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'I didn't think of Iraqis as humans,' says U.S. soldier who raped 14-year-old girl before killing

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posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 01:25 PM
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I was there, in an Infantry Division and close to the action. I was never EVER made to believe that the enemy wasn't human. I never looked at those people, even the people actively trying to harm me, as anything evil. They were just on the other side of the problem (notice how i didn't say the wrong side).

If you cannot empathize with your enemy, you become your worst enemy.

This individual is sick and he is deservedly in prison for the rest of his sick life.




posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 01:46 PM
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This is nothing but a bogus statement to prove his innocence. This moron should rot in jail.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 02:01 PM
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Originally posted by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep
reply to post by Bun-G
 


I don't think American soldiers are brainwashed to do what this sick individual did. You cannot blame his training for that. This guy is disturbed and sick, probably as a result of serving in that dangerous war zones.

But, this does not justify in any means what he did. He should know how to control himself and conduct himself. It might also just be his own personal views of not thinking of them as humans, that goes to show how wrong and sick he is.

VvV


Then you're wrong. Do you think someone who hasn't been conditioned can pick up an assault rifle and start blowing people away? Do you think someone who hasn't been conditioned can fire from a chopper gunner seat a mile away at a guy carrying a camera and a minivan full of kids?

We spend so much time debating the state of mind of terrorists who kill civilians with suicide bombs but absolutely no time whatsoever about soldiers who knowingly kill civilians without blinking an eye.

Murdering innocent people is the same regardless of who is pulling the trigger. Collateral damage is murder.

This sick guy should rot in jail but there are a lot cold-blooded politicians who will never go to jail - men who lied and manufactured fake intelligence to trick the American people into war and who give the orders that killed hundreds of thousands of civilians.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 03:37 PM
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reply to post by Bun-G
 


i know most americans are decent human beings but the tragedy and suffering your country has caused and is causing in your name and in the name of peace, freedom and democracy is simply atrocious. over 1 million innocence iraqi's have been killed since your governments contrived war on iraq and terror. no one seems to be held accountable for any wrongdoings and all this from the country with God on its side, with the largest nuclear arsenal in the world, who were complicit (at least) in the mass murder of over 3000 of its own people to further their own ends. every single thing your government condemns, they are the worst perpetrators of. untold misery abounds worldwide where-ever your country has interfered. decent people in the U.S. keep strong and keep up the fight against the enemy within. we need you all to lead the way and then the rest of us can follow. whats good is bad and whats bad is good. peace to those who have suffered unjustly and to those who still are suffering. i don't know what else to say.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 03:58 PM
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Although I completely disagree with this soldiers actions, I do feel that the amount of "killing" soldiers see in war and their repetitive mental training for war can mentally break a persons compassion for their fellow human beings. I remember reading the book "A Rumor of War" a memoir by Phillip Caputo about his service in the United States Marine Corps. in the early years of the Vietnam War. He goes into detail about how some soldiers can become paranoid on the battlefield and indiscriminately kill innocent civilians.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 04:23 PM
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Originally posted by ofhumandescent
reply to post by forklift
 


Forklift...............good post


Thanks!


It's a very deep and revealing documentary.

The War You Don't See



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 04:26 PM
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This is an interesting interview with a military insider. He says that soldiers are given drugs that make them act psychotic and that gang members are being recruited into the military. He also discusses homosexualiy in the military and how it is being used as a destructive tool:

www.youtube.com...



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 04:33 PM
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he took away peoples lives there is no repayment for that to be found in jail or anywhere else he should be put to death end of a sad story.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 06:16 PM
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Preventable? In this case, why yes!

Did Green call out to someone for help? Yes, he did! Did the CO or psychologist or both miss something, somewhere? Well, sure enough...they missed everything, everywhere.

Green's life on the outside is over and that is a good thing. He can never see the light of day, for so many reasons.

Sad beyond sad, this could have been avoided. For the full story, please read the link.

www.time.com...



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 06:53 PM
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Then nothing else needs to be said, he has no conscience, he has given up his will to life.

He should be sent sentence to death, he has broken the laws of natural justice, he should not be serving in the army, he is no a soldier, he is a monster.

He will die.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 07:38 PM
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Anthony1138 just to be clear. Green was never competent to be in the military. Further, we have people in charge that were incompetent to care for that boy at war or to decommission him. And when Green called for help, he said "All I want to do is kill Iraqi's" out loud and he wrote this same sentence on his psyche form. It fell on deaf ears and blind eyes. When Green confided that he was in the state of mind that caused this tragedy, he was given a sleep medication....lets take a moment to let that sink in, a sleep medication.

I would emphatically argue we failed Green and the Iraqi family for not taking him out of commission when Green made it clear to all he was suicidal and homicidal after the deaths of his comrades at the hands of insurgents.

Anthony1138, there was a point at which we lost Green altogether as a human, a warrior, a son and a brother. And you are correct, the time has come for the final verdict.

But, I would argue this is far from over, maybe it is in the courts, but not in the realms. We learn the most from each other when we take the stance that nothing in this world is black or white.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 07:44 PM
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reply to post by Bun-G
 


I once dated a very high level official in my community who was in Vietnam and believe it or not, # like THIS happened there as well. All is fair in LOVE and WAR I guess. Don't judge until you walk that mile



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 10:51 PM
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Originally posted by Zamini

Your post is so insulting to the millions of CIVILIANS who have lost their life to an illegal war. Not just in Iraq but in MANY wars. Go rinse your mouth with soap.


I thought people like you were already done with this lie about "the Iraqi war was illegal"... more so the claim that a million civilians have lost their lives because of the war.

First of all, there were PLENTY of deaths in Iraq because of Saddam Hussein... About 500,000 Iraqi children under the age of 5 had died because of Saddam and the sanctions. In fact Saddam was not giving the aid to the Iraqi people they were supposed to receive. In fact what occurred is known as the OFF scandal (Oil For Food scandal) which we found out several UN officials were in on the scam/scandal including Kofi Annan's son, all which were making money off the OFF program and in fact were helping Saddam get military weapons and technology instead of giving the aid to the Iraqi people.

Then there were the murders and oppression by Saddam, his sons, and Saddam's regime on the Iraqi people.

The claim that "the war was illegal" has been from the beginning the claim of people who don't even know history.

The Iraqi war was a "military engagement authorized by Congress" and was perfectly legal.

en.wikipedia.org...

Please inform yourself before you speak of things you don't know about.

That comment of yours telling the other member to wash his mouth makes you sound like you are a very young person.
edit on 22-12-2010 by ElectricUniverse because: errors.



posted on Dec, 22 2010 @ 11:01 PM
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I can side with the killing of Iraqis in his position.....BUT

the RAPE of that little girl.....HE DESERVES to DIE.

I hope he is raped in prison time and time again and its filmed and sent to all his family.

I hope his sentence is increased somehow.



posted on Dec, 23 2010 @ 01:16 AM
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Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

The Iraqi war was a "military engagement authorized by Congress" and was perfectly legal.

en.wikipedia.org...

Please inform yourself before you speak of things you don't know about.



The United States Congress NEVER declared WAR on Iraq. Congress passed a Joint Resolution to enforce the UN sanctions on Iraq as well as:

""""The resolution authorized President Bush to use the Armed Forces of the United States "as he determines to be necessary and appropriate" in order to "defend the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq; and enforce all relevant United Nations Security Council Resolutions regarding Iraq.""""


IRaq never posed a threat to the United States of America. No WMD's, No ICBM's, no power to project military force to us....had nothing to do with 9-11.

So what was the ""continuing threat posed by Iraq"" to us??

They refused to accept US Dollars for oil. That's why we slaughtered them.



posted on Dec, 23 2010 @ 07:08 AM
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reply to post by ElectricUniverse
 



I thought people like you were already done with this lie about "the Iraqi war was illegal"... more so the claim that a million civilians have lost their lives because of the war.


It was an illegal war. And yes, that many people have lost their lives due to 1- the invasion, 2- the civil war that broke loose because of the power vacuum the US invasion created. Read your history. Read about war tactics.


First of all, there were PLENTY of deaths in Iraq because of Saddam Hussein... About 500,000 Iraqi children under the age of 5 had died because of Saddam and the sanctions.


Yes, that is horrible. But lets see who put Saddam into power, who armed Saddam to the teeth and who sanctioned Iraq because of Saddam?


In fact Saddam was not giving the aid to the Iraqi people they were supposed to receive. In fact what occurred is known as the OFF scandal (Oil For Food scandal) which we found out several UN officials were in on the scam/scandal including Kofi Annan's son, all which were making money off the OFF program and in fact were helping Saddam get military weapons and technology instead of giving the aid to the Iraqi people.


Kofi Annans son was the patsy.The fall guy. Or do you think that nobody knew what the Saddams regime was doing with the funds it received? Do you want to know a little secret? The funding the UN gives to several other nations involved in conflicts is being sucked up by dictators, but here's the secret: THEY KNOW and they do it on purpose to keep selling weapons to conflict areas. That is how the people you admire make their money and keep their power.



Then there were the murders and oppression by Saddam, his sons, and Saddam's regime on the Iraqi people.


This is deflection. The reason for the Iraqi invasion was not this. The US funded Saddam and his sons to do these same things as long as Saddam kept the oil price in dollars and where the US wanted it to.


The claim that "the war was illegal" has been from the beginning the claim of people who don't even know history.


I'm confused,do you live in a different timeline than the rest of us? Are you from another planet? Which history are you talking about?


The Iraqi war was a "military engagement authorized by Congress" and was perfectly legal.


Sigh...simple answer: Absolutely NOT.


en.wikipedia.org...


Really? You tell people they don't know history and you use wikipedia as a SOURCE? What a load of hogwash



Please inform yourself before you speak of things you don't know about.


WHAT?



That comment of yours telling the other member to wash his mouth makes you sound like you are a very young person.


Or it makes me a person who values life, and, it makes me a person who is well informed. It's called the bigger picture, something they won't teach military personnel. Don't worry though, this wisdom will come to you with age.

You told me in another thread that I shouldn't speak on the subject because you knew Spanish. Do you understand either Arabic or Farsi?



posted on Dec, 23 2010 @ 08:09 AM
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Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

Originally posted by Zamini


First of all, there were PLENTY of deaths in Iraq because of Saddam Hussein... About 500,000 Iraqi children under the age of 5 had died because of Saddam and the sanctions.


I like the fact the you added Saddam when the 500,000 kids died ONLY due to the sanctions.

And what were those sanctions for? WMD's that never existed or the ones that US gave to Saddam during the First Gulf War?

Ho Ho Ho, that makes 1.5 million innocent Iraqis killed by US.Bush and his dad should meet the same fate as Saddam for perpertrating war crimes and genocide.And Cheney? He should be punished like what we have seen in the SAW movies, maybe hand him over to a cannibal.

Thanks for the reminder though.



posted on Dec, 23 2010 @ 08:22 PM
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Originally posted by Pervius

The United States Congress NEVER declared WAR on Iraq. Congress passed a Joint Resolution to enforce the UN sanctions on Iraq as well as:


...Again, you are confusing a military engagement with a declaration of war... In a declaration of war Congress declares the war, but in a military engagement Congress authorizes the President to use our Armed Forces WITHOUT FORMALLY DECLARING WAR...

There have been MANY military engagements in the history of the U.S. From the Quasi War, July 9, 1798, BOTH Barbary Wars, 1802, 1815, the military engagements used to enforce the ban on slavery in the early 1800s, and several other "military engagements" in which Congress NEVER formally declared war...

Throughout the history of the U.S. there have been several military engagements, including the war with Iraq that were LEGAL...

Again INFORM yourself first...




Originally posted by Pervius
IRaq never posed a threat to the United States of America. No WMD's, No ICBM's, no power to project military force to us....had nothing to do with 9-11.

So what was the ""continuing threat posed by Iraq"" to us??

They refused to accept US Dollars for oil. That's why we slaughtered them.


According to the Russians you are wrong... and we know that it was mainly the Russians who armed Saddam since the 1980s.


Putin Says Russia Warned U.S. on Saddam

Jun 18, 7:56 AM (ET)


ASTANA, Kazakhstan (Reuters) - Russia warned the United States on several occasions that Iraq's Saddam Hussein planned "terrorist attacks" on its soil, President Vladimir Putin said Friday.

"After the events of September 11, 2001, and before the start of the military operation in Iraq, Russian special services several times received such information and passed it on to their American colleagues," he told reporters.

The Kremlin leader, who was speaking in the Kazakh capital, said Russian intelligence services had many times received information that Saddam's special forces were preparing terrorist attacks in the United States "and beyond its borders on American military and civilian targets."

"This information was conveyed to our American colleagues," he said. He added that Russian intelligence had no proof that Saddam agents had been involved in any particular attack.

Russia had diplomatic relations with Saddam's Iraq and opposed the U.S.-led military offensive that toppled him.
...

news.myway.com...::08:05%7Creuters.html

Anyone remembers for how long before this announcement Putin, and the KGB, excuse me, the Russian mafia were claiming the same thing so many people are claiming now, that the U.S. had no reason for attacking Iraq, and it was illegal?...

The following excerpt and links are about ten f the myths of the Iraq war.



Myths of the Iraq War
January 28, 2007: Top 10 Myths of the Iraq War. In no particular order. There are more, but ten is a manageable number.


1-No Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD). Several hundred chemical weapons were found, and Saddam had all his WMD scientists and technicians ready. Just end the sanctions and add money, and the weapons would be back in production within a year. At the time of the invasion, all intelligence agencies, world-wide, believed Saddam still had a functioning WMD program. Saddam had shut them down because of the cost, but created the illusion that the program was still operating in order to fool the Iranians. The Iranians wanted revenge on Saddam because of the Iraq invasion of Iran in 1980, and the eight year war that followed.


2-The 2003 Invasion was Illegal. Only according to some in the UN. By that standard, the invasion of Kosovo and bombing of Serbia in 1999 was also illegal. Saddam was already at war with the U.S. and Britain, because Iraq had not carried out the terms of the 1991 ceasefire, and was trying to shoot down coalition aircraft patrolling the no-fly zone.


3-Sanctions were working. The sanctions worked for Saddam, not for Iraq. Saddam used the sanctions as an excuse to punish the Shia majority for their 1991 uprising, and help prevent a new one. The "Oil For Food" program was corrupted with the help of bribed UN officials, and mass media outlets that believed Iraqi propaganda. Saddam was waiting out the sanctions, and bribing France, Russia and China, with promises of oil contracts and debt repayments, to convince the UN to lift the sanctions.


4-Overthrowing Saddam Only Helped Iran. Of course, and this was supposed to make Iran more approachable and open to negotiations. With the Iraqi "threat" gone, it was believed that Iran might lose its radical ways and behave. Iran got worse as a supporter of terrorism and developer of WMD. Irans clerical dictatorship did not want a democracy next door. The ancient struggle between the Iranians and Arabs was brought to the surface, and the UN became more active in dealing with problems caused by pro-terrorist government of Iran. As a result of this, the Iranian police state has faced more internal dissent. From inside Iran, Iraq does not look like an Iranian victory.


5-The Invasion Was a Failure. Saddam's police state was overthrown and a democracy established, which was the objective of the operation. Peace did not ensue because Saddam's supporters, the Sunni Arab minority, were not willing to deal with majority rule, and war crimes trials. A terror campaign followed. Few expected the Sunni Arabs to be so stupid. There's a lesson to be learned there.


6-The Invasion Helped Al Qaeda. Compared to what? Al Qaeda was a growing movement before 2003, and before 2001. But after the Iraq invasion, and especially the Sunni Arab terrorism, al Qaeda fell in popularity throughout the Moslem world. Arab countries cracked down on al Qaeda operations more than ever before. Without the Iraq invasion, al Qaeda would still have safe havens all over the Arab world.


7-Iraq Is In A State of Civil War. Then so was Britain when the IRA was active, and so is Spain today because ETA is still active. Both IRA and ETA are terrorist organizations based on ethnic identity. India also has tribal separatist rebels who are quite active. That's not considered a civil war. This is all about partisans playing with labels for political ends, not accurately describing a terror campaign.


8-Iraqis Were Better Off Under Saddam. Most Iraqis disagree. Check election results and opinion polls. Reporters tend to ask Iraqi Sunni Arabs this question, but they were the only ones who benefited from Saddams rule.


9-The Iraq War Caused Islamic Terrorism to Increase in Europe. The Moslem unrest in Europe was there before 2001, and 2003. Interviews of Islamic radicals in Europe reveals that the hatred is not motivated by Iraq, but by daily encounters with hostile natives. Blaming Islamic terrorism on Iraq is another attempt to avoid dealing with a homegrown problem.


10- The War in Iraq is Lost. By what measure? Saddam and his Baath party are out of power. There is a democratically elected government. Part of the Sunni Arab minority continues to support terror attacks, in an attempt to restore the Sunni Arab dictatorship. In response, extremist Shia Arabs formed vigilante death squads to expel all Sunni Arabs. Given the history of democracy in the Middle East, Iraq is working through its problems. Otherwise, one is to believe that the Arabs are incapable of democracy and only a tyrant like Saddam can make Iraqi "work." If democracy were easy, the Arab states would all have it. There are problems, and solutions have to be found and implemented. That takes time, but Americans have, since the 18th century, grown weary of wars after three years. If the war goes on longer, the politicians have to scramble to survive the bad press and opinion polls. Opposition politicians take advantage of the situation, but this has nothing to do with Iraq, and everything to do with local politics in the United States.

www.strategypage.com...


edit on 23-12-2010 by ElectricUniverse because: add comments.



posted on Dec, 23 2010 @ 09:15 PM
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reply to post by Bun-G
 


It is not too surprising. I mean, soldiers are trained to think of the enemy as not human. How come we think it is OK to kill them but not to rape them? Neither is OK.

-rrr



posted on Dec, 23 2010 @ 09:47 PM
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Originally posted by forklift

I like the fact the you added Saddam when the 500,000 kids died ONLY due to the sanctions.


It's nice to see that for you the death of 500,000 Iraqi children as a joke... It shows your kind only like to make up excuses when it suits you...

BTW... yes those children died because Saddam was using the aid meant for those children and the Iraqi people to buy military equipment instead with oil...


Originally posted by forklift

And what were those sanctions for? WMD's that never existed or the ones that US gave to Saddam during the First Gulf War?


You must be German, or from one of the other European countries who were the ones mainly selling WMD to Iraq...

Obviously your kind HATE facts and instead you make up BS and try to pass it as facts...

Germany was Saddam's number 1 WMD provider during the 80s, and after Germany other EUROPEAN countries were behing Germany in the sell of military equipment, including missile equipment Saddam used to deliver the nerve, and mustard gas which Saddam bought from GERMANY and was used to gas and massacre Kurds...

Germany also sold to Iraq, among other things...


NEWS
New Search for Iraqi Nuclear Equipment
January 14, 1992 | By JOHN J. GOLDMAN, TIMES STAFF WRITER

U.N. nuclear inspectors have returned to Iraq after receiving information that German manufacturers sold Iraqi President Saddam Husseins scientists several thousand gas centrifuges designed to enrich uranium for atomic bombs. U.N. sources said Monday that export data about the centrifuges was provided to the International Atomic Energy Agency by the German government, prompting the new search mission.

articles.latimes.com...


www.iraqwatch.org...

Unfortunately the American Type Culture Collection and the Centers for Disease Control in the U.S. did sell or sent some biological samples of anthrax, West Nile virus and botulism to Iraq, which Iraq claimed it needed for University research.


Originally posted by forklift
Ho Ho Ho, that makes 1.5 million innocent Iraqis killed by US.Bush and his dad should meet the same fate as Saddam for perpertrating war crimes and genocide.And Cheney? He should be punished like what we have seen in the SAW movies, maybe hand him over to a cannibal.

Thanks for the reminder though.


Wow.. your reading comprehension is worse than that of a 2 year old child...

First of all, under Clinton it was known that the sanctions were not working, and Clinton signed for the sanctions to continue.. Another fact the left loves to ignore...

I would rather prosecute Both Bush senior and junior, first for Bush senior calling for a Sunni uprising to topple Saddam, and then for leaving those same Sunni majority at the mercy of Saddam, (but then again JFK did the same to Cubans in the Bay of Pigs, but I guess your kind would not have called for this right?...) and Bush junior for selling out to Russia, since Bush junior kept claiming they were our friends despite the fact that we know for certain Russia became Saddam's number 1 WMD and other banned military equipment provider in the 1990s and until the war, and we even know that Russia was even giving out to Saddam's regime our troop movements during the war but they did some back door deal, and the Bush administration fired the U.S. official who became a whistleblower that both the left and the right media ignored.

This whistleblower was/is John A. Shaw, who served as Deputy Undersecretary of Defense for International Technology Security and in a variety of other senior U.S. Government positions. In fact it was Shaw's job to investigate Saddam's WMD program. When he went to his superior with evidence as to what was happening to the Iraqi WMD Shaw was fired and I quote:

After accusing Russian GRU of helping Saddam to remove his WMD, Shaw was asked to resign for "exceeding his authority" in disclosing the information, a charge he called "specious." Shaw was forced out of office when his position was eliminated on December 10, 2004.

en.wikipedia.org...

We also had the reports from allied nations around Iraq whose military saw large Russian convoys move in and out of Iraq. Not to mention the report from Sada who was the #2 high ranking official in Saddam's Air Force who said he was a witness of how civilian aircraft were retrofitted to move out WMD from Iraq.

www.nysun.com...

That also goes without mentioning that Saddam's regime also gave several Russians ex-officials medals for their help before the war in Iraq, and other facts such as.


In Search of Saddam Hussein’s WMD: The Russian Connection
Part 2 of a 5
World/Scott Malensek
April 4, 2006

In December 2002, Russia’s Middle East envoy, Yevgeny Primakov (former Russian Intelligence Chief), flew to Baghdad under the front of making one last chance for peace with the dictator. As soon as his plane landed, it was allegedly loaded withsensitive materialsand flown directly to Belarus. People speculate as to whether or not it was WMD, WMD equipment, documents, people, or things the Russians didnt want the US to get their hands on, but in any event…the plane was loaded with things the US wanted. There is no doubt that the Russians did send GPS jammers to confuse American satellite-guided bombs, night vision goggles, special anti-tank missiles, and Russian advisors.
...
Renowned reporter Joe Galloway reported that two Russian Generals, Gen. Vladimir Achalov, a former commander of airborne and rapid-reaction forces, and Gen. Igor Maltsev, a leading expert in air defense systems were in Baghdad up until 6 days before the war. During theirvisit they were photographed being given medals by Iraqi Defence Minister Sultan Hashim Akhmed. Other smiley photographs include the two Russian Generals standing with head of the General Staff of the Iraqi Army Izzat Ibragim between them. Upon their return to Russia, the generals were asked why they went on alast-chancediplomatic mission. They replied,We didnt fly to Baghdad to drink coffee.” One wonders if all the elements of the story were proven true, could the claim of “special weapons” being moved out be less true than the other elements.
...

www.newmediajournal.us...



Then we have the several Russian high ranking defectors all who said Russia provided Saddam with WMD and plans to remove those WMD if the west ever got close to them. In communist Rumania that plan was called Sarindar.
www.victoryinstitute.net...

But most people these days would rather let the issue die "believing there were no WMD" than to actually find the truth about it.
edit on 23-12-2010 by ElectricUniverse because: add links.



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