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still think chemtrails are not real?

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posted on Jan, 18 2011 @ 08:33 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
No you don't.

You "know" chemtrails exist because you choose to ignore the vast amount of evidence that they are something ewlse, AND prefer to believe something that is unproven but simpler for your to comprehend.

which means you have been duped by of the hoax - one of its main planks....indeed one that it absolutely must maintain, is that 100+ years of atmospheric science is all part of the conspiracy.


Something that's not proven?
Wow. Says who? Popular Mechanics? Bill O'Reilly? The Pope?

In a day and age of String Theory, Quantum Physics, Multiple Dimensions, Black Holes, Anti-Matter, Anti-Gravity, Magnetic Energy and an Electric Universe (all unproven)------you want 'proof' of thick purposefully placed criss-crossing trails?

Okie dokie!




posted on Jan, 18 2011 @ 08:38 PM
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Originally posted by weedwhacker


Then, it is true......no matter HOW much evidence is shown that "chem"-trails are a delusion,


Perhaps if you used a word like............let's say 'misunderstood' instead of 'delusion', you might have a better chance of being listened to.

Why don't you back off your insults. Because no one is insulting you. Just your style and now everyone can see why!

Make a point. Not enemies.



posted on Jan, 18 2011 @ 08:47 PM
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reply to post by Human_Alien
 

I believe a lot of progress has been made on chemtrail awareness on ATS. In my mind, no purpose is served any longer arguing with those in a vocal minority that have nothing to offer. For too long, threads have been derailed with "prove it", as if any of us has access to top secret classified information.
It is time we moved beyond the question of IF, to WHAT AND WHY.
It only serves the trolls to feed them.



posted on Jan, 18 2011 @ 08:48 PM
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Originally posted by iceblue20-12
And the Argument goes on and on and on and on like a broken record from both sides.

IT is called GEOENGINEERING.

www.naturalnews.com...


www.abc.net.au...


This is correct yet they don't even want to admit the 'good' (bad) type of chemtrails. Geoengineering doesn't contain water. It contains chemicals. And that is, in part, what we're seeing but the debunkers still won't even acknowledge that.

They rather hurl insults as a method of debating.



posted on Jan, 18 2011 @ 09:32 PM
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"Chemtrail" threads are always an interesting and stimulating read for me here on ATS. I would like to commend Apex, Stars15k, Weedwhacker, Firepilot, tsurfer2000h, and the others in this thread that have offered concise arguments and scientifically valid information in their posts.

I would also like to commend Nichirasukenshin for this post which offered concise and poignantly relative information regarding a piece of disinformation so commonly used by "chemtrailers". Laterallateral has offered several rational well thought out posts most of which have been ignored and two of which were met with false associations. I am impressed that all of these posts were ignored by the "chemtrailers" active in the thread as well as the manner in which you two posted.


Its good to see DPlum517, Stewie, and HumanAlien up to their usual tactics of false associations, framing arguments so as to cause a slanted and biased outcome regardless of the response to the argument, distraction, misdirection, and selective attention. I honestly believe that the three of you are so irrational in your religious like belief of chemtrails and so resolute in your steadfast refusal to acknowledge science that you make individuals like myself, whom use this site to Deny Ignorance, as your cover for a government operation to discredit chemtrailers. I wouldn't be surprised if they were using you three in an Agent like capacity to paint a picture of a typical "chemtrailer" that is easy to portray in an extremely negative fashion; so as to make it easier to discredit other actually valid conspiracy theories through the false associations method you all so notably yourself employ. That would be very ironic wouldn't it?

edit on 18-1-2011 by Dilligaf28 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 18 2011 @ 09:56 PM
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Originally posted by Human_Alien

Originally posted by iceblue20-12
And the Argument goes on and on and on and on like a broken record from both sides.

IT is called GEOENGINEERING.

www.naturalnews.com...


www.abc.net.au...


This is correct yet they don't even want to admit the 'good' (bad) type of chemtrails. Geoengineering doesn't contain water. It contains chemicals. And that is, in part, what we're seeing but the debunkers still won't even acknowledge that.

They rather hurl insults as a method of debating.



Its still hard to understand exactly what chemtrailers do not agree with. Which of the following statements do you find objectionable

1. Combustion engines burning petroleum productions, result in water as a byproduct.
2. At altitudes of jet aircraft 28-42k feet, it is VERY COLD, way way below freezing.
3. The upper air conditions can vary with temperature and humidity.
4. Airplane up there are at different altitudes, and those different altitudes can have different conditions.
5.. Ice crystals at those altitudes can persist, as evidence of cirrus clouds.
6.. Hundreds, even thousands of aircraft can be aloft at times, going all over the place and often crossing paths.

There is not a single one of those they will find at fault, but will still disregard it as a whole



posted on Jan, 18 2011 @ 10:02 PM
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Originally posted by dplum517
reply to post by stars15k
 


Why did you show my pics of WW2 planes? I don't care about Contrails, I care about Chemtrails.... not to mention you don't know what the military did for countermeasures against radar....fuel additives, chaff, flak....

I have never claimed to support all Chemtrail websites or the other. That's like saying I agree with every Chemtrail person out there, which is ridiculous.

And you quoted me out of context. I was specific to the BS website "contrailscience.com"

Just because people spout off the their craziest thoughts and come up with odd theories does not negate the fact that Chemtrails exist. You keep asking me to get lab results or something...... duhhhh ...as if I have the resources to do all that...


You prove over and over again, you have not the slightest clue what you were talking about. You tried to claim earlier that Chemtrailing was going on against Germany in WW2 and those contrails were evidence of that. You actually claimed that contraills may have actually been chaff, showing that yet again, your ignorance of anything aviation related, really knows no end at all. You are just another chemtrailer who believes anything you read on chemtrail sites, and multiple people told you that you had no idea what you were talking about.

Yes, we know exactly what radar countermeasure there were in WW2. Your endless uninformed speculation, does nothing to change that. There was chaff released (NOT SPRAYED in contrails), jamming, and attacks oin radar sites. Not B-17s and B-24s with secret spray gear making chemtrails

Radar does not show particles anyways, if you knew something, you would know that.

Contrail science has one thing that chemtrail sites do not have...SCIENCE. . I think you were asked to show one thing that the website had that was incorrect, and of course we hear nothing, other than silly phrases like disinfo, like the gov actually cares about what you think



posted on Jan, 18 2011 @ 11:37 PM
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reply to post by firepilot
 


What I find objectionable is your total disregard to address pertinent posts such as this Geo-engineering one.

Yet....this particular post was good enough for you to use as a reference-post but yet.....you ignored the entire content and intent of the post .....in which you grabbed!

Now that's clearly an example of Dumbfounding Debunking-101



posted on Jan, 18 2011 @ 11:44 PM
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Originally posted by gateway30
reply to post by mydarkpassenger
[mo



GO HEREthomas.loc.gov... THEN TYPE IN THEBILL NUMBER H.R.2977.IH
edit on 30-12-2010 by gateway30 because: (no reason given)


I did that and it shows there are no results for that... Indicating there is no such Bill....

So..... That suggests to me, that the "bill" that you are showing to us is not real. Perhaps you have been had?



posted on Jan, 18 2011 @ 11:45 PM
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Originally posted by Human_Alien
reply to post by firepilot
 


What I find objectionable is your total disregard to address pertinent posts such as this Geo-engineering one.

Yet....this particular post was good enough for you to use as a reference-post but yet.....you ignored the entire content and intent of the post .....in which you grabbed!

Now that's clearly an example of Dumbfounding Debunking-101


Really? All you and other chemmies offer is endless speculation, multiple versions of chemtrails that often debunk each other, statements that are not just incorrect but impossible, no empiracle evidence, and endless amounts of total junk science.

I have told you all time and time again, find specific statements I make that are incorrect. I put myself out there when it comes to science, aviation, meteorology, aircraft, etc. And I stand by everything I post. I can have my own ideas, without having to resort to youtube videos and links to conspiracy sites.

And its I that I am having to constantly correct all of you chemmies in regard to anything aircraft related, at least I could get a thank you sometime, because whether you like it or not, you probably come away with more aviation related knowledge from my posts (and weedwhackers too for that matter).

You can go ahead if you want, and tell yourself that jet aircraft cant make cirrus, that upper air is warm and balmy, that aircraft can not cross each others paths, and that there is some secret fleet of aircraft out there that apparently no one can see. Who knows, maybe you believe in the reptilians and sylphs too



posted on Jan, 19 2011 @ 12:18 AM
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Originally posted by gimme_some_truth

Originally posted by gateway30
reply to post by mydarkpassenger
[mo



GO HEREthomas.loc.gov... THEN TYPE IN THEBILL NUMBER H.R.2977.IH
edit on 30-12-2010 by gateway30 because: (no reason given)


I did that and it shows there are no results for that... Indicating there is no such Bill....

So..... That suggests to me, that the "bill" that you are showing to us is not real. Perhaps you have been had?


Oh they were had a long time ago. Some chemmie convinced a Kucinich staff member to put chemtrails in a house bill, and once Kucinich figured it out, he disavowed himself completely with it. But chemmies to this day, use the fact that they got a staffer to insert the word chemtrails, as actual evidence of chemtrails.



posted on Jan, 19 2011 @ 12:18 AM
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Double post..


edit on 19-1-2011 by firepilot because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 19 2011 @ 12:19 AM
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reply to post by firepilot
 


Once again......you avoid the issue at hand (geo-engineering)

Why can't we be seeing THAT (seeing I will give the benefit of doubt that they're doing 'good')
Why? why? why? why? why?

You know, Florida is a great state for chemtrail observance.

The weather doesn't vary as much here as most other places. It's pretty much 70 percent humidity/70 degrees in the winter so let's just PRETEND to go with that. Okay? Let's say it doesn't vary that much (which it doesn't) The upper atmosphere doesn't vary that much either most of the time. Again, lets pretend.

Now....why don't I see 'trails' ....hell, I'll do one better, PLANES more often? If this is their regular flight path and let's just SAY....conditions are the same 15 days a month...then why don't I see the planes over my house all the time?

I am retired. I am outside ALL THE TIME. I have a hawks eye and notice everything in the sky. I am looking up most times except driving (and even then actually)

So what are the odds, any time I see heavy plane activity is............only when their leaving a trail behind them? Why? why? why?

I never see 2, 3, 5 planes at once (unless I am at the airport) that aren't leaving trails.
What are the odds?????

Winning PowerBall has better odds than the odds of having optimum weather conditions....every weekend ...and seeing 2, 3 or 6 planes leaving trails.

Ah, this just isn't worth it.
Forget. Don't bother responding because I'm not gonna bother reading.

Have a good one.



posted on Jan, 19 2011 @ 02:23 PM
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Originally posted by Human_Alien
reply to post by firepilot
 


Once again......you avoid the issue at hand (geo-engineering)

Why can't we be seeing THAT (seeing I will give the benefit of doubt that they're doing 'good')
Why? why? why? why? why?

You know, Florida is a great state for chemtrail observance.

The weather doesn't vary as much here as most other places. It's pretty much 70 percent humidity/70 degrees in the winter so let's just PRETEND to go with that. Okay? Let's say it doesn't vary that much (which it doesn't) The upper atmosphere doesn't vary that much either most of the time. Again, lets pretend.

Now....why don't I see 'trails' ....hell, I'll do one better, PLANES more often? If this is their regular flight path and let's just SAY....conditions are the same 15 days a month...then why don't I see the planes over my house all the time?

I am retired. I am outside ALL THE TIME. I have a hawks eye and notice everything in the sky. I am looking up most times except driving (and even then actually)

So what are the odds, any time I see heavy plane activity is............only when their leaving a trail behind them? Why? why? why?

I never see 2, 3, 5 planes at once (unless I am at the airport) that aren't leaving trails.
What are the odds?????

Winning PowerBall has better odds than the odds of having optimum weather conditions....every weekend ...and seeing 2, 3 or 6 planes leaving trails.

Ah, this just isn't worth it.
Forget. Don't bother responding because I'm not gonna bother reading.

Have a good one.



Because there is one thing that you lack.

PROOF.

Patents are not proof, chemtrailers speculating about "geo-engineeering" is not proof, articles proposing an idea of a massive fleet of 747s is not proof. 10 Chemmies with 10 different ideas is not proof. Youtube videos are not proof, nor are links to other chemtrail websites

Nor is it proof when you and stewie make wild statements that if either of you two stepped away from conspiracy sites and did some actual research, you would not be making those statements.

You chemtrailers need to understand what a patent is. It is not proof of anything except that someone has an idea that they want to have the intellectual rights to. It does not mean it has been tested, or that it was even practical or constructed.

Living next to an airport means absolutely nothing. Why? because you are looking at enroute aircraft going someplace else and if they are up that high, they are obviously NOT landing at the airport near you.

And yes, sometimes there will be multiple aircraft overhead, you do have several very busy international airports there. You keep thinking that the conditions do not vary any - YES THEY DO. And do you know what the biggest thing is that chemmies can not understand? Not every aircraft is at the same altitudes. Thats mind blowing concept I know for some of you.

So you have different kinds of aircraft, with different kinds of engines, at different power settings. different altitudes, flying in different temperatures, over different routes. Guess what? Some may leave big contrails, others may not. Some days can have lots of contrails, some may not.

edit on 19-1-2011 by firepilot because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 19 2011 @ 03:00 PM
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Originally posted by Human_Alien

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
No you don't.

You "know" chemtrails exist because you choose to ignore the vast amount of evidence that they are something ewlse, AND prefer to believe something that is unproven but simpler for your to comprehend.

which means you have been duped by of the hoax - one of its main planks....indeed one that it absolutely must maintain, is that 100+ years of atmospheric science is all part of the conspiracy.


Something that's not proven?
Wow. Says who? Popular Mechanics? Bill O'Reilly? The Pope?


About 150 years of atmospheric science.

By all means show that the efforts of thousands of researchers over th decades are all completely wrong - yo'll get a nobel prize for it.


In a day and age of String Theory, Quantum Physics, Multiple Dimensions, Black Holes, Anti-Matter, Anti-Gravity, Magnetic Energy and an Electric Universe (all unproven)------you want 'proof' of thick purposefully placed criss-crossing trails?


Yeah - 'cos "chemtrails" should be nice and physical - no need to go into esoteric math to prove them - all you have to do to prove their existance is go up there and take a sample!

Not sure why the other theories are in the least relevant - AFAIK the chemtrail hoax does not depend upon any of them for its existance does it?

Okie dokie!

Still waiting.



posted on Jan, 19 2011 @ 03:10 PM
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Originally posted by Human_Alien
reply to post by firepilot
 


You know, Florida is a great state for chemtrail observance.

The weather doesn't vary as much here as most other places. It's pretty much 70 percent humidity/70 degrees in the winter so let's just PRETEND to go with that. Okay? Let's say it doesn't vary that much (which it doesn't)


At the moment florida.statesite.com... says that it is 63 deg F at Daytona Beach and 83 F at Ft Lauderdale - that seems like a fairly wide variation to me.

there's a humidity map at www.usairnet.com... - currently shows from 50 to 68 - again that seems fairly wide.

So here's an idea - let us NOT PRETEND ANYTHING.

Let us, instead, deal with what is real.


The upper atmosphere doesn't vary that much either most of the time. Again, lets pretend.


Again - let's not - let's stick with what is real rather than a pretend world. The upper atmosphere does vary - that is why there are high level clouds in some areas and not in others, why there is high altitude hail and electrical storms.

Let us use atmospheric science rather than anecdotal observation.





edit on 19-1-2011 by Aloysius the Gaul because: Because my typing sucks



posted on Jan, 19 2011 @ 07:50 PM
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CHEMTRAILS Shows Presence of Fibrosis





posted on Jan, 19 2011 @ 07:54 PM
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posted on Jan, 19 2011 @ 08:02 PM
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Contrail Fibers under 60x magnification from [2]




Morgellons fibers under 60x magnification [1]



Of course, we can't state conclusively these fibers are one and the same without a chemical analysis. Common characteristics of both types of fibers appear to be similar size and chaotic, uncontrolled growth. If these fibers are the result of highly advanced nanotechnology then we have found the disease, and possible who is behind it.



posted on Jan, 19 2011 @ 08:05 PM
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Originally posted by Human_Alien
CHEMTRAILS Shows Presence of Fibrosis




So what aircraft contrail was that taken from?

Oh wait, it wasnt. What ever it is, I am guessing there is absolutely nothing to connect that to aviation. You are just someone who believes anything that comes from another chemtrailer, without any critical thinking or skepticism.



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