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Why do Americans need guns? Rip UP the Second Amendment, problem solved.

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posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 01:55 AM
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The reality is:
1) Guns exist on this planet and anyone who really wants one can get one.
2) Legislation or the lack thereof only governs the weak and the submissive -- the strong are not bound by word or paper. If the strong want guns, they will acquire them, and they will use them, and there isn't anything the weak can do to stop them. No combination of words in a living document or on the internet will change that. Ever. And that goes for anything the strong want, not just guns. Some people think rights are given to you by a nation-state. Some people think rights are given to you naturally or by God. But the strong inherently understand the truth: that rights are what they take or defend for themselves.
3) Until there is a technology that renders them obsolete, guns will remain available and ubiquitous.
edit on 15-12-2010 by bikeshedding because: Spelling correction




posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 02:00 AM
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Originally posted by Gradius Maximus
reply to post by c0ldPhr34k
 







Well guess what cupcake - Up in canada they have begun restricting firearms and it hasnt slowed down crime at all in regards to guns. Not to mention now there is a registry on file for the government to seize your guns immediately. Not to mention I get pulled over and searched because im flagged as a gun owner. not to mention the fact that police treat me like a criminal because I MIGHT have a gun on me.





Well my little Friend. Its a fact that gun crime in Canada has gone down. In fact you should know better coming from Vancouver. In that dump you call a town you have next to no crime except from the tiny amount of gangbangers from Richmond and Surrey. If you check the BC criminal statistics (which you can obtain from BC vital statistics) for the last 15 years you will notice (if you can read) that gun crime among other crimes has gone down dramatically. In fact it is what has actually been a positive for Vancouver and Canada as a whole.

The only thing that has risen is since the Province closed down a couple of the mental hospitals near Vancouver you now ha a load of mental retards swarming all over you little town.

The reason you are questions when pulled over by the police in Van is because you probably are and anyway you are a citizen and if the police wish to question yo then its your problems. If you have done nothing wrong then no need to worry.. the Vancouver police has 89% of the citizens in van on their database.

So don't pretend vancouver is anything like a major american city because its not. Its a small tiny place where people like to hug each other and say eh and support an awful hockey team.

Crime is DOWN in Canada from 15 years ago. Go check it out. GUN crime is down remarkably. No your fact before you flap your mouth beaver man
edit on 15-12-2010 by c0ldPhr34k because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 02:01 AM
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Even if we give our guns to the government, the problem still stands. We'll just be defenseless, any criminal can still purchase a firearm even if they are outlawed, there is always a way for them to do so. Why should I be defenseless in the event of some crack head trying to break in and take my property? I'll keep my guns. All of em.

Every time I read on the news about some man or woman in their home shoots a burglar breaking in I clap just because I know some buck-tooth European or stoned hippie would be offended that their neighbor defended their family from possible harm of an attack.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 02:02 AM
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I've been using guns my whole life, I was lucky to have a grandpa (WW2 veteran, 11th airborn) to teach me safety and ethics of weapon handling.

Guns aren't going anywhere, that is a fact in the world we currently live in. But it's obvious everyone should have the right to defend themselves. I also believe that everyone should be introduced to a rifle or pistol in a safe and educational way. Because once again, they aren't going anywhere.

If more people were are made aware of the safety precautions and dangers (without taboo) of guns - the misuse of them would go down exponentially, from deadly cases of mis-fired weapons, all the way to school shootings. Movies completely mis-represent guns, especially how they should be handled. It is this taboo on guns, parents telling their kids that guns are evil - without physically affirming their full capabilities. It leaves a gap, where the negative influences can settle - psychologically misrepresenting the real facts of guns and replacing it with some romantic idea about them eg. Hollywood.

Thus a valid reason for why they are misused from accidents, to murder caused by an emotional (and clearly misguided) person with access to a nearby gun. With guns, it is too easy to make mistakes. And with guns, there are absolutely no room for any mistakes. Safety first kids.
edit on 15-12-2010 by ThinkingCap because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 02:11 AM
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have you ever or do you live in america? guns already are HEAVILY regulated and some even outlawed. and more than not, gun crimes are committed with illegal weapons that have been regulated or outlawed anyway so tearing up the 2nd amendment won't do anything to help.

beyween calling for the destruction of the 2nd amendment and your other "NWO doesn't exist with absolutely nothing but my personal opinion to support that claim" thread, it makes me wonder.....



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 02:21 AM
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Originally posted by c0ldPhr34k
Originally posted by Gradius Maximus
reply to post by c0ldPhr34k



Thanks for the laughs cupcake,

You claim to know a lot about my city, but every weekend we have shootings and all thats happened is its far more difficult for us to own guns then it used to be and it costs our tax payers more. I have had no problems with the law or this new system, but I can smell a rat. It stinks of Tyranny.

If anything has dropped gun crime in Canada its because the borders have tightened up and its harder for US gangs to smuggle guns into Canada.

Why would you think a useless gun registry does anything to prevent criminals from using guns? It just makes the government and liberals feel safe knowing how many guns there are and where they are.

Feeling sorry for your crowded, crime filled city.

-G



edit on 15-12-2010 by Gradius Maximus because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 02:32 AM
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You can not "rip up" the Second Amendment. You would have to get rid of the entire constitution. It was intentionally designed that way.

QED.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 03:22 AM
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I often wondered in the past why did americans had the right to own a firearm in the constintution, it was odd for me a canadian to unserstand this. But by reading a bit on the history of the US and the formation of the US, i totally get it, the US was created to let people have a choice to freedom, the whole act of independe from england and the way they wanted the country to be run was an awsome thing. The Firearms where the proctection from coruption, or outside influences. And to day where the government in the US seems to be not for the people like it was intended, so these firearms might be again used in a revolution, i dont wish it, but from ashes great things come out.

just my 2 cents



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 03:24 AM
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Originally posted by silo13
Why I need a gun? How about why do you need a car? They kill more people every year than guns.

Or a swimming pool? Why do you need a swimming pool, they kill more children a year than guns.

But can a swimming pool protect me? Help me hunt for my family? Protect me against against powers within and without?

No.

Can a car provide me with a 'well regulated militia' that's the 'most natural defense of a free country'?

No.

Why do I need a gun?

Because - It's my right, that's why.

And I can assure you, when the ‘woop’ hits the fan? Who will most people be hiding behind?

The man or woman with the gun.

peace


In no way Im I mocking youre post. I just thought it funny when you signed off, Peace, when defending something designed to kill?

Peace..



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 03:39 AM
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reply to post by kevinunknown
 


Sir, you really have no idea of what you are talking about.

First of all, you have NO RIGHT to "want to restrict our American rights"... NONE whatsoever... BTW, if you want to keep on with that inane stance on "wanting to restrict Americans our right to bear arms" I want even more to stop people like you from your right to express your inane stance on firearms, because you really have no say on what Americans do, or our Second Amendment right and more so our entire Constitution, which you even want to destroy...

Second of all, you have shown complete ignorance on the history of "gun control" and what happens when governments get complete control over a country just like you want.

Third of all you have also shown complete ignorance on what has been happening to your country since "guns were banned"...

Even UK police officers have come forward to say the UK is a more dangerous place since guns were banned, and millions of British people have taken to the streets to get back their right to have/own guns and to hunt, alongside wanting other rights back...

There are more GUN crimes in the UK since the GUN BAN simply because despite you ignoring and not understanding this simple concept "CRIMINALS DO NOT CARE FOR LAWS"...and much less for your naive opinion.

Even Ghandi knew that regular citizens need to be armed. In his autobiography he himself wrote, and I quote:

"Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest." -- Mahatma Gandhi (An Autobiography OR The story of my experiments with truth, by M.K. Gandhi, p.238)

www.abhijeetsingh.com...

Here is one quote from a government, and one of the many people who have implemented in the past draconian laws banning citizens from owning firearms...


"The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed the subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing. Indeed, I would go so far as to say that the supply of arms to the underdogs is a sine qua non for the overthrow of any sovereignty." -- Adolf Hitler (H.R. Trevor-Roper, Hitler's Table Talks 1941-1944)

www.abhijeetsingh.com...

And from that same link...


"No kingdom can be secured otherwise than by arming the people. The possession of arms is the distinction between a freeman and a slave. He, who has nothing, and who himself belongs to another, must be defended by him, whose property he is, and needs no arms. But he, who thinks he is his own master, and has what he can call his own, ought to have arms to defend himself, and what he possesses; else he lives precariously, and at discretion." --James Burgh (Political Disquisitions: Or, an Enquiry into Public Errors, Defects, and Abuses) [London, 1774-1775]

www.abhijeetsingh.com...



UK News

28 gun crimes committed in UK every day

By Christopher Hope, Home Affairs Correspondent 10:49AM GMT 24 Jan 2008
The spiralling problem with gun culture was highlighted by figures that show 28 firearms crimes are committed in England and Wales every day.

www.telegraph.co.uk...



Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade
By James Slack
Last updated at 8:42 AM on 27th October 2009

Gun crime has almost doubled since Labour came to power as a culture of extreme gang violence has taken hold.

The latest Government figures show that the total number of firearm offences in England and Wales has increased from 5,209 in 1998/99 to 9,865 last year - a rise of 89 per cent.
In some parts of the country, the number of offences has increased more than five-fold.
In eighteen police areas, gun crime at least doubled.

The statistic will fuel fears that the police are struggling to contain gang-related violence, in which the carrying of a firearm has become increasingly common place.
Last week, police in London revealed they had begun carrying out armed patrols on some streets.
The move means officers armed with sub-machine guns are engaged in routine policing for the first time.


Shadow Home Secretary, Chris Grayling, said last night: 'In areas dominated by gang culture, we're now seeing guns used to settle scores between rivals as well as turf wars between rival drug dealers.

www.dailymail.co.uk...

Gun crimes have increased in the UK, and at least Wales as well since the gun ban, and people like you after over a decade still can't understand why...

Your police officers didn't have to carry firearms BEFORE the gun ban, but now many of them have to.

Firearms, and the right to own them has no age, just like dictatorships still exist to this day, countries like the UK, and the U.S. can, and are slowly becoming dictatorships.

It is happening a lot faster in the UK simply because your people fell asleep, but your people are slowly waking up, not too long ago there was one of the largest, if not the largest, demonstration in the UK to restore the right to own guns and hunt in the UK.

Your politicians promised for years that fox hunting and owning firearms would not be banned and they wwent against their word. Likewise many other rights are being eroded by politicians, and their rich masters who want a One World Government with more draconian laws.

You obviously haven't watched this, so do yourself a favor and watch it.

www.youtube.com...

I was born in a country were citizens were, and are banned from owning weapons, and such country was completely transformed into socialism/communism, that same country to this day is one of the worst dictatorships in the world. That country is Cuba.

Anyway, back to the most important part, neither you, nor anyone else, not even Liberals and Democrats who like you are too brainwashed to think, you have no right WHATSOEVER to want to restrict ANY American from owning weapons...

Billions of people around the world would love to be able to defend themselves against dictators, warlords, jihadists, and socialist/communist guerrillas, among others which are killing defenseless people in several countries around the world.

edit on 15-12-2010 by ElectricUniverse because: errors



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 03:45 AM
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reply to post by kevinunknown
 


Its funny how the people who want to outlaw guns are so much less vocal about outlawing BATTLESHPS, TANKS, and NUCLEAR BOMBS. Perhaps we can start our way at the top and work our way down? And since governments have well proven them self to kill people using guns before the general population, don't you think its more important that they get rid of theirs first? At that point when all the battleships and tanks are gone, your argument for banning guns could be downgraded from monstrously authoritarian and tyrannical to patently ridiculous.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 03:50 AM
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Originally posted by mackey1224uk

Originally posted by silo13
Because - It's my right, that's why.

And I can assure you, when the ‘woop’ hits the fan? Who will most people be hiding behind?

The man or woman with the gun.

peace


In no way Im I mocking youre post. I just thought it funny when you signed off, Peace, when defending something designed to kill?


It makes perfect sense. In the American "wild west", guns seemed to keep people pretty peaceful in general. A lot of people carrying guns on their hip is the main reasons the "wild west" was orders of magnitude safer than today's inner cities. If we've got to have a government mandate about guns it should be that all sane adults should have one on their hip when out in public in crime-riddled areas. Guns are peace-keepers, and if I remember right, there are one or two actually called "the peacekeeper".



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 03:54 AM
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reply to post by Gradius Maximus
 


I once had to put up with two years and 4 months of living in Vancouver. I hated every moment of it. But you have very little gun crime compared to a proper city.

The only stupid regulation Canada has is the fact that you can not buy or wear a bullet proof jacket without permission. For example, the police can etc. How dumb is that.

In fact canada is a very safe country. I have never felt safer than in Canada. No one does anything remotely aggressively on a day to day basis and you all live in fear of the police there. So job done for the police. Your police have guns to use against YOU lot. But they go through training.

The average citizen is a moron and should not have a gun because they are just to stupid to know when to use it and how to use it safely. Not for them but for the public.


Does it make you feel big having your gun? I bet you have LMS - (little mans syndrome) thats why you feel the need for a gun.

In Vancouver you could just pop into Camouflage (your Muslim owned) shop and buy all manner of knives and swords. You can protect yourself with them. And you can carry one legally if you have the handle in plain sight.

Why can't you use a knife? Why do you need a gun? You could buy a crossbow. That can be lethal to any intruder. Personally, I would prefer my knife. If someone breaks in I want to maim them not kill them. You cant torture a dead man.

So enjoy your gun that you cant carry in public or have in your house unless its locked unloaded in a gun cupboard with ammo on the other side of the house.

You dont NEED a gun in Canada - you may need more straight men or a sense of humor but not a GUN.






edit on 15-12-2010 by c0ldPhr34k because: (no reason given)

edit on 15-12-2010 by c0ldPhr34k because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 03:54 AM
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Originally posted by c0ldPhr34k

Well my little Friend. Its a fact that gun crime in Canada has gone down. In fact you should know better coming from Vancouver. In that dump you call a town you have next to no crime except from the tiny amount of gangbangers from Richmond and Surrey. If you check the BC criminal statistics (which you can obtain from BC vital statistics) for the last 15 years you will notice (if you can read) that gun crime among other crimes has gone down dramatically. In fact it is what has actually been a positive for Vancouver and Canada as a whole.
...
Crime is DOWN in Canada from 15 years ago. Go check it out. GUN crime is down remarkably. No your fact before you flap your mouth beaver man


Really?... Why is it that Canada's violent crime rate has been DOUBLE than that of the U.S.?....


The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.
By James Slack
Last updated at 12:14 AM on 3rd July 2009

Comments (106) Add to My Stories

Britains violent crime record is worse than any other country in the European union, it has been revealed.
Official crime figures show the UK also has a worse rate for all types of violence than the U.S. and even South Africa - widely considered one of the worlds most dangerous countries.

The figures comes on the day new Home Secretary Alan Johnson makes his first major speech on crime, promising to be tough on loutish behaviour.

The Tories said Labour had presided over a decade of spiralling violence.
In the decade following the party's election in 1997, the number of recorded violent attacks soared by 77 per cent to 1.158million - or more than two every minute.
The figures, compiled from reports released by the European Commission and United Nations, also show:

The UK has the second highest overall crime rate in the EU.
It has a higher homicide rate than most of our western European neighbours, including France, Germany, Italy and Spain.
The UK has the fifth highest robbery rate in the EU.
It has the fourth highest burglary rate and the highest absolute number of burglaries in the EU, with double the number of offences than recorded in Germany and France.
But it is the naming of Britain as the most violent country in the EU that is most shocking. The analysis is based on the number of crimes per 100,000 residents.
In the UK, there are 2,034 offences per 100,000 people, way ahead of second-placed Austria with a rate of 1,677.



The U.S. has a violence rate of 466 crimes per 100,000 residents, Canada 935, Australia 92 and South Africa 1,609.
Shadow Home Secretary Chris Grayling said: 'This is a damning indictment of this government's comprehensive failure over more than a decade to tackle the deep rooted social problems in our society, and the knock on effect on crime and anti-social behaviour.

www.dailymail.co.uk...

I lived in Spain for 9 years and I knot that one main problem in most of Europe is that violent crimes are not as avertised as they are in the U.S., but ALL of Europe is more violent than the U.S...
edit on 15-12-2010 by ElectricUniverse because: errors.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 03:56 AM
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What a ridiculous topic. Criminals do not obey gun laws so why do you think banning guns would work at all? If they tried to ban guns good luck to them. There will be a rifle behind every blade of grass.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 03:58 AM
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reply to post by ElectricUniverse
 


We are talking about gun crime. And I said in my post that in the last 15 years Canada's crime has dropped. I never said it was worse than the US.


But now you have said its lower than the US I have to question where you got your info. The US has more gun crime than anywhere in the western world.

edit on 15-12-2010 by c0ldPhr34k because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 04:02 AM
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While I am a firm believer in the right to bear arms, I must admit I am starting to wonder why. Or better stated........why bother. We say its to protect us from tyrants yet we allow our government to takes our rights one at a time....all to protect us from "terrorists" or those horrible pot smokers.....or the enemy of the week. Just when will enough be enough? People speak like this enslavement is somewhere in the future....and have been saying the same thing for at least 50 years but it isnt.....its happening now.....and guess what........NO ONE is doing a damn thing about it other than bitching and moaning

I fear for the world my children and grand children will grow up in



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 04:02 AM
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Let me tell you why I have guns. Back in March I was driving on the freeway and was cut off by some A-hole. I honked and flipped him off, and then he gets next to me and points an AK-47 at me and laughs. I smile and back off and proceed to call 911. Rings once, twice, ten times, and I gave up at ring #20. I hang up and repeat the last sequence with the same results. Never got a call back from CHP or NOTHING. I will absolutely positively NEVER call 911 unless for a medical emergency. If someone breaks into your home, you will most likely be beaten, dead, or a hostage by the time the police show up. So that's why.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 04:03 AM
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Not to beat a dead horse but just to throw my two cents into the ring, I respectfully submit that the OP is not, nor ever has been an American citizen who has cherished and lived by the creed that the founding fathers of this country wanted for him.

The Second Amendment to the United States Constitution never was about duck hunting or target shooting but to be able to live in the pursuit of life, liberty and happiness as a free man should. To NOT be able to defend one's self against tyranny and oppression from a government who does not respect a man's right to free speech, a right against unreasonable searches and seizures, and to defend his nation against all oppressors, both foreign and domestic is an unrealistic and utopian suggestion.

With that said, yes, guns are made for killing. Whether it be venison for the table or from a crackhead who would rape my wife and daughter for the pocket change in the sofa, the gun is a tool, a means to an end. Not much different than a carpenter's hammer. Sure a hammer is a tool and yes, it can also be used for killing but can you imagine how different things would be if the Constitution guaranteed the right to keep and bear hammers?

I would imaging not much would change. Claw hammers might be okay but Ball peen hammers would be outlawed as they serve no useful nail pulling purpose. Most certainly sledge hammers over 3 pounds would be restricted to permits that could prove the usefulness and justify the extra power.

I hope the OP sees where I'm going with this, guns are just a tool. Yes, guns can kill innocent people, yes, guns can defend us from criminals, and yes, guns can defend us from an oppressive government but the bottom line is that guns are used responsibly by 99% of the American population without a problem.

Have you ever done a study on drunk driving homicides and the correlation to automatic transmissions? I would be willing to bet an automatic transmission in the hands of a drunk driver is more likely to kill a person than a manual transmissions. So what is the answer? Ban automatic transmissions? Hardly, stop drunks from driving. Right?

I for one, will echo Charleton Heston and say "From my cold dead hands..." I will not give up my weapons without a fight. I DO NOT want to rely on the local police, the FBI , Homeland Security or any other alphabet agency for my safety or security, just my self, my family and others I know and trust to know firearm safety and proper operation when the time comes it is needed.

Just because the UK caved in and outlawed guns is no rational reason why guns can not be lawfully owned and used in a country with the right to keep and bear arms. To suggest otherwise shows an ignorance that I can only assume is to bait ATS'ers into posting their positions to further classify and subdivide the American way of life.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 04:06 AM
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Originally posted by lastrebel
While I am a firm believer in the right to bear arms, I must admit I am starting to wonder why. Or better stated........why bother. We say its to protect us from tyrants yet we allow our government to takes our rights one at a time


Well said, Americans will never stand up for themselves to their own government. They act like they will but deep down they are two broken and scared to do so.

Everytime we hear of someone shooting a cop, everyone condemns it. But are they not the enemy NOW. They used to stand up for something but now they act as tyrannical monsters for the gov.

Americans are trying to hold onto the bill of rights and constitution. Fair enough. But they are already beaten. Whipped. To scared to fight back.



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