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US Sues School over Denial of Muslim pilgrimage

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posted on Dec, 14 2010 @ 10:40 AM
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This from a different article.

It sounds as though she had only finished one year of teaching before deciding to ask for the time.

I cannot believe that this woman didn't already have this in her mind when she signed the contract of employment with the school, and furthermore, why she didn't determine if she would be able to go before
beginning emplyment.

This is a "once in a lifetime" event. I cannot believe that she would just, on a lark after being hired, decide to take this trip, and it had to be Dec. 2008 haji that began on December 6., without asking about this in negotiating her employment.

Personally, I would not be planning the trip of a lifetime, that means so much to me as a devout person, without having foreknowledge of this plan one year prior.

Especially as a teacher, who would need to budget accordingly for three weeks of unpaid time off, as well as the travel costs.

Khan began teaching math at the district's McArthur Middle School in 2007. According to court documents, she wrote to the school superintendent in August 2008, asking for an unpaid leave from Dec. 1-19 that year to travel to Mecca on the pilgrimage.

The district denied her request, noting that the "purpose of her leave was not related to her professional duties," the Justice Department said. The legal challenge filed Monday states that "because Berkeley School District denied her a religious accommodation, the district compelled Ms. Khan to choose between her job and her religious beliefs, and thus forced her discharge."


www.aolnews.com...




posted on Dec, 14 2010 @ 10:54 AM
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reply to post by thegoodearth
 


Exactly, it's not like she didn't know. The Hajj isn't a spur of the moment event, it is to be taken once in one's lifetime if one has means, it's not supposed to interrupt your life.

I think that this is a completely bull lawsuit, it's not a thing that can't be postponed till a more suitable time, it's something that you can carefully plan for.



posted on Dec, 14 2010 @ 11:04 AM
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In my contract, it specifically states that the employer can grant leave if it is "operationally" feasible.

Which means that my leave can be denied or suspended if there are things that MUST be done (and I happen to be in the country). And isn't Dec 1 -> Christmas when all of the mid terms done?

Wouldn't it be operationally imperative that she be there?

Or doesn't the US have that kind of system?



posted on Dec, 14 2010 @ 11:38 AM
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Originally posted by lestweforget
The whole concept of a muslim in a position of teaching is worrying enough.
The only thing a muslim can be qualified for and would be willing to teach westerners honestly would be,
The quran.
How to convert to islam.
Sharia law.
How to hate.
How to find jews behind rocks.
How to eat spaghetti while wearing a burqua.
How to wipe your ars with your hand.


Really?! umm no.

My children have several teachers who happen to be Muslim and they are hands down the best math teachers they have ever had. Not only are they caring and kind, they work with the kids who need help.

Try to be original and not use the broad paintbrush.

Back on topic.

I get the feeling that this so called lawsuit is nothing more than whining and pouting and attention seeking on her part. If this was so important to her, she truly could have attended. You don't get bonus points for wanting to do something, you get them for actually doing what is important.



posted on Dec, 14 2010 @ 05:41 PM
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reply to post by juniperberry
 


That is my thinking as well-
Should the school district have to pay another "substitute" to come in for three weeks?
That won't be familiar with the students or their work?

It is hard to find substitute teachers now that can commit to that long of a stretch,
which also factors in the possibility of multiple subs that don't know the lesson plans,
aren't familiar with the students. therefore the students suffer as well.

I realize that subs have to come in and cover for a teacher from time to time, however,
to be honest, the longest I have ever seen a sub in for students (in my experience years ago,
and with my kids now) is when a teacher is on their maternity leave.



posted on Dec, 14 2010 @ 06:40 PM
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Seems to me that this is something that should have been brought up prior to accepting an offer of employment.

At any rate, aren't teachers off for 2-3 months in the summer? That would seem to me to be a good time to make a pilgrimage if one were so inclined.

I'm interested to see how this pans out.



posted on Dec, 14 2010 @ 07:04 PM
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reply to post by Darkrunner
 


As was explained before, the pilgrimage isn't just a do it whenever thing, it's done at a specific time of the year.

But saying that, it is something that can be done when convenient, I think personally it was a little presumptuous that she decided to try this only working there for a year.

She could have arranged this years down the road.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 04:17 AM
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My thoughts are that asking for time off to attend a once in a lifetime pilgrimage is not unreasonable....after all, we work to live and not the other way round. However, it seems unreasonable to me to make such a request less than a year after starting a new post, and even more unreasonable to resign and pursue a legal claim under these circumstances.

Since the religious obligation is only to do this once in a lifetime, as others have pointed out, there was no religious obligation to attend the pilgrimage that particular year, there was only a personal wish to do so.

To me it looks as though this person saw an opportunity to abuse the discrimination laws, and did so.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 06:34 AM
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Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by Darkrunner
 


As was explained before, the pilgrimage isn't just a do it whenever thing, it's done at a specific time of the year.

But saying that, it is something that can be done when convenient, I think personally it was a little presumptuous that she decided to try this only working there for a year.

She could have arranged this years down the road.


Well what day of the year is it supposed to be undertaken?



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 07:04 AM
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reply to post by Darkrunner
 

After careful research, the last month of the Calendar year.
However, the implications, if she wins this lawsuit will have implications on all businesses across the board, that will affect everyones life and day to day activites across the country.
If she wins this lawsuit, and they rule, then all businesses can be sued for failing to allow their employees time off to attend and follow through with celebrations of their faith,
That means, a devout catholic can, when say the pope died, request unpaid leave of absence, for the length of time, to go to Rome, to be there for the burial and the election of the new pope. People can demand Sundays off, and every religious holidays. Employers would have to be very well versed in all of the major religious events and festivals, along with the rising cost to cover for the temp workers or additional staff that would be required to cover for those days off, or be shut down during different times of the year. Think about it, this thing passes, could you not go shopping on Sundays, or when you really needed to? How about for major things, like EMS, would it be ok, if your house burnt down, cause the firefighters could not be there, as they were off for religious fesitvals?



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 07:05 AM
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reply to post by Darkrunner
 


It was explained in This Post

It's not a specific day, it's during a month, and because Muslims use a lunar calendar, the time for the Hajj is different every year.

Doesn't excuse the fact that she could have planned this much better, but at least we should all be aware of the real facts about what is going on here.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 09:07 AM
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reply to post by thegoodearth
 


This part is crazy

The government asked the court to order the school district to adopt policies that reasonably accommodate its employees' religious practices and beliefs, and to reinstate Khan with back pay and also pay her compensatory damages.

And who suffers here?
The school and the students.

Teachers have the most time off compared to any other profession, well maybe elected officials get more time off.
But in any case this will just have the school rethink on hiring muslims, and other schools in the area too i'm guessing.

The school should fight back against the Govt. as well as Chicagoers should fight back too.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 09:28 AM
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reply to post by ModernAcademia
 


The key words there were "reasonable accommodation" in my opinion, her request is not reasonable as she could have put in for the time off years in advance.

This is in my opinion a lack of proper planning on her pert.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 04:07 PM
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Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by Darkrunner
 


It was explained in This Post

It's not a specific day, it's during a month, and because Muslims use a lunar calendar, the time for the Hajj is different every year.

Doesn't excuse the fact that she could have planned this much better, but at least we should all be aware of the real facts about what is going on here.


Alright, fair enough.

Learn something new everyday. I wasn't sure if it was a particular date or time this pilgrimage was to be undertaken.



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 09:17 PM
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I found this online, I can't imbed the video, but this was discussed on Fox News yesterday, "Weihl of Justice" segment the first 4 minutes.

They aren't very sympathetic.


video.foxnews.com...



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 09:45 PM
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AG holder is an idiot,

that teacher is an idiot too.


the school has a right to deny her leave no matter what the reason.

the doj getting involved in this is crazy.

another attempt to get more privilege's for muslims.

suing for back pay and damages?



after she quit!
wow, imagine that as a precedent!



posted on Dec, 15 2010 @ 09:59 PM
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Originally posted by fooks
suing for back pay and damages?

after she quit!
wow, imagine that as a precedent!


Yes, I find this extremely troubling.
So now a person can resign over personal issues, and then sue for back pay and damages?

I have been trying to find out if this lady went on Haji or not, and where she now works, but it
hasn't come up in any of my digging.

Seems to me that would be two factors that would have been also covered in the news.



posted on Dec, 19 2010 @ 07:37 PM
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reply to post by thegoodearth
 


Well, I could go both ways on this, honestly.

Unpaid leave has nothing to do with school but paid leave might.

Guess that depends upon which she is asking for and School Administration's tolerance levels.

Of course our country being dominantly a Christian nation this is going to look bad.

With our economy being as bad as it is I am highly surprised anyone would try to get leave.

Unpaid or otherwise.

Then again I see all religions as a means to control populations through machinations.

No matter what denominations, country, or religion.

So, I read my Bible, and lead myself and ask none to follow.

Then again I do not allow any one religion to control me because I control my own actions.

As well as my own destiny regardless of what other think, say, or do.
edit on 12/19/10 by SpartanKingLeonidas because: Adding Depth and Insight Into the Post.



posted on Dec, 19 2010 @ 09:49 PM
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reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas
 


My question is...
what doors does this open,
and where does the "buck" stop?

If this lawsuit is won, then it opens up
a doorway that will result in millions of people
trying to get "in" on this, with many people
suing for being "forced" to work on Sundays,
Christian holidays, etc...

Then businesses (especially small businesses)
will be inundated with requests for time off for "religious" reasons...

That is, the ones who are able to still operate after paying all the back
pay and compensation to those that were "discriminated" against...
Just my opinion.



posted on Dec, 20 2010 @ 10:20 AM
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Based on the dates of Hajj, here is another way to look at this- Islam works on a lunar calendar, which is 11 days shorter than the Gregorian calendar. Every three years, Dhu al-Hijjah rotates back over a month. Though she wanted to do her Hajj in 2008, in twelve years, she could've gone during the summer months, when she is not at work, and would not have to disrupt the student's lesson plans for three weeks or force the school to look at multiple subsistutes. Since this is a once in a lifetime pilgrimage, and she is a young woman, this doesn't seem to be outrageous to me.



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