Originally posted by Jamuhn
I know 1 & 2, but the translations are assumed to be based on something. That is why they all talk about Hermes. I already said why alchemy would
have evolved from this.
When you make an assumption you make an @$$ out of U and Mption. (i'll have no part in it.) How could heavily Christianized books full of previously
unknown ingredients be based on anything earlier? THINK man- most if not all of THAT Hermetica is false. The books the Greeks were talking about MAY
be somewhere to be found, may not exist anymore, or may have never really existed. But they ARE NOT the basis for "the secret sermon on the mount"
and other such things. (the secret sermon is probably a cousin to the book of Enoch- there seems to have been an apocryphal fascination with the idea
that either Enoch recieved secrets from the fallen angels, or moses recieved secrets on the mountain.)
And 3. You just say that because they haven't been found. If everyone had that kind of attitude nothing would ever be found.
You would be right, if it weren't for the point above- that there can't be a stone tablet associated with the psuedo-hermetic books such as the
secret sermon on the mount, because the information in that book doesn't predate that book itself.
That is presicely why I am trying to find their origins. You say it is written by an alchemist, what the alchemists name was Hermes. The whole point
is its littered by the name Hermes which is associated with Thoth. Just because he may have been a mythological figure does not mean there was
something prior to those translations.
Holy mutha freakin something, I better just bite my tongue and take a minute before I respond... You get debunked, but she says "it was written by
an alchemist". So you say, WAIT, I'm not debunked, because Hermes was an alchemist!
Hermes existed long before Christian books which are attributed to him. My research into Greek Gods has the sons of Hermes consistently being placed
about 2 generations before the trojan war, which means that any historical hermes character could be attributed to the mid to late second millenium
BC, at least with the limited evidence I have seen so far. Hermes didn't write these books. Hermes didn't originate the knowledge in them. Hermes is
a minor fascination indulged in by the Christian writer of these books.
Let me break it down barney style for you- suppose I was going to write a book about modern war tactics, but to make it interesting i called it the
lost writings of genghis kahn. You could call it a translation and look for the basis, but it would be all about 21st century mechanized forces, and
genghis kahn would contribute nothing but a name. But wait- it was written by a military man, and Genghis Kahn was a military man! There must be a
That is a good point, I should see how far back I can go. But what if Greek philosophy was affected by these tablets seeing as Hermes is of the
You don't belong in history- you belong in theoretical physics. At least you do if you honestly have figured out how Christian alchemists influenced
Greek philosophy. "These tablets" didn't influence Greek philosophy. Strictly in theory, the REAL Hermetica, IF it exists, may have influenced
Greek philosophy, but there's a problem with that too.
Byrd I need your confirmation of this point... in the period roughly surrounding the Trojan War, wasn't the Linear B script being used? Specifically
wasn't it found in the level of Troy immediately following what may have been Homer's Trojan War (Troy VIa or VIIa or some such thing?)? Hermes is
dated to 2 generations pre-trojan war, which means if I'm right he would have used the difficult Linear B script, which would hinder his influence
significantly. (forgive me if my reference to Troy is wrong or slightly off- you've got to keep in mind that I'm actually a heavy equipment
operator, and not terribly well educated, regardless of my IQ).
That doesn't say anything about Thoth. The fact is Thoth was talked about a lot in other heiroglyphics and other early Egyptian works. I'll pull
up where mentions are made of Thoth's works in very old Egyptian texts in my next post.
That says EVERYTHING about Thoth. What it doesn't say anything about is alchemists. You know why I think that is? Because Egyptian Gods weren't
projected into every single bit of history the way Greek ones are, which means Thoth wasn't based on an alchemist probably- he was just merged with
Hermes, who might have been based on one, or on SOME historical figure, MAYBE.
But, I do thank you for giving me some places to look for information because I am wholly new to this concept, specifically, I will look for mentions
of the work and the oldest known reference to the Emerald Tablets....
If there's going to be research on the Hermetica itself it needs to be directed at finding initial evidence that a legit Hermetica exists.
Researching the origins of the pseudo-hermetic christian books is a fool's errand. Researching medival alchemy is just boring to me.
Research Hermes himself- great. Research Greek Mythology and possible historical bases for the stories- great. If we're really lucky, finding legit
ancient greek philosophical works attributed to Hermes (entirely seperate from anything you've presented so far)- great. Reading the Secret Sermon on
the Mount- not for me. Thinking that you're going to find pictures of mystical emerald tablets online when NOBODY is recorded to have seen them in
the last 3400 or so years... waste of time, even if they ever did exist.
As for ending disbelief with a hand full of egyptian texts that are probably in mortal danger of a rapid debunking... good luck. People in this forum
even argue about the deluge, and there's quite a bit of text about that, compared to your emerald tablets or other such things.