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16 year old caught in Holland for hacking paypal and mastercard

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posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:24 PM
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reply to post by gift0fpr0phecy
 


For the companies involve I agree it might be a buisness decission, but paypal did it because thye were pressured by the US government.



PayPal's vice-president of platform, Osama Bedier, told an internet conference the site had decided to freeze WikiLeaks' account on 4 December after government representatives said it was engaged in illegal activity

Source: The Guardian

What illegal activity?
Why no charges?

And do you not think corporations should have any kind of morale other than making money?




posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:29 PM
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Last I checked deliberately interrupting a business is a crime pretty much anywhere, good on Holland for not taking a weak stance on computer crime. If the kid is smart enough to take part in the attacks then he should at least be aware of the risks associated with it. I look forward to more stories like this as these anti-social miscreants face the music for their actions; two wrongs don't make a right after all!



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:35 PM
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reply to post by SkurkNilsen
 


I'm 16 and if I was pretty skilled in the hacking field I'd do anything I could to help get this information out to the public.
I think it concerns some of us teenagers a lot, we are the ones that will be living our future lives in a world built in a cage if we don't do anything about it. Good on him for risking his freedom to help the masses.

Some say it was an immature decision. Who are you to say if it was an immature decision? Have you met the kid?
I don't like how people judge others on their age.

Cheers
Brady



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:37 PM
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reply to post by ThePyramidAgenda
 


Nothing Anon is doing right now is helping to get information out, they are merely being reactionist and going after people who have refused to provide services to Wikileaks, instead of perhaps setting up the necessary services to keep Wikileaks running.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:39 PM
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I am guessing that the most this kid did was click the button that downloaded the program that turned his computer into a bot. The program did the rest, attacking whatever sites the programmers or controllers chose to target.

So little effort on his part -- probably little thought about what it would actually do. Certainly the bot, once on his computer, is out of his control.

Guilty of immaturity at best. I also came upon a site earlier today with that little button on it. Experience in life told me this is not a thing to do. That kid has no such experience to go on.

Even tho I didn't personally give over my computer to this cyber warfare, I am glad it is being done. This is the first concrete action taken by ordinary people against the controlling class. This is a good thing.

A very good thing. If we don't fight now to preserve freedom of speech when will we? Ever? Now is the time.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:39 PM
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Paypal has been the target of several investigations.. I doubt there was any pressure by the US Gov for the assange/wiki garbage. The last thing I heard discussed at a certain place was the fact that paypal was holding seller funds in escrow and getting the interest in pocket. The illegal activities youre hinting at are along those lines.

Paypal is an independent private business. They can deny service to or for whomever they want. Thats their right. I wonder just what kind of patriots some are who seem to be cheering illegal activities being done against a business exercising its rights and doing what the heck it wants to do with its own business.

The fact is that wiki is providing access to a stolen item. Several laws have been broken.. federal laws. If there were any further charges made against wiki... paypal and other companies are smart to exercise their rights to choose not to be involved in anything illegal. What this kid and others are doing against private businesses is ILLEGAL. Wanna be script kiddie hackers pretending they are in a movie and thinking nothing can be traced back to them due to the all powerful proxies.. well, they get exactly what they deserve not only for the illegal activity, but for their stupidity.


Im starting to wonder about some of you...



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:41 PM
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reply to post by SkurkNilsen
 


Do you know anything about PayPal? PayPal has a history of freezing accounts it thinks are involved in illegal activities. In fact, many false alarms even happen with PayPal and eBAY. They hold payments and money of normal innocent people if they have even the slightest concern about illegal activity. There is an entire website(s) dedicated to PayPal complaints:

paypalcomplaints.org...

paypalcomplaints.org...

paypalcomplaints.org...

This is because PayPal, in the past, was used for many frauds and illegal activities, and they have strengthened their security and rules to prevent it. Sometimes they even act on innocent people because of false alarms, causing complaints.

If the government goes to them and tells them a certain account may be involved in illegal activities, you better believe it that PayPal will hold those funds until further notice. It's not just for Wikileaks, it is for EVERYONE.

Punishing PayPal for taking the safe route is just moronic.


Originally posted by SkurkNilsen
What illegal activity?


Receiving stolen property. Publishing knowingly classified documents. That is illegal.


Originally posted by SkurkNilsen
Why no charges?


I don't know yet.


Originally posted by SkurkNilsen
And do you not think corporations should have any kind of morale other than making money?


That is a different topic. Yes, I think companies should have morals. However they shouldn't trample on freedoms either.




edit on 9-12-2010 by gift0fpr0phecy because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:44 PM
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Originally posted by Helig
reply to post by ThePyramidAgenda
 


Nothing Anon is doing right now is helping to get information out, they are merely being reactionist and going after people who have refused to provide services to Wikileaks, instead of perhaps setting up the necessary services to keep Wikileaks running.


How do you know what Anon is doing and not doing?
How many Anonymous is setting up mirrors?



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:46 PM
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Originally posted by gift0fpr0phecy
reply to post by SkurkNilsen
 


Do you know anything about PayPal? PayPal has a history of freezing accounts it thinks are involved in illegal activities. In fact, many false alarms even happen with PayPal and eBAY. They hold payments and money of normal innocent people if they have even the slightest concern about illegal activity. There is an entire website(s) dedicated to PayPal complaints:

paypalcomplaints.org...

paypalcomplaints.org...

paypalcomplaints.org...

This is because PayPal, in the past, was used for many frauds and illegal activities, and they have strengthened their security and rules to prevent it. Sometimes they even act on innocent people because of false alarms, causing complaints.

If the government goes to them and tells them a certain account may be involved in illegal activities, you better believe it that PayPal will hold those funds until further notice. It's not just for Wikileaks, it is for EVERYONE.

Punishing PayPal for taking the safe route is just moronic.





ALSO,
They are also holding funds of new sellers.. people who havent established a track record. The seller has to send out the item before funds were being released by paypal .... said to protect the buyer.. and sellers rose up and tried to get a lawsuit going against paypal not too long ago as well
They also didnt read the TOS they agreed to to use Paypal and had no lawsuit. If people would simply read and actually inform themselves.. well, you see what Im saying.

There are A LOT of issues with PP ... and the fact is that they have absolutely NOTHING to do with the nefarious and all powerful govt telling them to not allow funds to be transfered to wiki..



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:49 PM
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Originally posted by Advantage
Paypal has been the target of several investigations.. I doubt there was any pressure by the US Gov for the assange/wiki garbage.


Well, Paypals vice-president does not agree:




PayPal's vice-president of platform, Osama Bedier, told an internet conference the site had decided to freeze WikiLeaks' account on 4 December after government representatives said it was engaged in illegal activity. "On November 27th, the state department, the US government basically, wrote a letter saying that the WikiLeaks' activities were deemed illegal in the United States and as a result our policy group had to make the decision of suspending the account," Bedier said


Source: The Guardian



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:53 PM
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Originally posted by SkurkNilsen

Originally posted by Advantage
Paypal has been the target of several investigations.. I doubt there was any pressure by the US Gov for the assange/wiki garbage.


Well, Paypals vice-president does not agree:




PayPal's vice-president of platform, Osama Bedier, told an internet conference the site had decided to freeze WikiLeaks' account on 4 December after government representatives said it was engaged in illegal activity. "On November 27th, the state department, the US government basically, wrote a letter saying that the WikiLeaks' activities were deemed illegal in the United States and as a result our policy group had to make the decision of suspending the account," Bedier said


Source: The Guardian


Uhm.. that agrees with exactly what I just said...



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:54 PM
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reply to post by gift0fpr0phecy
 


you are entitled to your opinion, but imo it's also moronic to be a coward supporting TPTB.

So let's just agree to disagree as there are no definite answer to this question.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:56 PM
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reply to post by Advantage
 


And how is it not pressure?
If something illegal was taking place there would allready be a case against wikileaks.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:56 PM
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ok look... real real simple.

Wiki is "selling" illegal goods. They have violated federal law. PP cant do business with a place that is violating federal law unless they want to be brought into it. NO normal business person wants to be brought into this BS. They and the CC companies were smart in stopping invilvement with it. They were nto "pressured" into it as you are hinting at. The federal govt whos laws were violated told EVERYONE.. NOT just PP.. that it was illegal. Tney have the choice if they want to be involved in it or not. As you can see, not too many fools want to deal with the BS out of wiki being flung back on them. They are not allowing their business to be used in support of illegal activities.

Gee.. seems pretty simple to me.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 05:00 PM
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Originally posted by SkurkNilsen
reply to post by Advantage
 


And how is it not pressure?
If something illegal was taking place there would allready be a case against wikileaks.


Are you serious.. ???

you havent looked into this very deeply have you?

If wiki was on US soil.. it'd be under wraps already. Believe it or not we cant just bust into another country and impose our laws on their citizens or businesses.. in case you didnt know.. its in Solna Sweden.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 05:04 PM
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reply to post by Advantage
 

I have to do some research on the illegality of wikileaks and what laws have been broke before I check back on you, but now it's night time over in Europe.

My main point is still that atacking these sites is a good thing no matter if what wikileaks is doing is legal or not, this is our time to strike back on those that have lied to us and sent us to wars under false pretence (if that's not illegal it should be). If that means we have to react to those supporting TPTB in their insanity, so be it.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 05:07 PM
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There is a thread on this already in the same forum. It's really annoying to see doubles all the time. It helps to look at the recent posts and the firehouse to see what has already been posted.

www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 05:08 PM
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reply to post by SkurkNilsen
 


Who, in your opinion, is "supporting TPTB"? Anyone who doesn't want to be involved in illegal activity?

PayPal freezes accounts if there is even the slightest hint of illegal activity. Heck, my account got frozen once because an object I sold had shipment problems and the buyer thought I was trying to con him out of money. When the shipment arrived my account was back to normal.

If the government, or anyone for the matter such as a buyer on eBay suspects illegal activity, and they inform PayPal, then PayPal is going to follow their own terms of service and freeze the account.

All your quotes from PayPal only prove that PayPal is an honorable business for treating everyone equally and following their own terms of service / contract. They are not being pressured by the government, they are following their own terms of service.

I am not supporting anyone. Not Wikileaks nor the imagined "PTB". I am neutral, and don't want to get involved. But that doesn't stop me from discussing this with REASON.
edit on 9-12-2010 by gift0fpr0phecy because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 05:08 PM
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Originally posted by Advantage


Believe it or not we cant just bust into another country and impose our laws on their citizens or businesses.. in case you didnt know.. its in Solna Sweden.


Oh, you can't?
sure does look like you can to me..... I'm not going to start listing all those countries that have been tasting the US version of freedom with a gun to their heads, but we both know there are quite a few.

And that's why we have wikileaks, to show the world how the US operates on lies and deception.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 05:09 PM
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Originally posted by SkurkNilsen
reply to post by Advantage
 

I have to do some research on the illegality of wikileaks and what laws have been broke before I check back on you, but now it's night time over in Europe.

My main point is still that atacking these sites is a good thing no matter if what wikileaks is doing is legal or not, this is our time to strike back on those that have lied to us and sent us to wars under false pretence (if that's not illegal it should be). If that means we have to react to those supporting TPTB in their insanity, so be it.


Feel free to check on our ( US) federal laws that have been broken and the FACT that we can not go to other countries to inpress our laws upon them. We can however, press our own laws upon our own businesses if they allow themselves to be used to transfer funds to a business that is engaged in breaking federal law. That has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with if you or anyone else feels what assange and wiki is doing is correct or not. That is simple fact concerning our laws.

You may find that your little script kiddie heroes are not as smart as they think they are. You may suffer from their ignorance as well as the rest of us.



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