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Did aliens make Stonhenge or the Pyramids? Maybe not...Cool Video

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posted on Jan, 9 2011 @ 11:49 PM
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reply to post by Arbitrageur
 


Okay so please show me what technique they would have used for cutting granite

And its not that I dont think this guy is a genious, however it is FAR from explaining things like the pyramids, and the sphinx. Think about how many stones they moved. How many of those contraptions are you going to set up to move each stone. No those monuments where built because whoever built them didnt think it was more difficult then us putting a skyscraper up today.

I bet stone henge was FAR more beautiful and larger and more grand then we can ever imagine. That goes for the rest of the ancient monuments. What we are seeing are remnents, after nature has beat at them for 1000s and 1000s of years.


edit on 9-1-2011 by Ghandi because: (no reason given)

edit on 9-1-2011 by Ghandi because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:05 AM
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Now that looks a whole lot simpler than aliens travelling all the way here to arrange a few stones



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:12 AM
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reply to post by ziggyproductions05
 


Of course both Stonehenge and the Pyramids were built by human beings, to suggest anything else without providing evidence is absurd and flies in the face of everything we've learned about civilization and our own past. The video is pretty cool but I think its kinda sad if we need a youtube video to put the idea that aliens built stonehenge to bed...



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:32 AM
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still doesn't explain how stones were raised and placed on top of the other stones, or how exactly they were "rolled" uphill using his method.



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:47 AM
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reply to post by Ghandi
 





Okay so please show me what technique they would have used for cutting granite


Yes please do. since I am a mason I would like to know
I would be a friggn loaded with cash
remember some of the stones in the pyramids are over 30 tonne, Ghandi they weren't granite it was limestone ( Pyramids), cuts like butter, but still to cut those blocks so precise so large, still boggles my mind,

You give me a life time and I could carve you a sphinx. but too raise it that high without breaking, ( remember limestone) I don't know but have a theory


I have made this post before. They dug a huge hole, then they laid the blocks, filling it in as the structure went up. then over time, the shifting sands across the desert eroded what we see too day. Only theory that I have heard which has some logic behind it, without involving Aliens

This video is great, I use some of these techniques today, but the Pyramids is another whole ball game. Stone Hendge, easy, but what about some of the stones in Asia/ South Pacific, that where stones that cant be found in that area ?, carvings/ stones weighing 10 tonnes +, sitting on mountain hills, how did they do that ?.

I for one hope I know this mystery before I die, since I am a mason


Wal



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:58 AM
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Originally posted by Ghandi
Okay so please show me what technique they would have used for cutting granite


"Mechanical Methods" in "The Pyramids and Temples of Gizeh"


"That the Egyptians were acquainted with a cutting jewel far harder than quartz, and that they used this jewel as a sharp pointed graver, is put beyond doubt by the diorite bowls with inscriptions of the fourth dynasty, of which I found fragments at Gizeh...

"That the blades of the saw were of bronze, we know from the green staining on the sides of the saw cuts, and on grains of sand left in a saw cut.
But that's an older reference, here's a more modern one:

www.rps.psu.edu...


According to Redford, ancient Egyptian quarrying methods—the processes for cutting and removing stone—are still being studied. Scholars have found evidence that copper chisels were using for quarrying sandstone and limestone, for example, but harder stones such as granite and diorite would have required stronger materials, says Redford. Dolerite, a hard, black igneous rock, was used in the quarries of Aswan to remove granite.

During excavation, massive dolerite “pounders” were used to pulverize the stone around the edge of the granite block that needed to be extracted. According to Redford, 60 to 70 men would pound out the stone. At the bottom, they rammed wooden pegs into slots they had cut, and filled the slots with water. The pegs would expand, splitting the stone, and the block was then slid down onto a waiting boat.


There's also a guy who thinks the Egyptians acquired iron tools via trading, though I'm not convinced of that:
www.cheops-pyramide.ch...

Franz Löhner doesn't allege, that the ancient Egyptians already knew the difficult and elaborate procedure of making wrought iron - but, that they acquired the valuable iron by trading. The Egyptian smiths then made tools from this iron or at least were able to maintain (= temper and sharpen) the tools acquired.

In the granite quarries in Assuan the stone working was done as follows: Granite grows in layers or sheets (beds). Quarrying takes a keen eye to determine the grain of the rock. The foreman (or rockman) chooses the place where the rock is intact. Then the stone is cleaved from the rock face by driving in wedges. A series of holes is now drilled along the line to be split, using a chisel (not a drill!)...

A stone block split off with this method breaks cleanly and regularly and needs very little additional work.

So, whether the wedges were iron chisels as he claims, or pieces of wood with water added to them as others claim, the granite splits off pretty cleanly when this type of pressure is applied, you can see the crack forming in the photo in almost a straight line. They obviously had mineral tips for their tools tools harder than granite that could score that line between the holes to make it even straighter.

Whichever method they used, iron or not, it doesn't seem necessary to invoke aliens.



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 01:13 AM
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Originally posted by Ghandi
Okay so please show me what technique they would have used for cutting granite


"Mechanical Methods" in "The Pyramids and Temples of Gizeh"


"That the Egyptians were acquainted with a cutting jewel far harder than quartz, and that they used this jewel as a sharp pointed graver, is put beyond doubt by the diorite bowls with inscriptions of the fourth dynasty, of which I found fragments at Gizeh...

"That the blades of the saw were of bronze, we know from the green staining on the sides of the saw cuts, and on grains of sand left in a saw cut.
But that's an older reference, here's a more modern one:

www.rps.psu.edu...


According to Redford, ancient Egyptian quarrying methods—the processes for cutting and removing stone—are still being studied. Scholars have found evidence that copper chisels were using for quarrying sandstone and limestone, for example, but harder stones such as granite and diorite would have required stronger materials, says Redford. Dolerite, a hard, black igneous rock, was used in the quarries of Aswan to remove granite.

During excavation, massive dolerite “pounders” were used to pulverize the stone around the edge of the granite block that needed to be extracted. According to Redford, 60 to 70 men would pound out the stone. At the bottom, they rammed wooden pegs into slots they had cut, and filled the slots with water. The pegs would expand, splitting the stone, and the block was then slid down onto a waiting boat.


There's also a guy who thinks the Egyptians acquired wrought iron tools via trading, though I'm not convinced of that:
www.cheops-pyramide.ch...

Franz Löhner doesn't allege, that the ancient Egyptians already knew the difficult and elaborate procedure of making wrought iron - but, that they acquired the valuable iron by trading. The Egyptian smiths then made tools from this iron or at least were able to maintain (= temper and sharpen) the tools acquired.

In the granite quarries in Assuan the stone working was done as follows: Granite grows in layers or sheets (beds). Quarrying takes a keen eye to determine the grain of the rock. The foreman (or rockman) chooses the place where the rock is intact. Then the stone is cleaved from the rock face by driving in wedges. A series of holes is now drilled along the line to be split, using a chisel (not a drill!)...

A stone block split off with this method breaks cleanly and regularly and needs very little additional work.

So, whether the wedges were iron chisels as he claims, or pieces of wood with water added to them as others claim, the granite splits off pretty cleanly when this type of pressure is applied, you can see the crack forming in the photo in almost a straight line. They obviously had mineral tips for their tools tools harder than granite that could score that line between the holes to make it even straighter.

Whichever method they used, wrought iron, or dolerite with wooden pegs soaked with water (probably the latter), it doesn't seem necessary to invoke aliens.



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 01:45 AM
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reply to post by Arbitrageur
 



If their method was so effective mate why don't we use these methods today?

sorry I don't buy it, if you understood about masonry and not just some guy reading a text book, they/you would understand, its not that easy, trust me

We have now plasma cutting that could cut these stones, but before that, your stone selection would be like winning lotto, and to build what. a pyramid ?

Buy the way I have read every link on the net trying to come up with an answer, it isn't as clear cut ( excuse the pun) as you suggest, besides what any scientist says.

I am on the fence, what about other parts of the world Arbitrageur, They had knowledge that we haven't got now, that is the mystery

Wal



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 02:01 AM
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Originally posted by auswally
If their method was so effective mate why don't we use these methods today?
How many methods that we use for anything today are unchanged over the last few thousand years? Are you serious?


sorry I don't buy it, if you understood about masonry and not just some guy reading a text book, they/you would understand, its not that easy, trust me
I trust you didn't read the sources I cited which said it's not easy, it's very hard.


I am on the fence, what about other parts of the world Arbitrageur, They had knowledge that we haven't got now, that is the mystery
Well one thing we wouldn't even consider today is tying a rope around something and getting 100 guys to pull on the rope. But that would have been considered before our modern mechanization.

Sure we haven't recorded every detail of every construction method used around the world so there are bound to be some mysteries. But the answer is pretty simple to me. We're pretty smart monkeys, so were our ancestors. Maybe they did figure out how to do something, didn't record it and we don't know how to duplicate it today, is that really so shocking? According to my tour guide when I toured the Johnson Space Center, we can't even send a man to the moon today, and we did that only 5 decades ago. We could probably figure out how to do it again a different, maybe better way, but we can't even duplicate what we did back then because many of the components used aren't even manufactured anymore.



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 02:31 AM
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reply to post by Arbitrageur
 





I trust you didn't read the sources I cited which said it's not easy, it's very hard.


eggsactely, not only have I read your links but thousands of others, remember I am a stonemason
if I could make my job easier I would, and I would investigated it trust me.

Do you even understand the principles of what your fantastic links suggest , I will say one word for you and its called fracture lines. I suggest you investigate it before you post your fantastic links again, sorry if I sound aggressive but what you think is not easy or very hard is virtually imposable , besides what some guy from this century writes about, and you believe him, wow

As I said I want to know before I die

Wal



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 03:06 AM
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Originally posted by auswally
besides what some guy from this century writes about, and you believe him, wow
So I take it nobody in this century has a clue about what they're writing about, according to you?

We agreed it's hard and not easy so I'm not sure what the problem is.
edit on 10-1-2011 by Arbitrageur because: clarification



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 06:32 AM
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reply to post by Arbitrageur
 





So I take it nobody in this century has a clue about what they're writing about, according to you?


please quote me where I said that, stop trying to dig a hole for me when your hole is already big enough


Stonemasonry is one of the oldest professions on this planet don't kid ya self

Wal



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 06:37 AM
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Originally posted by auswally
please quote me where I said that
I provided a quote from you and tried to interpret it, if my interpretation is incorrect, perhaps you can clarify what you meant.



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 06:52 AM
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reply to post by Arbitrageur
 



Easy Stonemasonry is one of the oldest trades/ professions that has come from thousands of years of learning. past down through the masons ( freemasons) If some guy/ women and I don't care who he/ she is, reckons they have cracked that golden egg, please show me the research and that golden egg, As I said before it is still a major mystery in our history and not one person has even come close.

WE CAN NOT RECREATE THAT GOLDEN EGG, without machinery
Do you agree or not Arbitrageur

Wal

Ps you investigated fracture lines yet
Then just maybe you may understand a mason, its what we look for, no matter how big or small the stone is



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 08:36 AM
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Originally posted by auswally
WE CAN NOT RECREATE THAT GOLDEN EGG, without machinery
Do you agree or not Arbitrageur
I'm not sure what you mean by "golden egg". But what do you think about the the unfinished granite obelisk which cracked and was left in place, which shows some evidence of the stone cutting techniques used to remove that?

www.reshafim.org.il...


An unfinished obelisk carved from the rock was not yet completely detached when it cracked. This is always a risk when quarrying. As layers are removed, the pressures on the freshly exposed rock change, different parts expand at different rates, and the rock reacts by fissuring. When these are more than micro fissures, the rock becomes useless.
One can still see the pits made by diabase hammer stones, which were used to pulverize the granite in order to shape it. Wet sand and sandstone were then used to burnish the surface. This obelisk, if it had been successfully detached would have weighed more than a thousand tons, three to six times as much as ordinary obelisks.
Now that only provides evidence regarding how that particular stone was cut, and other methods may have been used to remove other granite stones. It's an ongoing topic of study. But look at the marks made where granite was quarried at Aswan:



Don't those marks provide some clues about how the granite stones were removed?



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 08:41 AM
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We discussed him a bit in this thread about Stonehenge.

See what you think.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


I don't think he has all the answers. Just a possibility of how it may have been done. And, he only is doing to scale-if I remember correctly. Not the full size.



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 09:52 AM
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Originally posted by anon72
I don't think he has all the answers. Just a possibility of how it may have been done. And, he only is doing to scale-if I remember correctly. Not the full size.
He did make a small scale test arch years ago, as seen in the OP video.

But his latest block can't be scaled back too much, look at the size of it:
www.theforgottentechnology.com...
It's over 20,000 pounds. I'm pretty sure I could do what Wally Wallington is doing. And I think I could stack a 3rd block on top all by myself, as long as it doesn't break, it's a long block. All I'd need is some lumber to use as levers and some bricks to make support stacks out of while I'm lifting it. But it would take me a long time to do it, it would go a lot faster with help.

I'm guessing the reason he doesn't show how he stacks the top block on his website is because he has to leave something unseen for the DVDs he's selling?
edit on 10-1-2011 by Arbitrageur because: clarification



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 01:51 AM
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reply to post by Arbitrageur
 





I'm not sure what you mean by "golden egg". But what do you think about the the unfinished granite obelisk which cracked and was left in place, which shows some evidence of the stone cutting techniques used to remove that?


Yep like you, they didn't read up on fracture lines


Golden egg is proof how they cut these stones with utmost precision, then transported them ( in some cases hundreds of miles), then up a jungle hill or up the side of the pyramids, Your links which I have seen before don't cut it




Wal



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 04:50 AM
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Originally posted by auswally


I'm not sure what you mean by "golden egg". But what do you think about the the unfinished granite obelisk which cracked and was left in place, which shows some evidence of the stone cutting techniques used to remove that?
Yep like you, they didn't read up on fracture lines
Well the reason they never finished extracting that obelisk, is because it fractured while they were trying to extract it. Would that have something to do with fracture lines? I tried googling that but didn't have much luck, have you got a link where I can read more about that?



posted on Jan, 11 2011 @ 06:02 AM
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reply to post by Arbitrageur
 






Well the reason they never finished extracting that obelisk,



Thats Astrix's mate isnt it


I give up, keep reading text books

Wal
edit on 11-1-2011 by auswally because: (no reason given)



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