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Raising Taxes On The Wealthy May Create More Jobs Than Lowering Them.

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posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 08:29 PM
I know that there is another thread containing similar topic matter but I wanted to offer another perspective and I felt it deserved it's own thread.

All of the evidence that i've seen clearly shows that tax cuts for the "wealthy" does not, in itself, create jobs. If it were so, why were 22 million jobs created under the Clinton era tax rates and only 1 million during the Bush years? Why didn't the Bush tax cuts result in millions of new jobs? It's because tax cuts for the wealthy and jobs are only coincidentally linked and one is not the direct result of the other. It's something that the wealthy would like to have you believe but it's just not true.

Just because a wealthy business owner is awarded a lower tax rate doesn't insure that he/she will elect to hire more people or expand their business. He/she may elect to take an extra vacation or just put the money in the bank, they do a lot of that you know. That's why rich people have bank accounts and poor people don't. The only mechanism that will accomplish this feat is to increase the demand for the product they are selling. When the demand for their product exceeds their ability to produce, they will consider expanding their business to accommodate the demand and in doing so they will hire new people. Although, in this "Free Trade" environment, you may have to move to China or India to get one of those jobs.

I'm beginning to contemplate the idea that raising taxes on the rich may produce more jobs than lowering them. Common logic tells me that if we're going to collect taxes, we must do so from where the money is and not from where it isn't. Under this line of reasoning, if the rich want to spread out the tax burden then they need to learn to spread the wealth as well. When the "few" control the vast majority of the nations wealth, it makes it extremely hard for the rest of the population to meet the revenue demands of our nations government.

Depak Chapra once gave a very enlightening lecture regarding the peril of hoarding or taking things out of circulation. It was fundamentally based on the idea that if everyone hoarded their money and refused to spend it, then eventually there would be no new money out there for them to acquire. Someone else once said that it's no sin to become rich but it is a sin to die rich.

Therefore, I putting up for debate, the idea that maybe we should tax the ultra rich proportionally according to the percentage of the nation's wealth they possess and not necessarily on their annual income. That way they have a choice to either spend it or get taxed for hoarding it. The 1.8 trillion that american corporations are currently sitting on isn't creating a single job so long as they refuse to spend it and giving them more money isn't going to change the situation.

On the other hand, these corporations could decide to opt for more of a win-win situation if they just chose to spend some of that money to increase pay and benefits for their current workers who would then pick up more of the nation's tax burden while at the same time spending their extra income creating the demand for more products and more jobs. The corporation would not only enjoy a lower tax rate but they would also have a happier, healthier and more productive workforce. So maybe, just maybe, we should tax the ultra rich to the point that hoarding vast amounts of money just isn't worth the trouble. I mean when is enough, enough?

In closing I would like to emphatically state that until such time that we as a nation demand legislation to mandate that products put up for sale in America be made in America, our jobs are not coming back, period. I mean, unless you're willing to work for the same wages as a worker in China, Mexico or India, it's just not going to happen. This "Free Trade" environment is the other job killing elephant in the room that no one is willing to talk about.

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 08:44 PM
Good post!

Here's my take.

The wealthy have shown themselves to be the innovators and entrepreneurs.
We all know these people strive to increase their wealth. But theres a big difference between doing that politically and doing it through the free market system.

We should raise taxes on the wealthy, and put a year or 2 ban on raising the CPI.
We should strive for innovation and I believe this would provide the incentive. An investment into the middle class would kick start this economy. And the longer it takes for "them" to see that, the more it looks like corruption.

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 08:46 PM
yes. this could be true.

you have to hire lots more irs agents, outfit them with equipment to do audits, searches & seizures, and make it possible to have federal government employees take property that does not belong to them.

also, you need to turn them into armed "agents" that are able to extract those private assets at the point of a gun, if need be: hasing_shotguns_no_really.html

the remington arms corporation will be working overtime to manufacture pump-action 12 guage shotguns for the tax collectors.

so yes, your thesis is correct.

taxing more creates more jobs.

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 08:52 PM
reply to post by Flatfish

What do wealthy people do with their money. The buy stocks
in China,Japan,Foreign oil companies,buy gold and silver,invest
in diamond minds,invest in foreign companies. None of that does
anyone in the USA much good.

The average person with tens of millions to spend does not risk it
all to start up a new company that he knows little about. If he wants to start up a company he borrows someone elses money.
Yours,from your bank. Well thats my 2 cents worth.

We should have a 99 percent inheritance tax.
Where wealth is hereditary power is hereditary -John Locke

edit on 11-12-2010 by RRokkyy because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 09:48 PM
Yeah this is the mistake all tax cut supporters make. In the past, when rich people had more money, that means there would be more enthusiasm to create or expand their businesses, which would be a godsend for anyone looking for work In America. But the problem lies in the fact that this is not the past. Everyone just about knows now that doing business in America is too expensive due to the multitudes of taxes and fees, and its future is not looking bright at all. There are far more opportunities arising in developing countries to create and develop businesses that target the same bracket of consumers that exist in America, and the best part about it is that you can offer those services or products and develop your industry at much cheaper rates. Businessmen will be businessmen. Their priority is to expand and innovate their company in order to reap that maximum amount of revenue for themselves, for their employees, and most importantly, for their shareholders. There is nothing wrong with that. But to expect patriotism from them, that is just ridiculous.

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 09:18 AM
reply to post by asperetty

Hence, my closing statement; "In closing I would like to emphatically state that until such time that we as a nation demand legislation to mandate that products put up for sale in America be made in America, our jobs are not coming back, period. I mean, unless you're willing to work for the same wages as a worker in China, Mexico or India, it's just not going to happen. This "Free Trade" environment is the other job killing elephant in the room that no one is willing to talk about."

"Free Trade" has allowed corporations to take advantage of the differences in the standard of living of developing nations against the more developed ones. You can say that it's taxes and regulation that make us uncompetitive but in reality it's the fundamental difference in our standards of living. That's why they are developing nations and we are a developed nation.

As time goes on and they become more developed, they too will demand a higher standard of living and environmental protections. At that point, their businesses will move on to the next developing nation leaving in their wake, a trail of nations with collapsing economies. The writing is on the wall for all to see.

The only real way to maintain our economic base is to demand "Sell It Here, Build It Here" legislation. In this global economy, it would be wise for every developing nation to demand similar legislation in order to protect their own economic base. Without it our manufacturing jobs are gone forever, plain & simple.

"Free Trade" is probably the most efficient job killing machine the american economy has ever seen. Import/export taxes were designed to help offset the difference between our standard of living and that of emerging economies in order to help keep the american worker on an even playing field with cheap foreign labor. Without these tax structures in place, the only way that the american worker can compete with cheap foreign labor is to lower our standard of living to one that is commensurate to that of the emerging nation.

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 09:43 AM
reply to post by MMPI2

Those jobs you're eluding to were created to collect taxes under our current tax structure from those who would evade paying their fair share. Also, I find nothing odd about the IRS purchasing shotguns in a time when the militia movement has exploded and we're finding headless corpses in the desert and all.

I keep hearing rich people say that the government is unjustly taking "their" money when in reality a large portion of the ultra wealthy sector of our nation got that way by evading taxes, hiding money overseas, flat out lying to investors like Enron did or just plain corruption.

I personally tend to not trust individuals who have amassed excessive wealth as much as I do those who have not. More often than not, excessive wealth is directly associated with greed, corruption and deceit. I'm not saying that all wealthy people are bad, just the majority of them.

edit on 12-12-2010 by Flatfish because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 09:52 AM
reply to post by RRokkyy

You are exactly right. My father in law, who was quite wealthy at one time, always told me that "you never use your own money to start a business, you use someone else's." I had forgotten about that until you mentioned it in your post. Thanks for reminding me.

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