Vatican Emerges From WikiLeaks As A Key Player On Global Scene

I would not take this as any holy grail.

I highly doubt Obama/America listens that much to the pope and Vatican or that they have any real say so in the countries business.

This wiki leaks information keeps getting more boring by the day...

When will the significant information come (don't think ever)

With Assanges at the helm of this information I would not trust it at all.

The wiki leaks prove nothing and the wikileak fan-boys just drool like
ignorant schmuck dogs and hang onto every word Poppa Assange tells to them only to their demise...

I dont know whats more suprising, wikileaks trying to out the vatican, like every other organisation.. or that pedophilia may actually rule the world... just saying.. looking at those bishops.. yeah.. and of they are a powerful lobby, well then.. "add it up!"

actually none of this suprises me

Originally posted by Myendica
I dont know whats more suprising, wikileaks trying to out the vatican, like every other organisation.. or that pedophilia may actually rule the world... just saying.. looking at those bishops.. yeah.. and of they are a powerful lobby, well then.. "add it up!"

actually none of this suprises me

Nothing that has come out of wiki leaks has surprised me but confirmed a few things I already knew.

As times move forward it becomes painfully obvious that organized religion is to blame for the abuse of humanity.Yet, I can't believe for a second that the world would be better off without Jesus... what needs to change IS this idea that some mortals are of higher rank than others in the kingdom of Heaven...it's not true... God loves everybody totally and equally. He made all of us, and we all have a role to play in bringing more light, truth and love into the world. When humanity gets this, the Catholic church will finally die, and the real Christanity that Jesus brought forth will come to light.

Originally posted by wavemaker
Except for the Pope, all those listed are based in the US. I don't think that only US-based people are in control of the world.

Really you don't think the U.S. Military with bases in 152 nations is not in control of the world?

The trillogy consists of three City States, Vatican City, not bound by Italy, the City of London not bound by England, the City of Washington D.C., not bound by the United States.

One controls the spiritual backbone of the system and the record keeping (the Vatican) one controls the commerce and the banking (London) and one controls the Military Governance of the world (Washington D.C.).

That also happens to be the chain of command.

This is in reality what the world looks like to the United States...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/46a8f3eaea40.png[/atsimg]

reply to post by JohhnyBGood


While I didn't know the details, this does not suprise me. Do you all learn about the Crusades?

Years ago I read something that said that the single largest 'private' landowner int he Unites States was...

The Catholic Church.

They own more land than any individual, corporation, or anyone in the US, aside from the US Government.

I wonder if it's still true today.

Thanks to all everyone contributing to this thread time is short at the moment, however I do plan to respond to all comments.
.
Is it not interesting, compelling, and cliff teetering that this was published on December 23, (2010 - not as a factor).
Most of us will know, for those who do not its time to take note.

There is no mistaking this announcment, its timing.
It was timed at The Winter Solstice.

The seasonal significance of the winter solstice is in the reversal of the gradual lengthening of nights and shortening of days. Depending on the shift of the calendar, the winter solstice occurs on December 21 or 22 each year in the Northern Hemisphere, and June 20 or 21 in the Southern Hemisphere. The 2010 winter solstice (summer solstice in the southern hemisphere) occurred on December 21, at 23:38 UTC. This is 11:38 pm Western European Time (WET) or 6:38 pm Eastern Standard Time (EST).

Worldwide, interpretation of the event has varied from culture to culture, but most cultures have held a recognition of rebirth, involving holidays, festivals, gatherings, rituals or other celebrations around that time.

en.wikipedia.org...

Why Dec. 25th? Church settled on ‘Christ’s birth day’ centuries later

Those of you have studied know that the December 25th date that The Catholic Church designated as "Christmas" is not the actual time of the year, nor near the date that Jesus Christ was recorcded to have been born.
They, following the tradition of men have convoluted history.

Many people believed the world was re-created on the first day of spring (March 25 of the Julian calendar followed in ancient Rome). How appropriate, then, for the world's redeemer to become incarnate that day!

- Other scholars argued that Jesus became incarnate not at his birth but at his conception. If Jesus was conceived March 25, he would be born nine months later, Dec. 25.

This date didn't catch on immediately, especially in the Eastern Mediterranean region where people believed Jesus was born Jan. 6. But in the West Dec. 25 had much appeal. Why?

Many Romans venerated the sun, whose birthday was Dec. 25, or a virility god named Mithra with the same birthday. Also, the Romans observed a raucous celebration called Saturnalia Dec. 17-23. Thus, Dec. 25 offered a date with a good theological basis that also would counter several pagan holidays.

Although we don't know the final steps, in 336 the church at Rome officially observed the "birth day of Christ" Dec. 25. This tradition spread. But what about Jan. 6? The church decided to use that day for Jesus' manifestation to the whole world, symbolized by the Magi

www.catholic.org...

reply to post by yrwehere1


Thank you for your post, and the links. From one of them....

Joseph Ratzinger, now Pope Benedict XVI, answered this question when he was a top advisor to John Paul II:

“‘Even if the most recent, loathsome experience of the Shoah (Holocaust) was perpetrated in the name of an anti-Christian ideology, which tried to strike the Christian faith at its Abrahamic roots in the people of Israel, it cannot be denied that a certain insufficient resistance to this atrocity on the part of Christians can be explained by an inherited anti-Judaism present in the hearts of not a few Christians.’”

[My emphasis – J.I.]

– Joseph Ratzinger as quoted by Abe Foxman in an Anti-Defamation League (ADL) press release welcoming Ratzinger’s election as Pope.
www.adl.org...

www.adl.org...

www.emperors-clothes.com...

reply to post by MikeboydUS

They were philosophers. People can think, but organizing and planning for a project that lasts millenia. None of them could do that. The other problem is they are mortal.

You really are going out of your way to cast doubt on the actual value of a University Education, let me help broaden your horizons by introducing you to one Mr. Samuel Hazard who tragically is not with us today, but back in the mid 1800's he was the Registar of the Key Stone State of Pennsylvania which is actually aptly named as understanding the Proprietary Colony William Penn set up there looms large in understanding how modern day America works.

Mr. Hazard was becoming alarmed because one of the first things William Penn did was to write the Great Law.

The Great Law was in fact so greatly written nothing can actually supercede it to this day, which is why the Supreme Court of the State of Pennsylvania is the Highest Court in the United States because it is the best versed with the Great Law, Crown Law and Cannon Law, all of which are still used in appeals as Mr. Hazard is nice enough to demonstrate, because one of the things in the Great Law is that every act of importance pertaining to the government must be recorded.

These records dating to 1630 were being slowly eaten by rats so Mr. Hazard took the time in the mid 1800's to type them all out again to preserve them, where they are still on file today.

They will walk you through from a time in America where well there were only a couple hundred Europeans here, and how the devised to build the nations infrastructure, create it's commerce, survey it for resources, place a value on those resources, require the human stock and bond investments from European Lords and Royals, and build the nation you live in.

As you read through these thousands of pages of records you will learn history as it happened as the actual government at that moment in time percieved it and conducted it, as well as their long range plans.

You will also learn something else, that a contract is a contract is a contract and bestows both benefits and liabilities on it's heirs.

Which is why unbeknowst to most people the Great Law is still in effect inside the United States to this day.

www.ebooksread.com... gister-of-pennsylvania--devoted-to-the-preservation-of-facts-and-document-aza.shtml

History is not in fact in the text books your professors read and lecture you from, history is in the actual contracts and instruments that build enterprises, corporations and nations. In the Treaties that establish nations and end wars.

A binding contract from a thousand years ago is just as binding today, which is yes, why, in fact, these lazy stupid humans you have so little respect for labor away at ongoing plans because the contract that governs that calls for it.

Humans do not like to follow the directions of dead people. Every generation redefines itself. It may borrow from the previous, but just as species evolve biologically, human civilization and society evolves every generation.

Really then please explain to me why billions of people are still listening to Jesus who claimed to be just a man, and listening to Mohamed who claimed to be just a man and living their lives and planning their futures based on what they had to say about their beliefs in a monotheistic system of worship.

Why do we hear 10,000 times a day here on ATS someone mention Thomas Jefferson, or Benjamin Franklin or George Washington?

You have some respectable sources for that accusation? The Tetragrammaton was around before Rome ever mattered. The last bit about gold is absurd.

I need no evidence that the Jews have steadfastly refused to name their God(s) because you yourself don't know the names of their God(s).

Further you have no idea what was around before Rome since Rome has controlled the History of the World for thousands of years by being the main point of desemination for it.

Let's not even get into some of the absurdities of some of the Jewish beliefs, for instance that their are only 600,000 Jewish Souls and if there are more than 600,000 Jews alive, that each is only considered to be a fragment of one of those souls, and the numerology involved in the religion because once you understand Jewish Numerology then yes conquering the world based on a simple plan of math not only becomes plausible but down right obvious child's play.

While you might not be willing to see it or admit it your arguments actually contradict themselves as you defend the validity of ancient superstitions passed on by men from generation to generation, while at the same time stating that men are not capable of following plans and things from one generation to another.

Your arguments are devoid of common sense and seem just to be a personal opinion that is based on a form of desperate denial, that doesn't even consider the very things you are saying.

By who? More humans? Humans without computers? Humans whose minds grow feeble within 90 years?

The human mind is in fact a very complex computer that can simultaneously conduct a host of functions no man made computer can do, it executes thousands of functions a second, while being able to multi-task on many different levels.

Science is still attempting to map out the human mind and understand all its complex functions and has not been able to complete this yet with all the computers in the world.

Humans design computers, it’s not computers designing humans.

You know if some ancient Egyptians built some immortal AIs thousands of years ago, I would be more inclined to believe some of these hypotheses. Even then the machines would have to have some amazing psychohistorical abilities.

Once philosophy led to an understanding of psychology and basic math was mastered everything needed to make complex plans was evident.

This is in fact how flawed your thinking is on this subject, the classic Roman Empire which I contend never did die historically is known to have existed in it’s early stages as a Republic up to furthest point of it’s relentless expansion which included large swaths of England, Africa, Asia, Europe and the Middle East for over a 1200 year period as a continuing system, that was intent and considered it’s survival to be based on expansion, over this known period it evolved from a Republic similar to our own at it’s founding, to an Imperial Dictatorship and finally into a religious theocracy, that it might further have evolved by morphing into yet another form(s) would not be inconceivable based on it’s known track record.

The only plausible way this might work, and then probably for only a few generations, would be for the Engineers of such a project to be a religious cult and not just any old cult either. I'm talking about a cult with severe brainwashing and indoctrination, bound by a very strict religious code. There would have to be autistic "mentats" bred to compute various plans, with scribes adept at cryptography recording the computations in archives. Vast well protected archives would have to be established containing the data. The data itself would have to be treated as some holy code revered by the houses that comprise the cult.

Oh boy at the height of the three hundred year reign of the Knights Templar founded in the last and still surviving Roman State of Seborga that has never been anything but a Roman state from the earliest days of the Empire and it's holiest place in the classic Empire (thought to be the Mount Olympus of the Gods) the Knights Templar Organization included over 250,000 members with only one out of 7 being a man at arms, all the rest were clerks and scribes.

Throw in the Jesuits, the Knights Hospitalier, the Tutonic Knights, the Knights of Malta and Columbus and their own support networks of scribes all taking their ultimate direction from Rome and in fact what you say was necessary was present.

The houses of the cult, would have to have an advanced, 19th century, understanding of mathematics, genetics/eugenics, sociology, political science, and economics.

What we do in fact know is Classic Rome reached a level of unparalleled amenities and building acheivements, the oldest functioning building in the world the Romam Parthenon still recieves thousands of visitors each day, many of the aqueducts are still standing. Homes had running water, advance medicine including brain surgeries were evident, so were simple computers like those found lost at sea that threads have been done on here by ATS, not to mention what might have been in the Library at Alexandria.

What Rome and the Vatican retained while imposing the Dark Ages to stamp out the pagan religions might have in fact been and is still beyond our own modern understanding of some of these things.

During the dark ages the peoples of Europe who once desperately wanted included into the Roman Empire for it's luxuries, amenities, entertainments, sciences and other conveniences were told that these things and Romes wicked ways had led to God punishing them all and denying them these things.

This was one of the methods that they used to make God real, yet don't you think it rather suspect that two years before Columbus 'discovered' a teaming continent full of resources and first nation's peoples that Rome decreed it belonged to them in advance of that, and then just that quickly it was found?

You know what Rome wants you to know, whether you accept that or not is not relevant, the fact that you are not prepared to question what Rome in fact knows and does, simply suggests a mind prone to assumption and what it's been indoctrinated to believe.

Lastly and I cannot see a way around it, is the use of psychics, either as clairvoyant spies/inquisitors, telekinetic assassins, and the use of Channeling mediums.

I will admit I host vistors from time to time who are not of this dimension. This makes me nothing but a gracious and open minded host, and not a member of a religion or a cult.

Though they would like me to think they can dominate me, (and I let them think that at first simply so we could get to know each other better by making it more inviting for them) I have proven to them, I can dominate them.

Do they possess knowledge of some of the Universe I do not, they do seem to, but they are none the less envious of my temporal ability to experience things within this physical realm that they can not.

The Planet itself is a life form, a concious one, so are the other planets. Have these spirits aided me with knowledge that even at times has saved my life? Yes, but I don't put it past them from having first created the situations where my life becaome endangered for them to save it.

I remain cordial with these entities but I am far from impressed with them, nor do I particuarly trust them. However I do not fear them either. Though my cat seems to really not like them and is afraid of them.

I refuse to limit my ultimate potential and my perspectives.

I still can't see it lasting long though. The Roman Patricians didn't give much thought to the teachings of Pythagoras and Plato. There is no indication that until Marcus Aurelius, the Emperors cared much for philosophy.

Yet the truth is all Patricians spoke Greek and considered it a much more descriptive and aristorcratic tongue than Latin.

Rome was and is an almagamation of the Gods of Troy, the philosophical mind of the Athenian, and the war like courage and dominance of the Spartans, all blended into one 'superior' human, which was typically Stoic in nature, with Stoicism being the primary philosophy instilled in the militant masses in order to carry out the carnage of it's relentless conquests.

While scant evidence exists for the above outside of the Skull and Bones 322 and the highest degrees of Masonry, the lack of evidence is once again, in part to sell the notions of monotheism and mergin One God into One State with allegience to one being in essence allegience to another, hence you are either a God fearing American or a Godless Commie!

Brilliant plan actually. It's been working rather well from where I sit.

I still hypothesize, the forces at work are not human though and the Twelve are not simple myth.

I know that you believe this, and I am dilligently investigating it, I am leaning to a conclusion that the 12 are the signs of the Zodiac the actual planets in the Solar System each a life entitity of supreme power after absorbing everything into one collective concious.

One could argue the same is happening here, Tigers are almost extinct but people still have the courage of Tigers, Dinosaurs are extinct but the Dinosaur Rock of the 70's lives on, we continue to expand and evolve emulating the best qualities of the things we are eliminating by actually incorporating them into the earth itself, as we all are incoporated into it.

Ashes to ashes, dust to dust as they say Mr. Boyd.

Our limited understanding of evolution and the Universe has in part been largely impeded by Rome and the Monotheistic Concepts of God that still make and have long made some mysteries off limits and a matter of herracy, or the pervue of the Devil.

Does Rome though possess the knowledge it denies the masses, and I contend it knows far more than it lets on, as the Vatican itself is a hodgepodge of symbols from dozens of different religions and belief systems, including the Zodiac.

I believe many of the answers you seek are being zealously gaurded by Rome, but I do not believe, and I can not stress this enough that the open mind and an indominable and intrepid soul can not acquire most of this knowledge themselves through self evidence if you are prepared to cast societal constructs aside.

Anyway I do intend to do a gray area thread on the 12 classic Gods one of these days, and I will certainly invite you to participate and take part in it, and look forward to more of your thoughts on this.

Thanks.

www.catholicnews.com...

Occasionally, there are frank assessments of differences, as in a U.S. Embassy memo from July 2001, which forecast continued problems with the Vatican over Israel, the death penalty and Iraq.

"The Vatican will continue to oppose U.S. efforts to isolate Saddam Hussein. We should recognize that the Vatican will not support our efforts in Iraq, and investigate ways to limit Vatican interference with our objectives," the cable said tersely

This was said in a cable/memo dated: July 2001

[...]"The Vatican will continue to oppose U.S. efforts to isolate Saddam Hussein. We should recognize that the Vatican will not support our efforts in Iraq, and investigate ways to limit Vatican interference with our objectives," [...]

This cable/memo written by American Diplomats was sent to the USA long before 911 attacks, long before the capture of Saddam, long before USA invaded Iraq and long before Saddam Hussein was captured followed by the hanging of Saddam Hussein


Then in 2007 the article notes:

when Pope Benedict XVI said in 2007 that "nothing positive comes from Iraq, torn apart by continual slaughter as the civil population flees," the embassy quickly objected, telling a high-level Vatican official that Iraq was experiencing positive developments and that the papal comments were not constructive.

reply to post by Ellen15


Obviously the American officials were not interested in the Vatican's opinion, the ties between America and the Vatican have been strained more then not,

reply to post by Stormdancer777


Agreed. Its highly duplicitous of The Vatican to deny that they endorse GMO crop production.
They in fact do. While on the other hand they deny it.

They hide behind the scientific panel they created; The Pontifical Academy of Sciences.

Members of the Pontifical Academy of Sciences:
Prof. em. Werner Arber • Switzerland, University of Basel: Microbiology, Evolution.
Prof. Nicola Cabibbo † • Italy, Rome, President Pontifical Academy of Sciences: Physics. H.Em. Georges Cardinal Cottier, Vatican City: Theology.
Prof. em. Ingo Potrykus • Switzerland, Zurich, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology: Plant Biology, Agricultural Biotechnology.
Prof. em. Peter H. Raven • USA, St. Louis, President Missouri Botanical Garden: Botany, Ecology.
H.Em. Msgr. Marcelo Sánchez Sorondo • Vatican City: Chancellor Pontifical Academy of Sciences: Philosophy.
Prof. Rafael Vicuña • Chile, Santiago, Pontifical Catholic University of Chile: Microbiology, Molecular Genetics.

www.ask-force.org...

How many American presidents were Catholic?

I remember the Kennedy years many didn't want him because of that fact,

wonder what is up with the Episcopalians, I need to check that out.

en.wikipedia.org...

I would say that founders of America were more protestant.

They didn't want anything to do with the Catholic church.en.wikipedia.org...

Oh I see

Originally posted by Echtelion

Originally posted by burntheships
The Vatican, a key player on the global scene?
Imagine that.

The WikiLeaks cables have described Vatican diplomats as generally well-informed and as influential lobbyists behind the scenes. What's amazing is that the Vatican accomplishes all this with a relatively tiny diplomatic corps -- a few hundred bishops and priests who were hand-picked and trained at a little-known diplomatic academy in downtown Rome.

And who thought they were in the business of religion.
Pehaps politics is a religion after all. A religion of control.

it actually seems to be a lot more than this...

Yes, and as you brought to attention:

Malta has been some sort of focal point for every single empire around the Mediterranean for thousands of years. Its geographic location, being at the very center of the Mediterranean has always been a key geopolitical point, for all issues related to trade, diplomacy and of course, military operations. So now turns out the island of Malta is under the strict rule of the Roman Catholic Church! There are many other striking similarities with the Roman Empire... like how it's being run exclusively by mens, just like the patricians.

Thanks for that addition!
bts~

reply to post by burntheships


EW that Malta thing is interesting, I missed that.

Well that would be home to the great mother goddess,

Ancient Home to Goddesses and Fertility Cults
www.infohub.com...

Nowhere on earth did a Goddess ever reign as she did in Malta. Architect Richard England explains the Maltese temples themselves as the personification of the Earth Mother, with floor plans which echo abundant maternal curves. One can easily imagine the concept of entering the "womb" of the temple for communion with the Goddess, and emerging "re-born" into the sunlight. Amazingly, visitors can still walk in several of these prehistoric temples. They are UNESCO World Heritage sites and the oldest free-standing buildings on the planet. But what about the advanced civilization which they represent?

Two terms seem to go hand-in-hand when the temples of Malta are discussed. Fertility Cult is often used to describe pre-patriarchal societies of the Neolithic period, which in most of the world some 4,500 years ago worshipped a Goddess.

www.infohub.com...
www.infohub.com...

yeaaaaaa, it all ties in

reply to post by die_another_day


Not sure about the Vatican's value but Queen Elizabeth/The Crown owns trillions of acres of land throughout the world. They own more land in the U.S than any other entity.

One item I am confused about is if the Vatican is part of the PTB why are they so anti- birth control, which conflicts with elitist agenda.

Have you folks read "the Secret Terrorists" by Bill Hughes. A MUST READ book for all on ATS! Just finished it yesterday and was floored by the revelations. Connected the dots on the Titanic, the fed, world wars and other events and how they fit in perfectly with their agenda, of course cleverly using their ancient enemies the Jews as their scapegoat and 'moat' around the castle to protect themselves from their crimes!

www.pacinst.com... or search for it on scroogle or startpage

Assassinations, terrorist attacks, world wars, NOTHING is beyond these extremely evil black occultists.

They have used murder and torture for centuries to amass wealth, power and terrifying obedience

They have sought to destroy all culture that lives in harmony with nature and each other

Horror films of today? They are nothing compared to what the Vatican did to estimated millions upon millions of so called 'heretics'

Deposing and assassinating kings and queens is all part of their MO

They are so devious and cunning it boggles the mind, the proof is in how they are not even in the minds or on the radar screens of even those aware of these conspiracies! They are too 'holy' and 'devout' for all the wars, intrigues and terror they cause and have caused for centuries

Want further proof look at all the extremely common accounts of pedophilia amongst these servants of hell.

Perhaps they are also fulfilling biblical prophecy either consciously or unconsciously, according to the dictates of the demons/evil they serve?

On a positive note the courageous actions of men have curbed their endless desire for violence and suffering, the actions of Martin Luther and the reformation, the Protestantism and common law in England, and perhaps the greatest achievement the declaration of independence and the bill of rights!

Humanity faces a common enemy and we need to expose these scum and defend ourselves before they attempt their final 'heretic' extermination. Now the rumors of guillotines combined with the mass FEMA coffins makes sense!

reply to post by JohhnyBGood


JohhnyBGood,

Thanks for the link, great information!

Ah yes, The Vatican?
How dare we.

From your link....

For many, the belief that the Holy See was pursing a vision of world government was simply too much

Indeed, its hard to stomach men holding out the "wand of salvation" to other men when in fact they are nothing more than imposters, wanting for political gain and world control.

Dare I say such. Yes....I did.

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler

The Pope has the right to strike down any law passed in America since the year 1898.

So if we the people want things fixed in America, we should see the pope?
interesting.

reply to post by CodeRed3D


What we see at this moment in time as the nations are reduced, left wanting and abandoned;
yes people will panic and turn to a "higher power" to help.

When the "higher power" fails, or turns traitor its that moment when we choose.
Know your gods...

And know your God.