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Bring back the States, we need a Declaration of State Independence! NOW!!!!!

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posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 11:32 PM
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I was reading this:

www.worldnewsstand.net...

And it seemed mostly like "rhetoric" or paranoia. Until I decided to cross-check the USC they were talking about. After all the entire thing was just "claiming" that the US was "taken over by bankers" and was made a "corporation" thus been put under military law for the past hundred years.

Also it claimed that we have lost our Sovereignity that the United States no longer was a government for the people.

And as it said, none of us can say that it has been such a government even before our life time.

Here it is!

caselaw.lp.findlaw.com...

Go to (15) and read A-C.

Oh crap read (14) too

"(14) ''State'' means any of the several States, the District of
Columbia, the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico, the Commonwealth of
the Northern Marianas, or any territory or possession of the
United States.
(15) ''United States'' means -
(A) a Federal corporation;
(B) an agency, department, commission, board, or other entity
of the United States; or
(C) an instrumentality of the United States."

All I can say and I think any moderator here will allow me to swear as we all would.

"What the fu.ck?"

I mean here we have it plainly, congress, not the US Constitution, not the States, but congress, has declared that the States are property of the US Government, that the US Government is a "Federal Corporation".

I'll leave you to start looking this stuff up.

I've been right all along, no wait, I've been wrong. I've only been declaring that the Federal Government was over-excersising its powers.

I had no idea how far it had really done so.

The US Constitution is a lie that they feed us in High School to shut our mouths.

Damn the Feds...we the People should charge them with treason, all of them.




posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 12:56 AM
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FreeMason, it's really old now. You have four threads about state's rights now, and you've lost every debate. Just post in an existing thread or put it to bed.

~Astral



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 02:06 AM
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Wow because you claim I have lost a debate, I have lost anything?

We have not even debated, you merely state your erroneous opinion that the Federal Government can do whatever it wants.

I suggest you read the US Constitution again, realize that it indeed only establishes two things, the duty to regulate interstate trade, and to opperate a post office.

No where does it say anything akin to, "Govern morality for the nation" nor does it say, "has any power not expressly enumerated to it in this Constitution."

However the Constitution does say that any power not enumerated to the Federal Government, is reserved by the States.

And we all know, the only powers of the Federal Government is to:

1) regulate interstate commerce and coin monies.
2) raise an army and equip it.
3) every 2 years must provide for a navy.
4) opperate a post office.

And ironically one power it can not do:

1) tax the people directly.

Oh my...look kid *ahem* Astral, you have your own opinion, but you base it off nothing.

This United States Code presented here is valuable information deserving its own discussion.

The fact you think it is just an extension of another thread, shows how little informed your mind is on the founding of our Nation.



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 02:16 AM
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Originally posted by FreeMason
Wow because you claim I have lost a debate, I have lost anything?

We have not even debated, you merely state your erroneous opinion that the Federal Government can do whatever it wants.

I suggest you read the US Constitution again, realize that it indeed only establishes two things, the duty to regulate interstate trade, and to opperate a post office.

No where does it say anything akin to, "Govern morality for the nation" nor does it say, "has any power not expressly enumerated to it in this Constitution."

However the Constitution does say that any power not enumerated to the Federal Government, is reserved by the States.

And we all know, the only powers of the Federal Government is to:

1) regulate interstate commerce and coin monies.
2) raise an army and equip it.
3) every 2 years must provide for a navy.
4) opperate a post office.

And ironically one power it can not do:

1) tax the people directly.



looks like we're reading two different constitutions. the one i'm reading has an Article I, section 8 and a 16th Amendment. also, it does seem like there have been a lot of states rights threads lately. couldn't we all just consolidate them?

-koji K.



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 02:28 AM
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Nah Koji you just need to look at the history of it all, since the 14th Amendment the Federal Government has done as it pleased, with every Amendment. So brigning up the 16th is rather pointless in that respect. However! Article I states: "No capitation, or other direct, Tax shall be laid, unless in Proportion to the Census or Enumeration herein before directed to be taken."

Since in 1871 the Federal Government declared itself a corporation and that all the States were parts of its holdings, it has not been Constitutional, so especially since then, how can any Amendment be regarded as furthern enumeration when the proposers are not representatives of States and the ratifiers are Federal Districts?

That's another Debate though since you bring it up.

I was going to mention something else, but actually I want to point out the 16th Amendment...

It does not create the IRS which is an unelected legislative body.

That's where I'm coming from (the angle of attack). I also don't believe that the 16th Amendment is legitimate, but that is because I don't believe a Federal Government that has "created itself" is legitimate.

Others don't want to share that, regardless, repeal of that Amendment would be a good idea.



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 02:36 AM
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Oh and of course there are a lot of States' Rights issue threads, States' Rights IS the issue, and it's so broad that one thread can't hold all the subject matter.

There's USC's

There's Judicial Reviews that have to be looked at.

Cases

Legislation

Unfunded mandates.

Civil War history

Causes of the Civil War

Post-Civil War History

Reconstruction Acts

Act of 1871

Act of 1790

National Security Acts 1-4

The list goes on, States' Rights was our only hope of freedom and self-governance.

All that is under threat, and the IRS is a good example, all pervading, all invading, unelected legislative body that has contributed 17,000 pages of laws to our nation and you probably don't have a clue of even one single law of theirs.

Most don't.

17,000 pages of laws.

Created not by the Legislature, but by employees of the IRS.

Please think about that....I didn't see that in the US Constitution anywhere. Without States' Rights, the Feds have just grown like a cancer.

Oh yeah, more stuff to discuss:

EPA

Endangered Species Act.

EPA is its own legislative body as well, and the US Constitution mentions NOTHING about regulating the environment.

You think the entire issue of States' Rights and violations of the US Constitution by the Federal Government can be covered in one thread? The post would have to take hours to write and would be many many pages long.



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 03:10 AM
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Freemason I'm not going to attack you because I apreciate you thread, and your point of veiw. I'm new to this fine source of info and haven't had time to read every post out there, when one of interest pops up I check it out and yours is certantly of interest. Although do you realy think the government still "coins" the money, just a question. I don't think so. I collect old silver coins because they are really the only true money, the new coins are clad so they are not worth half of their face value by technicalities, and as far as paper goes have you seen the silver certificate bills with the blue seal? they were made after the federal reserve act when americans couldn't get used to the Idea of paper being worth something. They said you can go to the bank and exchange a bill for a silverpeice whenever and that made peple comfortible with paper. Gradualy these were removed from circulation (I still have a couple and you ought to see the look on a bank tellers face when you tell them you would like your silver dollar now) so what have we now a bill legal for tender and trade. A bill is exactly what it is because you are paying a bill every time you use on. Or a note, I will gladly wright you a note if you work for me for a week, heck I'll even make it out for a thousand , also I'll be nice enough to write legal for all debts public and private on there. It wouldn't be much different than what you have in your wallet. You probably allready know about it but here's some info on the federal reserve act (Passed on december 22nd 1913 when most of congress was out for christmas vacation) centre.telemanage.ca... check it out if you have the time. thanks, double down.


[edit on 8-7-2004 by double down]



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 03:27 AM
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Actually I thought I heard it was something like 17 cents to make a Dollar bill heh...so that's how much it's really worth


Actually good eye though, while the Income Tax issue was delt with by the 16th Amendment. (sort of) the trend of Federal usurpation of power can be traced through money.

The US Constitution states that only gold and silver can be used as legal tender, hence we had gold-notes and silver-notes.

Then in 1932 FDR just said "f--- that".

Didn't even bother to have the Constitution Amended.

So apparently in 1917 the Constutiton still meant something, by 1932 obviously it meant White House Toilet Paper.



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 03:30 AM
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Yeah, '32 if I remember right though was the date the Gold standard was removed.

But yeah I have a 10 dollar silver certificate.



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 03:49 AM
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FreeMason I must say that I find your states right's articles very interesting. I have been looking into this issue more lately.

I haven't read the articles you posted but am going to once I get the chance.

I believe that FDR made illegal to redeem gold and silver bonds in 32, but it was Nixon who did away with gold standard in 71 and put us onto fiat currency.




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