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Emptiness and Nirvana

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posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 04:07 PM
reply to post by Tryptych

The writings of the Theosophists mentioned here are worthwhile. At least the writings of H.P. Blavatsky, Manly P. Hall 33°, and Rudolf Steiner. Some other Theosophist's writings are somewhat questionable though. In fact, Samael Aun Weor wrote that–aside from a handful of books by Theosophical authors–reading Theosophical books is a waste of time.

Really though, when one enters Initiation, it is implied that one either becomes a Mason of the Black Lodge, or a Mason of the White Lodge; even if one never sets foot in a physical Masonic Lodge. Samael Aun Weor wrote in Practical Astrology that–through Initiation–we receive the Masonic salutes, tokens, grips, etc. in the Astral Plane. Also, many Masonic Initiatic Societies existed in ancient times amongst the Native Americans, Africans, Europeans, Arabs, Asians, and other cultures.

About Elemental creatures of the Fourth Dimension, why are we–having not ever seen them–so skeptical about them, knowing that our Pineal and Pituitary Glands are atrophied due to sexual abuse? Can we really say that Elementals don't exist just because we haven't seen them due to not having awakened our Chakras (the internal senses of the Soul) ?

"It is the commonest of mistakes to believe that the limit of our perception is also the limit of all there is to perceive." - C.W. Leadbeater

Everywhere there are many scoundrels of the intellect lacking positive direction and who are poisoned with loathsome skepticism.

Certainly, the repugnant poison of skepticism has infected human minds alarmingly since the eighteenth century.

Before that time, the famous Nontrabada, or Encubierta island, located off the Spanish coast, was constantly visible and tangible.

There is no doubt that such an island is situated in the fourth dimension. Many are the anecdotes related to this mysterious island.

After the eighteenth century, the aforementioned island was lost in eternity; no one knows anything at all about it.

In the times of King Arthur and the Knights of the Round Table, elementals of Nature were manifest everywhere, deeply penetrating our physical atmosphere.

Many are the tales of elves, leprechauns and fairies, which still abound in green Erin, Ireland. Unfortunately, all these things of innocence, all this beauty from the soul of the Earth is no longer perceived by humanity. This is due to the intellectual scoundrel’s pedantries and the animal ego’s excessive development.

Nowadays, the know-it-all ignoramuses laugh at all these things, rejecting them, though deep down they have not even remotely achieved happiness.

If people understood that we have three minds it would be a very different story. Possibly they might even become more interested in these studies.

Unfortunately, learned ignoramuses, absorbed as they are in the labyrinth of their own difficult scholarly pursuits, do not even have the time to pay any serious attention to our studies.

These hopeless people are self-sufficient; they are conceited with vain intellectualism; they think that they are on the right path; and they do not have even the slightest idea that they are up a blind alley.

In the name of truth we must state that in synthesis we have three minds.

The first one we can and must call the Sensual Mind. The second we shall christen with the name of Intermediate Mind. The third we shall call the Inner Mind.

Now we are going to study each of these three minds separately and judiciously....

- Samael Aun Weor

edit on 11-12-2010 by Tamahu because: edited text

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 08:14 PM
There is also a fourth mind: No Mind aka beginners mind ie: an open mind. This is more in line with Adi Da's teaching, as well as that of Zen Buddhism. No within. No point of view. Humour.


Samael Aun Weor looks very impressive in the ring, lots of moves.

Adi Da has only one punch, but it can hit home and hit hard, about this very notion of striving, of seeking, viewing, analysing, and knowing all about something, with ever increasing data, practices, and strivings, and thus WILL - being utterly absurd to begin with, there being no conceptualization which can adequately conceptualize that which is inconceivable and can only be experienced, and known in felt presence, as an enjoyment in liberation.

Surely we have to "throw it all away" at some point and just BE "in it" and be with it, in the presence of "it", a thing which cannot be pinpointed, nor described by any words or any method, of any kind.

Adi Da giggles, after a strong counter attack single punch of absolute simplicity...

The bell rings three times, round one is over.

edit on 11-12-2010 by NewAgeMan because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 09:51 PM
imho, Christ is very much in line with Krishna, with God expressing himself through the devotional love of bhakti one to another, born of the love that is both within and without, and among us, as the only "process" or movement in the world, either within or without, and of course nowhere in particular (mirthful peace of liberation) that is worthwhile or meaningful. In short, it is a spirit of loving kingdness, mercy, compassion, forgiveness of sin (end of karma - gift of eternal life). This is the joy that wipes away the tears from our eyes! The first/last cause and the alpha and omega of existence, summed up in a simple devotion of love. The reason this works, I believe, is because this love, the love of the lover and the beloved other, of the two that are not two, is eternal, and in the final analysis, the ONLY thing which makes any rational sense! It's the only game in town.

So Samael Aun Weor is correct that we MUST Christify ourselves and the world around us, the Great Work of all Ages MUST be performed, so that we might overcome, and in so doing recieve the white stone, the name of the lord, a white horse (saddled with a Beginners Mind), arrows (which always fly to their mark), a doubled edged sword of Civility, and a shield of love. And then the bride and the bridegroom they say come and freely drink the living water, and there is the river, between two trees of life (no more tree of the knowledge fo good and evil or of duality).

He's right, Christ must incarnate through us and be resurrected.

That said, however, surely Christ is the spirit of love I just mentioned, of mutuality, and all the fruits of the spirit, and this is the tree of life, since what is born of flesh is flesh and what is born of spirit is spirit and truth and light.

He isn't like a mummy we are trying or needing to piece back together within our physical body, no we must be resurrected through the eternally unfolding present moment (water of life) according to what is spirit, and truth, and love. Jesus Christ is not like Frankenstein, and neither are we, any more, those who simply have the imagination and the audacity to willingly give up.

edit on 11-12-2010 by NewAgeMan because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 10:34 PM

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

Adi Da giggles,

When we were driving up to the Mountain of Attention Sanctuary,someone said that Adi Da had said that when we die we should listen for His Laughter.

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 10:47 PM

Originally posted by RRokkyy

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

Adi Da giggles,

When we were driving up to the Mountain of Attention Sanctuary,someone said that Adi Da had said that when we die we should listen for His Laughter.

I've heard it. There is nothing left but that laughter, and it belongs to everyone even as we die now to the delusion of selfhood and striving, it something shared, the laughter of understanding, as he called it, what I like to think of as the ulimate inside-joke capable of saving the world. For many of us we might think it an embarassment, unsure as to what's funny. Then as more and more people start laughing we would become convinced well beyond any doubt, that they are ALL laughing at us and us alone!

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 11:09 PM
reply to post by RRokkyy

This humour is everything and means everything, because it is, as he points out, the very basis for our creative action in the world, as well as the basis of our freedom, and therefore, the freedom to love. In it's fullness is contained the capacity also, for hope. It is a fundamentally optimistic humour, a fearless humour, and a compassionate humour, it does not laugh AT people, but instead encourages them to have a wonderful laugh at their own expense, and then move, into a new frame of reference, which, once understood, in laughter, can thereafter never be undone!

This is a very very powerful insight

"I tell you that unless you become one as these little children here, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven."

posted on Dec, 11 2010 @ 11:53 PM
reply to post by Tryptych

Many Gnostic Instructors have told us to not confuse Gnosis with contemporary Freemasonry!

"Who Are the Black Lodges and Who Decides..."

There exist very respectable and venerable schools. These institutions have their courses of instruction and degrees. Some of them also have rituals of initiation. However, in the Superior Worlds the degrees and inititations from these schools are useless. The Masters of the White Lodge are not interested in the degrees and hierarchies of the physical world. They are only interested in the Kundalini. They examine and measure the spinal medulla. If the candidate has not yet raised the serpent, for them, he is simply an ordinary being, like any other, even though he may occupy some high position in the physical world... - Samael Aun Weor

edit on 11-12-2010 by Tamahu because: typo

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 01:13 AM

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 02:01 AM
reply to post by LifeIsEnergy

From what I've learned, the Nine Yanas of Buddhism encompass the entire Path. Even beyond the Nine Initiations of Major Mysteries.

There are Nine Initiations of Minor Mysteries, and then after that there are Seven Initiations of Major Mysteries related to the Seven Serpents of Fire, plus two more Initiations of Major Mysteries.

The following gives the Buddhist terminologies for the first Four Initiations of Major Mysteries:

"All the processes of the Great Initiations are performed in the secret, ardent chambers of the Sushumna canal.

"The four great Initiations of Major Mysteries are: Srotapanna, Sakridagamin, Anagamin, Arhan. These are the four paths that lead to Nirvana.

"However, even when the Arhan is an Adept, he must still raise his Fifth, Sixth and Seventh Serpent of his eternal Divine Triad in order to convert himself into an Arhat of the “Mist of Fire”.

"These are the seven Great Initiations of Major Mysteries. There are the seven serpents that any human being must raise by intensely practicing sexual magic with his spouse....

The Masters of the seventh ardent scale are only one step from the fundamental root of their Hierarchy." - Samael Aun Weor

There do seem to be more Initiations than the Nine Initiations of Major Mysteries however, as Samael Aun Weor wrote that there are also Seven Serpents of Light.

Although perhaps the Seven Serpents of Light are all within the Eighth or Ninth, or the Eighth and Ninth Initiations of Major Mysteries. I'm not sure.

For more on this, study The Three Mountains, Practical Astrology, The Major Mysteries, Tarot and Kabbalah, and The Mysteries of the Fire, by Samael Aun Weor.

I do agree one must work their way up to higher teachings such as anatta "no-self" and "no-ego", as I made this mistake myself and became very confused. Can you share more detailed info on these different levels?

Thanks you have helped me tremendously

The Adepts and Masters can explain this much better than I could.

I've noted over the years, the best Buddhist authors; and have listed most of them here:


Books written by almost all of the authors listed there, have been recommended by various Gnostic Instructors. Although if you conduct your own investigation, you'll come to find that the books written by said authors truly are the best that the Buddhist teachings have to offer.

The complex philosophies of Emptiness, Kabbalah, Atman, Anatman, etc., are not exactly easy to understand at first. But it really is worthwhile to study and comprehend them, as to see how they can all be reconciled with one another.

edit on 12-12-2010 by Tamahu because: edited text

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 02:02 AM
reply to post by NewAgeMan

The Guardian of the Threshold

"The first ordeal that the candidate has to face is the trial of the Guardian of the Threshold. This Guardian is the reflection of the "I," the intimate depths of the "I." Many are they who fail this ordeal.

"In the Internal Worlds, the candidate has to invoke the Guardian of the Threshold. A terrifying electrical hurricane precedes the terrible apparition.

"The larva of the threshold is armed with terrible, hypnotic power. In fact, this monster has all the horrible ugliness of our own sins. It is the living mirror of our own evil deeds. The Clash is terrible: it has a face to face and hand to hand battle. If the Guardian wins, the candidate becomes enslaved by the horrible monster. However, if the candidate is victorious, the monster of the threshold flees terrified. Then a metallic sound shakes the universe and the candidate is received in the Children's Chamber. This reminds us of that requisition uttered by the Hierophant Jesus Christ who stated:

"Except ye become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven."

"In the Children's Chamber, the candidate is welcomed by the holy masters. The happiness is immense because the human being has entered the Path of Initiation. The entire College of Initiates (Children) congratulate the candidate. The candidate has defeated the first Guardian. This ordeal takes place in the Astral World." - Samael Aun Weor

"It is not unusual for some aggregate psyche to assume the form of Jesus Christ in order to issue false oracles...

"Any of these many entities which together constitute that which is called Ego can, if it so wishes, take the form of a Mahatma or Guru and so when the dreamer returns to a state of wakefulness, he will say of himself, "I am Self-Realized, I am a Master."

"In this regard, the observation must be made that in the subconscious of all people lies the latent tendency to take advantage of personification.

"This then is the classic reason that many Asian Gurus warn against all possible forms of self-deceit before initiating their disciples in Transcendental Magic.

"A monk visited Tai-Shan, who shut the door in his face. The monk knocked on the door and Tai-Shan asked: "Who is it?"

"The monk answered, "The Lion's Cub."

"Then Tai-Shan opened the door and jumped onto the monk's neck shouting, "Animal! Where will you go now?" The monk did not reply.

"The term "Lion's Cub" is used by Zen Buddhists to describe a disciple who is capable of understanding Zen Truth. When the Masters praise a disciple's comprehension, or they wish to test him, this term is usually employed.

"In this case, the monk presumptuously names himself the Lion's Cub, but when Tai-Shan tests him, treating him like a real Lion's Cub as he clambered onto his neck and asked an esoteric question: The monk did not know how to answer.

"This is evidence that the monk lacked the authentic understanding which he claimed to possess. Such a monk was in fact a man whose consciousness was asleep, he was sincere but mistaken, a Mythomaniac." - Samael Aun Weor

"To end with this, let me tell you a story. When Master Samael Aun Weor wrote his first book called The Perfect Matrimony, all of the Black Lodge was angry against him because he was unveiling and teaching these mysteries to all of the world, openly. And then the black magicians told him: “We are going to work against that book, you will see.” So, in the physical world, he was waiting for another book that would reject his book. And he kept writing other books and never found a book talking against his writings. Finally, he discovered that the Black Lodge was not writing any book; what the Black Lodge was doing was promoting pornography – thus pornography is the work against it. Now pornography is very widespread, so through pornography is how the Black Lodge works. It is too easy to enter into Hell; the door is very broad to enter there, but the door to the superior dimensions is chastity, and nobody, no ego likes that."

"Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

"Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it." - Matthew 7:13-14

The Sermon of Nasreddin

edit on 12-12-2010 by Tamahu because: edited text

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 03:55 AM
reply to post by Tamahu

If you commiserate with your neighbor and share with him your difficulties, and your struggles, while attempting to help ease his own burden - if he is kind-hearted, he will thank you, but if he is hard-hearted, he will scorn you. God will be the measure of my heart, I do not need my "friends" to try to accumulate data on me by attempting to read between the lines between the lines, taking inventory, as if preparing a case against me. Some "friends".

"What you measure out will be measured unto you."

And if >I< was being harsh in the same manner, in any way, ie: by implying a lack of understanding on anyone's part, please forgive me. I am only ever trying to be as helpful as humanly possible, and if you didn't notice, I always defer to Christ with head bowed, and raise his name "on high", his logos the joy of my communication, never to point to myself as if a guru of any kind. I even offer a course in self-guruhood, developing in my Alchemy thread, a do-it-yourself 123.

I love all people.

None of us are without stain or blame, but yes, few of us pass through the ordeal, the "dark night of the soul" while retaining their sanity and able to report back, childlike, that's true.

But all these contortions of spiritual knowledge in the form of knowing about - what about simply acceptance, something available to most people, even my "retarted" (learning disabled) neighbor, who's got a heart of gold but a mind fixated in an insecurity which knows no bounds.

One "esoteric" thing I know about Christ. He is like a camel, able to carry massive amounts of water across the desert in the blazing heat of the day until the sun sets, and then he rests until another day.
The incarnating love of God in devotion to Christ, is coming, but it doesn't come from any one particular direction, and no one will be able to point to himself and say "I am he" or "look there, there he comes".

Please don't assume the worst of a well intentioned friend in Christ, is all I'm saying, and if I read in too much also, I'm sorry.

You see, I'm a very nice person, and a loving person, a gentle person, even funny sometimes. But I am nothing. And I don't even have a single original idea of my own! Not one. But I "grok" things, I take them in as my own, I don't just have them as facts, merely as things known about, but not integrated. I see it as food and water, not as a practice, and the test is the freedom of our love, and our willingness to make a fool of ourselves as needed, to make this love manifest. Our action, and intent, it's usually self evident, but not on ATS.

Here, directly and by inference, I've been called narcissus, the anti-Christ, the false prophet(s), evil, crazy, the two thieves on either side of Christ (symbolizing the thinker and the self) and all manner of hurtful things, especially "new age" as a prejorative..

Good thing we're just communicating via keyboard, mouse and screen!

If I have a plank in my eye, I'll allow you to help me remove it, and I know how narcisstic and OCD-like my posting patterns may appear, along with the sheer volume and repetitiveness of my posts in certain threads (like this one!), but I don't care, because I've done some of the actual heavy lifting on some of these issues, and my work here is helpful to the reader (i think?).

And no this little rant wasn't an over-reaction because of the porn comment and your call to chastity. I'm just sick and tired of being accused of having some evil scheme or wicked agenda, when all I'm doing here is illuminating the Christ!

But there's a lack of social cues, so it's hard to tell!

edit on 12-12-2010 by NewAgeMan because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 04:43 AM
reply to post by NewAgeMan

Perhaps I've been overzealous in my quoting of information and teachings. At least in my previous post.

I sincerely do feel remorseful for making you feel judged. If you would have told me earlier that you felt personally attacked or singled out by my last post, I would have edited it (it won't let me edit it anymore).

I've tried to keep this thread from turning into an argumentative one. I obviously did not succeed.

So I sincerely apologize for getting judgmental towards you. I honestly did not intend to come across in such a way.

Not to blame it all on "my ego". Only to point out that I obviously have ego, and that the only one there is to blame for it, is myself.

Question: Master, what about the Gnostic ego? Is that good or bad?

Samael Aun Weor: Well, let me tell you the truth. That question becomes a very spicy one, you know, because in the Gnostic Movement there is not a single person without a Gnostic ego. The interesting thing is that such an ego must also be annihilated. Only the Gnostic consciousness must remain. The Gnostic ego is an automatic, mechanical ego. You must reduce it to ashes. You must be cognizant of the Doctrine so that Gnosis will develop in you by cognizant, doctrinal conviction. And not like a mere mechanistic automatism. The Gnostic I is mechanical. But the Gnostic consciousness is revolutionary, rebellious, and terribly divine.

edit on 12-12-2010 by Tamahu because: edit

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 05:00 AM
reply to post by Tamahu

No worries my friend. For all I know, you are building an arc, which I myself may one day ride WITH you, and that would be fun!

edit on 12-12-2010 by NewAgeMan because: forgot the word "be" in be fun.. TYPO!

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 05:23 AM
reply to post by NewAgeMan

Well, since your screen-name is after all NewAgeMan, you might be interested in this thread:

Could We Actually Be in the (New) Age of Aquarius Now?

edit on 12-12-2010 by Tamahu because: edit

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 06:07 PM

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 06:44 PM

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 07:33 PM
reply to post by Tamahu

Given the willingness to suffer, even as a committment to the truth about the present realities of the world in which we live, including the suffering in relation to the loss of everything due to the impermanence or transience of ALL our attachments, including those attachments of even of love, to the people we love, and to our own selves and our present ego (personality) and form, unto to life iself and "the world"...

let us then imagine, if we will, in that unconditioned nothingness, and the loss of everything, a race, in eternity, between suffering, and joy...


posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 07:46 PM
many smiles arise now, in an infinite series, of the kind which is capable of wiping away the tears from our eyes.. and we move, and are moved, first to suffering, and then to joy of the everlasting kind, the joy of the Lord who lives in this eternal light of love. Then as children, we may enter the playground and be free to free love, and thus experience the love of God as the love transcendant.

even now as I type this, realizing what was just relayed through me I am moved first to tears, and then a loving smile, at an imagined perfect you observing

this is not an imposition on the mind

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 08:17 PM

Originally posted by seeyounexttuesday

Originally posted by Tamahu

"For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow." - Ecclesiastes 1:18

Yeah, but...."if you can fly, then soar."

My God! I thought she was about to jump from the ship towards the end!

Absolutely unbelievably appropriate and synchronistic and instructive, helpful and loving thing, to share. Thank you!

Phew, sigh...stretch out, relax.

This is what being with people is all about, even if only in word form, we don't need to be meditating by ourselves any more unless we want to just for fun and enjoyment.

It is a very spacious ship.

posted on Dec, 12 2010 @ 10:05 PM
reply to post by NewAgeMan

It is said that Love and attachment are two different things. Even if we have not directly experienced the true meaning of this in its fullness, it would be wise to for us to aspire to comprehend the wise words of those who have told us that attachment, desire, and sentimentalism, are the opposite of non-attachment, Bliss, and Love.

The personality is not the ego. The personality itself is merely an interface, that can express either the ego or the Being. Samael Aun Weor stated that the Being and the ego are like oil and water, they can never mix. Yet the personality at any given moment is expressing either the ego or the Being.

As for meditating alone, and interacting with others; both are necessary for attaining balance.

Mystical Death

"Indeed, the ‘I’ can only be annihilated by means of a rigorous creative comprehension. We need to perform a self-dissection to the ‘I’ with the scalpel of the self-criticism. Instead of criticizing others, we must criticize ourselves. Practical life is a full-length mirror where we can see our selves just as we really are. When the mind is found in a state of alert-perception while coexisting with the neighbor, we can then easily discover our defects because these spontaneously arise. It is astounding the manner in which our defects emerge while in relation with the neighbors, with our friends, with our fellow workers, with our spouse, with our children, with our acquaintances, etc., thus, if we are alert and vigilant as the watchmen in the time of war, it is then clearly logical that we can see our defects as they really are..." - Samael Aun Weor

"When we deny ourselves, when we learn how to receive with gladness the unpleasant manifestations of our fellowmen, when we learn how to love our enemies, to return good for bad, to love those who hate us, who curse us, who persecute us, then the Second Force, the Holy Denying, crystallizes within us - that is to say, the Logos, the Chrestos, the Christus, Vishnu, Osiris. This is how we Christify ourselves."

- Samael Aun Weor

“Blessed are they that mourn, for they shall be comforted.”

"The supreme repentance, necessary in order to disintegrate any psychic aggregates, demands cries and remorse.

"It is not possible to disintegrate psychic aggregates without tears, repentance and supreme pain."

- Pistis Sophia Unveiled by Samael Aun Weor

However, this does not mean that we should actually feed pain, because to do so would be to continue to strengthen the ego; as Samael Aun Weor also wrote:

"Pain is Satan (the psychological "I"), because Satan is the one that makes the evil deeds. The Abstract Absolute Space, the Universal Spirit of Life, is absolute happiness, supreme peace and abundance.

"Those who make mysticism out of pain are masochists. Satan was the creator of pain. Pain is satanic. No one can be liberated with pain. We need to be Alchemists."

- Samael Aun Weor

edit on 12-12-2010 by Tamahu because: edit

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