Americans----> You're FAT!

" couple that with his commentary and it's clear he has an ego the size of Texas."

If I have an ego it is born of achievement. Talking the talk, walking the walk.

Who would you rather have give advice. Someone who doesn't practice what they preach. Someone who has failed themselves so has no right to recommend anything.


I put myself in the shoes of someone who is 300kg, with all the disabilities that entails. Mental and physical. And still found a way to help them when everyone said it couldn't be done. I had zero support, but now the medical field is jumping on the bandwagon. So my perceived ego just might be arrogance and obstinance combined. Which believe you me, if you wish to fight the medical fraternity you better have in abundance.

Originally posted by thedeadtruth
reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd

 

Concentrating on pre WW2 is simply wrong. Have you ever studied some of Dr Kelloggs work around 1910. He was already talking about the upcoming obesity epidemic. It is like reading something out of the paper today. Our lifestyles were already going downhill fast.

Well, Dr. Kelloggs probably contributed to the obesity epidemic himself...thanks for the breakfast cereals, Doc! I'll stick to actual data, not the opinions of a vegetarian, seventh-day adventist Doctor that promoted heavy intake of cereal grains.

Technology / less labor intensive jobs, and cheaper food was becoming the norm. To completely disregard the fact we used to have active lifestyles, just because you don't like that fact, is ignorant.

Weston A. Price, like Kellogg, made some observations during his travels around the world--along with many other epidemiologists throughout the 19th and 20th century--noting that less affluent people worked the most physically demanding jobs...and yet the poor demographics tend to be the most corpulent. Conversely, Vilhjalmur Stefansson spent years with Alaskan Inuit describing their women as consuming copious amounts of food and extremely sedentary while maintaining a healthy weight (they ate primarily fat).

Examples like this are found everywhere. The poor, less-fortunate who work the most tend to be the fattest. Look at the history of the Pima Indians...

Work physically harder + eat less = No obesity.

Unfortunately, that's not the case, and most experts will readily admit that, while burning more than you consume is the way to prevent/treat obesity, the success rate using this method is embarrasingly sad. Saying obesity is caused by eating too much and exercising too little is just like saying obesity is caused by a caloric surplus. It's saying the same thing. It's like saying car accidents are caused by accidents. It doesn't tell you WHY!

Yes, weight gain is associated with overeating...that doesn't mean it's caused by overeating. Same with exercise.

You have to think of exercise as a prescribed amount you need every day. Some people still get that from their jobs. But the rest of us who have jobs where we are just standing or sitting down, have to work out to get our prescribed amount.

Some months I workout 5 days and play basketball 2-4 days a week. Sometimes I go entire months without hitting the gym except for maybe 4 times to play some ball. My weight generally stays the same (slight variances in body composition do occur probably because I drink more beer when I'm not routinely lifting and also because I fast intermittently). My fat accumulation depends primarily on my diet. It just so happens that when I'm working out with a goal in mind (hypertrophy, cutting, strength) I tend to eat extremely well, and considerably more. When I'm not lifting, I don't eat as much cause I'm not as hungry and if I don't watch what and when I eat...I'll stay weight stable but become flabby.

I won't get into the why, as I've done that plenty of times here on these boards. But it has everything to do with diet and how the body wants to stay weight stable. Diet, not exercise, is the determining common factor, my friend.

It's not what I want to hear, trust me. I'm a trainer. Exercise is a confounding factor that can aid in fat loss if done correctly, but it's not necessary.

Originally posted by thedeadtruth
" couple that with his commentary and it's clear he has an ego the size of Texas."

If I have an ego it is born of achievement. Talking the talk, walking the walk.

Who would you rather have give advice. Someone who doesn't practice what they preach. Someone who has failed themselves so has no right to recommend anything.

Someone who knows what they're talking about. Someone who understands that they'll never know the whole truth while striving to find it. Someone whose ego doesn't keep them from analyze subjectively, allowing for the dismissal of one's theory when the data contradicts it.

reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd


Do you know that personal trainers are the lowest qualified health profession there is. You can not actually get a lower qualification ( I dare you to name one if you say I am wrong ) .

Hair dressers and beauty therapists are more qualified to give health advice. Hell a shaved monkey could pass a personal training course. I know because I have seen them.

You are not striving to find anything. You are just regurgitating data to support your already existing viewpoint. You have offered no solutions or anything we haven't heard a million times before, just excuses.

Poor people are fat ? Have you even spent time in third world countries, I have. Only the rich are fat, the poor are skinny. It has been like that throughout history. So stop talking about a few individual cases out of billions of people that have ever lived, its an argument anyone can see right through.

The lower-socio economics groups suffering from obesity in western countries now are not POOR. They wouldn't even know what poor meant.

Your lack of education is astounding, and your enabling of obesity by repeating old excuses is alarming considering you claim to be a trainer.




PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE THE REASON WE ARE HAVING AN OBESITY CRISIS. ALL DENIAL AND ZERO RESPONSIBILITY.


ITS PEOPLE LIKE ME WHO HAVE TO CLEAN UP AFTER YOU. THANKS.

Slayer, Thanks for the heads up! I am going on about 15 pounds over weight. Starting to look a little chubby. Time I did something about it starting today, not Jan. 1, 2011.

Mahree

Originally posted by thedeadtruth
reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd

 

Do you know that personal trainers are the lowest qualified health profession there is. You can not actually get a lower qualification ( I dare you to name one if you say I am wrong ) .

Jesus Christ, dude. Why can't you focus on the post itself? I'm not qualifying myself to you. The point was I like to work out and I train clients, so it's tough for me to sit here and admit that exercising, generally, is inefficient.

Hair dressers and beauty therapists are more qualified to give health advice. Hell a shaved monkey could pass a personal training course. I know because I have seen them.

Generally speaking, I couldn't agree more. And I'm not giving health advice, sir.

You are not striving to find anything. You are just regurgitating data to support your already existing viewpoint. You have offered no solutions or anything we haven't heard a million times before, just excuses.

Ok, now you're just acting like a child. Not once have I made an excuse. I'm pointing out the logical fallacies that exist within this genre. It's not my opinion. My "viewpoint" is based on research and data. If the data change, so does my "viewpoint".

Poor people are fat ? Have you even spent time in third world countries, I have. Only the rich are fat, the poor are skinny.

Wow. You really are that dense. Go eat 1600, 1400, 1200, 1000 calories day and see what happens.... My god. That's called starving. You can't be seriously retorting with that? Tell ya what...look at the poor American population...then go look at the Pima Indians.

Your lack of education is astounding, and your enabling of obesity by repeating old excuses is alarming considering you claim to be a trainer.

I very seriously doubt you have any idea of the biochemical pathways involved in anobolism and catabolism, the sum result of which is metabolism. Your tautological approach to this subject is sort of sad. You're oblivious to the WHY. And it's sort of ironic how you're commenting on my education...didn't you boldly proclaim your own lack of education? I dont' remember...

I still don't know how I'm making excuses...if you can find them for me, I'll gladly remove them.

And, for the record, me being a trainer has nothing to do with my knowledge on the subject at hand. I damn sure didn't learn it through NSCA.

PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE THE REASON WE ARE HAVING AN OBESITY CRISIS. ALL DENIAL AND ZERO RESPONSIBILITY.

Once again, I have no idea where you're getting this from. It'd be nice, however, if you'd address the post and not the poster.

ITS PEOPLE LIKE ME WHO HAVE TO CLEAN UP AFTER YOU. THANKS.

It's people like you who drive people away from ATS because you can't focus on discussing a topic like an adult without making it personal. I have better, more structured debates with my 21 year old sister....

So I've watched this heated debate escalate over the past 5 pages, and I think I have a solution to the problems at hand. I want to submit my own body as a human guinea pig. Tell me if this sounds like a stupid idea or something that would fix this debate.


I want those of you who are "in the know" to give me a plan for weight loss, including: daily diet, types of exercise, and anything else that you deem important in your personal weight loss plans. It must be cheap; aka: no gym memberships (as I just canceled mine today, realizing that I could no longer afford it), and foods that are cheap and effective in supporting weight loss. Pretend that I am a poor person that has very little money to spend on "expensive groceries" or gym memberships or expensive work out tools. Since the jobs I work don't pay very much, I have to be able to afford each of your individual plans.

Each plan I will do for one month. I will record what I eat, what I drink, the types of exercises I do, and do a weekly weigh-in. At the end of the month, I will measure my waist size, my weight, etc. and record that data. After I have done all the plans recommended to me, I will record what was the most effective, what made me feel the best, and I what I would continue to do to maintain (if I lose weight at all). I would like to implement this experiment starting on January 1st, 2011. So a little over a week and a half away.

If you are interested in this (Devo, thedeadtruth), please U2U me, and we'll discuss what the best course of action is. I could stand to lose a bit of the belly fat that I have.

Once I have mail from those of you "in the know," I will make a new thread dedicated to this experiment, including my starting weight, my height, my shoulder width, my chest size, waist size, the plans to be implemented, beginning body pics, ending body pics, etc. I will post daily to the new thread, as I said, recording everything. I'm looking for three very good plans, and since it looks like Devo and thedeadtruth are already in the know, I will highly consider your individual plans.

If you think this is a good idea, send me a U2U. I want to prove or disprove these plans once and for all.




Peace be with you.

-truthseeker

So when are we going to start the support group, I want to be healthy and sexy at sixty,

We could call it ATS, AKA, A$$es Triumphantly Slimmer, I started today.

We could share recipes and encourage one-another, have weigh ins, NOT.

Post before and after pictures NOT.

and lie about how much we lost.

Just kidding, about the lying part.

Hey thedeadtruth, DevolutionEvolvd.


Just a reminder "Keep it civil"

Now.....


FIGHT!

reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd


" so it's tough for me to sit here and admit that exercising, generally, is inefficient."

No I am stating its your limited understanding of what constitutes exercise that is the problem. It is the problem with 99.9999% of all trainers.

You only think in terms of what you can control. Getting people to push weights or run around in circles. Because that is easy to understand.

Whoever told you that was most efficient way to burn off calories was either lying or had no place teaching.

Luckily, I'm Canadian.

reply to post by thedeadtruth


No one has. I'm not really sure where you got that from either. I've been trying to tell you that caloric balance, trying to maintain it in the negative to lose weight, is an outdated system that never worked.

Honestly, that post made no sense. Would you like to clarify?

reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd


You were the one that stated exercise plays no part in body fat % .

What forms of exercise do you prescribe ?

reply to post by thedeadtruth


Well, I'm done. Either your an adult with the reading comprehension skills of a 10 year old....or you really are 10. Have fun arguing with yourself.

Edit to add: I hope you understand that I'm not going to have a discussion with someone who can't comprehend my posts and consistently ignores the bulk of what I'm saying. The type of workout regime that I would put a client on varies depending on his/her goals...but that is COMPLETELY irrelavent. You're trying to find a way to find something you can 1 up me on....besides the actual points orginally discussed.

It was a simple enough question Mr Trainer.

You stated exercise was inefficient at fighting obesity. If you cant list what you personally prescribe as exercise, there can be no starting point to the conversation

reply to post by thedeadtruth


The conversation has already started. When you can determine the difference between "inefficient fat loss tool" and "no effect on body fat %".....I'll rejoin this conversation.

reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd


Ok very sorry, will rephrase ...

What forms of exercise have you personally prescribed that you found were an "inefficient fat loss tool"

whatever, its just more of me to love! no, but for real, i gained 50 lbs since i was 25 - now 30. it scares me. i dont "pig out". im just not active. i need sport!!

reply to post by thedeadtruth


By itself? Nothing. Because, as I've been saying, diet is the largest confounder.

Look...You can work out all you want. But if your diet is pure crap, exercise can't make up for that.

However, you can eat healthily...and sit on your ass all day and still maintain a healthy weight.

...DIET is the determining factor, not exercise.

That's it. Now I'm Done. Enjoy.

I think typing more will help weight loss, less hand to mouth movement,