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Assange has been misleading on wanting to stop the war - Revenge on the US

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posted on Dec, 6 2010 @ 02:26 AM
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reply to post by Xcathdra
 



To be technical he is attacking the National Security of the US be releasing information thathas nothing to do with any cause. His most recent stblackmail attempt is to tell the world if he is arrested, he is going to release his "insurance file".


Technical?? I'd say it's an opinion and nothing more..
I have heard many many experts in law state Julian/Wiki have done NOTHING wrong...
I'd say that is confirmed by the US not laying ANY charges..
Now THAT"S technical and FACT...

Unlike your WMD claim that I already proved wrong..

I don't mind your OPINIONS but not when you claim them as FACT...




posted on Dec, 6 2010 @ 04:12 AM
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reply to post by Xcathdra
 



I dont remeber people bitching about WWI, WWII, Gulf War, Korean war, etc etc etc.


Not until they found out what the hell really happened. And that is exactly what is happening NOW. The wars in the middle-east America finds itsself in and for which it has been portrayed as a bringer of freedom to the world - until the people find out what the hell is really going on. Like what is happening NOW. Can YOU comprehend this and let go of either side of the media and understand this is a pivotal part. Are you going to advocate for a clamp down on open government or not? YOU pick YOUR side...useless debater that you are. You talk about opinions and facts yet disregard the notion that even facts are subjective(golly gosh did you learn something new?)



So when the media reports on information released by wikileaks that puts the US in a bad light. When the media reports information that alls wikileaks into quetion, they are bought and paid for. Typical and not surprising.


You forget to mention that it puts the US in a bad light in YOUR OPINION. To anyone with half a brain the US has been in a bad light for decades, it is only BLIND people that get a peek at the real world and panic.


Again, people champion the media when they report the leaks and info, and again the media is making the guy out to be a crook. Maybe its because he is one.


It is because the released information cannot be denied or hidden from people anymore. Thanks to the internet. Of course the media is going to make them out to be crooks...it's what they are told to do by who pays THEM. Do you understand how the media works?


Do you think Assange has ALL of the classified information? Do you think the documents being released contain the entire story? If your answer is yes, then you need to learn how intelligence works, and how agency overlap occurs.


It does not need to contain the entire story, as the entire story is pretty obvious unless you are metaphorically BLIND.What it does do is stir up the pot for those people living in LALA land, such as yourself...now YOU are in the defense position, don't weasel your way out.


and as I said before, Assange is not on a quest for moral accountibility. He is doing this as revenge for his opinions of the US Government and people within.


I guess you have a magic ball that lets you peek inside peoples heads. Other than that...WHO CARES what happens to the US government? You as a citizen? Did you care when the US sponsored Iraq to invade Iran and kill citizens? Did you care when the US organized a coup in Iran? How about the Iran-Contra? Did you question your government back then or did you not care because you were too busy living it up in La-La-land?



People, entites, countries that want to take the Us Government to task, thats fine.


Yeh of course...empty words remain empty until said people, entities and countries have a leg to stand on. Guess what wikileaks gives them?


I would not throw stones in your glass house though. Just as Assange maintains the US has acted illegally, so has Mr. Assange.


You really don't understand. When it is the US government that sets up the laws and breaks them itsself, there is no way you can blame Assange for breaking any law unless you are afraid, afraid of the consequences that the US government can't avoid any longer.


Assange wants to hold the US accountible, yet refuses to account for his actions with the Swedish incident.

That has been long debunked. However, you using this as an argument this (relatively) late, while it has been debunked, shows part of your agenda and shines your beacon of ignorance. Further more it shows how much you don't UNDERSTAND.


Ironic really that people would support Assange and his actions, while condemning others. Thats the truely hypocritical part - Hold the US responsible for illegal actions, then wine when Assange is held to the same standard.


No. It is YOU who is whining, I am only reminding you that it is hypocritical of YOU and the US government to whine and you can rest assured that people WILL see this/wake up.


because they wont have the entire picture.

And you know this because once again, you have a magic ball that lets you peek inside peoples heads. And of COURSE, you do get the entire picture, that's why you can tell others they won't get it...right? Right?

Consider the last reply from me to you, you are way too immature in forming your arguments and thinking.



posted on Dec, 6 2010 @ 04:38 AM
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My opinion is everyone on ATS is looking for truth in some form so if this is too painful for some of you then why are you here on this site? Anway any good security agency should have contingency plans in place if their operations are exposed or facilities are under threat. My opinion is that the US already have and have done for years so I can't see why anyone is directly at threat of death by being exposed, so far we've had a list of personal opinions from diplomats and a list of vital facilities exposing... any good researcher with internet access could have worked that list out already and I bet there isn't any black sites on like area51 type places or hidden facilities so again it's much ado about nothing.
Finally we actually have one person Assange who is actually doing something with secret info we've been looking for on websites like this for years and I don't feel threatened by his actions. Not yet anyway.

This is just my opinion of course, feel free to shoot me down.



posted on Dec, 6 2010 @ 04:43 AM
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Originally posted by Xcathdra


My personal opininion is he seems to have taken it upon himself to make the citizens of the US non existant in terms of changing our Government. Instead of doing it through elections (which we did), Assange is ursurping the vote for a direct effort to crash the Government.



No offence but its not like the U.S. citizens are having much success doing it the old fashioned way. I think Assange is simply getting the ball rolling with a nuke instead of firecrackers (that is an analogy people).


Out of curiosity does this change anyones mind who were supporting Mr. Assange for his stated goal (end war)?


Not one little bit. May he live long and prosper!



posted on Dec, 6 2010 @ 04:46 AM
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Originally posted by Pervius
Assange is naive.


Our Government would kill every person with the Insurance file on their computer if they wanted to.

All they have to do is take some young kids in the Army and tell them they are part of a Special Ops Team to annihilate foreign spies in our country. They would kill Americans thinking they were "spies" or "terrorists" without batting an eye.

Our Government doesn't give one rats dairy aire about any of its citizens. We're all expendable in their grand scheme of things.


Ummm....you do realise that the 'Insurance file' was released worldwide don't you? I have a copy sitting on my computer here in Australia for instance. I seriously don't think the U.S. government has the capability or where-with-all to take out literally millions of people scattered globally.



posted on Dec, 6 2010 @ 04:51 AM
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I have never considered that Mr Assanges effort was in consideration of stopping war, his acts place many countries in a bad light, and could actually start wars instead of stopping one. He was not doing this for the reasons he said, that much is and was clear, he has an ulterior motive that we have not seen yet, other than to cause discourse.



posted on Dec, 6 2010 @ 06:42 AM
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Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by wcitizen
 


Disagreement is fine. I just find it offbase when a person states the reason for actions is to stop a war, while at the same time the actions suggest anything but.

Well, what do you think he should do to stop the war? Have you tried to understand how he believes his actions may contribute to stopping the war? What do you think of this reasoning on that?




To me, what Assange has done, is to tell the world that he has information that documents illegal actions taken by the US.



I know that is what you think, you've said it a number of times now. I actually don't agree with you, I think there is much, much more to this, but even if it were the case, if US has been acting illegally IMO it is good that it is being exposed. It's a good start.



He goes through ll the trouble and hoopla, telling the world anything and everything - except the information he says he has that shows illegal behavior.


That is blatantly not true. Illegal actions by the US definitely have been exposed, the problem is it's not the kind of information you personally wanted or expected.




Release it, or dont release it. Holding onto it makes about as much sense as placing a screen door on in the access hatch to a submarine.


Well, many, many people disagree with you there. You personally don't understand a value in releasing them slowly, you want it all at once, but that is only your view. Many people disagree and think the slow release is by far the most effective.


edit on 5-12-2010 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

edit on 6-12-2010 by wcitizen because: (no reason given)

edit on 6-12-2010 by wcitizen because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 05:27 AM
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Originally posted by wcitizen
Well, what do you think he should do to stop the war? Have you tried to understand how he believes his actions may contribute to stopping the war? What do you think of this reasoning on that?


Thats the problem I have been talking about. Assange claims his goal is to stop the war, but its very evident by his actions that his goal of stopping the war was nothing but a cover, to make his actions more palatable to people. What would go over easier to gain you smypathy:

* - stealing and releasing classified information while saying you are trying to stop wars
or
* - stealing and releasing information because you want revenge (which is what he is saying now)

Its bad enough we are at war and are loosing people on a daily basis.. Its even worse when those deaths are being used by Assange to push a personal vendeta against the US solely for revenge.


Originally posted by wcitizen
I know that is what you think, you've said it a number of times now. I actually don't agree with you, I think there is much, much more to this, but even if it were the case, if US has been acting illegally IMO it is good that it is being exposed. It's a good start.


And how do you expect for any person to be held accountible for actions when the evidence collected to bring it to light wont see the inside of a courtroom? Everything Assange is "wanting" from this, has been underminded by his own actions.




Originally posted by wcitizen
That is blatantly not true. Illegal actions by the US definitely have been exposed, the problem is it's not the kind of information you personally wanted or expected.


I have gone on record stating I have no problem with the US being held accountible for its actions. What I have issues with is the manner in which its being done. Had this entire incident revolved around something other than the US, people would be bitching up a storm as to how the information was collected and used.

You and others want action based on illegal activity, while definding Assange and his illegal activity - which undermines your own argument. Simply repeating to yourself assange did not break any laws simply does not make it true.

As far as not liking what I am hereing.. I would probably choose a different way of saying that since the supporters of Assange, who did not hear something they liked, namely Britain arrested, denied him bail and will extradite him back to Sweden.

What happened? Criminal attacks on several companies that interfered with business operations.

Dont look now, but the trm hypocritical can by applied to them.


Originally posted by wcitizen
Well, many, many people disagree with you there. You personally don't understand a value in releasing them slowly, you want it all at once, but that is only your view. Many people disagree and think the slow release is by far the most effective.


That is a BS argument and here is why. If his goal is to stop wrs and killing, as you and others claim, then holding onto information that could put a wrench in the gears and not releasing it is irresponsible. When you hold onto information that contains evidence of criminal wrongdoing, as you and others claim, and refuse to release it, making it an insurance policy to prevent arrest...

He is now keeping information secret, which is against the stated goal. Refusing to release the information can get people killed, where relase of the information could make an impact on stopping it. Refusing to release it goes against the stated goal of wikileaks, who claims to be doing this to stop the war and to force transparency with Government.

In lames terms its hindering prosecution, concealing an offense, obstruction of justice and blackmail using illegally obtained classified government proprty.


So which is it?

Assange is nothing but a hypocritical narcissistic self absorbed little man who has issues against the US. Instead of behaving like an adult, he is behaving like a spoiled 5 year old throwing a temper tantrum because he feels his actions are justified, and is pissed because he was arrested for his actions in Sweden.

The bulk of the support Assange has is not from groups who want to see wrong doing exposed. The bulk of the people who support Assange do soi because they feel they have a right to have access to classified information based on some delusional thought process that vastly over estimates their own self worth.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 08:29 AM
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reply to post by Xcathdra
 


I will agree to completely disagree with your perspective.

Peace.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 09:32 AM
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Originally posted by wcitizen
reply to post by Xcathdra
 


I will agree to completely disagree with your perspective.

Peace.



No problem.. I will continue to make the argument that people could care less about Assange, so long as they continue to leak classified information illegally obtained and illegally published. Even after Assange has gone on record stating his intentions are to get revenge on the US, you and others still argue he is a journalist and did nothing wrong.

As people have said to me, when is your blind loyalty to this ass clown going to stop? You guys really need to take a stepo back and look at whats going on.

Its kind of hard for you and others to make your argument supporting Assange, when he has done the complete opposite of his stated goals. He wants transparency in government, yet hides himself and financing of Wikileaks. He accuses the US of committing crimes, yet he has been refusing to answer the claims against himself with regards to Sweden. People arguing Sweden was part of rendition is a cop out in an effort to justify Assange's hypocritical behavior.

He has supporters who are so sure in their view of moral superiority, that they turn around and break the law themselves to hack into mastercard, bring down the swedish governments website, attack paypal etc etc.

He has not stopped any wars, contrary to claims by other members. He has no intention of stopping wars according to himself.

This is nothing but revenge by a person who has a need to feel superior to others, as his own staff has stated.

I am curious what excuses people will come up with if he is convited of a crime in Sweden, or extradited back to the US when we file charges.

Will it be another conspiracy... The powers that be conspiring against him?

Its always amusing whatching people demand others be held accountible, yet look the other way when its against someone they worship as a god.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 11:18 AM
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I respect your right to an opinion with which I strongly disagree, and I'm happy to concede the floor and let you have the last word.



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