U.S. using chemical weapons in Afghanistan: report

we all know that the chemical weapons have more damage than others
hope it can be used anymore otherwise our earth will be damaged by this horrible thing

posted by oozy
With the exception of Natural Uranium, alternative explanations are attributable to radio-isotopic signatures (ratios of isotopes of uranium) not substantiated by the laboratory results of Afghan civilians and bombsites. The isotopic measurements are objectively reliable and cannot be misrepresented other than by intentional adulteration of the specimens or intentional efforts to contaminate the population to mask the origins of contamination. Notably, the results of the analysis of biological specimens (urine) and the bomb-crater samples are compatible.

reply to post by oozyism



This statement you posted, is saying that the samples are not reliable, and not substantiated by the Afghan government.

Originally posted by oozyism

U.S. using chemical weapons in Afghanistan: report

www.tehrantimes.com

Afghan infants have suffered with many congenital deformities in every part of the country as a result of the usage of the chemical weapons.

(visit the link for the full news article)

DU weapons are not 'new' to this war or any war in the ME either where the US/UK are involved.
DU weapons are 'cheaper'..more efficient to produce....they ensure that everyone currently involved on the ground will be dead realiably soon, or driven mad and so not listened to by anyone credible, and they ensure that there will be no future generation to rise against you!

The US wanted victory... What did you expect they would do?

Once you conqure and deamonize and dehumanize an "enemy" and ensure no one gives two hoots about them via propoganda...all thats left to do is fight about how efficiently to eliminate them...its nazi 101....not rocket science.

reply to post by oozyism


I overheard people from the U.S. army talking about local troops suffering from the flesh eating virus and having to get parts of them cut out. My thought is that anthrax is running rampant over their.

reply to post by open_eyeballs


DU weapons are classified as Chemical weapons.

DU fits the description of a Chemical Weapon, go read the Wikipedia description and tell me it doesn't, ohh wait, I will do that for you too.

Chemical warfare does not depend upon explosive force to achieve an objective. Rather it depends upon the unique properties of the chemical agent weaponized. A lethal agent is designed to injure or incapacitate the enemy, or deny unhindered use of a particular area of terrain. Defoliants are used to quickly kill vegetation and deny its use for cover and concealment. It can also be used against agriculture and livestock to promote hunger and starvation. With proper protective equipment, training, and decontamination measures, the primary effects of chemical weapons can be overcome. Many nations possess vast stockpiles of weaponized agents in preparation for wartime use. The threat and the perceived threat have become strategic tools in planning both measures, and counter–measures.

en.wikipedia.org...
See why it can be classified as a Chemical Weapon?

It has the same effects.

reply to post by space cadet


Highlight the part which states that?

Thanks in advance.

reply to post by oozyism

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by oozyism

 

Lol you almost got it. Thermo baric weapons and bunker busters are conventional weapons, not chemical and to my knowledge they are not even equipped to carry it.

Now I want you to do me a favor - go back to the article and read their "proof". See anything different about it?

* - The Canadian medical team - Can you find the report where this is claimed? Ive been unable to find any reference to canadian medical teams doing whats described.

* - The investigative research scholar in part 1 - Claim poisons were found - Which ones were found? in what quantities, where was it located?

* - part 3 changes the the story, using the term biological weapons instead of chemical - There is a massive difference between the 2, and the biological weapon type was not identified, there is no supporting medical info from Hospitals who "treated" any problems.

* - Source of info was not given. The US military no longer uses phosphorus bombs as its outlawed. The only weapon in the US arsenal that uses depleted urnaium is the M1 Main battle tank, which are not deployed, and have never been deployed, to the Afghanistan theatre.

I have never seen an infant suffer from weightlessness as the doctor described on Earth. Since we dont have levitation technology, and we ar not in orbit, I am not sure how weighlessness on the ground would work.

Lukemia is caused by:
Smoking, Exposure to Radiation, Previous Chemotherapy or Radiation Therapy, Human T-Cell Leukemia Virus, Myelodysplasctic Syndrome, Downs Syndrome. None of which can be caused by anything the US has in theatre or out of theatre for that matter.

* - Afghans suffering from Congenital deformities - This is why these countries need to spend less time denouncing the great satan and more time building a damn medical center. What is a congential abnormality and what causes it?
-

A congenital disorder may be the result of genetic abnormalities, the intrauterine (uterus) environment, errors of morphogenesis, infection, or a chromosomal abnormality

* - and finally the blanket, vague statement of Afghans are suffing from various disease.. ok.. which ones? where, patient age, exposures etc etc.

Please Oozzy.. I am now begging you, research article before you post them. This is propoganda and you are smart enough to know better. Please start thinking for yourself and maybe once in a while take the time to question an article. I know you hate the US and want to provide whatever information you can to support your agenda, but this is just borderline asshattery.

Please practice what you preach and research on your own before buying into the propoganda, just as you tell us westerners to do.

** MOD any chance we can get this moved to the Hoax section for lack of facts, supporting documentation in addition to it being nothing but a piece of propoganda trash**

Your thread has been debunked on the first page

reply to post by Steam


Try harder with your one liners

Originally posted by oozyism
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

Once again, you have provided nothing to this thread, rather showed that you actually do have the "America can't do no wrong" disease.

Let's make this simple shall we.

Evidence supporting US use of DU in Afghanistan

Depleted Uranium Ammunition in Afghan War: New Evidence

During the operation “Enduring Freedom” in support of the Northern Alliance against the Taliban-Regime, US-aircraft used, amongst others, armour-piercing incendiary munitions with a DU-core. Because of its pyrophoric character, when this type of munition is used against hard targets (e.g. tanks, cars) the uranium burns. During the combustion, toxic dusts can be deposited, particularly at and around the targets, which can then be re-suspended easily.

The above is from "German Bundeswehr Manual".

Afghan 'health link' to uranium

Some scientists say the rise is linked to use of weapons containing depleted uranium (DU) by the US-led coalition that invaded the country in 2001.

--------

Doctors in Kabul and Kandahar showed data indicating that the incidence of a number of health conditions, including birth defects, has doubled in under two years.

Funny, ignore the connection. Afghanistan is bombed -> within a year or two health issues revolving around DU contamination. WOW, that is so hard to decipher, it must be something else, it just couldn't be those bombs that were dropped.

Asaf Durakovic, URMC's president and a former US army adviser, believes that exposure to DU weapons may have brought a rise in birth defects as well as "symptoms of muscular-skeletal pains, immune system disorders, lung disease, and eventually cancer".

Just so you say that naaaa, it can't be DU, it might be natural:

Depleted uranium and natural uranium contain different ratios of two isotopes of the metal.
So scientists can tell whether a person has been exposed to the natural form, or to DU.

DU is used in armour-piercing shells because its density means it can penetrate further than other metals.
Dr Durakovic said his research showed that in Afghanistan, coalition forces had also used DU in "bunker buster" bombs, which can penetrate tens of metres into the soil.

"In Afghanistan it has to be... a weapon that destroys not only bunkers or caves, but also penetrates through the soil and through the fragile environment of the mountains."

Naaa, it couldn't be American bombs, they just can't do anything wrong. It must have been the damn terrorists who bombed there own caves and then we see symptoms of DU contamination:

The Pentagon Steps Up its Use of Radioactive Munitions by Marc W. Herold Departments of Economics and Women's Studies Whittemore School of Business & Economics University of New Hampshire

Ever since the first Gulf War the U.S. military has increasingly used radioactive Depleted Uranium (DU) munitions. Against Iraq in 1991 they proved very effective at penetrating enemy armor (tanks). More recently in the Afghan campaign they were used extensively for destroying underground facilities and caves. The following table summarizes estimated usage of radioactive DU in three of America's recent wars. All these weapons will be almost certainly be heavily used should Gulf War II take place.

The amount of DU use in Afghanistan: 500-600 tons.

Intensely bombed hard target zones like Tora Bora and Shah-i-Kot may now be heavily contaminated with DU oxide. During the battle of Shah-i-Kot, A-10s were heavily used, flying up to eight hours every day from an unnamed base outside Afghanistan. The potential health risks to U.S. and Afghan troops being sent to check out bombed cave systems are horrendous unless they are using full nuclear, chemical and biological (NBC) protection. But even more serious are the risks in densely populated target zones like Kabul - where DU oxide is likely to contaminate soil, buildings and water and be suspended in the Kabul "haze" seen in several media reports.

The claim above that Tora Bora and Shah-i-Kot might be heavily contaminated was proven to be true after UMRC investigation to the matter. They went to Afghanistan investigated to see whether there was any contamination, turned out to be true.

Then UMRC sent a second team of investigators to find the factors behind the contamination, guess what:

Background – the discovery of a new type of uranium weapon

Mass spectrometric analysis conducted by the NERC Geoscience Laboratory of the 8 urine specimens taken from selected subjects in the Jalalabad area, Nangarhar Province, May/June 2002, showed abnormally high concentrations of Uranium. Unlike UMRC’s previous research into radiological and heavy metal contamination of NATO conflict zones, which found Depleted Uranium (DU) in the urine of Operation Desert Storm soldiers, the Jalalabad subjects have abnormally high concentrations of Non-depleted Uranium (NU).

The concentrations of Non-depleted Uranium in the Jalalabad community subjects are 400% to 2000% higher than normal populations. This concentration of radioisotopes is not known to have occurred before in civilian populations.

The results of the analysis of the Jalalabad area specimens rule out contamination by depleted uranium, enriched uranium and/or uranium recycled from the nuclear reactor waste stream. The Jalalabad area subjects’ uranium signature cannot be explained by the any known geological or other features in the area. These anomalous research findings pose an unexpected investigative challenge to UMRC and NERC. One of the main objectives of Trip #2 was to investigate the variables that could explain these findings.

(UMRC report regarding Afghanistan)

Are ground troops and civilians at risk in "hard target" smart bomb and cruise missile target zones?

Reports from the Center for Defence information suggest that at least 500 tons of smart bombs and cruise
missiles have been used in the first three weeks of the Afghan war. They are most likely to have been used on
"high value targets" e.g. Taliban and Al-Qaeda command centres, airfields and other military installations.

 

Evidence to support that no DU weapons were used

Afghan 'health link' to uranium

The US military rejects claims that it used DU-containing bunker busters in Afghanistan.

Depleted Uranium

both the United Kingdom and U.S. governments denied using DU in Afghanistan

.....

 

Conclusion

There is clear cut evidence suggesting DU weapons were used in Afghanistan.

Go try to foul someone else, ATS denies ignorance, even if IGNORANCE IS A BLESS.

Watch from 9:40 and continue to the next part.



This proves, this so called research you refer to, is nothing but baloney.
The premise of your OP regarding chemical weapons has no grounds, since depleted Uranium has nothing to do with chemical weapons, and yes, I read the wiki.
Have you ever considered that deformed babies are born because of marriage inside the family?
You will find it is a very common cause for deformations, in areas that are not war zones at all.

not substantiated by the laboratory results of Afghan civilians and bombsites. The isotopic measurements are objectively reliable and cannot be misrepresented other than by intentional adulteration of the specimens

reply to post by oozyism

Originally posted by space cadet

posted by oozy
With the exception of Natural Uranium, alternative explanations are attributable to radio-isotopic signatures (ratios of isotopes of uranium) not substantiated by the laboratory results of Afghan civilians and bombsites. The isotopic measurements are objectively reliable and cannot be misrepresented other than by intentional adulteration of the specimens or intentional efforts to contaminate the population to mask the origins of contamination. Notably, the results of the analysis of biological specimens (urine) and the bomb-crater samples are compatible.

reply to post by oozyism

 

This statement you posted, is saying that the samples are not reliable, and not substantiated by the Afghan government.

yeah yeah, Oozy got it wrong again.

But if you were as interested in learning as you are in cutting him down, you might have read the article his quote was sourced from:
www.globalresearch.ca...
and realised the situation in Afghanistan is every bit as bad as he is making out.

Radiological measurements of the uranium concentrations in Afghan civilians’ urine samples indicate abnormally high levels of non-depleted uranium. Radiological measurements of Afghan civilians’ have high concentrations of uranium in a range beginning at 4 X’s and reaching to over 20 X’s normal populations. This is 400% to 2000% higher than the study controls and normal population baselines of the concentrations of nanograms of uranium per liter of urine in a 24-hour sample. UMRC has completed initial but still preliminary studies that corroborate these finding in biological controls and geological samples taken in Operation Enduring Freedom bombsites.
. . .
UMRC’s Field Team found several hundred civilians with acute symptoms and reportedly developing, chronic symptoms of uranium internal contamination (including congenital problems in newborns). All subjects’ on-set of symptoms are reported to coincide with the calendar dates of the bombing and were not present prior to the bombing. A randomly selected urine specimen donors’ sub-group was sub-selected out of the adult male population of the first-level triaged population. Males-only were selected to respect the cultural preferences of communities participating in the study. The sample and specimen collection method is outlined in UMRC’s study, which has been accepted for publishing and will be made available on this website following peer review.

The fact is, America as a country is completely immoral and is busily murdering innocent civilians in other countries in order to gain access to opium, gas and oil, in order to prevent oil being sold for Euros, in order to gain control of important pipelines and in order to keep the manipulative state of Israel happy.

Americans have been kept rich at the expense of other countries they were leeching off for years.
It's hardly surprising if some Muslims find it amusing that this time, instead of keeping the average Americans rich, it's ruined their country.

I'm not amused personally because America has been taken down by traitors who, in cahoots with Israel, orchestrated 911 in order to bring about this situation. They have made themselves personally rich while robbing Iraq, Afghanistan and America blind, and ensuring not one of these countries can now be called free.

Americans have lost quite a legacy while they smugly cheered as their troops stole that legacy from other countries. And, like stolen virginity, now no-one has it.

reply to post by gravitational


I already proved my point that DU or NDU can be classified as Chemical Weapons, anyone who wants to refute that, must see the definition of Chemical Weapons and compare it with the effects of DU and NDU.

By the way, you don't get contaminated with NDU or DU due to "marriage inside the family".

reply to post by Kailassa


Again I will point out that Operation Enduring Freedom is not just America. It is a coalition that is doing their work in Afghanistan. But just like Oz you are quick to place any and all blame on the United States of America.

This article is presented by Globalresearch website.

An independent research and media group of progressive writers, scholars and

[/quote

I don't see scientist, medical researcher, doctors, ect. They are an independant research group. Everyone on ATS is an independant researcher, collectively we are a group of researchers. Does that make every point and statement we make truth? I think not.

reply to post by space cadet


Then you have a disease, the "America can't do no wrong" disease.

Just re-read what you are posting.

You will realize after re-reading your post couple of times that you are more focused on the messenger rather than the message, because the message is rather convincing with immense amount of evidence.

Originally posted by space cadet

not substantiated by the laboratory results of Afghan civilians and bombsites. The isotopic measurements are objectively reliable and cannot be misrepresented other than by intentional adulteration of the specimens

reply to post by oozyism

 

How does that mean it is not reliable?

it says clearly afterwards that you can't misrepresent them unless you intentionally contaminate people.

reply to post by Kailassa


I am not interested in 'cutting him down', I have had private conversation with oz about family and life and I respect that he feels like he has been handed the short end of the stick, however citing truth is important when making such claims agains any country. He uses site that are not reputable. He uses sites for proof that are nothing more than propaganda slinging machines, and he doesn't get it that what he sees as truth is what he has been spoon fed to think the way he does. If this were not the truth, we would see him angry at a coalition, he would name each member of this coalition, but he doesn't think like that. He only sees america as doing wrong, leaving out truth, leaving out all other members of this coalition, he thinks the way he has been taught to think, through pure propaganda. I, amongst many here, try to show him the fallacy of that. Also his lack of understanding of the english language hinders his ability to fully understand the rebuttle as well. He doesn't understand that the Terhan Times will lie to his face to gain anti american sentiment, it will post that which it is told to post, and create 'facts' as it goes along.

Originally posted by space cadet
reply to post by Kailassa

 

I am not interested in 'cutting him down', I have had private conversation with oz about family and life and I respect that he feels like he has been handed the short end of the stick, however citing truth is important when making such claims agains any country. He uses site that are not reputable. He uses sites for proof that are nothing more than propaganda slinging machines, and he doesn't get it that what he sees as truth is what he has been spoon fed to think the way he does. If this were not the truth, we would see him angry at a coalition, he would name each member of this coalition, but he doesn't think like that. He only sees america as doing wrong, leaving out truth, leaving out all other members of this coalition, he thinks the way he has been taught to think, through pure propaganda. I, amongst many here, try to show him the fallacy of that. Also his lack of understanding of the english language hinders his ability to fully understand the rebuttle as well. He doesn't understand that the Terhan Times will lie to his face to gain anti american sentiment, it will post that which it is told to post, and create 'facts' as it goes along.

Look how this thread evolved from insults, more insults, accusations and blind belief, ----> to a constructive discussion where both sides are posting evidence pro and con, regarding the claim made by Tehran Times.

If you think I was more concerned about Propaganda, then I could have just posted a news ----> forget whether it is true or not -----> don't research regarding the claims -----> and don't get involved in my own threads.

This thread is evident that I'm concerned whether the news which I post is true or not, the fact that I have investigated all the claims Tehran Times have made, and the fact that I have pushed others to do the same shows something to me.

But

If you want to see everything as anti-American, so be it.

I don't put this much time and effort to stay blind

Then you have a disease, the "America can't do no wrong" disease.

reply to post by oozyism



Oz that is the problem, there is no 'immense amount of proof' in that article. It is no different than me sitting here writing about things I only have little knowledge of. I am a researcher. You are a researcher. Does that make either of us an expert on the subject? No it does not. If I call myself spaceglobalresearch does that make me an expert? Naming yourself globalresearch doesn't mean you are an authority on the subject.

The article says only males were tested. What the hell kind of medical testing is that, if babies are affected, why then are only boys tested, that in itself would make testing inconclusive. But the article states that the results are not proof. If I am reading something and then the same article tells me that what I am reading is not accurate, then I am not going to believe in it's accuracy.

Also, you did not address why you only blame America and not the coalition, please exlain why.

reply to post by space cadet


The report was conducted by

UMRC

I can't believe I have to do this all over again. Did you read their reports?

They were the ones who conducted the tests, took samples of dust in bomb sites, took notes from eye witnesses regarding the bombs that were dropped, the after math etc...

They actually went to Afghanistan, they are experts in their fields.

I have said this many times, and now have to say it again.

Go to Google, type "UMRC report", the second and third result of the search engine is regarding contamination in Afghanistan and Iraq.

These reports are not written by some amature researchers, but rather by experts, by doctors, Uranium experts and military advisers.

reply to post by oozyism


OK oz, just left the site for UMRC, they are located in both Washington and in Canada. The article you are refering to is dated 2005. They were supposed to update with futher findings, nothing in their findings was conclusive, it warranted further research. The last update to the site was in 2007, 3 yrs ago. I suppose by now they should have had a definate answer as to where the uranium came from, they mention several times that they do not know if is is a naturally occuring uranium or weapons related, they point out that no geological study has been done to prove it, but that bombs going underground could allow naturally occurring non depleted uranium to escape. In the begining of the report, they lean more towards this as an explaination. But no where in the article does it state that definately weapons were the cause, or that they came from American weapons, to the contrary, they do mention that no weapons used by US military contianed non depleted uranium.

Also, they still fail to explain who they are, who are their researchers, what are their qualifications, ect. So essentially they are the same as you and me. Consider why they never returned to their own website with conclusive information and not speculation. It has been over 3 yrs and they have not returned to the site.

edit to add: Wikipedia is asking for any reliable source third party to substatiate what the UMRC is, and states, they apparently do not consider them to be a reliable source, and ask that others substantiate that :

"This article needs references that appear in reliable third-party publications. Primary sources or sources affiliated with the subject are generally not sufficient for a Wikipedia article. Please add more appropriate citations from reliable sources"

No one ever substatiated it. No other party has come out to say that the UMRC is really doing what they claim or that they are done in any capacity, let alone a capacity to say is the truth.