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Abraham...Ancestor of the Brahmins?

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posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:00 PM
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In Genesis Abraham is said to have sent off his wife Keturah, and her children (who are also his children) to the lands of the East - Kedem.

Many in the Jewish tradition have speculated what these lands of the east refer to. Before Abraham sent them off, he gave them presents. These presents are interpreted as occult or spiritual knowledge.

Now, is it coincidence that in Indias Caste system, the highest class are the Brahmins? Brahmin and Abraham, are etymologically very close. Is it possible that they are the descendants of Abrahams 2nd wife, Keturah?




posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:03 PM
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Everything is possible I believe. Maybe you could be on to something. Browse around online and see if you make an connection.



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:03 PM
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Interesting idea. And possible.

Ive speculated many times that Abrahamic Religions have their origin in Hinduism.

For example here: The hidden connections between Religions



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:08 PM
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There might be a clue in his name actually. If I remember right his name was Abram until god changed It to Abraham. The change had to do with the Hebrew letter `Ah` meaning God breathed or something close to that



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:11 PM
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reply to post by Skyfloating
 


Yes I've always thought the energy points in the Kaballah (sp) and the Hindu Chakra point similarities were quite interesting.



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:12 PM
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reply to post by bluemooone2
 


I believe this could explain the name change better. I believe Abraham is the father of more then the Jewish and Arab people. Probably some close groups in the Middle East.

Abraham's name first appears as Abram (Hebrew: אַבְרָם, Modern Avram Tiberian ʾAḇrām), meaning either "exalted father" or "my father is exalted" (compare Abiram). Later in Genesis God renamed him Abraham; the text glosses this as av hamon (goyim), "father of many (nations)", but it does not have any literal meaning in Hebrew. Many modern interpretations based on textual and linguistic explanations have been offered, including an analysis of a first element abr- "chief", but this yields a meaningless second element. Johann Friedrich Karl Keil suggests there was once a word raham (רָהָם) in Hebrew, meaning "multitude", on analogy with the word ruhâm which has this meaning in Arabic, but no evidence that this word existed has been found; and David Rohl suggests the name comes from Akkadian "the father loves.

Source



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:13 PM
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Keep digging my friend till you get to Enlil!

S&F



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by mayabong

Yes I've always thought the energy points in the Kaballah (sp) and the Hindu Chakra point similarities were quite interesting.


Ah, so you've noticed...very perceptive of you



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:17 PM
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reply to post by dontreally
 

I remember reading about this a long time ago,

viewzone2.com...



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:19 PM
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So much of my time has been in focus of Ishmael and Isaac. I totally forgot and neglected to research into the children Abraham fathered with Keturah. Thanks for posting your speculation. I'll look more into it.

I remember long ago in Christian Sunday School singing a song with these lyrics;
"Father Abraham, had many sons. Many sons had Father Abraham.
I am one of them. And so are you.
So let's all praise the Lord."


I'm interested in seeing how far Abraham's lineage goes.



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:27 PM
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reply to post by Skyfloating
 


Abraham was from mesopotamia. He sent his wife and kids to the East - East of mesopotamia, which can be interpreted as the indus valley.

Meaning the brahmins themselves derived their knowledge from the middleeast.

This is of course what the text implies. The presents given were the basis of their spiritual tradition (which they surely expanded upon).
edit on 17-12-2010 by dontreally because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:32 PM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


Thats very interesting. I would be interested to find out the origin of the Brahmins.



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:33 PM
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reply to post by mayabong
 


energy points in kabbalah are actually quite different in many ways than the cahkra system in Hinduism. Of course, its universally the same that theyre along the spinal column.

In kabbalah theyre broken up into 5 group of 3.

The fifteen contact-points divide into five groups of three, each group corresponding to one of the five primary personas of the complete human form. The first group of three are:

1. The point at the top of the skull
2. The point where the hair meets the forehead (the place above which the head-tefilin are placed), and
3. The point of the middle of the forehead (referred to as the essential point of the “forehead of will”).

All three of these points embody super-rational energy; they are all above the eyes, the beginning of conscious perception. They correspond to the three points (figuratively: mouth, chest, and brit) of Arich Anpin (above Abba and Ima, the Father and Mother—wisdom and understanding, the rational mind).

The next grouping are the three points (mouth, chest, and brit) of Abba:

1. The point between the eyes (the “mouth” of wisdom),
2. The point of the nose, and
3. The indent above the upper lip (the point that the angel strikes before birth to cause us to forget all the Torah we learned in the womb).

The next grouping are the three points (mouth, chest, and brit) of Ima:

1. The tip of the tongue in the mouth,
2. The point of the chin,
3. The middle point of the throat.

The next grouping are the three points (mouth, chest, and brit) of Ze'er Anpin:

1. The point between the shoulders,
2. The middle point of the upper chest (referred to as the “bird of the soul”), and
3. The middle point of the (lower) chest (the essential point of the chest, the point of embrace described above).

The final grouping are the three points (mouth, chest, and brit) of Nukva Deze'er Anpin:

1. The point of the navel (the “mouth” during pregnancy),
2. The point of the lower abdomen (the point of the female womb), and
3. The point of the (male) brit.



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 03:42 PM
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reply to post by Sahabi
 


It is interesting.

Whats also interesting is the Hebrew association of Sini - sons of Canaan, with China.

The modern Hebrew word for chinese people is Sini. And of course the group of chinese languages care called "sinitic"

I think there could be a very deep reasoning for this.

I think the bible actually does chronicle the history of the peoples of the world. Except the elite would prefer us not to know that.



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 04:02 PM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


I think he was A-Brahm, it makes sense.


6. And in Chaldea, Brahm was known. A pious Brahm named Terah lived
in Ur; his son was so devoted to the Brahmic faith that he was called
A-Brahm; and he was set apart to be the father of the Hebrew race.

www.sacred-texts.com...



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 04:36 PM
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reply to post by dontreally
 

wow thanks for that? Do you practice this? Do you just meditate on these points to open them?
W



posted on Dec, 17 2010 @ 04:49 PM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


Those points still generally correspond to the Chakra system except that the system you just presented seems to be more elaborate and exact. Highly Fascinating. Hence the possible origin of Hinduism in Kabbalah.
edit on 17-12-2010 by Skyfloating because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 18 2010 @ 01:47 AM
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Now, is it coincidence that in Indias Caste system, the highest class are the Brahmins? Brahmin and Abraham, are etymologically very close. Is it possible that they are the descendants of Abrahams 2nd wife, Keturah?


As somebody who was raised with a Hindu parent, I have to say that your hypothesis is to say the least bizarre.

The Indian caste system like everything else in Indian culture has been continuously evolving through out many millenia. The Brahmins become top of the food chain only very recently in the caste structure and through most of its history, the caste system was controlled naturally by the warrior castes- as would be expected. Even Further back, the caste system was very fluid and open with castes not central to people's lives and didn't resemble the closed caste system that we are all taught about.

Further, from what we know of Abraham from the Old Testament, his kindred would be very different from the brahmins of India. Where as Abraham and his people were survivors, fighters and shepherds, the brahmins of India are religiously forbidden from owning property or possessions. They sole duty is to preserve the collected knowledge of the Vedas and the instruction of the rest of the people in conducting rituals and religious sacrifices. Their religious practices were also very rigid and they were forbidden from ALL meat and even Eggs. The Brahmins were an exclusive group of people that stemmed from a single source. Brahmins come in all shapes and sizes from those who look like Eastern Europeans to those who would look like Africans. All too often, we in the West try to link some racial component to the caste system, where none actually exists.

Perhaps the biggest problem to your hypothesis is the fact that Brahmins are the corner stone of the Hindu religious faith and thus they would be central to practices like worship (which would always be idol worship!), ritual sacrifices, the funeral rites ( which would involve cremation) and marriages etc. Most Brahminical practices would be antithetical to Abraham's kindred let alone be relegated to the station of being responsible for their proper execution.



posted on Dec, 18 2010 @ 02:07 AM
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Originally posted by dontreally
Abraham was from mesopotamia. He sent his wife and kids to the East - East of mesopotamia, which can be interpreted as the indus valley.

Meaning the brahmins themselves derived their knowledge from the middleeast.


East of Mesopotamia is the Indus valley ? So is China! Don't you mean "East of Babylonia" ?

The Brahmins didn't "derive" their knowledge from anybody. ALL their knowledge is from the Vedas. The Vedas are the ROOT of all Hindu faith. The Vedas consist of many books about many subjects and were written during the Iron Age from around 1500 to 1000 BCE. The Abrahmical period is from about 600-500 BC, which is about the end of the Vedia era in Hindu philosophy. So by the time Abrahams kindered would have moved to the "Indus Valley", which was destroyed back in 2500 BC, they would meet a culture that was very sophisticated and very structured to have "imparted" anything to influence them in any way.



posted on Dec, 18 2010 @ 02:28 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


There is no creedence in any of the mainstream books or bibles! So no clutching at straws. India's caste system is one of the most disgusting forms of discrimination in the world ever. We are all human, fact! Saying that some are elite i.e brahmins & others are "Untouchable" is absolute rubbish!. So no!



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