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IRS tormenting struggling taxpayers

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posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 07:23 AM
reply to post by crimvelvet

Thats pretty much in a nut shell.....

now watch a majority of the state govts in the USA go's happening NOW as we speak.

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 07:47 AM
reply to post by projectvxn

Yeah, taxation is such a noble and altruistic way to dole out charity isn't it? It's not theft...No, it's called doing your part citizen!

Why the heck do you think the Central Bankers LOVE Socialism?

We "owe" more than 40% of the interest on the $14 trillion dollar debt to the Federal Reserve who lent us "Fiat Fairy Dust"

In the early seventies Congress started going nuts and forming all sorts of Bureaucracies like the EPA and OSHA. They have also been entangling us in very expensive wars with the Central bankers "Funding" both sides. Take a look at what happened to the debt in the seventies. It sky rocketed


Here is a graph of the debt as a percentage of the GDP

Socialism is the mechanism whereby wealth is transferred from the poor to the Central Bankers in return for FRAUDULENT DEBT!

I just wish the do-gooders would figure that out. Unfortunately the brainwashing from the banker run government schools has been too complete. See Dumbing Down America

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 07:49 AM
reply to post by whatukno

If I'm not mistaken your roads and stuff gets payed for by the gasoline tax.

I don't mind paying taxes, but the income tax needs to go. Your money goes straight to the bankers.

The country did survive before 1913 you know.

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 08:26 AM
reply to post by crimvelvet

Corperatism is the problem the US has, not socialism. America is the least socialist state you can visit in the west for crying out loud. Its got such a bias to the right in some places its a wonder it doesnt topple over in a swastika daubed fit and destroy itself with its bias and xenophobia!
This is not driven by the attitude of socialism , which in its rawest and fairest form seeks to take from the rich and give to the poor in an effort to make everyones oppertunities absolutely equal in every way, preventing rich folk from buying power, and providing poor folk the means to aquire education and a decent gainful method of employment. This should create peace in a community because no one has leverage over anyone else, and the only thing that dictates a persons ability to rise in stature, is what they can do for thier nation.
Corperatism however places emphasis only on those who have wealth, and offers only them power, even though some of the hardest working people in a society are the lowest paid. This drives a wedge deliberately between societal groups, making the populus easy to control because of the divisions driven between them. It promotes persons who have gained money no matter how they have done it, and it virtualy ignores the suffering of hardworking people who regardless of their strength and determination are considered less than nothing by the state, and by the corperations who buy and sell thier political influence to control the flow of money amongst themselves, doing only the barest amount of actual work, but gaining so much that they could never use it all no matter how they tried. This creates anger , because those in poverty or close to it see these folk and thier petty problems broadcast all over the papers and the news, whilst knowing that they themselves may loose thier home, thier livelihood at any time, which is a far more terrifying prospect than any of the pathetic worries of the rich and famous. Corperatism PROMOTES the creation of an unofficial slave class, and cares nothing for the welfare of those who inhabit that demographic. Not only that but it advocates against care systems which allow the poor the same access to health care as the rich, regardless of the consequences to good honest folk who merely have no money.
Dont get me wrong, socialism has been hijacked by everyone from the Russian soviets, to the Nazis (who lied about thier politics anyway and were clearly a fascist group, not a socialist one) , and corruption is rife in those countries which firmly cling to it, North Korea for example fails entirely because they have too much power centred around one family . But socialism has a bad rep because those nations which embrace it, always end up doing it wrong, allowing power to flow too far to one person, rather than allowing democratic socialism to occur naturaly through public discussion of the issues , and decision making to be done by ALL citizens rather than a select few suit wearing twits. In its most basic form , theres nothing wrong with absolute equality, offered only by socialism. But theres an awful lot of rot in the corperate run idea of democracy which currently has its grip on the US , the UK,and Europe, starting with the lack of power that persons on the street actualy have to change anything , and ending with the fact that in these nations and regions, the ability to fend for ones self, and have a roof over ones head is not a right, its a privilige. This surely is an indicator of just how sick a place must be, when only those of wealth may aquire the basics of life?

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 08:26 AM
reply to post by whatukno

I think that all federal and state employees should only be paid minimum wage, (and not be allowed to be in a union). You want to see a minimized federal government? Make it a minimum wage job.
WOW! I almost never agree with you, but I could get behind this. Must include congress and the Supreme Court as well.

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 08:31 AM
Reply to post by sonofliberty1776

When you get into Congress and the SCOTUS or even the POTUS it's awfully tempting to bust them all down to minimum wage.

But that coupled with their power will encourage even more corruption.

They dont run for these offices for the money or the prestige. They run for the power and the kickbacks. I might be on the books at $5/hour but I can rake in a million a month by selling out to the highest bidder.

The only good politician is a not so alive politician. Any other state of being will result in corruption and authoritarianism.

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posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 08:32 AM
Reply to post by thisguyrighthere

I should clarify, money and prestige of the job. Otherwise it sounds like the same things and become redundant.

Why cant I edit mobile posts?

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posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 08:35 AM
reply to post by thisguyrighthere

The only way that a minimum wage head of state would work, and be policed, would be if in order to attain positions in government you give up officialy your right to privacy, and a public body , on constant rotation were to be employed in suveillance to ensure that no other money arrives suspiciously in thier bank accounts or wallets. That public body would have to be free to run and so the persons manning it would be rotated through the populus as a public service, and not paid for doing so. All employers in the nation would have to agree to terms regarding time off for thier employees to carry out this function .

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 08:46 AM
Reply to post by TrueBrit

Sounds good but it also sounds like a lot of work and people arent too fond of work. That's how things have gotten as bad as they are in the first place.

It'll be the next jury duty. Corrupted by lethargy and ignorance.

I dont have much faith in people governing over me whether it's a neighbor chosen to to check the books or a career politician from across the country. It shouldnt be a full time job to wrestle with chains.

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posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 09:39 AM
reply to post by bluemirage5

Thats pretty much in a nut shell.....

now watch a majority of the state govts in the USA go's happening NOW as we speak.

The whole blasted Depression was orchestrated by the bankers with lots of help from Congress

Have you ever wondered what the bankers plan to steal this time???

The last time the Central Bankers collapsed the economy they got their traitor Franklin Delano Roosevelt to STEAL American GOLD

Quotations from speeches made on the Floor of the House of Representatives by the Honorable Louis T. McFadden of Pennsylvania, Chairman of the Banking and Currency Committee
..."Roosevelt ordered the people to give their gold to private interests- that is, to banks, and he took control of the banks so that all the gold and gold values in them, or given into them, might be handed over to the predatory International Bankers who own and control the Fed....

"The Prime Minister of England came here for money! He came here to collect cash!

"He came here with Fed Currency and other claims against the Fed which England had bought up in all parts of the world. And he has presented them for redemption in gold.

"Mr. Chairman, I am in favor of compelling the Fed to pay their own debts. I see no reason why the general public should be forced to pay the gambling debts of the International Bankers.

I think I know what the plans are this time.

All of our Manufacturing has been sold off, boxed up and shipped to other countries. Thanks to the"Leveraged buyouts" of the 80's and 90's, the bankers and "Foreign Interests" now own most of what is left. Heck even our Water Authorities, Seaports, Toll Roads and Bridges have been sold to Foreign Interests!

So what is left to Steal???

US Departments of Labor and Treasury Schedule Hearing on Confiscation of Private Retirement Accounts

the unstated agenda of these hearings, as I understand it, is to push for the US government to eventually nationalize (confiscate) all assets in private Individual Retirement Accounts (IRAs) and 401K plans!

The US government is desperate to get its hands on private assets to help cover soaring budget deficits and debts, and this is simply the largest and easiest piggy bank that could be seized. The Investment Company Institute estimates that at the end of 2008 that there were $3.613 trillion of assets in IRAs and $2.350 trillion of assets in 401K plans.

IS there anything else besides retirement Accounts?

Yes our LAND. Confiscation of private land has been in the works for years.

The real tool for land confiscation was a triple whammy.
1. The orchestrated real estate collapse: See AIG and the Big Takeover and Foreclosures

2. The proposed confiscation of American's personal saving that will prohibit individuals from investing in land.


3. The Food Safety Farce that has just been enacted into law will remove independent farmers from the land and drive up food prices as the Ag Cartel grabs complete control of our food supply. Please understand farmers have ONE buyer, the Food Cartel who sets the price they will pay the farmer. The spread between farm prices and consumer prices has been widening for years. Making the food cartel rich and bankrupting farmers.

This means the added cost of the new regulations can not be passed on to the consumer by the farmers. Farmers already work an outside job to support their farms. They do not have the extra time or money to deal with these regulations. Average age of the principal operator is 55.3. "According to the 2002 Census of Agriculture, 50 percent of the farmers are 55 years of age or older" With bewildering piles of paperwork and HUGE FINES coupled with up to ten years in jail, wouldn't you just give up, sellout and retire instead?

Forty-one percent of U.S. total land area is farmland (938.28 million acres).....

More than three million people farm or ranch in the United States. Individuals, family partnerships or family corporations operate almost 99 percent of U.S. farms. Over 22 million people are employed in farm or farm-related jobs...

The top five agricultural commodities are cattle and calves, dairy products, broilers, corn and soybeans. U.S. farmers produce 46% of the world’s soybeans, 41% of the world’s corn, 20.5% of the world’s cotton and 13% of the world’s wheat.

The FDA has already stated it will "harmonize" with international "Standards" I have read the international standards. Here are a few choice bits:

A complete and reliable system of recording procedures, actions and controls implemented on the farm as to make access difficult for unauthorised persons or vehicles

using inert construction and surface materials (NO WOOD???)

Keep a record of all persons entering the farm

keep the medical certificates of persons working in contact with animals and any document certifying their qualifications and training

...correctly isolated from pests and from wild or stray animals, and from other domestic animals...

...check the quality of the feed delivered in terms of provision for appearance (visual examination) and keep a written record of the results

...keep samples of purchased feed for any subsequent analytical testing should a problem of residues be identified at the farm production level [REQUIRES LARGE FREEZER]

An identification and traceability system for animals, their feed and products

For each animal or group of animals, require and keep all commercial and health documents enabling their exact itinerary to be traced from their farm or establishment of origin to their final destination (other farm or abattoir)

establish a data-recording system that can be used to ascertain exactly which batches of commercial feed the farm’s livestock were fed with and what raw materials were used in feed manufactured on the farm and given to the animals.

Also at

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 09:41 AM
reply to post by mayabong

Funny thing is, as it stands now, the money in this country is loaned FROM the bankers via the Federal Reserve. Every dollar in your pocket or bank account is a loan. (crap thing is, none of this reflected on anyone's credit report)

Kinda makes sense in the way they structured this economy that the taxes would go to pay off those loans. I am not saying that's how it should be, I am saying that's how it is.

Why bitch about a system you gladly buy into? You use those Federal Reserve Notes in every transaction gladly, but somehow don't want to pay the devil it's due.

And before you whine to me about it being the only way it is, a man named Kyle bartered a red paperclip for a house, thus bypassing the evil Federal Reserve's stranglehold on the economy altogether.

reply to post by sonofliberty1776

I meant everyone with a Federal or State job, every congressmen, every senator, every president, every fireman, every policeman, every secretary, every page every soldier, every gopher, all working for minimum wage. No benefits either, no paid vacations, no travel budget, no health insurance. You want to make this government shrink in a hurry? Make the job undesirable.

I believe that the reason that the government is so big is because these jobs are cherry. These government jobs are cushy and all one has to do is snag one and they can cruise through their entire career and snag a federal pension at the end.

The other thing that ticks me off royally about federal jobs is federal unions. What the hell is that commie crap? Police should not have a union, firefighters should not have a union, teachers should not have a union. Unions are destroying this country, if you want proof of this, look at Detroit. A person should be paid based on ability not because they have been there 20 years riding seniority.

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 09:41 AM
reply to post by DimensionalDetective

Right. They bail-out the big boyz, giving them billion$ of our money for bonu$e$. And then they go after the little guys.

It's harassment.

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 10:56 AM
reply to post by whatukno
I am with you on most of it, including this union crap. However, I do not agree on paying the military only minimum wage. Our military is currently to large, I agree. However, in this world we have now, we do need a strong professional military. I served, and I was in combat on more than one occasion. These men(and women) do not serve for money(as a primary consideration), but on minimum wage why would any person suffer the privations of military life? Why risk life and limb in combat? I believe, in general, that they are already under payed for what they do. So I would not support reducing them to minimum wage. Every other government employee, absolutely.

Edit: One caveat to this statement. If they were payed for every single hour on duty, and payed overtime, then most of their incomes would actually increase. I could support it then.

edit on 6-1-2011 by sonofliberty1776 because: (no reason given)

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 11:09 AM
reply to post by TrueBrit

Corperatism is the problem the US has, not socialism. America is the least socialist state you can visit in the west for crying out loud....

It is not Corporatism. Corporatism is a form of Fascism

Historically, corporatism or corporativism (Italian corporativismo) is a political system in which legislative power is given to corporations that represent economic, industrial, and professional groups.. Under Fascism in Italy, business owners, employees, trades-people, professionals, and other economic classes were organized into 22 guilds, or associations, known as "corporations"

neo-corporatism is used in reference to tendencies in politics for legislators and administrations to be influenced or dominated by the interests of business enterprises (limited liability corporations). The influence by other types of corporations, such as those representing organized labor, is relatively minor. In this view, government decisions are seen as being influenced strongly by which sorts of policies will lead to greater profits

You have identified one half of the game the bankers are playing on us.

For the "Right-Wing" the present form of neo-corporatism is labeled as "Socialism" And indeed "Socialism" is the "moral high ground" used to prod the ignorant masses into clamoring for more laws that strip away their rights and their money and deliver little in the way of actual support for those who really need it. To put it bluntly our "welfare system" is very nicely designed to get people onto welfare and allows no way to get off. That is why we have third generation Welfare all funded by "Magic Fairy Dust Dollars" borrowed from the FED and paid for into perpetuity by the working poor.

For other laws, the bureaucracies enforcing them are flooded with Corporate suits who make sure the "law" punishes (and bankrupts) the small businessman and lets the international Corporate Cartels off scott-free.

For the "Left-Wing" the present form of neo-corporatism is labeled as "Capitalism" although most never see even part of the whole picture. They certainly have no idea of what "Capitalism" actually is or that Bankers and Corporate CEOs hate REAL Capitalism with a passion.

So what the heck IS Capitalism?

Capitalism is a social system based on the recognition of individual rights, including property rights, in which all property is privately owned. Under capitalism the state is separated from economics (production and trade), just like the state is separated from religion.

Capitalism is about PRIVATE individuals using their wealth to fund advances in man's productivity.

Capitalism is NOT a banker printing money out of thin air and lending the money to his big corporate friends while he denies loans to small businesses. It is not about a corporate controlled government instituting regs that bankrupt the smaller competition. It is not about using the inflation of the money supply to steal the wealth of the poor and middle class.

In 1976 A typical American CEO earned 36 times as much as the average worker. By 2008 the average CEO pay increased to 369 times that of the average worker.

If you look at this table the typical American CEO is actually paid five times MORE in “buying power” compared to 1976 while the rest of us are now paid a third of what we were paid in 1976. The price of gold indicates the steady devaluation of the US dollar as its purchasing power is diluted by the ever increasing supply of fiat money.

Here is a money supply/gold/wage chart:
Date.....$ /oz gold.. Money supply......minimum wage...min wage in gold..CEO pay in gold
1971 ......40.62.............. 81 billion...........$1.60 ...................0.0394 oz.
1974 ......195.20...........101 billion...........$2.00.....................0.0102 oz.
1976 ......124.74 ........... $113 billion.......$2.30.....................0.0184 oz............0.663.oz
1985 .....354.20 ...........$205 billion........$3.35....................0.0094 oz.
1994 .....409.80........... $ 406 billion.......$4.25.....................0.0104.oz.
2006 .....636.30 ...........$808 billion........$5.15.....................0.0081 oz.
2008 .....880.30........... $831 billion........$5.85.....................0.0066 oz.............2.44.oz
2009...1,020.28...........$1663 billion........$6.55.....................0.0064.oz.

According to an article in The New Republic of Dec. 2, 1991, in 1948, a married couple with median income and two children, paid only 2% in state, federal, and Social Security taxes. In 1999, Social Security was 15.3%, plus 2.9% for Medicare, out of the first $62,700 in wages, or $11,411.40, and then perhaps 30% in federal taxes…if you were lucky....

NOTE: You are actually paying 30.6% for Social Security and 5.8% for Medicare because the corporations consider it part of your wages and the self-employed like me actually get stuck paying it. That plus a federal tax of 30% gives 66.4% in Federal taxes before you add in state, local and property taxes!

We do not need socialism, what we need is a system that encourages SMALL business and wipes out the useless monopolies and cartels.

Small businesses provide jobs for many individuals who might otherwise be shut out of the workforce because of disability, discrimination or other factors.

Small business employ half of Americans workers and have more patents per employee. Small business patents are twice as likely to appear among those most often cited by inventors as stepping-stones for their work. Small businesses are more creative and innovative and may also be responsible for the nation's technical creativity and innovation.

This is one of the reasons the Corporate Cartel's target a business for "regulatory scrutiny" followed by bankruptcy and hostile takeover at bargain basement prices.

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 11:22 AM
reply to post by crimvelvet

Ok , lets give this a different classification then. The issue is financial fascsim, the idea that one person is better than another just because they have been LUCKY enough to accrue funds.
It really doesnt matter what you call it, because the cause is the same. Greed, and a love of power.

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 12:08 PM
quote from DD:

I wonder how many folks here actually know that these folks are a private corporation, just like the fed, and actually are not PART of the gov, just like the federal reserve isn't?

true, it is currently based in the commonwealth of Puerto Rico,
which is why the resolution of PR's colonial status keeps getting deffered in order to keep it in legal limbo vis a vis
The IRS and other stuff

they don't want to steal your money, they just want you to lose it. as Rand pointed out.

"those bloody Anarchists! They want to wreck the world in order to rule the ruins!"
can anybody say psychopathic Projection?

edit on 6-1-2011 by DerepentLEstranger because: added edit

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 02:30 PM
reply to post by TrueBrit

It really doesnt matter what you call it, because the cause is the same. Greed, and a love of power.

On that I certainly will agree.

Since I am an agnostic, I take much of this article with a large grain of salt but there is certainly a long History of Lies, Thievery, and Deceit when it comes to Banking and Usury.

Getting rid of fractional reserve banking is the one thing I think Socialists, Communists, Anarchists and true Capitalists can all agree on. It is only the greedy and dishonest who want to continue the HELLISH system that makes all of us paupers and serfs to the banksters.

Heck according to the religious right "Christ drove the moneychangers from the temple and was crucified 4 days later." and so it has gone through out history.

If we, the people can manage to target that one goal - to throw the "moneychangers from the temple" of government - We will all be much better off.

Notice how the banker run media made sure the Tea Party has gotten lots of bad press aimed at dividing the left and the right and sidelining the Tea Party. Why?


If the Tea Party has its way, the Federal Reserve will be toast. They blame the Fed for everything from the nation’s soaring debt to the sinking dollar. Will “Dump the Fed” be the rallying cry of the new Congress?

I can certainly get behind THAT idea although I am a GDI and not affiliated with any political group.

posted on Jan, 6 2011 @ 02:45 PM

Originally posted by DimensionalDetective
Former IRS Agent Joe Banister just recently went head to head with the IRS in court for 'income tax evasion', and guess what---He was aquitted, as all others who challenge this unconstitutional behavior and rogue group are:

actually, he was acquitted on charges he helpd someone else file a fraudulent tax return. when he speaks he freedly admits that he files and pays his taxes.

On June 23, 2005, a jury acquitted Joe Banister of multiple counts of assisting Al Thompson file a fraudulent tax return. Banister's position was that as a then-member of the federal tax bar (he has since been disbarred) he was privileged to assist Al Thompson in preparing what is known as a "protest return".

Al Thompson, one of the USA Today posterboys for Bob Schulz's We The People organization, was convicted of failing to withhold paychecks from the employees of his Cencal Aviation, and is currently serving a six-year sentence. The Banister acquittal will not help Thompson's appeal.

Interestingly, Banister's attorney admitted that Banister had been paying his federal income taxes (which was apparently why he was not charged with tax evasion), and repeatedly referred to Al Thompson as a "liar" and "convicted felon".

Contrary to the claims of some tax protestors, this case did not even involve the question of the liability for federal income taxes, and did not in any way establish a right to not file tax returns or pay taxes. But with the tax protestor movement losing many significant cases in recent months (Meredith, Simkanin, Thompson, etc.) they'll grasp at even straws.

the claims of acquittals on tax evasion are not very accurate. what happens with these guys is that they don't file returns and the charges they are cleared on generally relate to their being accused of tax fraud. to commit tax fraud, you need to actually file the returns so the fraud charges are cleared and they all wind up filing returns and paying their taxes.

edit on 6-1-2011 by Crakeur because: added more info for those too lazy to click the link

posted on Jan, 7 2011 @ 03:57 AM
reply to post by crimvelvet

I think that there are two great tasks ahead of all the free world at the moment. First is getting interest on loans banned in all democratic nations, and second is removing persons of wealth from politics, and inserting people who have MORAL value ONLY, and no interest in amassing vast personal fortunes.

posted on Jan, 7 2011 @ 05:44 AM

Originally posted by projectvxn
Yeah, taxation is such a noble and altruistic way to dole out charity isn't it? It's not theft...No, it's called doing your part citizen! There's already a lot wrong with our 70 or 80,000 page tax code without adding thuggery to it...But here we are, the kings tax collectors are knocking.

It's not that I mind paying a minimal tax to cover Constitutional mandates that are required to be paid for by all of us. But this is just a step way too far.
edit on 6-1-2011 by projectvxn because: (no reason given)

what's amazing is even without all the scumbag dealings and fraud and shenanigans, people are paying twice as much tax as the slaves building pyramids thousands of years ago, ridiculous

tax then was one fifth, 20%.. now it's 27-49% depending on your status.
unless og course you're a billionaire and then it's 1% and you can avoid that too

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