BREAKING Gabrielle Giffords Shot: Congresswoman Reportedly Shot In Arizona [UPDATED]

One of the main reason people think the "good old days" were so much better is because things were not as widely reported as they are now. Towns actively would try to keep things hush hush to protect the image of said town. And when they did happen, the authorities were quick to try to point at a "vagrant passing through" rather than investigate the people of their towns. Look at the shoddy work in the investigation of the Martha Moxley murder(I think I spelled her name right) for example. Also as someone pointed out, the whole selective memory thing. Most people tend to remember the good, and push the bad to the back of their minds.

Neal Boortz is loosing it on CNN right now...CNN 3:46PM PST I respect this anchor, I do not know how he does it. Who is Neal Boortz? He's defending Palin, he is sure Politico's mission was to "pin" the shooting on the Tea Party. Politco does so much vetting, fact checking "yawn" its over when they finally post. Boortz decried the Sheriff as violent for speaking out against the "vitriol" in the current political environment. Accused the Sheriff of adding to the violence. Then he attacks the President as violent and contributing to the violence in the country with hate speech.

CNN plays the original 911 call:

911 Shooting at Safeway shooter ran it says not attacked by two guys ... some one is talking to the guy on the 911 call and 911 says "Oh my God.""

OKAY ...We have a lie. The original 911 call says the shooter shot and then ran away. No one tackled him to stop the shooting. Two heroes were described as having tackled the shooter to stop the crime. I remember that clearly.

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by ckstarling

Originally posted by spy66
reply to post by ckstarling

 

What this guy really needed was some proper friends to share his views with. That is what common people within a community should do.

Secondarily, I couldn't agree with you more about the necessity of community on every level. But it should be noted that some people resist community, even if it is offered/present/accessible. There will be loners regardless.

edit on 9-1-2011 by ckstarling because: HTML

But this guy was screaming for a audience. This guy seams very eager to share his visions with others, and teach how he understand our current system. He would never have made YouTube videos if he wanted to be alone.

After seeing his YouTube videos. it seams that he really has a message to tell, because he is on to something.

1. He clearly understands that people dont understand what they read. That is what he means with grammar or illiterate people.

::::Everyone thinks they can read, and everyone thinks that they understands everything that they read. But the truth is only a fraction does.

2. He also tries to tell people who lacks getting their grammar right. That authority uses our lack of grammar and reading skills as a mechanism to rewrite the constitution.

He was actually not any different then anyone else here about he's views. It was how he acted upon he's views that differed from most of us. And that could have been prevented.
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If this was the case, why did he disable comments for all of his videos? Strange, indeed. He went from 300 views to 1,000,000 in less than 24 hours. That is not strange though.

Hi guys, sorry I am late so my apology if this was already discussed:

Anyone have an idea or can investigate where and by whom Gifford's name was crossed in red on the crosshair hit list?

Here's how it appeared on the internet after it was taken down on Palin's site:

Originally posted by TKDRL
One of the main reason people think the "good old days" were so much better is because things were not as widely reported as they are now. Towns actively would try to keep things hush hush to protect the image of said town. And when they did happen, the authorities were quick to try to point at a "vagrant passing through" rather than investigate the people of their towns. Look at the shoddy work in the investigation of the Martha Moxley murder(I think I spelled her name right) for example. Also as someone pointed out, the whole selective memory thing. Most people tend to remember the good, and push the bad to the back of their minds

Absolutely! Mentally ill? Warehouse them and lock the door.

Now if we can just get past those of ancient archaic mindsets today - - - that interfere with science and the realities of over population.

OK - - - back to topic.

As one girl mentioned - - - he seemed normal until after suffering alcohol poisoning. Could he have damaged his brain?

It does seem he is not in his right mind.

reply to post by LooseLipsSinkShips


There is nothing odd about disabling the commenting section. At least not on YouTube.

There is a difference in wanting to discus a topic and being mocked about your topic.

Originally posted by LooseLipsSinkShips

Originally posted by old_god
Originally posted by old_god
Not had a full read through this topic but thought I would read the last few pages and take a look at this Jared guy.

His youtube profile is fake in my opinion:


Had a look at some of the Erad3 posts, this dude was in some kind of semi lucid state based on his writing suggesting he was probably high on something much stronger than just good old weed.

edit on 9-1-2011 by old_god because: oops

What kind of drug do you think he was on? Acid? Shrooms?

Something pretty intense, Interestingly I studied about the effects of these types of drugs ages ago (and from my own hazy past).

I think whatever he was on was chemical based and very powerful. Strong enough that it caused a total psychological change and/or breakdown of the mental defences (one has) which allowed for his personality to be changed or corrupted in some way.

Drugs are often seen as a door way and maybe there is some truth to that but I don't want to make assumptions on this subject.

Looking at what's out there (especially across the pond in the USA) and doing comparisons, I would make a guess and say he was on some kind of amphetamine and/or synthetic drug that caused this kind of extreme mental change.

I witnessed the effects of the European drug Meow Meow on a person at friends birthday party a year ago and this dude was out there. Total personality change to the point he was almost speaking in tongues (much like Erad3, who seems to be writing in tongues so to speak).

When he came down many hours later he was adamant he knew what was going on but his state of mind had drastically altered, where at one point he felt like someone else was in his body or his personality was no longer attached to his body (dissociative effects).

Combine the above with an addictive and/or damaged personality and you have a recipe for disaster.

My thoughts anyway, there are probably much more qualified and learned people out there who could take this off as a side topic.

Originally posted by makeitso
Statement of Probable Cause Filed in Phoenix

On January 8, 2011, a search warrant was executed at 7741 N. Soledad Avenue in Tucson Arizona, where LOUGHNER resides. Some of the evidence seized from that location included a letter in a safe, addressed to "Mr. Jared Loughney" [sic] at 7741 N. Soledad Avenue, from Congresswoman Giffords, on Congressional stationary, dated August 30, 2007, thanking him for attending a "Congress on your Corner" event at the Foothills Mall in Tucson. Also recovered in the safe was an envelope with handwriting on the envelope stating "I planned ahead" and My assassination" and the name "Giffords," along with what appears to be LOUGHNER's signature.

U.S. Cites Evidence of Assassination Plot

Court documents filed in the U.S. District Court in Phoenix indicated that evidence seized from Mr. Loughner’s home showed that he had planned to kill Representative Gabrielle Giffords, who was in critical condition with a gunshot wound to the head. Found in Mr. Loughner’s home, F.B.I. special agent Tony M. Tayler Jr. said in an affidavit supporting the charges, was an envelope with the handwritten words, "I planned ahead," "My assassination," and "Giffords."

edit on 1/9/11 by makeitso because: (no reason given)

Sounds like if it was a PSY-OP or MKULTRA, they went the extra mile to ensure that the insanity plea could not be. They were sure to have an envelope with the words "I planned ahead" at Jared's home. I think that virtually guarantees that he gets the death penalty and will be dead 3 to 4 years from now.

reply to post by LooseLipsSinkShips


So if I am reading it right, it was an envelope that said:

I planned ahead,
My assassination,
Gliffords

If that is true, it sounds to me like a failed attempt at trying to copy his "writing style".

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by TKDRL
One of the main reason people think the "good old days" were so much better is because things were not as widely reported as they are now. Towns actively would try to keep things hush hush to protect the image of said town. And when they did happen, the authorities were quick to try to point at a "vagrant passing through" rather than investigate the people of their towns. Look at the shoddy work in the investigation of the Martha Moxley murder(I think I spelled her name right) for example. Also as someone pointed out, the whole selective memory thing. Most people tend to remember the good, and push the bad to the back of their minds

Absolutely! Mentally ill? Warehouse them and lock the door.

Now if we can just get past those of ancient archaic mindsets today - - - that interfere with science and the realities of over population.

OK - - - back to topic.

As one girl mentioned - - - he seemed normal until after suffering alcohol poisoning. Could he have damaged his brain?

It does seem he is not in his right mind.

------------------------
Because, of course, meanness is soooooo mentally healthy! Let's not throw out the baby with the bathwater, okay. Perhaps SOME people from "the good old days" are deluded; not all of us are. Keep what's good and allow normal human evolution/progression to occur, as well. (to fix what wasn't so good). The sense of community, having neighbors watch out for one another was/is good and is sorely lacking in today's society. I still think that PERHAPS if Jared Loughner's close friends/associates/neighbors/friends took actual measures to help him, this tragedy may have been avoided. I, too, like crimvelvet grew up in a close-knit small town. There were no murders, etc. A little girl got kidnapped and murdered in a town about 50 miles away during my early teens...it was news for months--stuff like that just did not happen. We, too, took care of the town drunk's family. Were some people molesting/raping their own children, keeping it "hush hush"? Yes, I'm sure. But that's still going on today, isn't it? Women still aren't 100% getting properly paid today, are they? ETC. Yet, progress is being made in many of these "not so good" areas.
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Thanks to the person who shared about the past connection between Giffords and Loughner.

Originally posted by Habit4ming
Because, of course, meanness is soooooo mentally healthy!

Does this relate to something?

Keep what's good and allow normal human evolution/progression to occur, as well. (to fix what wasn't so good

From my first post: Yes - there was some good things. But I would not trade the "safety" of being a "company man" - - for the individual freedoms we have today.

The sense of community, having neighbors watch out for one another was/is good and is sorely lacking in today's society.

My hubby says the destruction of America came with the destruction of the Front Porch. So we agree.

I still think that PERHAPS if Jared Loughner's close friends/associates/neighbors/friends took actual measures to help him, . . .

Do you know they didn't? Also - disturbed people often try to act "normal" around their family and friends.

Women still aren't 100% getting properly paid today, are they?

Nope - women still have to fight for professional equality.

Again - I am 64. I actually lived the era being referred to.

Was it simpler? Maybe. Was it Real? No - not really. Everyone played a role.

The Hippie Generation was the beginning of making everything Real. Some people might want to go back to the time of the Beaver - - - and role play - - - but it just wasn't real.

I prefer REAL.

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by Habit4ming
Because, of course, meanness is soooooo mentally healthy!

Does this relate to something?

Keep what's good and allow normal human evolution/progression to occur, as well. (to fix what wasn't so good

From my first post: Yes - there was some good things. But I would not trade the "safety" of being a "company man" - - for the individual freedoms we have today.

The sense of community, having neighbors watch out for one another was/is good and is sorely lacking in today's society.

My hubby says the destruction of America came with the destruction of the Front Porch. So we agree.

I still think that PERHAPS if Jared Loughner's close friends/associates/neighbors/friends took actual measures to help him, . . .

Do you know they didn't? Also - disturbed people often try to act "normal" around their family and friends.

Women still aren't 100% getting properly paid today, are they?

Nope - women still have to fight for professional equality.

Again - I am 64. I actually lived the era being referred to.

Was it simpler? Maybe. Was it Real? No - not really. Everyone played a role.

The Hippie Generation was the beginning of making everything Real. Some people might want to go back to the time of the Beaver - - - and role play - - - but it just wasn't real.

I prefer REAL.

---------------------------------
I think I owe you an apology here, Annee. I think I misinterpreted your first response. I thought you were saying that those who liked anything about "the good old days" were mentally ill--which I considered a mean and nasty statement. After re-reading, I think you may have meant that the mentally ill were locked away, disposed of...which, unfortunately, years ago was true. Many many years ago, before my time even, women with loose morals could be locked away in a mental institution...and frequently were. Sad, really.
Perhaps Jared's friends/family tried to help him somewhat, but, imo, not enough. Unless things have changed drastically since I worked in the mental health profession, parents could FORCEABLY admit even their adult children to a facility for help. Of course, after 3 days if the doctors felt otherwise, that person could be released back into society. Maybe I am expecting too much of "ordinary" people; because I worked in the profession, maybe mental illness is more readily obvious to me and I've concluded that it would be obvious to others, as well. I'll have to give that some more thought.
I was around for the Hippie Era. I cannot speak for all previous generations, but I considered my parents and grandparents and even great grand-parents (longevity in my family) quite reality-based...so there I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree...

Sometimes people get sad, mad or upset because people don't understand them.

People who consider themselves intellectuals or superior in some way then often become snooty about it. The scientists running the LHC are a great example of this. So is Mr.Insane in this case.

I can understand why this is frustrating to people.

If people don't understand you, it behooves you to consider that you aren't communicating in an understandable way and to rectify it.

Ranting about grammar won't do it. Neither will getting snooty about how people are too stupid to understand your ever so important self.

Originally posted by Habit4ming

I think I owe you an apology here, Annee.

Thanks - but no need. Respect for honest discussion works for me. If we all agreed it would be a waste of time - - not to mention boring.

I'm not saying people weren't based in reality - - because I think they were. It was at that time more of a society of defined roles. It is the "roles" I am saying are not real.

Hey my hobby is social/cultural anthropology - - - I could talk on this stuff for hours. But I don't want to derail the thread.

So back to Jared. I really think it is way too early to judge his family or those close to him.

Hey folks, how do you like this one?

www.facebook.com...

I think you have to be logged in to see the ABC news link. The text with the link.

"ABC News and Facebook give you the latest on the tragic shooting in Arizona. Tune in to ABCNews.com now and join the conversation by logging in to the live stream application with your Facebook Login. More coverage will begin at 9 AM PT, 12 PM ET tomorrow. Which questions about the tragedy would you like ABC News to cover?"

So, does ABC news have Facebook in their pocket now? Maybe ABC news thought they needed to "set the truthers straight?" Because you know this story could be used to further the "homegrown terrorist" agenda to censor us. Or the agenda to disarm the public agenda.

I did find it interesting, so I posted it.

Troy

reply to post by cybertroy


I think Facebook just did it because they're asking for questions and trying to do CNN-style "Your Facebook post could be on TV! Express your opinion (that will be carefully selected from hundreds or thousands to imply that your perspective is popular) now!" viewer feedback and I guess ABC and Facebook have some kind of promotional deal. I'd guess that it's something where ABC gets X number of times when they can tell Facebook to make a post like that or they pay Facebook $Y dollars each time and then Facebook posts that they're "working with" ABC to provide coverage (even though it barely counts as collaboration... Facebook gets an email telling them what to say and where to link to and then they make a post and send the link to ABC so ABC's people can read the comments and air them). It's just a silly game the media and social networks play to get cross-promotion. Facebook gets more ad impressions and new or more active members and the news networks get viewers to tell them what spin they want on their news stories and to believe that the networks are really listening to them (which they are, but not because they give a crap. It's just a ploy to get viewers more engaged and less likely to tune away.)

reply to post by logicalthinking

I read the first linked article and was astonished to learn that Sarah Palin had a "crosshairs-styled TARGET" to show that this poor lady was up for "removal" or... worse. I think that politicians need to be VERY CAREFUL about the fashion in which they choose to illustrate a passionate point. Putting anyone or anyone's district/region in crosshairs is irresponsible in the greatest degree. Some idiot, some nut-job like this guy is going to take the bait.

Palin and people like her need to stop spreading lies about death squads going to put your grandparents to sleep. That kind of irresponsible and false talk will get more deranged individuals to take up that false torch and more of this is going to happen. Eventually, what comes around goes around, for everyone, and many people spreading such lies and exaggerations might find themselves on the receiving end of a situation that they helped create.

America is based upon the peaceful transition of power. We're based on heated, passionate AND NON-VIOLENT debate. When this kind of violence becomes commonplace, be ready for the police state that will surely follow. We may strongly disagree with each other, but at the end of the day we're AMERICANS.

Of course, greedy bankers have destroyed our once resilient economy and now people are starting to come apart at the seams. The majority of the evil in this country is generated by people who make more than 10 million dollars a year, who make 20 million dollars in a severance package because they did a poor job. Middle class folks can't afford health care and these greedy bankers spend millions on a single birthday celebration for one of their kids. A situation like this happened in a European country a few centuries ago, and the solution was pretty dramatic.

Originally posted by GhostLancer
reply to post by logicalthinking
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Palin and people like her need to stop spreading lies about death squads going to put your grandparents to sleep. That kind of irresponsible and false talk will get more deranged individuals to take up that false torch and more of this is going to happen. Eventually, what comes around goes around, for everyone, and many people spreading such lies and exaggerations might find themselves on the receiving end of a situation that they helped create.

I saw someone mention Neil Bortz. That one is a real flame-thrower. HATEmongering to the core of his (soul?) I wish that, for EVERY right wing hate radio talker, there would be a progressive one, like Thom Hartman, Mike Malloy and Randi Rhodes ***right next*** to the "conservative" one. How would that be unfair or infringement of some sort?

There must be a way to know for sure when Gifford subscribed to her assailant's youtube channel. That is just too freaky.

How do we get Google to preserve that information?

Originally posted by GhostLancer.

Of course, greedy bankers have destroyed our once resilient economy and now people are starting to come apart at the seams. The majority of the evil in this country is generated by people who make more than 10 million dollars a year, who make 20 million dollars in a severance package because they did a poor job. Middle class folks can't afford health care and these greedy bankers spend millions on a single birthday celebration for one of their kids. A situation like this happened in a European country a few centuries ago, and the solution was pretty dramatic.

You sure like your free speech. I wonder if anyone takes a shot at some "greedy bankers" or the "rich" are you going to take responsibility for their actions. I mean you are laying the blame for all our problems on them. Am I for the Federal Reserve system? No, but your own words are sort of hypocritical.

Palin is a well known NRA supporter, hunter, and second amendment advocate. She has never called for violence against anyone. If she has, please give the full quotes and/or video. Using a target on a map is a symbol, not declaring "Hey, go shoot these people in opposition to me." It's more like, "This is the region we are targeting to get our message out in and raise money to defeat those on a different political agenda." I wonder how many times we can find examples of the liberal's in politics using the word target. I mean it wasn't that long ago that people on tv or radio talk shows that leaned liberal outright called for conservatives deaths and heads.

I think it's the hypocrisy that gets people upset. I know I am sick of it. I said it yesterday, this would be used to attack Palin, the Tea Party, gun rights, and conservatives. It's just too bad the killer wasn't wearing a Palin 2012 t-shirt when he did this, but then again his political views have been formed from many groups. Also notice how ATS is pretty quiet on the whole animal death issue? Wow, I wonder what else we are not paying attention to now.