Originally posted by Datadayne
Images may encourage Idolatry.
Whats with all the bull# spreading on ATS,, anti Islam.
If you didnt read the Quran yourself, who the hell are you to teach me my religion.
Only the Arabic translation is completely accurate,, the other are translations.
Originally posted by oozyism
Originally posted by Freeborn
reply to post by oozyism
You are the self-professed ATS expert on all things Islam, surely you can explain to me?
Ask me that question when I say I will cut off your head for drawing a cartoon.
It is easily accessible in Google, the answers of those who would murder you for drawing Mohammad's cartoons. It is a click away.
And maybe whilst you are at it maybe you could explain why most of the myth's you highlighted in your OP originated from within Islam itself and why some Islamic elements still maintain and promote those myths?
Already been answered.
Muslims have free will, just like soldiers.
The Quran is there for everyone to see, even you.
Hence, the army sets the rules, but soldiers can still break the rules.
If a soldier breaks the rules, it simply means soldiers has freewill.
To clarify, just because an American soldier raped an Iraqi girl, then killed her whole family, doesn't mean the military allows such actions.
The soldier later claimed he didn't think Iraqis were human.
Just because a Muslim murders innocent people, doesn't mean Islam allows this.
I think you are just trying to press buttons here and play some games, I will leave you with the above.
Originally posted by oozyism
damage their young by attempting to reproduce with them before they are ready, so how come allah didn’t know this?
Very disturbing comment.
Now for the sake of argument let's argue, because I'm getting quiet sick of people like you.
Tell me exactly where in that verse, does it talk about sexual intercourse with someone who has not reached puberty yet.
Explain it in your own words, rather than copying and pasting someone else's.
This will be interesting.
8:12 When thy Lord inspired the angels, (saying): I am with you. So make those who believe stand firm. I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger.
8:13 That is because they opposed Allah and His messenger. Whoso opposeth Allah and His messenger, (for him) lo! Allah is severe in punishment.
8:14 That (is the award), so taste it, and (know) that for disbelievers is the torment of the Fire.
8:34 What (plea) have they that Allah should not punish them, when they debar (His servants) from the Inviolable Place of Worship, though they are not its fitting guardians. Its fitting guardians are those only who keep their duty to Allah. But most of them know not. 8:35 And their worship at the (holy) House is naught but whistling and hand- clapping. Therefore (it is said unto them): Taste of the doom because ye disbelieve.
8:39 “Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah.”
9:5 Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.
Legal opinion on apostasy by the Fatwa committee at Al-Azhar University in Cairo, the highest Islamic institution in the world, concerning the case of a man who converted to Christianity: "Since he left the Islam, he will be invited to express his regret. If he does not regret, he will be killed pertaining to rights and obligations of the Islamic law."
oozy absolutely infuriated me at times and I disagreed with him on almost everything but I think ATS will be a much worse place without him being here and I for one will miss him, I only hope there is still a way ATS and oozy can reconcile their differences and he can return all the better for the experience and continue being a valued member of the ATS community.
Is it acceptable to marry a girl who has not yet started her menses?
I have not yet reached the age of puberty. Is it correct that a girl could get married before her menses start, or is that just a traditional myth?.
Praise be to Allaah.
Marriage to a young girl before she reaches puberty is permissible according to sharee'ah, and it was narrated that there was scholarly consensus on this point.
1 – Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And those of your women as have passed the age of monthly courses, for them the ‘Iddah (prescribed period), if you have doubt (about their periods), is three months; and for those who have no courses [(i.e. they are still immature) their ‘Iddah (prescribed period) is three months likewise”
In this verse we see that Allaah states that for those who do not menstruate – because they are young and have not yet reached the age of puberty – the ‘iddah in the case of divorce is three months. This clearly indicates that it is permissible for a young girl who has not started her periods to marry.
Al-Tabari (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:
The interpretation of the verse “And those of your women as have passed the age of monthly courses, for them the ‘Iddah (prescribed period), if you have doubt (about their periods), is three months; and for those who have no courses [(i.e. they are still immature) their ‘Iddah (prescribed period) is three months likewise”. He said: The same applies to the ‘idaah for girls who do not menstruate because they are too young, if their husbands divorce them after consummating the marriage with them.
Tafseer al-Tabari, 14/142
2 – It was narrated from ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her) that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) married her when she was six years old, and consummated the marriage with her when she was nine, and she stayed with him for nine years.
Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 4840; Muslim, 1422.
Ibn ‘Abd al-Barr said:
The scholars are unanimously agreed that a father may marry off his young daughter without consulting her. The Messenger of Allaah married ‘Aa’ishah bint Abi Bakr when she was young, six or seven years old, when her father married her to him.
The fact that it is permissible to marry a minor girl does not imply that it is permissible to have intercourse with her, rather the husband should not have intercourse with her until she becomes able for that. Hence the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) delayed consummating the marriage to ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her).
And Allaah knows best.
Regarding sex with prepubescent children, Abu-Ala’ Maududi states:
"Therefore, making mention of the waiting-period for girls who have not yet menstruated, clearly proves that it is not only permissible to give away the girl at this age but it is permissible for the husband to consummate marriage with her. Now, obviously no Muslim has the right to forbid a thing which the Qur’an has held as permissible." (Maududi, volume 5, p. 620, note 13, emphasis added)
It is clear: Muslim men can engage in sex with prepubescent children!
3) EVIDENCE THAT AISHA WAS 9 WHEN SHE CONSUMMATED HER MARRIAGE
Now that we’ve established that Islam allows husbands to engage in sex with their child-brides, let’s move on to Muhammad and Aisha. The Islamic source materials state that Aisha was 9 when they consummated their marriage.
From the hadith of Bukhari, volume 5, #234
"Narrated Aisha: The prophet engaged me when I was a girl of six. We went to Medina and stayed at the home of Harith Kharzraj. Then I got ill and my hair fell down. Later on my hair grew (again) and my mother, Um Ruman, came to me while I was playing in a swing with some of my girl friends. She called me, and I went to her, not knowing what she wanted to do to me. She caught me by the hand and made me stand at the door of the house. I was breathless then, and when my breathing became all right, she took some water and rubbed my face and head with it. Then she took me into the house. There in the house I saw some Ansari women who said, "Best wishes and Allahs blessing and a good luck." Then she entrusted me to them and they prepared me (for the marriage). Unexpectedly Allahs messenger came to me in the forenoon and my mother handed me over to him, and at that time I was a girl of nine years of age."
Bukhari vol. 7, #65:
"Narrated Aisha that the prophet wrote the marriage contract with her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old. Hisham said: "I have been informed that Aisha remained with the prophet for nine years (i.e. till his death).""
From the hadith of Muslim, volume 2, #3309
Aisha reported: Allah’s Messenger married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house at the age of nine….
From the hadith of the Sunan of Abu Dawud, volume 2, #2116
"Aisha said, "The Apostle of Allah married me when I was seven years old." (The narrator Sulaiman said: "Or six years."). "He had intercourse with me when I was 9 years old."
From "The History of Tabari", volume 9, page 131
"Then the men and women got up and left. The Messenger of God consummated his marriage with me in my house when I was nine years old. Neither a camel nor a sheep was slaughtered on behalf of me"...(The Prophet) married her three years before the Emigration, when she was seven years old and consummated the marriage when she was nine years old, after he had emigrated to Medina in Shawwal. She was eighteen years old when he died.
From the Encyclopedia of Islam, under "Aisha":
"Some time after the death of Khadija, Khawla suggested to Muhammad that he should marry either Aisha, the 6 year old daughter of his chief follower, or Sawda Zama, a widow of about 30, who had gone as a Muslim to Abyssinia and whose husband had died there. Muhammad is said to have asked her to arrange for him to marry both. It had already been agreed that Aisha should marry Djubayr Mutim, whose father, though still pagan, was friendly to the Muslims. By common consent, however, this agreement was set aside, and Muhammad was betrothed to Aisha... The marriage was not consummated until some months after the Hidjra, (in April 623, 624). Aisha went to live in an apartment in Muhammad's house, later the mosque of Median. She cannot have been more than ten years old at the time and took her toys to her new home."
SUMMARY OF THE EVIDENCE OF AISHA'S AGE
The above references are just a sample of the Islamic source material statements that Aisha was 9 when her marriage was consummated. Over and over again the great Islamic scholars state that Aisha was 9 when her marriage was consummated. No serious Muslim scholar doubts this. Generally it is only embarrassed Muslims living in the West who challenge her age. For a more in-depth presentation of the evidence of Aisha’s age being 9, see Sam’s article here.
edit on 22-12-2010 by ElectricUniverse because: errors and to add comments.
The following excerpts are from The Mosque Exposed by Sam Solomon, a former imam and Islamic lawyer who converted to Christianity and is now residing in the UK, and E. Alamaqdisi, a prolific writer and debater, and a regular contributor to many Internet sites on the complex subject of Islam and its teachings. They also wrote Modern Day Trojan Horse: Al-Hijra, The Islamic Doctrine of Immigration, Accepting Freedom or Imposing Islam?
Despite the overtly cruel, harsh and intolerant Qur'anic views towards the 'others,' namely Jews and Christians, there are injunctions in the Qur'an that enable the Islamic community to disguise, play down, and, when necessary, deny both the intensity and validity of these anti-Semitic and anti-Christian teachings of its religious system.
[Takiyya] permeates almost all the activities and dealings of Muslims within non-Muslim societies...
Takiyya means "caution, fear, or disguise." It permits the suspension, as the need arises, of almost any or all religious requirements--including a total denial of faith--when fearing threat, injury or compulsion of any kind in a non-Muslim society, or even in a Muslim society.
Kitman is close to Taqqiya but rather than outright dissimulation, it consists in telling only part of the truth, with “mental reservation” justifying the omission of the rest (adjustment, deception etc, anything short of a full-blown lie). For example when a Muslim maintains that “jihad” really means “a spiritual struggle” and fails to add that this particular definition is a recent invention in Islam (little more than a century old), he misleads by holding back the true violent nature of jihad, and is therefore practicing “kitman.” Another example would be the insistence of a Muslim apologist that “of course” there is the freedom of conscience in Islam, followed by quoting the Qur’anic verse “There shall be no compulsion in religion.” The impression given is false, for there has been no mention of the Islamic doctrine of abrogation, or naskh.
 Conditions to lie set by Muhammad
In his Sira, Muhammad authorized lying to improve the chances of successful assassinations, for example in the case of Shaaban Ibn Khalid al-Hazly and Bin Kaab.
Muhammad said: "Lying is wrong, except in three things: the lie of a man to his wife to make her content with him; a lie to an enemy, for war is deception; or a lie to settle trouble between people" [Ahmad, 6.459. H]
See also Raymond Ibrahim's article for the Middle East Quarterly, Winter 2010: How Taqiyya Alters Islam's Rules of War
 Qur'an verses about Taqqiyah
A Muslim does not have to maintain his oath (faith) as long as whats in his heart is true
Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah: except by way of precaution, that ye may Guard yourselves from them. But Allah cautions you (To remember) Himself; for the final goal is to Allah.
Any one who, after accepting faith in Allah, utters Unbelief,- except under compulsion, his heart remaining firm in Faith - but such as open their breast to Unbelief, on them is Wrath from Allah, and theirs will be a dreadful Penalty..
Qur'an 77:38 and Qur'an 9:5 allows the Muslim to use any stratagem. A common Muslim defense is that this applies 'only in war' However as has been demonstrated, Muslims are always at war. Considering that non-believers can not be friends with Muslims. Therefore any relations can only be governed by enmity or truce. Also, Considering the Muslims are allowed to break a truce whenever they choose without prior warning (very dishonourable conduct) as per Treaties, I would have to argue that Muslims are constantly at war.
Originally posted by Datadayne
There is no "Secret plot to DOMINATE the world by force". Sure there are a # ton on Muslims out there that commit terrible acts,,, they will be punished for that.
Originally posted by Datadayne
Well I must congratulate TPTB, you've accomplished your goal. The masses hate us.
HERE! HAVE AN INTERNET HIGH FIVE!!!!