Aliens'; it's about what you WANT to believe!

reply to post by HRegressor


I hope there is truth in the stories you mention (sorry I don't know them all). I only would like to know that if they were able to build underwater or undermountain bases, why weren't they able to cloack their ships, make them in some way invisible?

regards!

reply to post by saturnus1962


Bravo!! Very VERY well put. You broke it down excellently.

I often clump (my reality of) aliens. as you mentioned, with trying to describe color. It's like trying to describe color to someone let alone a blind person.

It almost can't be done.


It's one of those things that unless you experience it, there are no words that come close to explaining it. And for that matter, our eyes TOO....have a hard time processing it because we're so conditioned.

Not to segue too much off topic but under hypnosis I remember not being able to formulate 'words' in describing some of my experience. I know what I was seeing, but from my brain to my mouth.....was a void. For instance, I was trying to explain the 'space' they were in for it wasn't quite 3D and..........I couldn't.

It's a WHOLE other reality that (again, like you mentioned) we weren't 'taught' so our brain cannot break it down.

I wonder if we were brought up in a cave, away from society our entire lives, we would have an easier time with this paradigm?

I love this thread!

Thank you for an enjoyable read!

reply to post by saturnus1962

From a Moon's standpoint we have been Aliens or ETs ....we traveled to the Moon in a spaceship, got out took soil samples and did a lot of weird stuff(like golf) that ( if there were inhabitants) would of made the front page of the "Moon times" news paper.

Originally posted by saturnus1962
reply to post by HRegressor

 

I hope there is truth in the stories you mention (sorry I don't know them all). I only would like to know that if they were able to build underwater or undermountain bases, why weren't they able to cloack their ships, make them in some way invisible?

regards!

Thanks,

The aliens enjoy showing us their intelligence, like magicians they like to intrigue minds. At other times they are just too busy to worry about what onlookers think. Given the amount of sightings in the late 40s and early 50s, I think it is clear to say that they wanted us to know they were here. An alien would never appear on the news, probably because they will not be able to dominate the situation, its something to think about...

reply to post by saturnus1962


I have an idea, how about i show you a photograph of some 'aliens" and see if you can describe them? A few specifics, they have Star travel, they are aphysical, communal and telepathic. That means they cannot be seen, heard or felt.....but they can be photographed.

A lot of folk call them a "delusion." To my way of thinking that is scarier then calling them aliens. This photograph is of the ceiling corner of my room, can you describe it?

Originally posted by EsSeeEye

What else could it be? The ETH has yet to be scientifically verified in any public forum, so by all the known rules of the universe, they don't exist. The likelihood is there, yes, but until it's confirmed it's still simply a hypothesis.

I feel that's just an assumption. People automatically assume it's a "scientific question" when it's not limited to this at all. The possibility of the existence of intelligent ETs is already confirmed by science, and the reality can be established beyond a reasonable doubt by various kinds of evidence, inclusing testimony, and the (eventual) study of alien life and some of the types of evidence for it (some of which we have even now), will once again belong within the field of science. But establishing that ET's have visited earth is not necessarily within the purview of "science", just as settling other issues of "has x occurred or has is not" variety do not generally or predominantly belong within the realm of "science".

Could you prove the existence of visiting intelligent aliens in a court case? The US Supreme Court doesn't cover the laws of physics any more than it would cover the existence or non-existence of visiting alien species. What else could answer the question if not the scientific community?

Yes, I believe it could be proven in a court of law, beyond a reasonable doubt.

The Alien question has nothing to do with laws of physics beyond establishing that it's possible or likely or inevitable (depending on your view) that other intelligent beings exist in the universe. Beyond that, it becomes unreasonable to reject the notion of ET visitation based on our present understanding of physics in relation to their ability to reach earth or their motivation to do so. If science has told us anything it's that our knowledge of the universe and it's laws is constantly changing and adapting, so that it would be unwise in the extreme to discount something like ET visitation based on present understanding of physics, especially if there is abundant evidence suggesting that ET visitation is occurring.

There is abundant evidence, it is just not - yet - all of the type that our present tools of science can get to grips with. But we have other tools with which we can address the evidence that the phenomena presents. It's always wise to use the right tools for the job, rather than insist on using only one tool and ignoring jobs it can't deal with. That makes no sense.

Imagine that eyewitness testimony are nails and types of scientific evidence are screws. Well at present we have hundreds of thousand of nails and only a few screws. Imagine then that science is a screwdriver. To limit this endeavor to science is to say "We can't build anything usng those nails, we only have a tool to deal with screws and there aren't enough screws to build anything". OK, well, use the right tool for the job. Then imagine that the Court investigation model is a hammer.

Use the right tool for the job.

We could achieve something now, rather than sitting back and twiddling our thumbs, ignoring the titanic, ever increasing mountain of "nails" in front of us, because we insist on exclusively using a "screwdriver".

Science is often driven by attention and demand. If the subject were legitimized by society addressing and acknowledging the enormous weight of credible testimony and some supporting scientific evidence (which does exist) for the ETH and publicly concluding that intelligent ETs are, beyond a reasonable doubt, visiting Earth, then the Scientific community would feel free to address the evidence and seek more without fear of ridicule. Then I imagine we would make great strides in short order. Perhaps even government would be more forthcoming with evidence it has, seeing as the population has already acclimatized itself to the reality.

Originally posted by saturnus1962

Prove it!

We can prove Aliens exist right now. Do you watch TAPS/Ghost hunters on TV? Notice how energy life forms can manipulate EMF meters with milligaus's of energy?

All you have to do is create a mouse and keyboard that 1 milligaus could actuate. Call this a Spirit Interface Device (SID). Open up windows word and leave a computer with the SID unit attached to in areas that are "haunted'.

Satan and the other "fallen angels" are all actually off-world life forms. Would they use the SID and start typing?

That would be proof of aliens on Earth, in their energy forms. Please don't let them get on the internet. LOL!

reply to post by saturnus1962

yet we all believe it exists, because we commonly decided this as known fact!

That's because we detect it with scientific instruments. We don't simply believe that something like oxygen exists, we can detect and observe it with something other than our eyes. People mistakenly like to claim something along the lines of seeing is believing as though we need to be able to see something to know its there. In fact the human sense of sight is fraud, one person's eye witness testimony is entirely worthless in science. You need repeated observation and hard data preferably from accurate instrumentation.

As such we have no found any hard evidence of aliens.

reply to post by Malcram


You have it completely wrong in so many ways that I don't even know how to approach a response to you.

I apologize for being blunt, first of all.

You're saying we can just decide it's true and it'll be true, and that's not how it works. It will be true or not with or without our acknowledgement of it, so us pretending it's true doesn't change in the slightest the outcome of it's reality. That's the whole reason we have science, so we can test, re-test, examine and re-examine things we think are possibly true. We don't just think something's true and then leave it at that.

As for the courts... What would happen if tomorrow a court case came through saying... what? What could possibly happen in the court that would concern aliens, and how could they prove anything through the courts? I don't understand this bit at all. Without ample scientific evidence, there's no way to have a worthwhile court case, because any intelligent attorney would get it thrown out on the falsehood of the existence of extraterrestrials. It would be like trying to sue God (which has been done, but never successfully, as far as I know, and we all know the cheap bloke won't pay out anyway).

To all who were so kind to post a comment: thanks!

I see some discussion about who's being right and who's being wrong; But that's the whole point: neither of us is right or wrong (including this mail)

We all learned the thruth in our younger years to be as we now experience. But it's only the truth because we all agreed to see it (define it) as such. And we need those definitions to be able to communicate with each other, nothing wrong with that!

But an alien has different definitions, a different "truth". Or maybe the same?!?!?. They might be visible, or the might not, they might be solid, or they might not. The mght be giant, larger than life, or minute.

Who'se to say and who'se to know?

reply to post by debris765nju


Hello my fellow ATS, what is you questoin exactly? That you can see an Alien in all? If you say there is an Alien in that picture, be cause you see it., I can't argue with that, I can only say I don't see it (in my definition), but I can't say it is not there!

thanks for your post!

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


Hello, you are right, we defined oxygen and currently accept that it's true as a scientific fact.

but can you imagine an alien would defin it as "air", "gas" or some unpronouncable word? you can't argue with the alien, because he lives within a different truth! (very likely anyway).

so what we difine as "orb" might be an "alien", who'se to say?

reply to post by saturnus1962


Science is to say... but first there needs to be some solid evidence. Without some kind of actual testable evidence in favor of aliens science cannot come to a conclusion and must therefore remain skeptical.

I would like to use Ghosts as an example,because i have known people more often think Ghosts are real and at the same time laugh at the prospect of Aliens being a reality. I really am not sure if it is because it is harder to travel from oh say the Sirius star to planet earth than to come back from the dead? Or just change form in to energy in form of a Ghost and this must be easier to do than oh say engineer a space ship that can go the speed of light, or travel through worm holes, manipulate dimensions and what have you.


I really do not see the big deal as far as Aliens go, to me the reality of aliens are more likely than life after death, spirits and the supernatural. Sure we can go in to a haunted house and pick up EVP's and use thermal vision and take pics of ORB's and apparitions now and then. Does this mean Ghosts are any more scientifically proven real then Aliens? Is it because we fear our mortality that we set double standards when it comes to the unexplained? Perception, without belief lets put the evidence to the test. I really have not seen much regarding aliens in physical evidence besides those implants in people being removed, scars, some metal slag that came from a alleged UFO. How do we prove something that may not be in a physical form as we understand it, we may not have the technology to even detect it. I have seen enough evidence to warrant that Ghosts are real, we just do not understand exactly how it works and how they manifest. So same goes as far as Aliens go, we simply do not understand where they come from, if they are aliens at all. But whatever they are ...something is going on and some little beings from somewhere are here for some reason if you ask me. There is no way this all stems from human fantasy entirely, and that it is all BS NO WAY.


I think we depend so much on our senses like Vision, Touch, Taste and Hearing that we wouldn't know of Ghosts or even Aliens were around us. And who set the standard that Aliens are all of a physical form? For all we know aliens and Ghosts could be the same? We are probably looking in the wrong places, we could be looking too hard and making things more complicated than they have to be. To me the idea of Aliens is natural, it seems absurd to think we are alone. It is also asinine to expect intelligent off world beings to stumble on to rocket propulsion the same as we did and use the same applications of travel from point A to point B. Yet a hundred years ago if you claimed we could send man to the moon you might find yourself in a mental ward.




When we stop thinking the universe revolves around us, then maybe we will start to grasp what these things are, how they really work and even who we are. To me it is two strangers passing each other in the night with a sense of familiarity we think they are out for a walk like us that they met us half way the same way. It's bound to happen, Humans and some other form of Intelligence sooner or later. Question is will we notice if it has not happened all ready?

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


You certainly must remain skeptical. So am I. And I'm the first to say that a public handshake from an "Alien" anlong with bringing science we have never seen before should clear it all! Gone with debunkers!

But what if they can't? If they are i some other dimension?, some other existence? how would they let us know they are there. And if they can't let us know they are theur (because the don't see us), then how would we sense their presence? What would their "footprint" look like?

Ofcourse here you come to the the point when you might say "well, if we can't see them and they can't see us, why bother to try to understand?" Anser: we won't have to, but to keep our mind open to the unexplainable an to what its source may be.....

reply to post by Unknown Soldier


Sorry for this one-liner; but exactly my point.

we have to quit thinking in borders, limits etc.