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Agent Provocatuer's at ATS?

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posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 04:27 PM
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With all of the posts I have been reading about Wiki Leaks and Julian Assange, I have come to notice that there is a faction of people on this bb that are not just trolling, but are actually appearing to try to cause more trouble by posting in such a way that is very undermining.

Those I am referring to hit and run...like a troll, but their writing is more intelligent and their words are well placed.
When asked to cease their "trolling" they continue on in such a manner as to "egg" their mark on. They spread negativity when optimism may be the goal of the thread.

I realize this sounds like trolling, and personally I will not reply to trolls (if that is what they really are)...but has anyone else noticed this and if so, your thoughts.




posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 04:30 PM
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As an agent provocateur being paid for my services, I can confirm there are indeed agent provocateurs on ATS.

~



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 04:32 PM
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I'd better not say anything either.




posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 04:59 PM
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Originally posted by AnteBellum
I'd better not say anything either.



Thanks for the reply...or at least the read. I hold no fear of anyone that may or may not be watching or taking notes...I have Never Run Away from anything and will not start now.

Only asked this question to find out if anyone else had noticed what it appears is going on.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:03 PM
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There have been many threads on this in the past. I will tell you that yes, they are here, but you will not get much else from most people. Either they'll make a joke of it, derail the thread, or they will start with the personal attacks.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:03 PM
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Yes they are here and have been for months if not years. Big Brother watches all.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:11 PM
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Originally posted by kennylee
Yes they are here and have been for months if not years. Big Brother watches all.


Yes I have noticed them. What seems to be the case is that they 'assign' themselves to specific topic areas - and appear with regularity on pretty much all of the threads relating to that specific topic. The motive seems to be to derail and divert the thread, yes, but also to prevent creative discussion through stonewalling people under the guise of discussion - perhaps to prevent unity through creative discussion by constantly baiting those on the thread. I agree that not engaging with them is the best tactic.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:13 PM
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reply to post by Holly N.R.A.
 


I did the same post here www.abovetopsecret.com... maybe chekc it out for more replies, there is a lot on the link, I was surprised by the amount of responces.

Yup, agents and their more modern form of data gathering/dis-information is strong on ATS but there is not much you can do. I plan on avoiding ATS just for this reason, this is not a site where people speak their mind, its a place where some people are told what to say.

Agent provocateurs are not too common, more common is trolling, some bizarre Israeli lobby software system and dis-info agents, ie they say others say 9/11 was done by space beams therefore truthers are crazy. The real problem is the limits of debate and a military industrial complex backed by millions of dollars.

Peace,

PS, the real problem is the BBC not having any integrity and holding people to account, history shows the MSM has failed and that internet activism is piecemeal.

PPS 9/11 was an inside job.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:21 PM
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To label someone an "agent provocateur" is simply a method to attack someone you don't agree with--with no evidence whatsoever. It usually takes the form of, "My words are so brilliant and my views so important that no one could possibly disagree with me, therefore if you do, you must be an agent provocateur." It also has the much desired effect of putting the person on the defensive, kind of like calling someone a 'child molester.' He then is effectievly de-railed, at least for a time, while answering the charges rather than sticking to the topic at hand. In other words, it's a way to deflect the issues, not paerticularly brilliant, in my view, and saying more about the accuser than the accused.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:27 PM
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reply to post by schuyler
 


I disagree whole-heartedly. There are those who throw the term around loosely. There are others, like myself, who study the patterns and styles of these posts.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:33 PM
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I hit and run on a fair portion of the wikileaks threads. But I have my reasons: In a world of meme warfare, guerilla fighters are needed.

Have you ever been in a relationship, romantic or otherwise, where your instincts kept screaming that you were being deceived and manipulated but you had no concrete proof? You wanted to trust your lover/friend/business partner but your subconscious wouldn't stop nagging you until the cold hard truth came out.

The strong circumstantial evidence is there to be read but our need for a world hero has blinded many.

There are OPs on here full of information that raise serious questions about the trustworthiness of wikileaks and their agenda. So that aspect is available.

I feel it's my duty to raise the issues that keep screaming at me that wikileaks is a tool of something that has no concern for you or I. You don't feel like your opinions have been manipulated at all? I do.

Don't hate us hit-n-runners. Most are only trying to look out for you.








edit on 10-12-2010 by The GUT because: clarification



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:36 PM
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Originally posted by Whyhi
As an agent provocateur being paid for my services, I can confirm there are indeed agent provocateurs on ATS.

~


You're getting paid? Geez, and here I am, doing it all for free! Could you hook a brotha up with a point of contact with your finance department??



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:37 PM
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reply to post by schuyler
 


To label someone an "agent provocateur" is simply a method to attack someone you don't agree with-

But what happens when someone IS an agent provocateur - what do you suugest?



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:38 PM
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Originally posted by captaintyinknots
reply to post by schuyler
 


I disagree whole-heartedly. There are those who throw the term around loosely. There are others, like myself, who study the patterns and styles of these posts.


Do you seriously think that a real agent provacateur would not be well trained enough to defeat any "styles and patterns" you think you see? How can you tell? Do they use semi-colons more often than other people? Is there an official "Chicago Manual of Style for Agent Provocateurs" that they simply must follow or face expulsion from the Agent Prvocateur Guild? I'm quite sure some people throw a stick at the hornets nests for fun, but it doesn't follow that you can mysteriously detect a paid provocateur because of some imagined styles and patterns. Plus it begs the question of why. ATS is extremely good at subverting its own self and does not require help to do it.


But what happens when someone IS an agent provocateur - what do you suugest?


What if someone really IS an alien? What if Hillary IS a reptilian? What-if questions are difficult to answer because they depend on unproven assumptions and conjecture and are too often absurdities. My suggestion is that if you're going to claim someone is an agent provocateur you need to have some clear evidence that this is the case, not some secretive intuitive feeling. The accusation is usually used as an ad hominem attack and has no basis in reality whatsoever. A REAL agent provocateur is surely intelligent enough to realize no action is the best action.

edit on 12/10/2010 by schuyler because: answer second question



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:43 PM
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Originally posted by captaintyinknots
reply to post by schuyler
 


I disagree whole-heartedly. There are those who throw the term around loosely. There are others, like myself, who study the patterns and styles of these posts.


Bingo, captain....there is a big difference in those that allow their "Ego" to be threatened and those that can actually see what is going on. It also comes down to intent...those that see what is going on are not "intent" on just salving a bruised ego...they are looking more for truth and will not accept the "games" these provocateurs are attempting to force on them.

We're not going to play their game...but we will say what we must.

Thanks to you too yyyyyyyy for the link to your post. some interesting stuff there too.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:45 PM
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Originally posted by schuyler

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
reply to post by schuyler
 


I disagree whole-heartedly. There are those who throw the term around loosely. There are others, like myself, who study the patterns and styles of these posts.


Do you seriously think that a real agent provacateur would not be well trained enough to defeat any "styles and patterns" you think you see? How can you tell? Do they use semi-colons more often than other people? Is there an official "Chicago Manual of Style for Agent Provocateurs" that they simply must follow or face expulsion from the Agent Prvocateur Guild? I'm quite sure some people throw a stick at the hornets nests for fun, but it doesn't follow that you can mysteriously detect a paid provocateur because of some imagined styles and patterns. Plus it begs the question of why. ATS is extremely good at subverting its own self and does not require help to do it.


Do you seriously think that COINTELPRO isnt involved in every major message board out there? Really? They admit they are on Facebook and the such...why is it a stretch that they are here?

As for patterns, it has nothing to do with writing style, and your asinine attempt to divert this topic is pathetic.

I also never stated anything about a mysterious ability to detect them. So again, quit with the pathetic diversions and attack tactics. Trying to spin this to make me look bad does not help your argument(and is an interesting tactic to immediately jump to , I might add).

I'm not going to sit here and argue this with you, you have obviously made up your mind already. Nobody is watching, nothing to see here. Carry on.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 05:49 PM
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reply to post by captaintyinknots
 



Do you seriously think that COINTELPRO isnt involved in every major message board out there? Really?


Could be partially answered with the quote below if you replaced ATS with any conspiracy group.


ATS is extremely good at subverting its own self and does not require help to do it.


It's not very hard for a conspiracy that has it's foundations in pseudoscience, misunderstanding, and just bad thinking skills to derail itself with more pseudoscience and misunderstanding combined with more faulty reasoning and a lack in critical thinking.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 06:11 PM
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I've been lurking here for months, with nothing much to say that was worth the time to say it. But I noticed this too, and was almost passionate enough about it to make a post of my own.

After having seen several posts of suspect intention, one particular one caught my eye--the one that goes: "What are your three strongest arguments for 9/11 being an inside job?" (or words to that effect). And it occurred to me that if the Administration were tasking agents with getting to the nub of "conspiracy theories" so that they could counter them on the "official story" .gov websites, this would be the way to go about it.

And ATSers falling all over themselves to give them the answers. Jebus Crossbroken Christ, people....



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 06:16 PM
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reply to post by Ex_CT2
 

Oh, sorry. I misunderstood your thrust, OP. Never mind.

Still, I meant what I just said.



posted on Dec, 10 2010 @ 06:21 PM
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Originally posted by captaintyinknots
Do you seriously think that COINTELPRO isnt involved in every major message board out there? Really? They admit they are on Facebook and the such...why is it a stretch that they are here?


I never said that. My contention is that a) You don't know one way or another despite your claim to "study" the issue. I don't think you could correctly identify an agent if you tried. You certainly have not proven you have any expertise in the matter; you've just tooted your own horn. b) ATS needs no provocateurs because it is nuts enough in its own right, and c) People may be listening in, but I doubt they are actively promoting any particular point of view. That's normally not their job.

If anyone is listening in, such as the NSA, here's how it works. An automatic sweep of the site is made and interpreted by pattern recognition software. If the software gets a hit because I've said something like, "Hey! NSA! Over here bud!
" then it gets a second level of analysis. If there is a statistical probability that there might be something there it goes to an analyst. This analysis is done by either a) a low level enlisted person in the armed forces (E-4, E-5, maybe E-6) who works at a NSA facility in some place like Fort Gordon, or b) a contractor working under contract for the armed services who hires the very same E-4-E-6 folks who have completed their enlistments, or c) the NSA itself whose recruits are, you guessed it, the same folks. Those analysts, normally 20-26 years old, will take one look at a thread like this and say, "These guys are nuts. Next." That's how it is done. I doubt seriously that they get anything relevant from ATS at all because nothing here is particularly threatening. You can bet your bottom dollar they are much more interested in militia boards than here because those guys are seriously scary and (could) represent a real threat to national security.

REAL "agent provocateurs" do not mess with aliens, ufos, and oh, my god, WikiLeaks low brow nonsense. They are involved in stuff like coaxing real jihadists who are up to some serious explosive plotting into betraying themselves before they look up their 72 virgins. They are listening in on some insurgency group as they talk on their cell phones. They are lookinmg for 'actionable' intelligence. That is vastly more important than jawing with a bunch of conspiracy nuts over the "facts" of cities on Mars, the Illuminati/NWO take over, and 2012 as end of world.



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