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another bad chemtrail video

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posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 11:22 PM
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This one, is just staggeringly bad, there is so much in this that is so laughable. If these people want to see who spreads "disinfo", they should just look in the mirror


edit on 12-12-2010 by firepilot because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 11:36 PM
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reply to post by firepilot
 

Well, I just saw a lot of planes from google earth, big deal! I live in the High Desert by Edwards Air Force base, and have been watching the sky and clouds for over forty years, and they haven't changed. This "chemtrail" myth is comical. Call me ignorant.



posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 11:42 PM
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Well thats exactly it, I was just commenting on the laughable content of this, just like every video they make. A 10 year old aviation enthusiast could tear this video apart.



posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 12:23 AM
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reply to post by firepilot
 


What do you call it when several planes throughout the day leave long cloud-like streams in the sky? These can be as long as a mile? Little over a week ago I saw 8 of these jets, and though I'm no expert they appeared to be spraying something. These contrails last for hours, and noticeably widen in the sky every 15 minutes until eventually dissipating.

What can you make of that? Easily explained, perhaps even laughable?
edit on 13-12-2010 by ThinkingCap because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 12:46 AM
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Multiple airplanes traveling in the same path? What is sinister about that? There are often hundreds of airliners up at the same time, sometimes going to the same places or along the same routes. Whats wrong with that?

You have not exactly looked an an aircraft high altitude nav chart, have you?

So what is the excuse for such bad info in chemtrail videos? They cant identify planes, they think an aircraft storage and scrapping facility with airplanes in long term storage, is somehow proof of a large chemtrail operation.



posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 02:56 AM
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reply to post by firepilot
 


You didn't listen to what I said. My reply wasn't about spotting several planes in one day. But I can see where this is going, in the "violently opposed" transition are we?



posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 04:57 AM
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reply to post by Xzorter
 

I may be the one who is ignorant but how it all started for me well..back sev. yrs. ago say late 90's
arrived to work early..looked up and saw what appeared to be a military jet flying low and releasing
some sort of trail..what it was, I do not know..now my memory is not good etc and I'm older but it was
not long afterwards, same day? that I noticed a grid pattern made of vapors being formed across the
sky..please tell me this is normal. If it was normal then why did I stand staring at it in awe?



posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 10:18 AM
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reply to post by ThinkingCap
 


You snapped at firepilot for pointing out the fact that airplanes will fly routes over your location. YES, even many, many. What you failed to comprehend is the meteorological reason for contrails:


These contrails last for hours, and noticeably widen in the sky every 15 minutes until eventually dissipating.


Once a contrail forms, it is for all intents and purposes INDISTUINGUISHABLE from a normal cloud. In the case of contrails, specifically cirriform clouds. Because of the altitudes where contrails form.


Aircraft condensation trails are a form of man-made cirrus. They can sometimes be seen in 'historical' films, to the delight of film buffs who enjoy spotting technical inaccuracies.

Cirrostratus is a fairly uniform sheet f thin cloud through which the sun or moon can be seen. Sometimes, if the cloud is thin, a bright ring of light (called a halo) surrounds the sun or moon. A layer or cirrostratus is often an indication of a deterioration in the weather.


Contrails, when they are produced, will either evaporate (sublimate) quickly, because the atmospheric conditions aren't sufficiently saturated with water vapor for them to remain...or, they will become "persistent", just as OTHER types of clouds, when formed, can also persist. Often, when you see them "spreading out" like that, it's because not only the contrails, but the regular and natural actions of the atmosphere are contributing to MORE cirrus cloud formation.

THIS is basic, basic meteorology.....



Want to know more? You can identify the flights you see, from our computer, if you just make the effort:

www.flightaware.com...

GO there. Look for the section that lets you track flights. Enter an airport near you (if you're in the USA). In orange area, left of screen, near bottom. Labelled "Airport Info". Click blue button labelled "VIEW ACTIVITY".

Look at real-time map of flights on active IFR flight plans. Enjoy. Compare to what you can see outside, with naked eyes. This site takes actual FAA radar data, and compiles it for display, for us, the users. Be advised there is an approximate 5-8 minute lag time that I've noticed, from paying close attention. You are seeing the positions of airplanes as they were about five minutes previously, so take that into account...but, it's as close to "live" as you can get, from your home computer.

Look at each airplane "target", to get the data block info for airline flight number, type, altitude, speed and departure/destination.

Note, also...for reference....in cruise flight, and at cruise speeds, a jet will cover anywhere between 6 to 8 miles per minute.

If you (or audience) aren't in the USA, but in Europe or the UK, there is this site:

www.flightradar24.com...

Presented differently, but like "Google Maps" you should be able to figure it out....

BOTH those sites, BTW, can be useful also when you know people who are flying, because you can monitor their flights...say, when you are going to meet them at the airport, for pickup , or whatever......(although FlightAware is better, for specific airplane, flight number, and flight plan information. Helps to interpret better, too, if you're a pilot....you'll get more out of the data).


edit on 13 December 2010 by weedwhacker because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 10:58 AM
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reply to post by firepilot
 

Here is a link that shows how contrails can appear to something else, like so-called "chemtrails".



Purely coincidental.




posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 11:45 AM
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Originally posted by Xzorter
reply to post by firepilot
 

Well, I just saw a lot of planes from google earth, big deal! I live in the High Desert by Edwards Air Force base, and have been watching the sky and clouds for over forty years, and they haven't changed. This "chemtrail" myth is comical. Call me ignorant.



You are ignorant, as per your request. Chemtrails are very real. Just because YOU don't seem them doesn't mean they don't exist. Millions of people see them everyday and are very aware that they are not natural contrails.



posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 11:46 AM
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reply to post by Stewie
 


You have to be freaking kidding me???

I have just been made aware of this group, "Calfornia Skywatch"...and they're just as nutty and ridiculous, ignorant and unscientific as all the rest of the "chemtrail" websites!!

"skywriting" has been around for many decades!! But, every generation of people, it seems, thinks that THEY are the first to hear of it!

It is just about the same thing as is used for airshows, for the "smoke" effects displays. It is a petroleum-based oil substance, designed to "burn dirty" and produce the smoke. It's about as innocent as fireworks smoke. ANY smoke, in sufficient density, is harmful of course....but, like fireworks, and your fireplace or campfire smoke, it dissipates quickly.

Honestly, the depths of ignorance displayed at "California Skywatch" are staggering....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Facts about "skywriting":


Skywriting is performed by a single biplane writing out each letter in "long hand" at altitudes of over 10,000 feet. Skywriting requires a blue sky background and negligible wind for best results. A short message of up to 6 characters can be repeated twice across the sky. Upon special request a heart, circle or other simple design may be written in the sky.

The letters are about a mile tall and the message may be as long as fifteen miles. The drifting smoke only retains a letter for at most 20 minutes so the message must be written quickly and without mistakes. The success of the mission is determined by several factors. First, the skill of the pilot. He must be both skilled and artistic.
From a company you can hire to "skywrite" your message for you


READ the Wiki Article:


The typical smoke generator consists of a pressurized container holding a low viscosity oil such as Chevron/Texaco "Canopus 13" (formerly "Corvus Oil"). The oil is injected into the hot exhaust manifold causing it to vaporize into a huge amount of dense white smoke.

Skywriting is never a permanent process. Wind and dispersal of the smoke cause the writing to blur, usually within a few minutes. However special "skytyping" techniques have been developed to write in the sky in a dot-matrix fashion, and are legible for longer despite the inevitable blurring effect caused by wind.
en.wikipedia.org...



Time for a boring video I found online:



And now, an exciting one!:



ALL at low altitudes, 10,000 feet and below. And, NONE ever are "persistent"...because they aren't clouds. They are pollution, really. Thin, wispy, diluted, and dissipate quickly.

Contrails are formed of WATER VAPOR that is present already, in the atmosphere...and water that is present in the jet fuel....water DOES NOT BURN as it goes through the heat of combustion, in the engines!! It comes out in the exhaust. IF the air is very, very dry, the HOT water vapor is never seen...in the COLD and saturated (high relative humidity) air, it can precipitate out AS ICE CRYSTALS, which is then seen as a contrail. CONDENSATION trail.

Nature ALSO makes clouds, all by itself, without any help from Humans and their airplane machines. But, the airplanes CAN make more clouds, too...sometimes they both COMBINE together, and last a very long time...because, CLOUDS WILL DO THAT!! Clouds can last for hours and hours and hours....or, didn't any of you notice that???

edit on 13 December 2010 by weedwhacker because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 11:50 AM
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reply to post by dplum517
 



Chemtrails are very real.


PROOF!!!

Mistaking normal contrails (which is what's happening...and it's NOT "millions of people" who think they're "chemtrails"!!). Billions of people see CONTRAILS, and 99.999% of them understand what they are.

It is only the fringe, uneducated, and barely literate that think they're "chemtrails"....in the sense of the word, as being "intentionally sprayed substances"...OTHER than normal jet engine exhaust vapor, and water vapor, forming ice crystals.



posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 02:21 PM
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Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by dplum517
 




PROOF!!!

Mistaking normal contrails (which is what's happening...and it's NOT "millions of people" who think they're "chemtrails"!!). Billions of people see CONTRAILS, and 99.999% of them understand what they are.

It is only the fringe, uneducated, and barely literate that think they're "chemtrails"....in the sense of the word, as being "intentionally sprayed substances"...OTHER than normal jet engine exhaust vapor, and water vapor, forming ice crystals.


Wow, really? By your statements alone I can see that YOU are the one who is uneducated and on the fringe. This isn't even an argument. I am right and you are wrong.
Chemtrails were invented by literate, educated, and intelligent scientists who want to Geo-Engineer the planet. If you don't know this already then you are a little behind.
If you want to reply back with some more insults, please do, I can take them all day. Otherwise if you are being PAID to post your disinfo on this site the please GTFO.



posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 02:56 PM
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reply to post by dplum517
 


You talk big, talk tough...and you have NO proof, whatsoever.

This is why I am confident....because I HAVE EXPERIENCE to know that "chemtrails" are bunk. What to you bring to the table? Experience wise? Reading those nut-case "chemtrail websites"??

The ones that take disconnected facts. like the types of studies...STUDIES, theories, ideas that have been discussed for a possible "geo-engineering" projects, and then present them to the ignorant who read their tripe, as "TRUTH"??

The "chemtrail" promoters lack any PROOF...as well as logic and comprehension...but mostly...where is the evidence??

There is zero....ZERO!

This is why people like me, who spent a career in aviation, and therefore happen to know how utterly ridiculous the entire "chemtrail" concept is, alternatively LAUGH at the idiots who spread this garbage...then get pissed OFF as it continues to infect the minds of the gullible.

Go right ahead, and "believe" all you want...waste money on books and DVDs on the "topic" too...but do not ever try to claim, to intelligent and educated and experienced people who know better, that "chemtrails are real"!!! It is bad enough that the sort of stupidity will be infecting others...until they (hopefully) take time to investigate properly, and learn reality.

Meanwhile, rest of us will continue to smile sometimes (at the most ludicrous claims), shake our heads in befuddlement at the ease by which people will follow any crackpot idea, and occasionally get angry enough to say it is time to stop the spread of ignorance and pseudo-science mumbo jumbo, when it continues to waste time and distract from REAL concerns.....


Back to the PROOF. This challenge has been presented quite recently, in several of the other currently running threads discussing "chemtrails". A summary:

  • Photos of the actual "spraying equipped" airplanes. Should be easy, since they have to LAND to get serviced. AND, that requires an AIRPORT

  • Describe the infrastructure for the support of this "operation". The delivery of the "substance" (whatever it is) that is being "sprayed".

  • Along with the above, describe where the manpower is coming from. The sheer number of MANHOURS needed is staggering. This means many, many people have to be involved. Don't forget about the pilots, too. There are rules about flight time limits, rest requirements, etc.

  • Describe the physics, and the math. Explain how "something sprayed" at over 30,000 feet --- the top of the troposphere, bottom of the stratosphere, depending on latitude and season --- can firstly, be of sufficient density to not become diluted in the three dimensions of air, on its way to the ground. (As claimed). OR, how sufficient material can be lofted, in a timely enough manner (see "manpower") to be effective in any way, considering the VAST area, in square miles or kilometers, to "cover".

  • Describe how environmental factors, such as prevailing winds, up/down drafts, all the conditions of upper level atmosphere, and its complexities, allow such an "operation", without causing a great deal of disruption,and uncertainty, to the "substance" being "sprayed".

    (I think you will get bogged down with bullet point #1, but the rest of those are for illustration...to show just HOW ludicrous the whole idea is.......)


    And, finally...some ATS housekeeping -- YOU do NOT tell me (nor anyone else) to "GTFO" as you so 'cleverly' put it, in order to evade the ATS censors.

    This isn't YOUR playground!

    (I do hope Mods will overlook the repeat of the offending acronym, as it was needed for context....)



  • posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 03:14 PM
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    reply to post by weedwhacker
     


    Sorry Weedwacker but I do not need to describe any of that to you because it is not my responsibility to do research for YOU. Get off your lazy butt and study the opposing side of the argument. I have researched and attempted to make sure what I was seeing was a contrail or a chemtrail.
    Since you can't even handle what you dish out I pity you greatly. YOU were the one who name called by lumping everyone into a large group of illiterate uneducated fringers. So don't act all offended because of some letters.
    Since you refer to this site as a "Playground" I can see you aren't serious about anything.
    BTW: The more you talk, the more you sound like you are a PAID agent to post you disinfo.



    posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 03:21 PM
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    reply to post by dplum517
     





    I am right and you are wrong.


    Good afternoon dplum.

    Can you please elaborate on your statement.

    Thanks ahead of time for the detailed, corroborated, scientifically backed explanation that will put this whole "chemtrail" debate to rest.



    posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 03:24 PM
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    Originally posted by dplum517


    Wow, really? By your statements alone I can see that YOU are the one who is uneducated and on the fringe. This isn't even an argument. I am right and you are wrong.
    Chemtrails were invented by literate, educated, and intelligent scientists who want to Geo-Engineer the planet. If you don't know this already then you are a little behind.
    If you want to reply back with some more insults, please do, I can take them all day. Otherwise if you are being PAID to post your disinfo on this site the please GTFO.


    Ahhh back to the old standard of accusing opponents of being paid government agents for disagreeing. Funny how that always seems to happen. I think its even against ATS rules too.

    And for us being uneducated, then how it is that us uneducated ones are always having to correct so much utterly wrong info from the chemtrail side. The chemtrail side cant identify airplanes, knows nothing about aviation, knows little to nothing about weather, has no idea about the atmosphere, and yet they are the ones who know more about it all?

    Just like in this silly video accusing an aircraft storage and scrapping operation of being a chemtrail base. But as with most any chemtrailer, you point out how A is wrong, and then go to B, then you point out how B is wrong, and they go to C, you point out how C is wrong, then they calling a government agent and go back to A.

    Yes sometimes clouds do cover the sky, even cirrus too. Just because airplanes flew one day, and then later on there was a cirrus cloud formation, does not mean planes cause that cirrus cloud.



    posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 03:28 PM
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    Originally posted by dplum517
    reply to post by weedwhacker
     


    Sorry Weedwacker but I do not need to describe any of that to you because it is not my responsibility to do research for YOU. Get off your lazy butt and study the opposing side of the argument. I have researched and attempted to make sure what I was seeing was a contrail or a chemtrail.
    Since you can't even handle what you dish out I pity you greatly. YOU were the one who name called by lumping everyone into a large group of illiterate uneducated fringers. So don't act all offended because of some letters.
    Since you refer to this site as a "Playground" I can see you aren't serious about anything.
    BTW: The more you talk, the more you sound like you are a PAID agent to post you disinfo.


    You could however do your research for you. However chemtrail research is laughable because it is so funny at times. The same debunked photos that chemtrailers put up time and time again, the navy E-6B doing a fuel dump gets put up here time and time again, as does the air sampling G-2 turboprop with FORWARD facing air collection tubes. And that French KC-135 photo really had them going

    Whats even funny is pranking the chemmies, because it is so easy, like that KC-10 video



    posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 03:35 PM
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    reply to post by firepilot
     


    Please don't assume what I have seen and have not seen. Also please don't tell me what research I have done and not done. You DON"T know. This is the problem with you disinfo agents is you can't have a logical debate. All you can do is explain everything away for which you know nothing of.

    Oh, and it's obvious you are working in pairs or teams since you came to weekwackers rescue. Really?? this is your life, your job? To lie and feed people full of half truths. How do you live with yourself?



    posted on Dec, 13 2010 @ 03:42 PM
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    reply to post by dplum517
     


    The problem with your argument is that they are not spreading dis-info, it doesn't take a genius to know a contrail is or how they are formed.

    The "chem-trail" nonsense was created by paranoid people and lapped up by more paranoid people.

    An aircraft's exhaust emissions aren't going to get you whilst you sleep.



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