Dying Inside: Elderly in prison

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posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 01:54 AM
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One of the major issues here, which was previously stated, is that the prison system is a business. They are making a lot of money on each inmate that is in there. Inmates get very little services in prison, definitely not $100,000 per person worth. They are fed cheap grade B food, they are given cheap medication brands from 20-30 years old, and usually have to pay their own money for any privileges such as phone use,commissary, etc. They also make very little money and are a source of cheap labor when working. The prisons are making money off the taxes, and off of the prisoner labor, and any other deals they have going on. It won't be easy to dismantle such an economic income.
I think outsourcing to a private sector would be a good idea. But the county or state jails/prisons aren't going to give up that source of income very easily. It's just falling on the tax payers. More inflated, wasted money, like everything else in the country.

Point is, PRISONS ARE A BUSINESS. and that about sums it up. They set 1st time offenders up for failure, and most people will violate probation in some way, and be thrown back into jail or to have a criminal record, and never be able to get a decent employment position again.

BTW, great thread! S&F
edit on 2-1-2011 by Mastermook because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 02:03 AM
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I wonder what kind of effect an 'eye for an eye' system would have on us.

Steal from someone? Your possessions are stripped.

Violently take a life? Your life is violently taken.

As primitive as this is, it seems more logical than spending hundreds of thousands of dollars to keep these people locked up.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 02:09 AM
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If it is cheaper to house those who are truly diagnosed with dementia in a nursing home, then by all means move them out of prison to die a descent death. At least the family members, if any, would be able to visit the elderly whenever possible. However, anyone can claim to lose their recollections of past activities. And that could be another "loophole" abuse of the system.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 02:26 AM
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The real criminals are the politicians and law makers who devote billions upon billions of tax payer dollars to every facet of the failed legal system. The police are paid bullies, the prisoners are mostly nonviolent offenders. They just keep building more overpriced jails, "supermax" facilities and laugh all the way to the bank after locking all the brown skinned people they can find up. Come to think of it, everything in America is a form of imprisonment. From the monetary and class system to the aformentioned legal system, unless you are rich, you are a prisoner not free to travel to or live where you want-- even in your own country.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 03:40 AM
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reply to post by ayoss
 


Excellent links! Them lucrative government contracts transferring money from the law abiding taxpayer to the business interests of the 'preferred' contractor/s, who act in the interests of the 'shareholder'.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 03:41 AM
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wow, I didn't realize I was stirring up such a hornet's nest.
As most would agree, the system is broken.
It needs fixing or a complete overhaul.
Which is the reason why I created this thread.
thanks to all who are contributing



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 03:53 AM
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Originally posted by dolphinfan
Perhaps the solution is a different kind of facility, more like a minimum security facility.


We have 'open prisons' in the UK.

At Ford, an open prison set at a former naval air base near Arundel, West Sussex, prisoners indulged in some New Year rioting.

I don't know how to do links; this from the Guardian newspaper online.


the jail houses category D prisoners – those thought by the authorities to be trusted not to escape and as such allowed to reside in an open prison.

Over the years it has housed a number of high-profile inmates. George Best played football for the prison team while serving time there in 1984 for drink-driving, assaulting a police officer and failing to answer bail.

Other famous residents have included renegade spy David Shayler as well as Ernest Saunders, Anthony Parnes and Gerald Ronson, three of the "Guinness four" share-trade fraudsters.

Formerly a Fleet Air Arm station, the base was converted to an open prison in 1960.

Its two wings house up to 557 inmates and is open to offenders with less than two years left to serve with no history of trying to escape.

But in recent years it has been hit by a number of controversies.

Security lapses became news in 2006 when it emerged that at least 70 prisoners had absconded from the premises over a 12-month period. Amongst them were three murderers. In May of that year, 11 foreign nationals simply walked out.

In 2009, an independent report highlighted failings, including an outdated CCTV system and a problem with the smuggling of mobile phones, drugs and alcohol into the prison.

The latest incident is believed to be connected to this last issue. It it thought prisoners went on the rampage after refusing to be breathalysed as part of an attempted crackdown on alcohol.

Mark Freeman, deputy general secretary of the Prison Officers Association, said 40 empty bottles of alcohol had been found on the grounds in the weeks leading up to the riot.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 03:58 AM
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Originally posted by Erongaricuaro
A little paradox, no? The freest country in the world has the largest prison population.


Private prisons, operating under contract to the government, need prisoners.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 04:02 AM
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Originally posted by Unity_99
Now it takes creating homes, apramtments and townhouses, and half way houses and providing care and dignity.

You know really good social services.


Another lucrative business opportunity for the governments preferred contractors to exploit.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 04:06 AM
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How much more efficient was the Law Code given to the Israelites by Jehovah God. For example if a person committed murder they were put to death. They were not sent to prison and became a burden to society. If a person committed an at of unintentional manslaughter there were designated "cities of refuge" where they could run to, and if they were found to be innocent, that is the manslaughter was unintentional they were allowed to remain in those cities for the rest of their lives as active members of society. Thus, a more lenient punishment was given them, and they remained active members of society, not a drain.

Of a person was found robbing, they were to repay double-fold what they stole. They didn't have to go to prison and become a burden to society. If a person was found committing an act of incest, rape, etc. they were put to death, they did not have to go to prison and become a burden to society.

I realize how much superior the law the Israelites followed under God's direction than modern-day ones, no matter how well intentioned they may be.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 04:56 AM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


At that point.. If they are old, demented and don't remember a thing anymore..

Whats the point. I thought prison was a punishment. If someone is old, and unable to remember.. it's not punishment, just cruelty..



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 05:01 AM
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Whats that famous saying?

If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 05:03 AM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


Listening tonight to a man whose 5yr old daughter was raped, beaten and murdered, his pain was still very fresh no matter how much time has passed. The perp in this case was already pretty old when he was caught, so yes he will rot in jail, and I am sure the little girls father thinks this is appropriate. So do I.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 05:07 AM
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Originally posted by boondock-saint

now the age old question,
if a prisoner has dementia and cannot
even remember his name or his crime
and is no longer a threat to anyone and
only a burden to the taxpayers at the
expense of $100K yr each ....
do these folks even need to be behind bars
anymore ???

They might not have their memory intact, but they may still have their psycho personalities going just fine. They are behind bars for a reason in the first place.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 05:46 AM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


I was thinking of the Same thing Boondock St,

Escape From New York is Great Movie By the Way
Prisoners Having Their Own World and their Own Laws Within ( Once you go in you cant get Out ) Speaking of the Hardcore Criminals that is in for Life without Parole Would be Perfect

I was going to post something about it until you beat me to it LOL

How about another Movie Called No Escape another Prisoner Free World Society An Island that Is Similar to Escape of New York The Good Side and the Bad Side of the Island but its a Self Service Society with occasional Ration/Supply Drops that is Away from Civilization

No Escape Trailer 1994


Or how about Having Brain Wash Rehabilitation Like ...

Clock work Orange


Have Hardcore Criminal Prisoner be Cured Rehabilitated
like what they did to Alex Delarge in Clockwork Orange
For the Crimes they committed before being paroled or
being Released from Prison as An Elderly or the Dying Sick,




Alex, a violent juvenile in the near future, is caught after a number of brutal rapes and murders. While imprisoned, he submits to a controversial experiment to make criminals ill at the mildest suggestion of violence or conflict. Now Alex's victims want to welcome him back into society with the same enthusiasm he has always exhibited when performing his crimes.


Plot Summary for
A Clockwork Orange (1971)
www.imdb.com...

IMDB
Clockwork Orange
www.imdb.com...

Another

The Prisoner
en.wikipedia.org...
The Village (The Prisoner)
en.wikipedia.org...
edit on 2-1-2011 by Wolfenz because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 05:52 AM
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Originally posted by Constantlysilenced
Absolutely. If you do the crime, you do the time, regardless of whether you can remember what you done or even go to the toilet on your own.


Yeah i would agree with this if america didn't have the ridiculous three strikes law. Should someone really be imprisoned for the entirety of their lives because they made some minor mistakes? Imagine a young person who is a bit messed up and steals a few things, it's stupid, it's a little scummy but they can often be helped with a small sentence and rehabilitation. However if they steal three times then that's life in prison, in there with murderers and rapists. It's pretty well known that countries who have draconian sentences for minor crimes end up giving themselves a more criminal society. Countries which mix rehabilitation with punishment seem to have lower reoffending rates and lower crime rates generally.

I believe there is a big conspiracy to these long sentences and three strike laws.

Prison labour is a big industry. They can employ prisoners for hardly anything, get long hours out of them and there is no real way they can complain about their treatment. This means corporations and government make a fortune from these people.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 05:56 AM
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Greetings, boondock-saint,

May I raise some questions about elderly prisoners and the obamacare death panels?

The "Death Panel" requirement was written back into the obamacare law just prior to signing.

Under the original house bill, it was reported that prisoners are exempted from death panel scrutiny and decision rendering.

The question becomes, "are prisoners exempted from the death panel requirements of the obamacare law?"
Searching around, I'm unable to find any website links, so it becomes a good idea to defer to the scholars of this, the Above Top Secret website.

Ultimately, will they live longer if they remain incarcerated (if immune to the obamacare death panel requirement), or if they are released, will the death panel officials let them go ahead and die off? A better way to ask is, will they be exempt from the obamacare death panel provisions in a parole status? If they are exempt, will obamacare-care cost the taxpayers more than leaving these felons incarcerated?



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 06:48 AM
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Decriminalize non-violent crimes, use the money now spent on those "criminals" to pay for the real criminals. If once deemed to require a life sentence, then a life sentence it should be.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 08:10 AM
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reply to post by Constantlysilenced
 


You should star in your own V for Vendetta movie. You are not even being reasonable. The OP showed decorum in answering your post, but I will be a little more blunt. If someone can be housed in a nursery home setting for far less than that of a prison, and they are no threat, then why not. It is not as if they are living it up anyway. Besides, a lot of those who wreak havoc are those who are not caught or are poisoning the well in other ways. With the vast amounts of self-interested behavior in this nation, it is surely foolish to blame convicted criminals solely for the ills of our society. A nice psychological scapegoat perhaps, or object on which vengeance is placed, but not much more. I would think regurgitated cliches offer little substance.



posted on Jan, 2 2011 @ 08:15 AM
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reply to post by Thain Esh Kelch
 


And that reason might be for stealing a snickers bar after getting caught with a dime bag of pot 2 years earlier after getting a dui 1 year earlier. The most common mistakes these criminals made was not being clever enough to avoid detection. And the scenario I listed or one somewhat similar happens all the time in states with 3 strikes laws. So, there is a reason, but not necessarily a good one.





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