The Weakest and Most Cowardly of all Arguments Against Wikileaks

I say please, arrest Julian Assange (given he has commited a serious crime)

So his "insurance documents" will be released to us all....

I don't reallly care about him. I care more about the documents...

So he can [SNIP] off as he is playing games with the world

Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

The Insurance File from July 2010 can be downloaded directly here:

WikiLeaks Insurance File

The "WikiLeaks Insurance" file, that founder Assange threatened to make public if he gets arrested.

At this moment the file is encrypted, Assange said he will give the key in case of his arrest.

The documents published on __._ are readacted and edited, this file would presumably hold the original documents, including names of secret agents.

The above quote came from the original torrent uploader of this file.

reply to post by schrodingers dog
WARNING!! DO NOT BECOME PART OF WIKILEAKS MASS-MIRROR TRAP!

REJECT ANY CONTACT WITH WIKILEAKS!!


The information they are looking for is a CIA trap and will be used to try and eventually shut your site down! DO NOT FALL INTO THIS TRAP!


Warn other Site Owners away from it!

Look at the info they are looking for!

There is no way I am going to have this site put on a list of sites for the CIA or whoever to restrict!

A lot of those sites have already done so and are going to be 'captured there!'

reply to post by magusman


Sources

Originally posted by hawkiye
reply to post by schrodingers dog

 

Yeah gee cause the WL ops couldn't possible be another attack on freedom to add to a long list because of the previous attacks mentioned above.... Gee that makes perfect sense... Sigh!!!

You obviously are unfamiliar with cost/benefit analyses ...

Cost–benefit analysis is often used by governments to evaluate the desirability of a given intervention. *

Furthermore, when one is try to justify one's flawed reasoning there's no amount of mental somersaults one will not undertake in order to accommodate any new information into their already flawed theory ... especially when said information would require action on their part.

Additionally, if this was to be psyops it would mean that those behind it are unfamiliar with basic psychology ... for the result of such actions, in the way they have unfolded, as has already started to manifest across the internet, is to galvanize the general public onto a common cause to resist it.

Finally, the reaction of the US and other governments and corporations has been clumsy, panicked, and above all reactionary ... none of which indicates a premeditated plan. This element, combined with all the others outlined on this thread, all but preclude this being such an operation.

Once again I reiterate that I am no way dismissing the possibility of a hidden agenda at play ... simply pointing out that there's simply neither evidence nor sound deductive process that can lead one to believe that further curbing of internet freedoms is it.

There are those like Mr. Lieberman and his ilk that will surely try to use this opportunity to that end, but that only indicates opportunism and not premeditation, for it is a knee jerk overreaction based on pure panic.

reply to post by schrodingers dog

The bottom line is, do you believe wikileaks is the real deal and not a government tool?
I'm pretty curious how many ATS members actually believe wikileaks is the real deal and how many believe it's a tool of tptb?

Originally posted by Jazzyguy
reply to post by schrodingers dog

 

The bottom line is, do you believe wikileaks is the real deal and not a government tool?
I'm pretty curious how many ATS members actually believe wikileaks is the real deal and how many believe it's a tool of tptb?

Well Jg I appreciate the wanting to understand and label the whole thing sooner rather than later but it's not really the topic of this thread ... nevertheless, with only 1060 out of 251,287 cables released to date, anyone declaring knowledge and understanding of the entire affair would be doing so prematurely and only to substantiate their preconceptions. It is simply too early to tell.

The analytical process can only take place one possibility at a time, this thread's scope is simply to address one such possibility and not to explain away entire WL phenomenon.

Originally posted by saabacura
I say please, arrest Julian Assange (given he has commited a serious crime)

So his "insurance documents" will be released to us all....

I don't reallly care about him. I care more about the documents...

So he can [SNIP] off as he is playing games with the world

Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

edit on 8-12-2010 by Gemwolf because: (no reason given)

With that kind of cold blooded, wholly lacking in human compassion approach, I'm sure the elites could find you a job. You've got the quality they find most desirable.

second

reply to post by schrodingers dog

Letting the elites always two steps ahead of you. That is the habbit of a sheeple.

reply to post by schrodingers dog


Gawd I love the way you write. and think. S&F

Small point - not Chinese water torture, more frogs in water slowly brought to a boil. They're dead before they realize the water got hot.

But what to do now? ...the same thing free-thinklers have been doing since the beginning of so-called civilization. Speaking out/up, teaching, carrying the torch. And relighting the dammed thing every 30 seconds or so.

reply to post by schrodingers dog

You obviously are unfamiliar with cost/benefit analyses ...

LOL what does it cost to feed worthless insignificant mostly known information to some dumbass with an internet account and claim it is a matter of national security of life and death? And watch all the little fan boys who think they are in the know ignore all logic and reason and attach their emotional wagons to this new anti-government saviour... Even though the guy touts the party line of War is good and there is no 9/11 conspiracy etc.

There are ample threads here listing the reasons and logic as to why the whole WiklLeaks op stinks to the high heavens I need not go through them again here. However emotional fanboys will have nothing to do with reason and logic.

CIA ops are laughing at how easily some are manipulated...

Originally posted by hawkiye
LOL what does it cost to feed worthless insignificant mostly known information to some dumbass with an internet account and claim it is a matter of national security of life and death?

A lot less than it costs to feed the masses propaganda through conventional channels.

Do you pay attention to sociological trends or do you post with reaction based upon your infallible perception?

In case you haven't noticed, the world has been in a state of life and death ever since the first broadcast of "The War of the Worlds"...the difference is now that the government and elite are not the only ones communicating...which is why I must suffer the expressions of ignorance at times...

And watch all the little fan boys who think they are in the know ignore all logic and reason and attach their emotional wagons to this new anti-government saviour... Even though the guy touts the party line of War is good and there is no 9/11 conspiracy etc.

A myopic analysis of the situation based on generalized rhetoric is actually worse than the 'fanboys' you speak of...I wonder if you have ever done any real research in your life...

There are ample threads here listing the reasons and logic as to why the whole WiklLeaks op stinks to the high heavens I need not go through them again here. However emotional fanboys will have nothing to do with reason and logic.

There are ample threads to the adverse as well...again, generalized rhetoric. Could you perhaps explain specifically your thoughts prior to painting the fence?

I'll tell you what...you provide specifics on your opinion and I'll counter them with facts...

CIA ops are laughing at how easily some are manipulated...

Yeah...here's your mirror...

I agree with the OP completely. People questioning Assange's motives from the safety of a keyboard, after all that WikiLeaks has been through, when he's facing arrest and extradition, are summer soldiers, at best.

Furthermore, WikiLeaks is an organization of people - not just Julian Assange - but a mass public who have been trained by broken educational systems and sensationalistic media to cast complicated issues with numerous players into simplistic, comic book type paradigms of Good Man vs. Evil Man, usually fail to grasp the complicated nuances of rapidly changing, multi-faceted situations.

For example, this guy, who among other things, was not taught that in English, the first letter of any sentence is capitalized:

Originally posted by stuncrazy
reply to post by schrodingers dog

 

i say lets put it to the test then. say he is standing up to TPTB, then he would focus most of his energy on that which started and lead to the eventual complete dissemination of the constitution of america (and the last ray of light in this God-forsaken world) that being 9/11. what does this man who is against GLOBAL TYRANNY have to say about this matter? what is his opinion on the biggest and most televised fake of all time?

What does Assange's opinion on 9/11 matter compared to the truth his site is providing? He's made it known he doesn't believe in the alternatives to the official story, probably because he's never seen anything about it in his Leaks. And why would he have seen it? You think there's a paper trail? You honestly think of someone conspired to cold-bloodedly murder thousands of people and subvert the Constitution, they would put it in a Memo, sign their names to it, and leave on a hard drive somewhere?

Why do people think Assange and his staff have supernatural access to every secret document in the world? And when the information WikiLeaks provides doesn't quite match up to their pet theories about UFOs or Zionists or the Stonecutters, then that automatically makes them a Mossad front? Do you people even have an educational system in America?

please if he is going to bring GWB to justice and incarcerated for the war crimes committed on that day which will forever live in infamy, then and only then can he be followed....

Just...wow? So according to your logic, Julian Assange must single-handedly thwart the entire Western power elite structure and personally arrest a former president of the United States, then serve as Harry Birdman, Attorney at Law and convict him - and if he fails to perform as Superman as you demand, then obviously he is a CIA front operation and cannot be trusted or supported, and all that information was typed up to trick us and the 'Collateral Damage' video was shot in the Hollywood Desert...

The world is so full of fallacious thinking and faulty reasoning, it just boggles the mind.

Originally posted by stuncrazy
reply to post by schrodingers dog

 

i say lets put it to the test then. say he is standing up to TPTB, then he would focus most of his energy on that which started and lead to the eventual complete dissemination of the constitution of america (and the last ray of light in this God-forsaken world) that being 9/11. what does this man who is against GLOBAL TYRANNY have to say about this matter? what is his opinion on the biggest and most televised fake of all time? if he was in fact a "truth seeker" then let's hear his opinion on 9/11 truth.. please if he is going to bring GWB to justice and incarcerated for the war crimes committed on that day which will forever live in infamy, then and only then can he be followed.
9/11 truth to me is the true sign of any truth seeker. if you call it a hoax you have done your research and realized it was the beginning of the end. if you believe it happened the way they said it did.. well you don't seem to be much for seeking the truth. all you have to do to change my mind is answer 3 questions. what happened to WTC 7, what happened to the plane at the pentagon, and what happened to the plane at Pennsylvania. (and not the answer that was given us)
the death of the constitution started on that day, and anyone that denies it was done with intent, is not for us but works (intentionally or not) for TPTB.
that was by far the largest attack on human rights, at least in my history, ever.

so in conclusion what does he say about 9/11?

edit on 7-12-2010 by stuncrazy because: (no reason given)

I have my "feeling" that these benign leaks have been to establish the disinterest and credibility of the WikiLeaks brand - with the endgame being the take down of the people responsible for all that's crippled the planet since the Attacks of 9/11. In my view of this, there is a faction of the US government that made sure WikiLeaks got what they've released so far, and that they've done so to make sure that when the 9/11 and Anthrax Attacks bombshell is dropped, it won't get shunted off to Alex Jones or George Noory's radio show along with all the oter evidence that's been marginalized.

And - this is my own notion, of course - the reason why WikiLeaks has been prepping for this, is because the US government and US mainstream media have been staring down catastrophic follow-on Anthrax Attacks if any action is launched against the increasingly obvious crimes of the GOP-assisted International corporate cabal that launched the 9/11 Attacks to re-establish the Cold War economy with a new eternal boogyman enemy. The extortion started with the Anthrax mailings to signal to the DNC Senate leadership (Leahey and Daschel) and the media (Brokaw) to lay off questioning the 9/11 Attacks, but in 2008, the demands suddenly ramped up unexpectedly to include the need for Goldman Sachs to get their trillion or so - which suggests that one of the dozen or so newly minted Intelligence firm sold what they discovered about the blackmail scenario to them, and they leaned on the perps to cut them in on a piece of the US Treasury (or be exposed as the 9/11 perpetrators).

Yeah, this theory sounds pretty elaborate, but if you really examine the bizarre nature of how completely assured the Bush/Cheney machine have been concerning things like the illegal Iraq invasion, the painfully obvious WMD lie, SpyGate, TortureGate, reshuffling the deck as soon as the Congress approved the 700 billion for the banks (making the entire plan become a cash giveaway instead of an asset purchase at the last minute) while the Democrats stand there and don't even object, then there comes a point where you have to include "something" into the balance in order to have any of it make any rational sense at all. The GOP kept the debt from two wars and trillions in tax cuts off the budget for 6 years, and yet no one has taken anyone to task over it. Not the media, and not the DNC. If the Democrats had done that the entire planet would've been on fire over it. Now, it's all being put on the Obama admin and the Democratic led Congress, and they don't even try to argue the issue.

It's as if that sort of thing is the least of their worries, and when has any organized group of politicians, with control of both houses of Congress and the White House ever acted like that. The answer is never. Something else is involved here, and it's not timidity on behalf of guys who beat everyone else out for those House and Senate jobs. Politicians are only timid if they know they have to be.

I am keeping my eyes open on this WikiLeaks business, and the announcement that Assange made of the banking leak thats coming up. If it ends up being an "Enron level scandal", as he suggested, then it might just be the last of the preparatory leaks before the real party begins. Besides, what else could be considered a "thermonuclear device" as information in a post 9/11 world? Really. What else could prevent the vaunted PTB from touching a hair on Assange's head? Certainly not classified troop movement documents or small-change stuff like that.

reply to post by schrodingers dog


Thanks dawg! You just made my day

Finaly someone is doing something and the paranoid mindset of some people just seems to be so illogical, support wikileaks in any way you feel you can. Mirror wikileaks, boycot paypal, let the world know what you think!

Keep Us Strong

Regardless of the intent behind Wikileaks, the integrity of the infortmation released to date or the change in thinking it may represent, it all comes down to one simple point for me. That is:

The exposure given to the released cables to date, far outweighs what the information contained within warrants. This is what leads me to believe Wikileaks is part of yet another plan to re-inforce and intensify the prison we are already trapped in.

Until Wikileaks exposes some of the Big conspiracies we already know to be true, I will continue to be wary of the momentum gathering bandwagon it appears to be. Perhaps they don't have access to the high-level top secret information that would expose the Big conspiracies? If that's the case, then why are they getting so much coverage?

IT DOESN'T ADD UP!

reply to post by schrodingers dog

oh, so if i don't believe everything i hear on tv now then i am an ignorant coward. okay, that makes perfect sense. being skeptical and using critical thinking is bad? oh, i didn't realize, well i assure you that i won't ever do it again. sorry.

Amen. I am heartened to find someone brave enough to speak out against it. Our freedoms are being stripped away behind our backs and Big Brother is looming ever nearer. He knows who you are. He knows all about you. You do not know him, but he has invaded your privacy. He has collected your personal information from everywhere you have been without leaving so much as a trace of his existence. One organization is the shining light in this era of espionage. Wiki Leaks is trying to expose this monster fro who he is and what he has done. Wiki Leaks is a drastic reaction to a severe problem and should be extolled for the progress they have made over the past four years. They have uncovered the warning signs of a degenerate and broken Government underneath all of the secrets and lies through the years. I fully support wikileaks, and I am under the impression that you do as well. We need to defend our freedoms!

reply to post by freakgenius


I agree. Since when has critical thinking and forming our own opinions made us narcissistic fools? It is just another ploy of the media and ultimately 'Big Brother' [1984 by George Orwell] to create unified thinking and destroy the individual.