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Can God and Evolution co-exist???

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posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 04:18 PM
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I've been learning a lot recently in college. I accept the idea of evolution to a certain extent. I think they are a little TOO sure of themselves but it was interesting to learn that to believe in evolution means there is no way a God created us. We have the same ancestors as monkeys. Ok, not too far fetched considering the evidence for evolution.

I also always believed in God for good reasons. So now I feel a little confused. I can't really come up with any theories as to how they can co-exist. Did we evolutionize to humans then God gave us souls?

I'm interested in viewing others theories to help me come to some sort of conclusion. I do believe God made us but I do not believe the bible stories which obviously came from ancient civilizations.

Your thoughts will be appreciated...




posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 04:22 PM
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YES THEY CAN COEXIST!
It's very plausible that Creationism and Evolution arent even mutually exclusive!
View Evolution as god's mechanism for creation!
Here's a good example;
A kettle is boiling, why does it boil?
1) There is enough heat energy in the system to... blahblah
2) You turned it on

Why was man created?
1) We evolved
2) God created us via evolution

I dont REALLY believe this myself, I dont even think 'God' gives a damn, just that he did something to cause the big bang, and for all we know, f**ked off.. lol


edit;
lol probably went to the pub for a pint and watch euro 2004.. =p

[edit on 7-7-2004 by browha]



posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 04:28 PM
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Why not? Of course Darwin's theory of evolution and things like the Christian bible would go against one another, but who is to say that god (if it exists) has much to do with the bible (if it is true). If a single god was so powerful then why could it not create through evolution if it so desired?



posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 04:48 PM
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I believe in the new age so, yes it can coexists, I believe that species were in earth and when their brain developed enough the consciousness was given to man. Yes it is a creator of all things.



posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 04:50 PM
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I believe that the Roman Catholic Church actually teaches now that God created humanity through evolution, at least that is what is being tought at several Jesuit universities that I know of.

Blessed Be
~Astral



posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 04:57 PM
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Hi

I had the same 'problem' as you do. And i believe there's nothing in the Bible against the evolution. I mean just think about it: if God wanted to teach something to ancient civs and people he just couldn't say 'hey guys you want to know how was the genesis? well first i created from xy things the H molecule... blablabla and than for some time I've been planning you. Well you know it was quiet a moment but you can say a couple of million years.'
But I still believe God didn't lied in it. Just read the genesis. With all our knowledge the scientists states the known world born the same way. Of course the Bible speaks in riddles days could be billion of years, but the truth is in it.

And are you sure the bible is only a couple of tales for ancient civs? I have nothing against this (i'm a christian but i have my opinions about the things too). But think it twice. Just to mention the last part of it, the visions of the apocalipse and the new world. If you read some thing and another here you can find interesting predictions. (for example the topic of kangaxx; where he's talking about how aliens will save us from the disaster). It' so similar to those things can be read in the bible. I still do believe that the truth for the past present and future are all in it, just we can not find them.

Anyway not saying that everything is predestinated, i believe in free will. But some days ago i read an interesting article which viewed the bible mathematically. And there the author made a statement: things could be predestinated for God for he can see the history at the same moment, also past present and future. But in our viewpoint the future is quiet unpredictable so we feel we have free will. And we have in fact, but as the future changes God saw it already in the beginning of all things so for him it's still predestinated.

Ugh I've gone into it quite deeply. Hope you understand. My grammar sometimes isn't the best. I'd give you a link on that article but it's in hungarian so you wont understand it...



posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 06:40 PM
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I understood and appreciate all the replies, and my original thought was that, yes, God used evolution to create us. So God IS science and science is God.

But the problem is that evolution firmly states that there cannot be intelligent design. Our existence came to be by pure chance and the bible no matter how you look at it, states God created us intentionally. My biology instructor's example he gave me was that just cause Bush is President of the US, doesnt mean he invented American automobiles. I see where he's going with it but it leaves a open end.

I can't help but wonder as technology keeps advancing that is God simply a being with knowledge which takes centuries to understand? That would still make him our creator, but thinking that way scares me and makes me feel like lucifer thinking he could be as great as God. But then again I don't even know if thats story is true. For the record Ring no i dont completely think the whole bible is made up, revelations intrigues me.

But it seems the more i learn, it just confuses me more. Life was simpler when i was forced to go to Church and read about Adam and Eve....



posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 07:56 PM
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If you believe in the evolution of man then the thoughts of lucifer,satan or the devil aren none existant because these are characters of myth, created by man.



posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 08:04 PM
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Think about this though, if god knows and created all then he created logical progression, the laws of physics and designed the way natural selection works, so there is still intelegent design, but is lost on some because it's seen as given.

So therefore the theory of evolution could be perfectly true, and could be created by god.

That's how profs at over at Notre Dame have explained it to me when I e-mailed them.

Blessed Be
~Astral



posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 08:23 PM
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God is the universe, correct? So, because of this, since God is physics, He must work within physics... He cannot go against Himself.

As Ring said, look at Genesis. Day by day, it is laid out as evolution dictates... but remember this as well... in the Greek (original) version of the Bible, it says epochs instead of days.

And could not have God just started things, got the ball rolling, and then evolution played a part?


ME

posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 10:47 PM
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Gen 1:11 And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, [and] the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed [is] in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.

First clue of creation, via, evolution.

Did God just say and it was so? NO. The Earth brought forth! Samething for everything else on this planet, 'till you get to the 'intervention'.

Go ahead, check it out. Gen 1, and the Earth brought forth and the Seas/Waters brought forth. They came 'from' the Earth.


ME

posted on Jul, 7 2004 @ 11:01 PM
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And could not have God just started things, got the ball rolling, and then evolution played a part?

That's what I believe.

But this was millions and billions of years ago, what about the LORD God/Most High that appears many millions and billions of years later? And why does this God of today have a gender?

Gen 1 says God or 'elohiym. Gen 2, written by an entirely different author, refers to a 'physical' personage of God of millions and billions of years later closer to our time, Y@hovah 'elohiym. And why is 'elohiym not capitalized and 'singular'?

Maybe man has been teaching man a bunch of crap!

IMO.

God=ALL

LORD God= Celestial/Higher Being

[edit on 7-7-2004 by ME]



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 05:59 AM
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Anyway do the scientists have any proof that the evolution can not coexist God? As I know noone never found any fossil with the manual on the bottom: "caution only for scientists above 50. Made with natural elements; doesn't containing work of God..."

Well I think it's no matter how we or the ancients call God, moreover I don't even care of understanding God (I doubt if i ever could), the important is that God exists he's the source and my destination. That I have in this dirty world something to turn to when I'm in need; that I'm not only born live and die. It's not over. I think that's the important. What you believe. The other things (how did he create the world etc.) are can be discussed but we won't get the true answer from neither a scientist nor from any scholar.



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 06:12 AM
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Yes they coexist, but is highly dependant on your interpretation of the term "God".

Evolution, is a science based theory, whos basis for existence is found in scientific evidence.

I have yet to see the same for "God"

However, to believe in "God" you are required to only to believe, have faith if you will, and as such no evidence is required.



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 07:10 AM
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I agree with soothsayer and ME also.

To use my own phrasing:

The Original Creator initiated The Big Bang and evolution played a role in the emergence of humanoid life.

>

That's very interesting Astral. It's good to see the RCC embrace a more progressive understanding.

Regardless, I still side with Interventionism or Colonialism, i.e., that a group of extraterrestrials jumpstarted Homo sapien life by mixing their DNA with the "already evolving primates" here many thousands of years ago. Corroborated by the archeological evidence of Zecharia Sitchin, the original intention of the aliens or Anunnaki was to use Homo sapiens as slaves to work the mines.

But Interventionism doesn't detract from the idea that The Original Creator initiated The Big Bang in the first place.




posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 07:36 AM
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I think it is for the best to leave Evolution open ended since there are multiple beliefs on creation. I perceive God and Goddess as the total sum of all physical forces and matter throughout space-time. For me this seems to be a way of believing in a divine/living creation matrix that would not contradict objective and logical conclusions that exist and yet to exist. It is from there I begin the separation process between subjective speculation and objective observation.


[edit on 8-7-2004 by Crysstaafur]



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 11:25 AM
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Hi SoothSayer:

How can you say that the 2 Hebrew Creation Myths in Bere#h (the Hebrew Genesis chatper 1:1 to 2:4a and 2:4b to 4:26) have anything whatsoever to do with the ORDER of Creation in either Myth 1 or Myth 2 (by the way, they DON"T MATCH) ???!!!?

Are you saying that Evolution Science teaches that the earth is surrounded by a SOLID DOME (Re'qiaq="bowl", "firmament") , i.e. an inverted "bowl" in which hangs the stars and the planets which literally covers the Earth? (Genesis 1:6)

Are you saying that Evolution Science teaches that the Sun, Moon and Stars were CREATED (bara) AFTER Vegetation? (Gen 1:15)?

So much for your so called ORDER BEING THE SAME...!

And if you read the 2nd Creation Myth (Gen chapter 2:4b to 4:26) you will notice a DIFFERENT ORDER.

Are you saying that Evolution Science teaches that ADAM was created first out of mud and that all the animals were brought to him to name and procreate with, but NO MATE WAS FOUND, so a creator god had to take out something from his side and make a MATE called Hayyaah for him?

How can you say Evolution Science has anything whatsoever to do with the (post Exilic) Adapted-from-Babylon Creation Myths that we read today in the paleo Hebrew of Bere#h (Genesis)?

Explain yourself if you would please....



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 02:34 PM
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Originally posted by Amadeus
Hi SoothSayer:

How can you say that the 2 Hebrew Creation Myths in Bere#h (the Hebrew Genesis chatper 1:1 to 2:4a and 2:4b to 4:26) have anything whatsoever to do with the ORDER of Creation in either Myth 1 or Myth 2 (by the way, they DON"T MATCH) ???!!!?


I don't think the order the words were placed are as important as the meaning behind the words. If you are compelled to worry about order, let me ask you this: Which came first, the chicken or the egg?


Are you saying that Evolution Science teaches that the earth is surrounded by a SOLID DOME (Re'qiaq="bowl", "firmament") , i.e. an inverted "bowl" in which hangs the stars and the planets which literally covers the Earth? (Genesis 1:6)


When I look up there is a word used to decribe what I see. It's called the sky. The reality is: there is no sky. It is only my perception of what I see. But yet, the word is still there and still being used.


Are you saying that Evolution Science teaches that the Sun, Moon and Stars were CREATED (bara) AFTER Vegetation? (Gen 1:15)?


Can science say the sun, moon and stars were created before organic matter?



Are you saying that Evolution Science teaches that ADAM was created first out of mud and that all the animals were brought to him to name and procreate with, but NO MATE WAS FOUND, so a creator god had to take out something from his side and make a MATE called Hayyaah for him?


Now compare this to what science teaches concerning asexual reproduction. Surely an evolutionist does not belief that males and females developed independantly of each other.



[edit on 8-7-2004 by Raphael_UO]


AF1

posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 03:03 PM
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Most evolutionist will tell you that they can co-exist to an extent, all creationists will tell you that they never could!



posted on Jul, 8 2004 @ 04:54 PM
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i don't know any creationist who say he can not agree it. I agree it myself





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