2004 @ 11:53 PM
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Originally posted by zcheng

Originally posted by Dx2
No matter....like I said before. North Korea isn't going to attack the United States. North Korea will sell their weapons to a terrorist organization that will use them to attack the United States.


What about the scenario that PTB sets off a nuke in a mid-sized US city, then blame on Al-Queda, and point to source to North Korea? There are rumors in the Internet about such nuke attack.

How will US react, How will US people react?

We know it was done before so PTB could set off the schedule of PNAC. Will they get away with it again? I think they can, with so many US people blindly following their mass media propaganda and their idiotic leaders.



I was saying more or less that North Korea would not launch an attack themselves. I never discussed anyone blaming them for an attack.



posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 12:27 AM
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Originally posted by Dx2
I never discussed anyone blaming them for an attack.

I do not imply that you suggested that. I am just posting a possible scenario and analyze how US will react.

There will be major events happen before Nov election, as the last attempt for Bush to stay in power. I am just trying to figure out what it might be.



posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 12:52 AM
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Originally posted by zcheng

There will be major events happen before Nov election, as the last attempt for Bush to stay in power. I am just trying to figure out what it might be.


Nope, an attack by Al Qaeda or other terrorists will probably happen, but we will have elections on time.

No dictatorship here, you are looking at the wrong country if you are looking for dictatorships. If you look down from South Florida in any map, a little island about 90 miles from Florida, that's a dictatorship. A bit more down from Cuba, in south America you will find some dictatorships too.
If you look over the Atlantic, or the Pacific to the next biggest continent, you will find dictatorships there too, the other continent down from Europe also has some dictatorships. But none in the US.

[edit on 21-7-2004 by Muaddib]



posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 02:22 AM
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Originally posted by zcheng
China has no intention to threat US, but China has every will to defend Chinese interest like Taiwan. Taiwan not only belongs people in Taiwan, but also belongs to All Chinese people in Mainland China.

Taiwan is part of China, though self governed now. If you are so thirsty of blood, join the fight when it comes.


Ok, I guess then your officials were kidding when they said war with the US is inevitable, and that they must fight the war in their terms, pretty much to win...


Speaking at the PLA's Military Command College in December 1999, Defense Minister Chi Haotian painted a stark picture of Communist China's future relations with the United States. "Seen from the changes in the world situation and the United States' hegemonic strategy for creating monopolarity, war is inevitable," Chi said. "We cannot avoid it. The issue is that the Chinese armed forces must control the initiative of this war."


Excerpted from.
www.insightmag.com...



posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 09:26 AM
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Originally posted by Muaddib
war is inevitable," Chi said. "We cannot avoid it. The issue is that the Chinese armed forces must control the initiative of this war.


In fact, this is determined by the US policy to disrupt any country that has the promise to surpass US. I do not think US has the right to rip China the opportunity to develop itself. That is in the interest of All Chinese.

Unless US mends its hostile policy toward Chinese development, I do not think this war is avoidable. In this sense, Chi is right. Taiwan is just a point in US chessboard against China.



posted on Jul, 21 2004 @ 09:32 AM
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Originally posted by Muaddib
Nope, an attack by Al Qaeda or other terrorists will probably happen, but we will have elections on time.
No dictatorship here, you are looking at the wrong country if you are looking for dictatorships.

Even if there is election in Nov, Bush and his cabal will use it for re-election.
What I see is the similarity between 9/11 and Reichtag Fire in early 1930, between Iraq and Poland in WW2.

I see most dictatorships in US supported nations like in Middle East, and Latin America, Africa. US do not like democratically elected governments like Haiti, Venezula, etc, when they do not follow US closely.



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