It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

The Story of Our Unenslavement

page: 1
7
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 01:36 PM
link   
Stefan produces yet another fantastic video on ending the abberant philosophy of statism.

In this video, Stefan compares belief in the religion of statism to the belief in cereal box superheros and mythical gods.





posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 01:48 PM
link   
Very good video I agree.

Practice harmlessness in all you do, in your thoughts and actions and feelings and you will experience a great leap in consciousness and new vistas and horizons will open to you that you never imagined before...



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 02:23 PM
link   
While I applaud your ideals, I feel I must interject a touch of reality.
Slavery is not dead, it is alive and well in many parts of the world.
Abuse and violence are far from dead, just read the police blotter of any major city.
Religion is far from dead and in many parts of the world a very powerful force day in and day out.

There are wolves in the world. These wolves live to inflict violence, pain, death and despair upon their fellow humans. With the current state of humanity, your utopia CANNOT EXIST. I am very sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings, but truth is truth whether we like it or not.



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 02:42 PM
link   
reply to post by sonofliberty1776
 


So the solution to the problems listed is for the majority of the public to 'empower' uniformed thugs to steal wealth from the productive members of society at gun point?

This is supposed to be a solution?

You can keep your solution to yourself, thank you very much.

I don't want to be a part of the looting 'solution'



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 03:06 PM
link   
reply to post by mnemeth1
 
I did not say that. I did not even imply that. What I said is that YOUR UTOPIA cannot exist at this point in time.

There are wolves, evil is real. If we do not oppose their violence, they will destroy and enslave us as we can see. The "best" form of government that CAN EXIST now is the original Constitutional republic founded by our forefathers. Even that is failing now only due to laziness on the part of our citizens. Our forefathers foresaw this. Thus Jefferson's famous quote "From time to time the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of patriots and tyrants. The tyrants and their wolves are at the door. Where are the patriots?



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 06:38 PM
link   
reply to post by sonofliberty1776
 


What is 'my utopia?'

A world where violent looting is abolished.

I'm sorry, but I don't like your corrupt violent world.

It is entirely possible for a non-violent state to exist today



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 07:40 PM
link   

Originally posted by mnemeth1
reply to post by sonofliberty1776
 


What is 'my utopia?'
This

" A world where the wolves lie with the sheep and do not constantly desire to consume them."


I'm sorry, but I don't like your corrupt violent world.
You think I do? I would prefer to live my life in peace, working the land and living off my own labors owing nothing to no one.


It is entirely possible for a non-violent state to exist today
I am sorry, but it is not possible. Consider the world that would exist if the US would have surrendered all of our weapons directly after WWII. Either Europe would be speaking Russian, or each European nation would have to have kept the bulk of their population under arms. At the time, the Soviet Union was a "pack of wolves" which would have devoured Europe quickly. Consider the paltry investment many western nations currently invest in defense? Why can they do this? Because for many years the US was a nation of wolfhounds protecting the sheep of the western nations. Unfortunately, as history often shows, power corrupts. After the fall of the USSR, our power was unchecked by a major enemy. Our nation became even more "corrupted" by it's power. Now we are here. Now there are new wolves, new wolves will always arise. It is inevitable. People(not necessarily individuals, but definitely groups) are by their very nature evil. This is an unfortunate truth. Our nature is what it is.




posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 07:49 PM
link   
reply to post by sonofliberty1776
 


I have considered.

I have come to the conclusion that the wars America fought were not necessary and were strictly a product of the federal government.

Without the federal government, millions more Americans would be alive today.



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 07:53 PM
link   
reply to post by sonofliberty1776
 

First off Merry Christmas, or I guess happy holidays if you are of a different faith.
I believe that your argument about post war history is flawed. The United States propped up and supported the soviet union since before world war 2. The idea that the history we have been indoctrinated with discounts other theoretical systems is incorrect. I do not know if the system stefan molyneux and other non-aggresion principled thinkers is one hundred percent viable. What I do know is that it cannot be worse than state systems which have killed tens of millions, destroyed the eco-systems, and destroyed the development of the human species. Any alterior system would be better. The clinging to the old state ideology reminds me of am abusive relationship. I know my spouse hits me, but what if I cannot find someone else who will love me? It is situation where the suffering of safety is better than the fear of the unknown.



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 08:02 PM
link   

Originally posted by mnemeth1
reply to post by sonofliberty1776
 


I have considered.

I have come to the conclusion that the wars America fought were not necessary and were strictly a product of the federal government.

Without the federal government, millions more Americans would be alive today.
WWII was not necessary? Should Hitler have been left in charge of Europe?



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 08:06 PM
link   
reply to post by stephinrazin
 

Merry Christmas to you as well.

I will not deny that a "non state" existence could be better in many ways. However, how would you have protected yourself from the pillaging tribe next door? I WISH humanity were able to live peacefully as would be necessary for the non state existence to support. However, we are what we are. Humans are by and large not very nice to each other.



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 08:17 PM
link   
reply to post by sonofliberty1776
 


Thank you,
I think stefan would argue that if the state did not exist to tax farm a population than there would be nothing worth conquering. Why conquer a group if there is no profit? My own challenge is that in times of scarcity, plague, or natural disaster this argument would not hold up. This acknowledged, I believe if a stateless population is armed and efficient at insurgency tactics than they can hold off any foe. That is as long as the foe is within a reasonable militarily equivalent. Could a stateless society hold up when surrounded by states? I doubt it. I would love to hear an counter-argument to that though. The point I keep coming back to is that no matter what the problems of an alternative system maybe it is irrelavent on a certain level. With the spread of nukes, the rise of totalitarian thought manipulaiton and surveillence, and the large amounts of bio weapons we are on a terminal path. It is only a matter of time in the current system that states fighting states destroy all life, or states fighting their tax slaves destroys all life.



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 08:34 PM
link   
reply to post by mnemeth1
 


First I would like to say, thank you for the video. I will show it to anyone that will take the 6:37 min/sec to watch it.

As Ive read the other post's, I would like to give my opinion on what was said, and what I think the video was saying.

We, as a people have already seen what things are to come, and what has already happened, and when trying to pin point what has happened in our world, you find yourself in a web so large, that sometimes looking away, is the only release, as you begin to see everyone's intertwined with one another, both friends and enemies. Corruption, greed, manipulation is what makes the world go round. It may not be the one we want but we still live it.

Now for the video, I think that is trying to convey that with the knowledge of the things that have gotten us this far, right in our faces, we have a way to avoid in the future, starting with the ones that seem to be attacked more then most, and thats our children. If we were to make our children aware of the dangers, then we have already started to bring a new mindset into the world. One where fear, is overshadowed by love.

It has to be learned as fear, and abuse has been. We may not be able to do something right now, but having the "it will never get better" attitude will not make it any better. One of the main factors in what is happening today, is that we are indoctrinated to think that "one" cannot fight many, and that being outside the group is a bad thing.

Bring back individualism. Love. Security (for ourselves), Compassion. And then we start to build anew.

S&F
Peace, NRE.



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 10:15 PM
link   

Originally posted by sonofliberty1776

Originally posted by mnemeth1
reply to post by sonofliberty1776
 


I have considered.

I have come to the conclusion that the wars America fought were not necessary and were strictly a product of the federal government.

Without the federal government, millions more Americans would be alive today.
WWII was not necessary? Should Hitler have been left in charge of Europe?


Hitler would never have come to power if the US had not involved itself in WWI.



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 10:50 PM
link   
I totally agree that one of the main ways we are guided is the belief that we are powerless. We play games, and get trashed to forget about our jobs because we feel powerless to do anything else. So many people are so hopelessly reliant on the systems that make them unhappy that they never even question them. If you are never shown a different way to do things, or how to critically look at your reality you will not realize there is another way. It is scary to tear down the walls that hold up our world view. At the end of the day can you let go of your ego connection to the systems that guide you? I got angry the first time somebody told me I was a slave. Why? Because I vested my self worth, and my self image in the system I was in. It took a shock to make me realize that I am in a system, and to be personally attached to a system someone else built for me was the height of folly. Continuing on an earlier post, love is the answer. Fear keeps you reliant and subservient to systems. Love give you the strength and faith to step away. The younger you are opened to love then the more likely you will be able to escape fear driven servitude.
Here is a video I think is somewhat pertinent to this discussion.



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 11:32 PM
link   

Originally posted by mnemeth1


In this video, Stefan compares belief in the religion of statism to the belief in cereal box superheros and mythical gods.



Being that OP never responds to me (possibly on ignore???)
I must say this is how I feel about the objectivism/"anarchist"/trickle down combo pack, there is whole lot of deification and FAITH going on IMO, especially in the purist realm. I have a fairly good example of this in my interaction with the OP over the year... Very simply put I am some form of a Statist and I can certainly see
many problems and abuses created by government, it is neither a firm belief or disbelief that can be applied evenly.

The example of religion only shines when I consider that OP has never ONCE questioned or conceded one simple solitary point, angle or fact for that matter, at least in my experience. Unlike my statist views which waver, wander and evolve; the objectivism/"anarchist"/trickle down combo pack salesman is as perfect and unflinching as the most Christian of Christians, Budhist, communist, Nazi, etc...

This philosophy is so RELIGIOUS it advocates decriminalizing Drunk Driving in the (OP case) - contrary to post upon posts which discredit OP's assertions, OP does not and will not venture outside of the realm of his dogma.
But more simply put, I think it is illogical to believe that one rule will GOVERN the entirety of all reality, in every case and situation. Criminalizing Drunk Driving works as a deterrent, I have lived enough life to have seen it time and time again, it is not 100%, but it works. Dig deeper and you will see taxation, Drunk Driving and private security enforcement are all governed by the EXACT same principles and they have the same result too!
It's magic! And Perfect!

Is it Jesus?

Might as well be..

Merry Christmas!



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 11:49 PM
link   
reply to post by Janky Red
 


I don't respond to you because you make no sense what-so-ever.

For example, anarchism, objectivism, and trickle down economics are all mutually exclusive.



posted on Dec, 25 2010 @ 11:58 PM
link   
reply to post by mnemeth1
 


Hi Mnemeth,

Great video and message!


There's no better time to start a better way of life than right this very moment...even though we're not in the "Golden Age" yet, why not get a head start?

Here is something that I wrote on my Facebook page.

ANNOUNCEMENT: Today I declare a new holiday. I celebrate the Golden Age on this day, December 25, and for the duration of this season (and all year 'round). It shall be named Enlightenment Day. No severed trees, no crucified bodies, no blood sacrifice, no torture, no humilation, no commercialism, to lies, no golden calves, no occults and no more division.

No more.

(End)

Wow so yeah I totally know what you're saying about the wolves. They've got the sheep surrounded?

But there's strength in numbers.



Toni-star



posted on Dec, 26 2010 @ 12:28 AM
link   
The ideas are interesting if only for being as far out of the box as one can get.There would have to be a transition stage (incubator) where your tribe goes state less and defense less ( noviolence right?)eshews (?) violence while the restof the entire world soldiers along in the "old ways". how can your tribe survive the transition?As the evil violent ones see your tribe as "ripe for the picking"???? In the movies Some old bad azz gunslinger rides in and protects the poor peaceful amish farmers from the bad guys.

So do it.. All you collectivist and non "statist"/anti-violence and anti-authority folks just move into an area perhaps buy up a ranch and split it up.Demonstrate the overwhelming value in your ideas.and do it. What's stopping you?
You don't need to tear the current infrastructure from one nation( irreversibly) to demonstrate your ideas.If they work you'll start a movement. and change the world.

Good luck.

edit on 26-12-2010 by 46ACE because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 26 2010 @ 01:40 AM
link   
reply to post by 46ACE
 


If a bunch of anarchists decided to move to a town and operate as free people, they would get bombed into the stone age by the federal government.

If an entire town threatened IRS agents at gun point, you can bet your bottom dollar crappy nappy would have tanks up in there faster than you can say the word 'Waco'

The anarchists would have to defend their flock from the EPA, ATF, FBI, CIA, NSA, DHS, IRS, etc.. etc.. etc..

Opening up a gun shop in town and not registering with the ATF would lead to a gun battle.

Opening up a pot farm in town would lead to a gun battle with the DEA

Running a fast food joint in town and not paying any federal taxes would lead to a gun battle with the IRS.

etc.. etc.. etc..

The fact that it is impossible to be able to operate as a free people without government guns being stuck in people's faces is the entire reason anarchists are mad in the first place.



edit on 26-12-2010 by mnemeth1 because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
7
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join