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Marine vet's 20-foot flagpole has homeowners association filing suit over a display of patriotism t

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posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 08:42 AM
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Originally posted by Annee
Are we in some kind of alternate universe?


Yes. It's called ATS.



Originally posted by mydarkpassenger
And you would know exactly what about patriotism? You have put your a$$ on the line exactly how many times?


Someone else who thinks you can't be patriotic unless you've served in the military... :shk: Is that what they teach you in there? That people who don't serve don't know anything about patriotism? That if you don't get your way, you can whine and break the rules and puff your chest out and throw a tantrum because you were a marine??? They teach you how to be a whining baby?


Originally posted by CodyOutlaw
Yes, he agreed to the HOA when he moved in, however, nowhere should we start saying that because we agreed to something, we should never disagree with it. Life is dynamic, it's not cut and dry.


Yeah, I said the same thing about not smoking at my job... "Hey, I know I agreed not to smoke in the office when I got this job, but now I disagree. Life is dynamic. I'm smoking in here." They fired me.

Also about my marriage. "I know I agreed to be faithful to you when we got married, but hey, I changed. I don't agree to that anymore... I'm cheating on you." He divorced me.

That's NOT how life works. You agree to the rules, you follow them. THAT is what an honorable, proud military person should do.

The Marines. The Few. The Proud. NOT the Spoiled Rotten Babies.


Originally posted by SyphonX
Oh, I'm sorry. I don't fit your cliché of what a "real soldier" is, so I must therefore be a liar or misguided?


Soon you will be labeled a troll because you disagree and have the guts to say so.



Originally posted by mydarkpassenger
Back on topic: this HOA's rules and contract were null and void by federal law, long before this Marine signed it.


You know... no matter how many times you say that, it still isn't true.



Originally posted by mydarkpassenger
This Marine is not in violation since, the HOA has had no complaints,


Complaints are totally irrelevant. You're assuming that only infractions that garner complaints will be addressed. Nowhere is that stipulated. If you break the rules, whether there are complaints about it or not, you have broken the rules. (I can't believe I have to explain this!) The officer who stops you for speeding doesn't say, "Well, no one's complained about your speeding, so I'm not going to give you a ticket. Carry on, friend"
What kind of warped thinking is that?

reply to post by GhostLancer
 


Great post! Everyone should read it a couple times!


Originally posted by Hendrix92TheUniverse
The HOA has received no complaints but they are trying to say that the property values have gone down because of the flag.


They are not saying that. The source mentions nothing about the HOA talking about property values. Another assumption, perhaps?

.
edit on 1/8/2011 by Benevolent Heretic because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 08:43 AM
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I'm sorry to say this, but this isn't home owners filing suit over a display of patriotism at all.

Back in the late 90's, we were looking for homes. We found one which looked like our dream home, but there was tight regulation on what we were allowed to do and not do on our property. For example, we couldn't have our cars parked in our drive ways because it'd "leak oil and ruin the overall look of the community". We also couldn't put up any curtains we wanted (!) as it'd "ruin" the overall look of the community. We couldn't do anything without approval first, and getting that approval... Well, let's just say it wasn't worth it. We decided that even though it was a nice home that we didn't want all these regulations so we continued our search.

This man did decide it was worth it and moved in knowing fully he wouldn't be able to do what he wanted without approval first.

So, in the end this is about getting the last word in. A bunch of old folks who run the homeowners association feel like little kings in control and they'll be damned if some guy puts something in (doesn't matter what, just happens to be a flag here which is tugging on your heart strings) that they feel ruins the overall look of the area.

If the guy doesn't like how things are run, then he should consider moving on. I salute him however for showing his patriotism, seeing an American flag wave freely always makes me smile.



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 08:54 AM
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An equally valid headline would be:

"Marine vet's 20-foot flagpole has homeowners association filing suit over breaking rules homeowner agreed to when he moved there"

If the man didn't like the Association rules in the community then he had the right to not live there.



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 09:26 AM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by Dilligaf28
 


Maybe you should read the Constitution and maybe god will talk to you and fill you in on alittle secret. That the constitution is the supreme law of the land, and god may even tell you to cast away your wicked liberal ways, for your lack of knowledge in the ways of things are laughable at best!



btw, power of government: Just read article 1 Section 8.
edit on 7-1-2011 by Whereweheaded because: (no reason given)


I think I heard it all now.
So neocons now believe the constitution is part of the bible...nice.

Great icon worship there mate.

Render unto ceasar..

The guy needs to get his pole sorted out and up to standards, or keep paying fines..he chose to live in the association, he needs to follow the rules. open and closed. Live in a apartment building, you can't have a barbecue pit. live in a home owners association neighborhood, you can't have a 20 foot flagpole. pretty simple, only tards that think God penned the constitution cannot understand that.



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 09:27 AM
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Originally posted by TheFlash
An equally valid headline would be:

"Marine vet's 20-foot flagpole has homeowners association filing suit over breaking rules homeowner agreed to when he moved there"

If the man didn't like the Association rules in the community then he had the right to not live there.


You make it sound so simple.

Oh wait - it is that simple.



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 09:31 AM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by TheFlash
An equally valid headline would be:

"Marine vet's 20-foot flagpole has homeowners association filing suit over breaking rules homeowner agreed to when he moved there"

If the man didn't like the Association rules in the community then he had the right to not live there.


You make it sound so simple.

Oh wait - it is that simple.


Its not that simple if you have a really simple mind.

Remember, rules need to be followed...unless your a neocon..then God allows you to do things against rules..cause its all for patriotism and "real america".



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 10:19 AM
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Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by TheFlash
An equally valid headline would be:

"Marine vet's 20-foot flagpole has homeowners association filing suit over breaking rules homeowner agreed to when he moved there"

If the man didn't like the Association rules in the community then he had the right to not live there.


You make it sound so simple.

Oh wait - it is that simple.


Its not that simple if you have a really simple mind.

Remember, rules need to be followed...unless your a neocon..then God allows you to do things against rules..cause its all for patriotism and "real america".





posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 10:44 AM
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Originally posted by captaintyinknots

I am not a fan of homeowners associations, but he chose to live in one, and therefore to follow the rules of it.


+1000, I am all for Patriotism, but if you choose to live in an area with laws such as these (i.e. every HOA in the US) then thats your own fault and you should follow them, this is how our country works people.



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 10:48 AM
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This is absolutely crazy. Home owners associations think they are the end all be all in community law enforcement.

I lived in a place that had a HOA and one guy would fly his rebel flag. They told him he could not fly it.

He went to management and threatened them with a lawsuit and he was ultimately able to fly it...

Who do these people think they are?



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 10:54 AM
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There has been a lot of posting in this thread regarding extraneous materials that do not effect this core issue. That being said lets review some facts:

1. The soldier was fully informed of the HOA before he moved into this community and still CHOSE to move into the community and follow the HOA guidelines.

2. The HOA guidelines prevent a flag pole of more than 6 feet in height.

3. Despite a request to the HOA board being denied the soldier persisted in putting up a 20 foot flag pole which exceeds the maximum allowable height of 6 feet under the HOA.

4. The HOA has thusly proceeded with the allowed course of action under the HOA to seek resolution.

5. There is not a piece of legislation which allows for unabridged display of the flag and in fact HOA type organizations are cited within the Flag Act of 2005 as able to regulate the display of flags.

6. A contract is a legal and binding document which once signed cannot be breached at will.

7. The equal protection clause of the constitution negates any notion that Veterans or any class/ group of citizens warrant legal favor over any other group.

8. The U.S. is secular and therefore our laws are as well. The notion of God given rights is not applicable in U.S. Law.

9. The soldier in question broke a contract that he agreed to in good faith when he erected a flag pole that exceeded the maximum allowed height under his HOA contract.

If anyone can site credible sources as to why any of these facts are in dispute I would certainly welcome it.

As for my opinion:

The man is a former marine whom should be accustomed to duty and honor. He signed a contract and now is breaking that contract. He deserves no special treatment. He is clearly in violation of the contract he signed and therefore has no ground upon which to base an argument that he is correct in his actions.
edit on 8-1-2011 by Dilligaf28 because: typographical error



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 10:55 AM
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Originally posted by dasauto
This is absolutely crazy. Home owners associations think they are the end all be all in community law enforcement.

I lived in a place that had a HOA and one guy would fly his rebel flag. They told him he could not fly it.

He went to management and threatened them with a lawsuit and he was ultimately able to fly it...

Who do these people think they are?


They are the people who make and enforce the rules of a specific community.

NO ONE is forced to live in a community that has an HOA.

YOU CHOOSE to live in an HOA community. And agree to abide by the rules when you sign the contract.

There are many people who want to live in these communities. If there weren't - - they would exist.



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 10:58 AM
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Originally posted by BigTimeCheater
reply to post by zombiesC4
 


Why should vets get special treatment?

Hint: they shouldnt.

Yes he chose to brake the but still cut him a brake



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 11:08 AM
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reply to post by Annee
 


It does not matter, the board can vote and CHANGE THE RULES AT ANY TIME..

Who would expect the HOA to change rules just because they do not like a specific residents.

HOA should be ILLEGAL!!!



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 11:11 AM
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Originally posted by dasauto
reply to post by Annee
 


It does not matter, the board can vote and CHANGE THE RULES AT ANY TIME..

Who would expect the HOA to change rules just because they do not like a specific residents.

HOA should be ILLEGAL!!!


And they should change the rules why?

Because one person thinks he is self-entitled - - - and the rules he agreed to no longer apply?

That's a bit ass-backwards - - - don't ya think?



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 11:16 AM
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I live in an HOA development and these dolts crack me up. The "Board" is nothing but a bunch of people trying to relive their high school glory days of being student body president and such. The rules are largely made up as they go along as the "Board" votes on "Infractions" and interprets the by-laws. I really don't give a hoot and pretty much do as I want. When I cut down a dead tree they threatened to take me to court - I invited them to do so and they backed off. When I put a flower bed in my backyard some persnickity termigant showed up at my door to notify me that I had violated HOA rules by not submitting plans to the "Design committee" for approval - WHATEVER!
To add insult to injury, I installed another flower bed right in the middle of my front yard a few weeks later - WITHOUT approval!


These people can kiss my keister! I'm just BEGGING for the day that these morons take me to court. The very next day I'll be out with petition in hand to disband the whole damned thing - and I only need 2/3 signatures to do it!



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 11:20 AM
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Originally posted by dasauto
HOA should be ILLEGAL!!!


Please tell me why HOAs should be illegal.

You want to deny the rights of people who specifically choose communities with HOAs?

Is that correct?



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 11:45 AM
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reply to post by Whereweheaded
 



I object to your topic title. The law suit was nothing to do with patriotism. When you take this sort of liberty with facts right away you throw away your credibility. In politics and sales this is done all the time. Let's raise the standard here on ATS.
edit on 8-1-2011 by trailertrash because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 11:47 AM
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reply to post by kozmo
 


What you say is true and is the reason I have never moved into a place like that. You trade a bit of freedom for "property value". The choice is BEFORE we move into the place not after.



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 11:49 AM
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reply to post by kozmo
 


I am always curious how someone can revel in breaking contracts and thusly ruining their good name? Your statement has informed us all that you do not honor your commitments and in fact take great pleasure in defrauding those with whom you have contractual relationships.

This is a behavior you seem to be proud of?



posted on Jan, 8 2011 @ 12:06 PM
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Originally posted by lee anoma
As a good neighbor I'd reduce the pole.
It really isn't a big deal.

I guess the homeowners association will be a bit more discerning next time.

I'm just waiting for a Conservative politician to take up his cause to ensure reelection.

It's going to happen.

- Lee



What exactly do you mean by "I guess the homeowners association will be a bit more discerning next time"?



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