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Walkom: Why Ottawa's new border scheme is such a loser

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posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 01:19 PM

Walkom: Why Ottawa's new border scheme is such a loser

The new scheme, set out in a confidential document entitled “Beyond the Border: A Shared Vision for Perimeter Security and Competitiveness,” is due to be formally announced in January.

Details remain unclear. But press leaks indicate that the aim is to fully integrate Canadian and U.S. border enforcement, particularly in the air and seaports that receive people and goods from outside North America.

Canada would also amend its immigration and refugee policies in order to bring them in line with those of the U.S.
(visit the link for the full news article)

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 01:19 PM
TSA controlling security of Canadian airports? US Immigration in control of seaports and the US.Canada border?

It's a step towards 'Fortress North America'.

Is this also one giant step towards becoming the official 51st State? What the heck does this mean if it goes through and the dominos start falling?

Will Canadian military eventually come under the jurisdiction of the Pentagon for convenience in responding to any future threats that are found?

For Canadian business lobbyists, the solution was, in effect, to let the U.S. extend its borders to the edge of North America.

If the Americans could control who and what got into Canada from abroad, it was thought, they would once again let our trucks breeze through from Windsor to Detroit.

And if we gave away more of our sovereignty in the process, the argument went, well so what?

So just what is going on here?!? Who is unravelling the threads on the wool sweater of Canadian self-determination? The multinational corporations? If that's the case, then we are no democracy, we're a corporatocracy (is that even a word?).

Somehow, knowing our present government, I can't help but think this is the ultimate aim.

Canadians, do you want to become Americans?
(visit the link for the full news article)
edit on 11/12/10 by masqua because: Removed contentious line... thought better of it

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 01:23 PM
I am in southern Ontario, and I can tell you nobody here will be happy about this.

Everyone is in flames about the TSA and scanners, and this will just add to the fire.

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 01:26 PM
Egads, this is a sorry commentary.
As a resident of Michigan, I do not look forward to the US attempt to beef up border controls and try to take over Canada's business.

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 01:27 PM
reply to post by gandhi

So am I, and I don't like the idea at all. We should have our own border control, by Canadian border guards and have jurisdiction over airports and seaports. What I'd really hate to see is some geared up private American security company taking on those jobs.

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 01:32 PM
This scares the s*** out of me.

Canada is also anticipating that the government of Mexico “may raise concerns about not being included in the vision,” the strategy says.

Canadians learned of the secret talks for a deal after leaks to the media this week.

Did the public ask for this?

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 01:41 PM
reply to post by worlds_away

This scares me too, if I didn't already feel left out of just about everything our government is doing:

Liberal public safety critic Mark Holland said it’s unacceptable that the Tories are trying to conduct such serious negotiations from “behind an iron curtain,” adding that the Conservatives should warn Canadians about their intentions. "When this government keeps you in the dark, it’s usually for a reason,” he said.

“This is a government that treats Canadians as children and tries to circumvent debate and feels they don't have enough knowledge to be consulted.”

Are we in a dictatorship or what?

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 01:52 PM
Another quote:

It also provides a rare insight into how the government regards Canadians: as a nation ignorant of the true scale of the security threat it faces and more concerned with privacy rights.


How are we, as citizens, supposed to make informed decisions on security threats when they are kept secret from us?!? They cannot have it both ways!

I would hope that we are more concerned with privacy rights than security threats. Unless of course they decide to share all of the info on specific security threats that they are privy to that we, the public, are not.

On a day to day basis, if you are more concerned with security threats than privacy rights you are living in fear of fear itself.

In Canada you have a greater risk of being killed by a drunk driver than being a victim of a terrorist attack. If the gov has info to the contrary and they are hiding it from the public... wtf?????

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 01:54 PM
reply to post by masqua

We will never be Americans. Our heritage is a proud one and our diverse culture is one of the most unique in the world. We have already accepted the fact that we must be tolerant of the world as a whole and willingly accept being part of the world community.

Our goal is peace, stability and keeping to our traditional morals of life and liberty for all. If establishing a stronger union with our neighbours to the south is a means to that end, then i see no problems with it and I am willing to be most Canadians won't either.
We will always be a Sovereign Nation even if we become a Union with the US and Mexico.

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 01:58 PM
Canada Surrenders Sovereignty and Privacy to U.S.

Canada: In Service To The Pentagon And NATO At Home And Abroad

Speaking recently at the launch of his epic book Earth Into Property: Colonization, Decolonization and Capitalism, which follows Dr. Hall’s critically acclaimed work The American Empire and the Fourth World, he told the gathering at Ben McNally's Bookstore, in downtown Toronto, that there is another side to the American dream.

“The other side of the invention of America as a New World has been the military, legal, cultural and psychological assaults on the Old World civilizations of the Indigenous peoples. Together these processes form a core component in the genesis of global capitalism.”

There is a suspicion that there are deals being signed in Cancun that are working towards ending National Souvenity as we know it .And as Harper may be talking about building deep sea ports in the north to keep it Canadian it sure looks like a capitalist project to steel the resources and pass along the start up costs to the rest of the country ....peace

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 02:07 PM

Originally posted by CanuckCoder
Our goal is peace, stability and keeping to our traditional morals of life and liberty for all.

Exactly... all Canadians, right?

If establishing a stronger union with our neighbours to the south is a means to that end, then i see no problems with it and I am willing to bet most Canadians won't either.

We'll see, won't we? As the announcemts are made and the deal signed before any debate is carried out in our parliament, I'm sure some eyebrows will be raised as they were when parliament was prorogued to squash debate on the Afghan Detainee issue. Remember how the whistleblower was treated by our feds? Remember how the inquiry was torpedoed?

Some think all of Canadians are sheep, but I don't believe that to be the actual case.

We will always be a Sovereign Nation even if we become a Union with the US and Mexico.

Yes... of course. With a private American security company like Blackwater Xe watching our population, the US Coast Guard our harbours and US Immigration/TSA in our airports, it may all go swimmingly well. All polite and stuff. I'm sure Vic Toews and John Baird would agree.

I know I'm speculating, but how long do you think American interests are going to be second to Canadian interests in these areas? And how long before our government completely toadies up to the will of POTUS?

edit on 11/12/10 by masqua because: sp

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 02:29 PM
reply to post by the2ofusr1

Thanks for that. It certainly clears things up regarding this topic:

Bill C-42, An Act to amend the Aeronautics Act would require Canadian airline carriers that fly over the U.S. to provide the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) with passenger information. This includes name, date of birth, gender, as well as passport and itinerary details when applicable. Airlines landing in the U.S. already have to supply this information, but allowing personal data to be shared on passengers who are only flying through American airspace essentially shreds existing Canadian protection and privacy laws. Bill C-42 complies with the Transportation Security Administration’s (TSA) Security Flight Program which would take effect globally at the beginning of next year. Most Canadian commercial flights pass over the U.S. while en route to Latin America, the Caribbean and Europe which in many cases would give the DHS the final say on who is allowed to travel to and from Canada.


Explanatory Notes

Aeronautics Act
Clause 2: Existing text of subsection 4.83(1):
4.83 (1) Despite section 5 of the Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act, to the extent that that section relates to obligations set out in Schedule 1 to that Act relating to the disclosure of information, and, despite subsection 7(3) of that Act, an operator of an aircraft departing from Canada that is scheduled to land in a foreign state or of a Canadian aircraft departing from any place outside Canada that is scheduled to land in a foreign state may, in accordance with the regulations, provide to a competent authority in that foreign state any information that is in its control relating to persons on board or expected to be on board the aircraft and that is required by the laws of the foreign state.

Secure Flight

Secure Flight, the Transportation Security Administration’s (TSA) behind-the-scenes watch list matching program, fulfills a key recommendation of the 9/11 Commission by assuming responsibility of watch list matching from individual airlines. By establishing a consistent watch list matching system, Secure Flight enhances aviation security and more effectively facilitates air travel for passengers.

Secure Flight requires airlines to collect a passenger’s full name (as it appears on government-issued ID), date of birth, gender and Redress Number (if applicable). By providing complete information, passengers can significantly decrease the likelihood of watch list misidentification. Secure Flight watch list matching takes a matter of seconds to complete, and providing this data enables passengers to print their boarding passes at home or at an airline kiosk.

So, if I'm flying directly to Cuba from anywhere in Canada, I guess the Americans need to know everything about me.

Then the backscatter/TSA patdown and all in Toronto International Airport.

Woo hoo!

edit on 11/12/10 by masqua because: bb code

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 02:32 PM
Personally I think there is another way to look at this. Canada is a Common Wealth Country; where as the United States for all intents and purposes functions as a Common Wealth Corporation.

Albeit it appears that the U.S. is in the dominant position, when it comes to the pecking order of the neighbors, but is this simply another way to consolidate Common Wealth Holdings while giving the people of the United States the illusion that we are an independent nation, by creating an illusion of dominance over Canada in the consolidation of the holdings.

As an American long concerned regarding English and foreign ownership of the American Infrastructure and States from a contractual standpoint, this could also be viewed as a weakening of America’s own illusionary sovereignty in my opinion.

Seems like a loss for Canada technically on the surface, yet it could be a great loss for Americans as the Crown itself begins consolidating its own holdings on the march to a one world government through consolidations and amalgamations.

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 02:34 PM
FanS Masqua
it just goes to show what the awake have been saying all along
the government we elected are just banana republic stooges for the G20

I wonder where the billion dollars plus from the G20 meeting was actually spent?

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 02:45 PM

Originally posted by masqua
Are we in a dictatorship or what?

Given the ignoring of Parliament and the Supreme Court, G-20 excess, and proroguing...I'd say we're well on our way.

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 02:50 PM
Many Canadians would rather die fighting against this than see it come to fruition.
The die however, is cast.We WILL be part of something together soon like it or not.
The sure thing is Canadians will get the #ty end of the stick in this deal as they did in NAFTA>
The US will then treat canada like its bannana republic, and extract every bit of natural resources we possess for the betterment of the USA.
Water, OIL, Metals and minerals, would all be going south at bargain prices.
While canada would get the immigration problems of all the southern border states combned.
We would become a dumping grounds for US atomic wastes and even their garbage.
Whatever form this unionn takes, wed better recieve full citizens rights of a US citizen at the outset, including the 2nd amendment!

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 03:00 PM
reply to post by stirling

The only way this could even be slowed down is if we held an immediate election and put some really off-beat political party in power, because if it was the Liberals or NDP that took charge, the same end result would happen.

Gilles... here's the chance for Quebec to actually run the whole country.

Either that or Elizabeth, the chipmunk from the East Coast

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 03:04 PM
It isn't America I fear
its the controllers of america
they are not a nice bunch
and they will manipulate and do what ever they have to do to accomplish their ends.
which can only be as good for Canadians as it was for the Canadinas that were killed in the

Remember the big power outage we shared a couple years ago
and certain Americans were screaming
Canada Canada Canada
When it turned out to be ohio ohio ohio

we can expect more of the same I'll wager

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 03:07 PM
One of the things that I found hard to understand and got me is TPTB's ability to move their agenda along .I found a article on Countercurrents by Michel Chossudovsky "Manufacturing Dissent": The Anti-Globalization Movement
Is Funded By The Corporate Elites
It is well worth a read but hard to imagine how we as citizens could come up with any sustained counter to what they seem to be trying to pull off ....interesting times for sure .....peace

I live in NB and would love to vote bloc

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 03:08 PM
reply to post by masqua

Originally posted by masqua

Are we in a dictatorship or what?

Welcome to OUR nightmare, where the government goes against the wishes of its citizens and/or decides things behind closed doors...or buried in thousands-page legislation that no one had read.

edit on Sat Dec 11 2010 by DontTreadOnMe because: (no reason given)

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