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A Galaxies Cluster Older Than Possible! Scientists say.

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posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 12:40 AM
reply to post by ker2010

Yeah i just watched that video and it began with "Well we're really not sure, but most physicists think"
I don't know how much less that can proclaim to be fact.

And even if it comes off as fact, that part of the answer in regards to the question should come off that way. If the big bang theory was in fact wrong, saying the big bang is 'so and so' in the big bang theory is still completely true. It's what we as humans have defined it as.

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 12:54 AM

Originally posted by flyingfish
I would not scrap the books just yet.Redshift measurements from SED modeling are inherently less accurate than spectroscopy.Such "systemic uncertainties" in the determination of the distances of these galaxies might still allow for approximate agreement between observations and model predictions.

Hey right on, look at Galileo, his middle finger can be seen at Italy's Museo di Storia del Scienza, giving 'the finger' to the Vatican for the last three hundred years...Copernicus.. the sun was the center of the galaxy? lol

Then you have the ever changing Hubble constant, wasn't that just recently updated.

however.... It's always safe to use the current model until it's proven wrong...

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 12:54 AM
Science is as good as it gets...

The earth is flat....oups, no sorry

The earth is the center of the universe...oups, no sorry

The sun is the center of the universe...oups, no sorry

The big bang started it all....oups, no sorry

Pluto is a planet....oups, no sorry

We can only take for granted what hasnt been debunked so far.


posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 01:06 AM
human scientists will never understand 0000000000.1% of the universe.
how could they?
so when a new discovery 'creates havoc' I just laugh. It's like when discovered Earth wasn't flat - it created havoc.
Imagine in 500 years how things will have changed.
btw, big bang theory is just a ludicrous theory. the universe has always existed, there was no beginning.
and we dont have a reliable technology to identify how old artifacts are even on Earth, how can scientists know how old something outside our planet is?
its really laughable

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 01:23 AM
reply to post by jsettica

I like it when something blows the top off everything...didn't people once think the world was flat? It only proves that the more you learn, you learn how little you really know...

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 01:34 AM
I wonder if this is finally some decent evidence leading to the multiverse hypothesis...sweet.

Of course, I personally think it is going to be found a "big throb" over time...aka, the big bang happens...and happen...and happens..perhaps every whatever, perhaps 50 billion years. This galaxy may simply be a relic from a previous "throb".

ok, its a bit out there...multiverse sounds more likely..but one hypothesis is as good as another until some confirmation comes in

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 01:46 AM
"Who really knows what happened? Who can describe it? How were things produced? Where was creation born?

When the universe was created, the one became many. Who knows how this occurred?

Did creation happen at God's command, or did it happen without his command? He looks down upon creation from the highest heaven. Only he knows the answer."

From the Hindu Vedas

The Big Bang, Black Holes, Quasars, Pulsars, Dark Energy, Dark Matter........All hypothetical concepts. No one knows for sure. Unless we graduate to a higher level and learn to think in more dimensions than the present four, we will never even begin to understand the true nature of life and the universe.

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 02:12 AM
Good find.

Maybe the Big Bang did occur but the Big Bang only pertains to our universe. We have expanded into a much older universe and maybe we're being absorbed by this universe. This would mean that we will began to measure objects in the universe that will be older than are local universe.

This is interesting when you think about the other thread about parallel universes and the CMB.

Maybe the multiverse is one structure that keeps giving birth to local universes ad infinitum. This would mean that we have been here in these lives and other lives over and over again as universes go through the birth-death cycle.

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 02:37 AM

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 02:38 AM
So old it cannot exist based on what they know about the universe.?

More to be revealed yet. They'll never get its beginings right.

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 02:39 AM
so to the people going "big bang theory disproven,blind worship of science is insanity" are really that stupid?

The more science develops, the more we will learn and the more will be dis-proven

the big bang was just a THEORY, just like Creationism THEORY

guess what?

this just means that new theories will be formulated and fixed

do you really want to sit there and believe that the universe is as young as the bible makes you believe when even this galaxy cluster proves other wise?

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 02:44 AM
Well well the big bang theory is that is a big statement but I really think there is a thing here which is not always being considered...Why on this panet Earth would one think that we are the only Universe in a infinite amount of space...just as we are slowly coming to the Realization we are not the only Earth planet out there...I personally go for the theory of multiple universes and during this time there are older and newer ones out there....the Universe is a living ogranism just as we are...and who is to say we are not having universal collisons going on where we are or already have collided with another universe...and if this is the case...the big bang Theory still stays ...and right at this very moment in a universe far far away in the exceptional vastness of Empty space there goes another bang.....oops and yet another one....and oh no there goes another one....they may be being formed all the time just as star goes through it's life cycle so do universes...and Also that is why i believe that the unverse will not collapse as there are a great many universes' out there all joining and supporting one and another .....creating a massive web of interlinking multiverse....Therefore you may very well have the exsistance of a much older universe sending outer bits into a much younger one.
It has always bothered me to think logically that there would only be one singular big bang and we were it...In a active vastness of space...just as we at one time thought there was nothing smaller than the atom we keep going deeper and deeper to the bowels of atomic exsistance....I mean what is inside a quark....the universe is infinite so therefore empty space should also be infinite.
the stability of the universe counts on there being a multi universe out there to support it in my opinion...think of it as an on going creataion where there are new ones happening all the I think the big bang theory can still be in place...and even more so in this case as the multiple universe coming closer would be ceating huge pressures between them there causing a big bang to happen in a singularity like when your hand clap together on a fly first the fly compresses in the instant before it explodes...I know a crude example but hey it is simple....and many times the answer lays in the simplicity of the events.
edit on 023131p://f47Thursday by plube because: (no reason given)

edit on 023131p://f48Thursday by plube because: missed a letter

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 02:47 AM
People need to realise that , the big bang was neither big nor a bang. We need to understand we have a lot to understand. In reality , we know very little. Speculation only causes more confusion.

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 03:12 AM
reply to post by XPLodER

This is the official video of INAF about this discovery.
The language is in Italian.

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 03:13 AM
There was big bang - in fact, there were many Big bangs.
I am sure there is one happening right now - either very very very very far away or in another dimension.

There is one thing that will not happen - there will be no Big Crunch.
This is because we f***ed it up - we were supposed to become one, but because, there is nothing to learn from me, you, everyone, Universe will be left to cool and expand eternally.

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 03:49 AM

Originally posted by dalibor1
reply to post by Arken

The theory of BIG BANG is collapsing! you think God has anything to do with it?

Seeing as he's obviously been far, far busier than we presumed (assumed, in all our infinite wisdom).

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 04:02 AM
reply to post by OldCorp

Xploder's post totally freaked me out - I've ben experiencing a disproportionate abundance of numerological synchronicities which feature the number 44 as the focus.


My first house was 44, and it was on a strangely titled road. Can't tell you what it was, obviously, but the devil is in the details as they say.

Back on topic - what a fascinating discovery. I liked Gazrok's response about needing a name for the substrate upon/ within which universes form. Not sure about what that could be just yet - perhaps 'omniversal substrate'..??

The term 'multiverse' has been bandied about in Science Fiction circles for decades, describing the intertwined nature of the various universes/ dimensional realities in existence.

Michael Moorcock seems to be one of those authors privy to 'muse-inspired insights' about the nature of time and space (imho). However, some of his religious musings are downright whacko (again, imho)

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 04:04 AM

Originally posted by sonofliberty1776
It is amazing just how many scientific theories are embraced and cleaved unto as fact, just to be disproved later. Makes you wonder if blind worship of ANY scientific theory is a sign of insanity????

Blind worship of any theory scientific political or religious is insane in my book.

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 04:07 AM
reply to post by FIFIGI


Made me think:

My beliefs? The Force binds us all 'as one', being the subtle energy manipulated by yogic masters, shaolin monks and so forth.

My conversion attempt? Perhaps the Force is the 'thing' which holds reality/ all universes together at the quantum level? If consciousness can interfere to some degree with quantum activity as speculated by some, then it would provide the beginnings of an explanation for the amazing feats purported to be carried out by said yogic masters etc.

Luke - I am your Father...

posted on Dec, 16 2010 @ 04:09 AM
One more flag makes 44...!!!!!!!


EDIT - Whoop!

edit on 16-12-2010 by FlyInTheOintment because: (no reason given)

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