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Welcome to Man's Beginnings

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posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 01:56 PM
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It's a little weird how I came about this website, but it is quite intriguing and since I don't have the knowledge to decipher these ancient records/findings, I thought I'd present it to ATS since there are individuals on this website with the knowledge (or purported knowledge).

I cannot even fathom owning such a collection as what seems to have been part of a Mormon legacy (only later to be entombed within a museum). It is quite incredible to say the least.

What say you ATS?

Also, I would love to stay and chat, but I am off for the day and will not be able to return until tomorrow for a short while.

mansbeginnings.com...

peace




posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 02:03 PM
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reply to post by Gutterpus
 


I'm not sure of the veracity of many of the supposed artifacts, but I would love to go through them personally just for the hell of it.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 02:16 PM
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That looks so fake to me.

however at around 10:25 there is a plate that has some hieroglyphs.
can someone translate that?
or maybe it will just be rubbish.
who knows.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 03:11 PM
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Originally posted by grey580
That looks so fake to me.

however at around 10:25 there is a plate that has some hieroglyphs.
can someone translate that?
or maybe it will just be rubbish.
who knows.


I went through all the individual pictures which you can see here: mansbeginnings.com...

Those "look" like Egyptian hieroglyphs and a few of them are similar to real hieroglyphs, but they don't actually translate to anything. Other tablets have Viking type runes which are also gibberish. Most of the artwork of the fake Egyptian pieces appears to be done by one person (the badly drawn bird is one clue.) The artist apparently had seen and admired some Egyptian material because there's an attempt to do some of the gods (clumsily) -- as well as the headdresses. However, they weren't drawing this stuff from accurate drawings of the real material. This is the artist who includes "five trumpets" in most of the work, including "Christ meeting the Algonquins (who never dressed like that, by the way.)

The signed artifact (the paper showing that they dug up artifacts signed with trumpets) is suspicious.

The maps are real, however. The Hopewell axe *MAY* be real (it looks like a real and original stone axe).

I can also say that they were NOT faked by someone who was an alchemist or interested in alchemy, though some of the material looks a little bit similar. The gold plates, in particular, have a few symbols that are similar to some of the mystical alphabets, but the "letters" there don't represent anything. The person who did the gold plates is not the same one who faked the Egyptian material (again, the way he draws faces and letters is different.)

The Montcalm "artifact" seems to be the same artist who created the Black Slate tablet, stone knife (etc) and stone amulet.

The "hebrew" phrases were created by people who used a version of the Torah from the 1800's or later (vowel points showing up) and who didn't carefully copy the letters.

The clay tablets were all done by the same person.

The stone knives and so forth are just... wrong. They're the right shape, but the wrong technique. Someone had seen Native American artifacts and copied them (using a grinder, I believe) rather than the handworked methods of the Native Americans.

So... I see three (or possibly four) people who manufactured these. Given the style and a few other bits of information, they were apparently created during the 1800's, when some of the very devout Mormons were creating "pious fakes" to help promote their religion.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 09:26 PM
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I highly suspect anything ,that comes out of Mormon research because they have an undisguised agenda
that being to conform all research to fit the book of Mormon...which I have tried to read lots of times but can't get through it ,like Sitchins 'translations' I just can't buy 'em


they seem willing to grab anything from Egyptian artifacts to Mesoamerican and put them all in pot and shake 'em and see what comes out.

a random collection of stuff does not a history make, to me it makes a mess like when artifact smugglers steal clay tablets and sell them on the Black Market then the context is lost and the tablet that could be really important no has no authentication at all now it's worthless.

I like maverick science but I still want it to be science



posted on Dec, 23 2010 @ 09:25 AM
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reply to post by Byrd
 


Byrd - this is exactly the reason I brought this topic to ATS for discussion. Your knowledge is quite apparent and appreciated. I only discovered this website from reading another which brought the topic up as follows:


“p.s. Since that gathering at Janice's, I've spent many hours working with one of the people I reconnected with there, Duane Erickson, helping him launch a new website MansBeginnings.com..., which takes a look at some ancient records that have come forth in the United States, as well as wisdom from other records and teachings from around the world. He presents these records in a spirit of open source, soliciting input about their possible meanings and ramifications for today. Most of his material has been available for a while, but there is some new stuff.”

He goes on to say tha the documents/items will be given over to Wikileaks for them to reveal to the public. But, if, as you say, they are faked items, then I’m sure Wikileaks will pay not attention to them.

Thanks for your thoughts – all of you.

peace



posted on Dec, 23 2010 @ 12:24 PM
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Originally posted by Gutterpus
He goes on to say tha the documents/items will be given over to Wikileaks for them to reveal to the public. But, if, as you say, they are faked items, then I’m sure Wikileaks will pay not attention to them.


Wikileaks won't take them... that's not the kind of content they publish (but he can try.)

However, yes, they really are faked (and even the museum recognized that.) I have an "armchair quarterback" type knowledge of Egyptology (I can read some hieroglyphs, know the periods and histories reasonably well, am familiar with major sites and artifacts...but I can't stroll up and read a temple wall like it was a newspaper, and I can't recite the kings and I'm not totally familiar with some of the more complicated concepts.) That said, these aren't Egyptian or Sumerian. As an anthropologist, I have a very small smidgin of knowledge of linguistics and I know when a set of symbols aren't really a language.

Speaking as an artist (I do lots of unusual things) the styles are pretty distinct, showing that these were done by just a few people who were not trained as ancient artists were. In Sumerian/Egyptian times, artists were kids who had some sort of talent who were sold/given/apprenticed to work under a master. The child (8 years an up) would work 10-12 hours per day mixing materials, making brushes, cleaning up and doing other chores like sharpening tools and repairing them. Eventually during this time they would be told to start making copies of other work. If they were good enough, the master would start letting them handle little details and then let them take over more of the work (painting large sections or rough cutting a sculpture under the Master's direction.) Only the best became masters.

For a subject of great importance (such as a religious artifact), only the very best artists would be allowed to create the material.

So the crudeness of the art (not due to difficult materials, I should add) is one indication it's faked by people with absolutely no art training. The incorrect iconography and clothing and so forth also shows that it's fake.

NOW... having said that, these are of interest AS fakes (to be kind, we can call them "hand-crafted religious memorabilia"), along with the documents that give us some sort of clue as to when they were made. They show early Mormon memorabilia related to their church history and their struggle to be recognized as a religion. There's actually one (or more) possible academic papers that could be created from this material... I don't know how appreciated it would be that they would be discussed as historical fakes, but they are interesting and significant, and I'm sure that the personal history of the finders (and their possible positions of power in the Mormon group) would be very revealing.

I don't know that the Mormons would particularly appreciate this, but they aren't totally valueless and I feel they should be cataloged for what they are -- Mormon iconography by Mormons created in the 1800's to go along with the story told in the Book of Mormon
edit on 23-12-2010 by Byrd because: (no reason given)



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