Place of His Sanctuary Cast Down

Originally posted by pthena

where would you find in all the apostate structures, churches of today His Sanctuary. I say structures because it is a building of man's own cobbling.

Right in the Zionist Christian commitment to having the temple rebuilt in Jerusalem, specifically for the anti-christ. They believe it's for the anti-christ, they work to have it built. That seems rather blatant to me.

Really? How are they planning to swing that, with the Dome of the Rock in the way? Do you have a link to someone talking about this?

The only thing that I've seen in recent years on the Temple is some guy who suggested creating a holographic Temple and projecting it where it should be, though I couldn't figure out what he thought that would accomplish. But for everyone else I've run across, rebuilding the Temple is off the radar.

reply to post by pthena
pthena,

If I have a creed system is is the total KJV Bible and then also did Tomothy and that is a safe path to dwell in.

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

"Who is Palmoni?" I'll give you this.- -
that certain saint. or, the numberer of secrets, or, the wonderful numberer. Heb. Palmoni. Jg 13:18; Isa 9:6; Mt 11:27; Lu 10:22; Joh 1:18

It is Christ, "wonderful" is His name, He is all things.

One thing Daniel realized these things were far down the road and that astonished him. His book was sealed till the time of the end, it can now be unraveled.

Most all the prophets did not see the things presented were way down the road, example, Paul and they all did around him at that time, - Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

What we are running into now is that most are putting things too far into the future instead of discerning the times with the prophecy given and should be understood and can be. Men back yon wanted to see the end of this rein of sin but today men want to keep it flying high.

Keep looking for the truth, the Rock, Yahshua.

Truthiron.

reply to post by ntech
ntech,

That time of the end, yes it should be discerned by all and like you see Dan. saw that his vision was way on down the road of time.

Then in Christ's day the disciples all thought he would return and end it all in their day.

Now today men want to put it afar off and have no valid reason, except mybe some are having so much fun they don't want it to end. While at the same time many are having a very hard time.

The time of the last events of prophecy are upon us to all who are awake I am convinced.

His Word the Truth fortells it.

Truthiron.

reply to post by truthiron

Revelation 15:7, 8 Then one of the four living creatures gave the seven angels
seven golden bowls filled with the wrath of God who lives forever and ever,
and the temple was filled with smoke from God’s glory and from his power.
Thus no one could enter the temple until the seven plagues from the seven
angels were completed.

That does not sound like a downfall of the sanctuary to me. I think it has to do
with what the SDA's call "the end of probation". There probably is a relationship
between the visions of Daniel and close of probation but I do not think that
Daniel spells it out as such. I think this may be where some confusion could
come in. As in what is meant by the "daily'. There definitely would not be a
"daily" after probation closes.

reply to post by truthiron
I don't know if Were was ever stateside and he
died in the early 60's, I think.
He is popular with the dissenters and has had a bit of
a resurgence lately with people republishing his works.
He was critical of Uriah Smith in this one book I linked
to. you are right about it being hard to read. I spent
probably an hour and a half last night copying and
pasting it into a document and fixing some OCR
mistakes. I will eventually print up a few copies for
distribution at church and the church of a friend of
mine in Georgia.
I will have to go through it and pick out a few tidbits
that pertain directly to the topic here.

reply to post by pthena
Same author, different book. This is a new one up on Scrib.
I have a Facebook account so maybe that gives me more functionality
on the site, but not sure. To directly download, you have to pay for a
subscription. What I do is press on the up and down arrows on the
tool bar at the bottom of the page to bring up more pages because it
looks like they do not want to display all the pages at once.

That does seem to be a fairly stern warning.

I tell people at church to go on a religion forum and post something,
that there are lots of people asking questions and here is their
opportunity to give some answers, and they need the practice,
seeing how having to explain what you believe, to someone else,
forces you to have to bring those beliefs into a sharp focus.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by truthiron

 

Revelation 15:7, 8 Then one of the four living creatures gave the seven angels
seven golden bowls filled with the wrath of God who lives forever and ever,
and the temple was filled with smoke from God’s glory and from his power.
Thus no one could enter the temple until the seven plagues from the seven
angels were completed.

That does not sound like a downfall of the sanctuary to me. I think it has to do
with what the SDA's call "the end of probation". There probably is a relationship
between the visions of Daniel and close of probation but I do not think that
Daniel spells it out as such. I think this may be where some confusion could
come in. As in what is meant by the "daily'. There definitely would not be a
"daily" after probation closes.

edit on 26-12-2010 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

jmdewey60,
I have no doubt that when the seven last plagues begin "probation" is over and I think that is a right term for it. The time is over to be saved. Also I believe the "place of His Sanctuary cast down" will already have happened, the mark of the beast and Satan on the scene personating Christ. SDA's mostly claim to be historicists and I am not. N0 doubt about it it won't be long until it all is. Just how long we can not know.

Where I differ too is the end of the 2300 yrs and the Sanctuary cleansed is the time but also the time to "start" the vision for :"the tine of the end". The time of the end rolls on from 1844.to the end. Dan 8:17,19 make it clear. Verse 8:25 then brings up Satan in a parallel with Re. 13:11-18. He personates and stands up that he is Christ. Then Christ soon comes and Satan is done broken without hand as Dan 8:25 states.

Da 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.

Satan is the one wanting to have men worship him instead of God and he could not have that on Gods Holy Day so he has instituted Sunday and the world loves it except for the Jews. The Jews are probably the reason it won't be enforced until after Satan comes and since the non Messianic Jew will accept him as the king they have always expected and he states he has changed the day that will not bother them one bit. It is the Messianic Jews and all who honor God by Truly keeping Sabbath that will not recieve the mark are in trouble.

We will not be persecuted for Sabbath until Satan comes and takes over from the "image beast" the first beast of Re 13.

The "Daily" ministration ends in the heavenly Sanctuary when Christ stands up. No more forgiveness as His Priestly Ministry has ended.

OK you know He holds church with us on the Holy Seventh Day, tabernacles with us. The Sabbath will be cast down by Satan. I'm wondering and possibly are of the opinion that "the place of His Sanctuary cast down", if that isn't "the place in time he tabernacles with us". When He holds Sanctuary with the ones "He" has "marked" as His own.

Shall we not see before very long? Isn't it time we knew? Is there a better answer, I'm listening.

jmdewey60, I'll get with you a little more later, possibly a U2U.

Truthiron.

reply to post by adjensen
I will try to stay on topic
.

reply to post by pthena
pthena,

I'm a spiritual Jew and keep the Holy Sabbath but I see nothing in the ceremony of - "There is the little matter of Red Heifers" Messianic Jews I am with on the Messiah has come and probably a lot more.

Thanks

Truthiron.

reply to post by truthiron

I'm a spiritual Jew and keep the Holy Sabbath but I see nothing in the ceremony of - "There is the little matter of Red Heifers" Messianic Jews I am with on the Messiah has come and probably a lot more.

Thank you. I was mistaken in assuming that you were former SDA. From your last post,

OK you know He holds church with us on the Holy Seventh Day, tabernacles with us. The Sabbath will be cast down by Satan. I'm wondering and possibly are of the opinion that "the place of His Sanctuary cast down", if that isn't "the place in time he tabernacles with us". When He holds Sanctuary with the ones "He" has "marked" as His own.

I will consider this, then, as the subject of the thread.

reply to post by pthena
pthena,

These things need investigation and thought. I see you are a sharp thinker. You can count me as a "generic" Adventist if you like. They are great people. We have a lot of Amish in this area and I think for the greatest part they are great people also.

Good to make your acquaintance.
Truthiron.

reply to post by truthiron

Shall we not see before very long? Isn't it time we knew? Is there a better answer, I'm listening.

Interesting theory and maybe one way to look at it but I think the Sabbath was cast down a long time ago. I have the first two volumes of a set of books, The Councils of the Church, which is very interesting to read, about how the Sabbath was destroyed completely through the Canons of the Church, a very long time ago. This is how it works, they are never content to merely institute a counterfeit, but have to take it one step farther by destroying the genuine.
Here, as promised, is a small blurb from the Ferments book:

God has promised to do nothing but He reveals His secret through the prophets (Amos 3: 7). Satan is a master student of the prophecies and anticipates their fulfillment. As Satan led to the rejection of Christ by the Jewish people through a counterfeit interpretation of the prophecies, so he employs that same method today. He works upon men to bring in counterfeit interpretations so that when the time comes for the actual fulfillment, people will not recognize it because they will have been taught to expect something different. This very deceptive method which Satan employed so effectively when leading the Jewish nation to reject their rightful King and Savior, he has prepared for the world to reject Christ’s last-day Message of warning and salvation. In fact’ as we hope to show, the basis of the deception then and today is exactly the same. This startling fact should make the studious thoughtful.

That's written by Dr. Were.

Yea, he magnified (1431) [himself] even to the prince (8269) of the host (6635,) and by him the daily (8548) [sacrifice] was taken away (7311 7311) , and the place (4349) of his sanctuary (4720) was cast down (7993) .

Yea, he ( [magnified], [ (2) to become great ] ) himself even to the ( [prince], [ prince, ruler, leader, chief, chieftain, official, captain ] ) of the ( [host] [ that which goes forth, army, war, warfare, host ] ) and by him the ( [daily] [ continuity, perpetuity, to stretch ] )
[sacrifice] was taken away (Hophal) to be taken off, be abolished , and the ( [place] [ fixed or established place, foundation ] ) of his ( [sanctuary] [ sacred place, sanctuary, holy place ] ) was cast ( [down] [ to throw, cast, hurl, fling ] )

It sounds like the destruction of Jerusalem.

reply to post by ACTS 2:38
ACTS 2:38,

Wondering if you think it will be rebuilt. I know some do. I think if it is it'll have to be fast. Prophecy is seen in many many ways and I think God only meant it in one way. So many of us work at it.

Look for the way you find it, the Bible interprets it's self I would say is a good way and study it out to see If you can agree.

Searching always for the truth.

Truthiron.

reply to post by truthiron


It has to be rebuilt, Israel became a Nation after 2000 years, the Father of all Lies has to defile the sanctuary with the abomination of desolation.

So yes, and yes the Bible does define itself as God would have it for those who seek it, though the Holy Ghost we are given the ability to understand the word of God without help.

Though some time we should look up the original Greek or Hebrew to under stand.

reply to post by jmdewey60
jmdewey60,

It is strange about the hate of the Sabbath but you know it is just as strange we still have full freedom where Christianity is allowed there is still freedom to keep it even though Sabbath keeping Christians are small in numbers. The point being though that will not be forever as we both well know. The mark of the beast will come and we agree I think on what that is. It looks like Satan has that ball to take across the court to me. He is to complete his play and it will be a fast one too. You know there are many ideas out there about what that mark is etc. and it shows many are wrestling with it. No doubt not in the same way we are.

I read most of Were's statement and caught most of it from different sources and especially what EGW wrote as I've over the years have read about all of it. He quotes her very extensively.

It is now being pushed for a one world religion and I cannot see how that be satisfactory to anyone who is a Bible Christian.

Any way "the place of His Sanctuary will be cast down" and I am about as sure as anything it isn't a temple in Jerusalem.. I was hoping to get more ideas of what others see but more may be coming.

Blessings peace and love.

Truthiron.

reply to post by ACTS 2:38
ACTS 2:38,

I know many I'm sure hold that view and I do not and I know also my view is a minority one.

I run the Hebrew, Greek dictionary right along with the KJV all the time continuously and I know what you mean. These computers and a good Bible software is a powerful study tool.

Acts I am afraid the time left is too short for them to complete it. Also I run into some that think a soon coming war will finish even tearing down that wailing wall but I don't hold any strong opinion on ether scenario.

Have you more you'd like to share, we will look.

Truthiron.

reply to post by ACTS 2:38

It has to be rebuilt, Israel became a Nation after. . .

Do you have some sort of scripture for that, or is it a theory
that sounds good to you? I'm not saying a temple will not be
built. But it would be more a distraction from what the
prophecy is really talking about. My understanding is that
I am spiritual Israel, as a member of Christ and a part of the
Church. Jesus said, "Your house is made desolate". And
afterwards the believers in Christ were called the Holy Temple,
and while it stood, the temple was called just, the temple.
The future person, The Antichrist was an invention of
the Jesuits to counteract the unanimous understanding
between the Protestants that the Papacy was the antichrist.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by ACTS 2:38

 

It has to be rebuilt, Israel became a Nation after. . .

Do you have some sort of scripture for that, or is it a theory
that sounds good to you? I'm not saying a temple will not be
built. But it would be more a distraction from what the
prophecy is really talking about. My understanding is that
I am spiritual Israel, as a member of Christ and a part of the
Church. Jesus said, "Your house is made desolate". And
afterwords the believers in Christ were called the Holy Temple,
and while it stood, the temple was called just, the temple.
The future person, The Antichrist was an invention of
the Jesuits to counteract the unanimous understanding
between the Protestants that the Papacy was the antichrist.

edit on 26-12-2010 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

Daniel 11:
[24] Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
[25] Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
[26] And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
[27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Mark.13
[14] But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:

Daniel 12:
[4] But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
[5] Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river.
[6] And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders?
[7] And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.
[8] And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?
[9] And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.
[10] Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.
[11] And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.
[12] Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.
[13] But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

In Daniel 11: it speaks of 69 weeks before the rebuild of Jerusalem,

reply to post by ACTS 2:38

You do realize of course that the temple was rebuilt already after the vision of Daniel?
Remember, it has a prominent place in the Gospels, like the story of Jesus overturning
the tables of the money changers?
I'm talking about a rebuilding of a future temple.
Anything on that?