It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Warp Drive - State of the Art - Taking ET Home

page: 1
16
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 03:19 AM
link   
Warp Drive - State of the Art - Taking ET Home



“We already have the means to travel among the stars, but these technologies are locked up in black projects and it would take an act of God to ever get them out to benefit humanity….. anything you can imagine we already know how to do.” - Ben Rich, former Head of the Lockheed Skunk Works

The Goal - Warp Speed!



Sci Fi Science - Building a Starship



Sci Fi Science: Traveling at Warp Speed

Meet Prof Miguel Alcubierre from the National University of Mexico



NOTE: Embedding disabled by request so click the picture or the link

www.youtube.com...

The Formula



When we speak of Warp Drives, we generally also think of Hyperspace;

Hyperspace

Hyperspace may refer to:

* in mathematics and general science
o A Euclidean space of dimension greater than three, see fourth dimension and higher dimensions (the original meaning of the word hyperspace, common in late nineteenth century British books, sometimes used in a paranormal context, but which has become rarer since then)
o A space with non-Euclidean geometry
o Minkowski space, a concept, often referred to by science fiction writers as hyperspace, that refers to the four-dimensional space-time of special relativity
o Hyperspace (topology), a topological space whose elements are subsets of another topological space
o Hyperspace (book), a book by Dr. Michio Kaku that attempts to explain the possibility of ten-dimensional space using string theory

en.wikipedia.org...

Minkowski space

In physics and mathematics, Minkowski space or Minkowski spacetime (named after the mathematician Hermann Minkowski) is the mathematical setting in which Einstein's theory of special relativity is most conveniently formulated. In this setting the three ordinary dimensions of space are combined with a single dimension of time to form a four-dimensional manifold for representing a spacetime.

In theoretical physics, Minkowski space is often contrasted with Euclidean space. While a Euclidean space has only spacelike dimensions, a Minkowski space also has one timelike dimension. Therefore the symmetry group of a Euclidean space is the Euclidean group and for a Minkowski space it is the Poincaré group.

en.wikipedia.org...

The Papers

Below is the paper written by Prof Miguel Alcubierre mentioned in the video, plus some others he wrote. There are many more by him and other scientists on Warp Drive at;

Los Alamos National Archives General Relativity and Quantum Cosmology

The warp drive: hyper-fast travel within general relativity
Miguel Alcubierre
lanl.arxiv.org...

Null geodesics in the Alcubierre warp drive spacetime: the view from the bridge
Authors: Chad Clark, William A. Hiscock, Shane L. Larson
lanl.arxiv.org...

Gravitational Collapse of Gravitational Waves in 3D Numerical Relativity
Miguel Alcubierre, Gabrielle Allen, Bernd Bruegmann, Gerd Lanfermann, Edward Seidel, Wai-Mo Suen, Malcolm Tobias
lanl.arxiv.org...

Metamaterial-based model of the Alcubierre warp drive
Authors: Igor I. Smolyaninov
lanl.arxiv.org...

The quantum interest conjecture in (3+1)-dimensional Minkowski space
lanl.arxiv.org...

Putting the Warp into Warp Drive
Authors: Richard K Obousy, Gerald Cleaver
lanl.arxiv.org...

Warp Drive: A New Approach
Authors: Richard Obousy, Gerald Cleaver
lanl.arxiv.org...

The warp drive and antigravity
Authors: Homer G. Ellis
lanl.arxiv.org...

Warp Drive With Zero Expansion
Authors: Jose Natario
lanl.arxiv.org...

Now then... I expect all you ATS geniuses to work this out as I could really use a working model by the end of the year




posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 03:36 AM
link   
I have read a bit about old Ben Rich and he is seems down to earth an a great reliable source from within.

Not doubt this drive has been built, tested and had the stamp of approval then buried in a vault some where never to see the lite of day regarding public knowledge and for commercial use.

Lets reinvent what already has


Nice post

edit on 1/12/10 by Bob Down Under because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 04:02 AM
link   
reply to post by zorgon
 



Now then... I expect all you ATS geniuses to work this out as I could really use a working model by the end of the year


I already have it 'worked out'.
Forget warp drive - and develop "Extended Heim Theory" f-t-l hyperspace propulsion. Warp drive requires consuming Jupiter-size masses of energy. EHT requires only spinning a strong superconductor magnetic field. Now which of those two sounds easier?


... and btw, ET never got here by warp drive in the first place. No one has ever reported a UFO, having warp nacelles engines attached.
ET's don't do warp drive... so we should not waste time on it either.



edit on 12/1/2010 by Larryman because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 04:10 AM
link   
 


off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 04:20 AM
link   
reply to post by pierre6000
 


WTF?

U posted in the wrong thread


Easy done



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 04:27 AM
link   

Originally posted by Larryman
reply to post by zorgon
 



Now then... I expect all you ATS geniuses to work this out as I could really use a working model by the end of the year


I already have it 'worked out'.
Forget warp drive - and develop "Extended Heim Theory" f-t-l hyperspace propulsion. Warp drive requires consuming Jupiter-size masses of energy. EHT requires only spinning a strong superconductor magnetic field. Now which of those two sounds easier?


... and btw, ET never got here by warp drive in the first place. No one has ever reported a UFO, having warp nacelles engines attached.
ET's don't do warp drive... so we should not waste time on it either.



edit on 12/1/2010 by Larryman because: (no reason given)


Hear hear...
I concure.. This would be much more prefered



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 04:50 AM
link   
It has been already discovered
:

www.zamandayolculuk.com...

No wonder with so many UFOs over Turkey



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 07:09 AM
link   
reply to post by zorgon
 


Zorgon... did Ben Rich ever state 'warp drive' specifically? Perhaps he was referring (in your quote of him) to a hyperspace drive instead.


If the Lockheed Skunk Works built the TR-3B gravity-shielding triangle ship... I don't see it as a warp drive ship either. But I do see it as being a hyperspace ship. No one has ever reported seeing any light distortion preceding or trailing a triangle ship. I think star-light would be distorted when passing through the compressed space-time, and the expanded space-time fields, leading and trailing the ship - resulting from a Miguel Alcubierre warp drive. But, my understanding of Extended Heim Theory hyperspace function is that the ship's spinning magnetic field releases a quantum force from extra dimensions. That force then alters normal matter to reduce it's mass. The now mass-less matter is then rejected by normal space-time, and thus forced into a hyperspace medium, where light speed is much greater. This process would not produce the compressed and expanded space-time fields to distort any background light near the triangle ship. But the mass-less matter of the ship it's self may look a bit funky. And there are reports by people having been directly beneath a triangle ship, that it's bottom displays moving waves of light distortion. So, this sounds more like the effects produced by Extended Heim Theory, than Miguel Alcubierre theory, to me. And another thing... Ed Fouche said the TR-3B was 'nuclear powered'. There is no nuclear power, that could fit within the TR-3B dimensions, that could produce energy equal to the mass of the planet Jupiter. So, I think the TR-3B triangle is using Extended Heim Theory hyperspace physics - derived from it's spinning magnetic vortex field, albeit generated from a spinning plasma, rather than a magnetic disc. And as Fouche said... the TR-3B technology is from reverse-engineered alien saucers. And they should know how to do space travel. Otherwise... there would not be any saucers here, for Skunk Works to reverse-engineer.


So, although Star Trek warp drive graphics are cool... I think Extended Heim hyperspace is the way to go for practical real faster-than-light travel. And with the side benefit of silent antigravity ship hover capability. I think you would have to wait a very, very, very long time for the Alcubierre warp drive technology. But the Heim hyperspace technology could be built now.


And S & F for the thread subject. I welcome the opertunity to pit hyperspace saucers against Trekies' warp drive.



edit on 12/1/2010 by Larryman because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 07:51 AM
link   
Some clarity for the interested in the problem:

translate.google.com...

P.S. Found the same on one another site. See “LOWER VOLGA: Black Triangle APPROACH” there.
Изменено 04.03.2010 18:50




edit on 1-12-2010 by realitydiscovered because: (no reason given)

edit on 1-12-2010 by realitydiscovered because: (no reason given)

edit on 1-12-2010 by realitydiscovered because: (no reason given)

edit on 1-12-2010 by realitydiscovered because: (no reason given)

edit on 1-12-2010 by realitydiscovered because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 10:17 AM
link   
reply to post by zorgon
 





“We already have the means to travel among the stars, but these technologies are locked up in black projects and it would take an act of God to ever get them out to benefit humanity….. anything you can imagine we already know how to do.” - Ben Rich, former Head of the Lockheed Skunk Works


Outstanding - bump and s&f, as usual.


That quote blows me away --- and I suspect that we'll find He3 involved in the propulsion/warping mechanism....ROC on.....


Side thought: with the ability to warp space, shouldn't it be possible to tone down the degree of "warping" low enough to enable a craft (of any proportions) to counter the effects of gravity? (hover/levitate - kind of like when you take your foot off the brake and yet remain stationary in a vehicle with an automatic transmission on a slight incline - the engine idle is sufficient to keep the vehicle from sliding backwards)

Zorgon - still waiting with baited breath for that thread re the deliveries, any idea on its eta??



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 10:26 AM
link   
It's still highly debatable that Ben Rich made the infamous comments that are often attributed to him. I've always been a big fan of the man, growing up as a Lockheed brat, and have tried to read up on him as much as possible (including his memoirs, which is a decent book).

Still though, it wouldn't surprise me if he did say such things.

The big problem though, with such advanced ideas, always comes down to power. The power needed by the equations is always mind boggling, and far in excess of even what we could imagine producing, let alone manage or contain. This seems to be where the aliens have us beat.
(at least for now). Another consideration is that we don't want to be atomized or transformed into energy, the first time we throttle up...



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 10:33 AM
link   
Well...Between Warp drive, teleportation and stargates, it's a wonder that we are still using the good old fashioned combustible engine !

I mean...What's the hold back, are we not ready for technological advancements, can't we cope with the mind numbing equations of light speed and warping space time, haven't we been exposed and "trained" enough with sci fi T.V. to expect the sci fi to become actual science fact !!!! ????



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 12:22 PM
link   
We have no chance or we cannot make it possible.



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 01:09 PM
link   

Originally posted by Larryman
Zorgon... did Ben Rich ever state 'warp drive' specifically? Perhaps he was referring (in your quote of him) to a hyperspace drive instead.


Not that I recall, but I can look. But listening to Boyd Bushman I would say no.. not Warp Drive... though MIT is working on that mega power supply

Levitated Dipole Fusion Confinement Concept using HE3 as the Fusion fuel. The system produces no watse and requires minimal shielding. HE3 is a lot safer than Mercury




Dipole Fusion Confinement



If the Lockheed Skunk Works built the TR-3B gravity-shielding triangle ship... I don't see it as a warp drive ship either. But I do see it as being a hyperspace ship. No one has ever reported seeing any light distortion preceding or trailing a triangle ship.


Though I know 100% that we have all sorts of Triangle craft, from small stealth UAV's to secret space planes... I am not convinced that this 600 foot 4 story tall TR3-B is real. Other than that Belgian single photo I have yet to see any images of triangle that show something of that size. And we DON'T test black ops craft over foreign territory...why? Because if it crashed, someone else could reverse engineer it. So if that Belgian sighting was real, then it wasn't ours


I have seen many pictures since, but any that are close up have all been shown to be fake. If you have any good shots point me to them will ya? three points of lights in the sky don't count without seeing the craft between them as any three lights make a triangle. And if it is a single ship, those lights do not change position in relation to each other beyond a small relative motion created by angle of view.

And this one is NOT a TR3-B






This process would not produce the compressed and expanded space-time fields to distort any background light near the triangle ship. But the mass-less matter of the ship it's self may look a bit funky. And there are reports by people having been directly beneath a triangle ship, that it's bottom displays moving waves of light distortion.


Well any hovering capable space craft would need a field of some kind. This distortion is why I say you will NEVER be able to show me a UFO in a CLEAR photo unless it is parked on the ground. The distortion would be like taking a clear picture through a jet exhaust.





Ed Fouche said the TR-3B was 'nuclear powered'. There is no nuclear power, that could fit within the TR-3B dimensions, that could produce energy equal to the mass of the planet Jupiter. So, I think the TR-3B triangle is using Extended Heim Theory hyperspace physics - derived from it's spinning magnetic vortex field, albeit generated from a spinning plasma, rather than a magnetic disc.


Well the NAZI were messing around with spinning mercury plasmas but I am not so sure we are still needing mercury plasma. I have documents showing HE3 deliveries in 1964. Since its rare on Earth... well you get my drift
I will post that soon, just no time to finish that project yet, as its a DEEP Rabbit Hole. The whole description of that TR3-B system is so weird.

And Ed doesn't really believe in Aliens
Nice guy but in the end his info on S4 and the TR3-B is second hand. He heard it from those he worked with, he does not have first hand knowledge... so leaves us back to square one.

Frustrating at times
Just once I would like someone to break silence and actually drop a photo on the table. While an insider testimony makes a great topic for discussion, and while an insider may convince you personally of his integrity in the end its still just a story without that photo. We give Stanton Freidman credibility when he says some UFO's are Alien spacecraft because he is a scientist, we call Bob Lazar a fraud (so does Stanton) Yet Stanton also doesn't have a photo of an Alien Saucer, or the TR3-B, or a scrap of Roswell metal.

Stories... that is all we have... OH and missing TRILLIONS annually from the federal budget


Federal Reserve Lost 9 TRILLION Dollars.



That is just for fiscal year 2009 alone... just LISTEN to that lady...

A couple more... I keep posting them because we here argue little stuff while all these billions vanish into a black hole of defense spending... and no one really bats an eyebrow

Cynthia McKinney Questions Rumsfeld on NORAD 9/11 Drills
FY 1999 2.3 trillion missing
FY 2000 1.1 trillion missing
www.youtube.com...

DyneCorp?
And listen to the replies

20 billion on computers that can't track the money


9/10/2001: Rumsfeld says $2.3 TRILLION Missing from Pentagon
www.youtube.com...

So we have the statements that we have the tech from many insiders
We have the massive amounts of money that they would need
Yet we also see by the responses in those videos that the guys running the place are morons


And in all this... we cannot get one lousy picture of a Triangle in a hanger... well other than mine





So, although Star Trek warp drive graphics are cool... I think Extended Heim hyperspace is the way to go for practical real faster-than-light travel. And with the side benefit of silent antigravity ship hover capability. I think you would have to wait a very, very, very long time for the Alcubierre warp drive technology. But the Heim hyperspace technology could be built now.
And S & F for the thread subject. I welcome the opportunity to pit hyperspace saucers against Trekies' warp drive.



Okay no problem...
an Extended Heim hyperspace drive system will work for my prototype too. When can I have it by? And 'anti-gravity' is a really bad term. Every time someone uses that they get laughed out of the peer circle and ridiculed. As long as lift is supplies, an ordinary airplane defies gravity. We need to use a new term. 'gravity shielding' is one, but not quite right either.

But they have a lot of papers on that at LANL too



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 01:09 PM
link   
Warp drive is a possibility, but imho in all likelihood it's got something to do with dimensional travel. All the ufo reports, such as dissappearing, reappearing, going into the ocean without making a splash, going into the side of a mountain and coming back out as a solid object...

ironically Carl Sagan here explains the idea of different dimesions and the possibilities inherent pretty well.
www.youtube.com...


imo a unified field theory (theory of everything) which we don't have could lead to how we could get it done, even at this point the promising theories postulate different dimensions that exist that govern the existance and behavior of particles and sub-atomic particles hint toward what could be possible. Though any understanding will be incomplete until science advances.

en.wikipedia.org...
edit on 1-12-2010 by redrezo because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 01:15 PM
link   

Originally posted by Gazrok
Still though, it wouldn't surprise me if he did say such things.


There was someone on another forum who had a tape recording of that speech and offered it to anyone who wanted a copy... unfortunately by the time I found that post the poster was no longer on that forum


Posted 10 March 2006 - 09:29 PM
“We already have the means to travel among the stars, but these technologies are locked up in black projects and it would take an act of God to ever get them out to benefit humanity….. anything you can imagine we already know how to do.” Ben Rich, former Head of the Lockheed Skunk Works

I actually have the entire speech on video....very....interesting, he died shortly after...imagine that


www.unexplained-mysteries.com...



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 01:16 PM
link   

Originally posted by Gazrok
Another consideration is that we don't want to be atomized or transformed into energy, the first time we throttle up...


I've got some bad news for you it's a possibility, but according to the theory of relativity E = mc^2
matter is already energy to begin with, as long as it's not a one-way trip and you can comeback down to earth in one piece that's all that's going to matter.



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 01:36 PM
link   

Originally posted by zorgon


Okay no problem...
an Extended Heim hyperspace drive system will work for my prototype too. When can I have it by? And 'anti-gravity' is a really bad term. Every time someone uses that they get laughed out of the peer circle and ridiculed. As long as lift is supplies, an ordinary airplane defies gravity. We need to use a new term. 'gravity shielding' is one, but not quite right either.

But they have a lot of papers on that at LANL too


The Theory of everything is still incomplete, but basically the idea behind the Extended Heim Hyperspace is pretty much spot on as it echoes my earlier post.

Imo it's definitely a better explanation for UFO's than warp drive.
en.wikipedia.org...

edit on 1-12-2010 by redrezo because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 01:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by Gazrok
The power needed by the equations is always mind boggling, and far in excess of even what we could imagine producing, let alone manage or contain.


What if the power equations are wrong? or maybe not wrong, but there is another way?

“We now have the technology to take ET home. No, it won’t take someone’s lifetime to do it. There is an error in the equations. We know what it is. We now have the capability to travel to the stars. First, you have to understand that we will not get to the stars using chemical propulsion. Second, we have to devise a new propulsion technology. What we have to do is find out where Einstein went wrong.” - Ben Rich

disclosure2009.blogspot.com...

I also have statements from Dr Joe Resnick along these lines and he gave me a sketch of a drive, but what I find fascinating is every time I dig up something, there is one name that ALWAYS pops up....

Dr Harold Puthoff

You talk about CIA Remote viewing Project Stargate, Zero Point energy, Roswell,TR3-B, UFO propulsion, Anti Gravity, etc etc... you will find his name. Even in that link above about Ben Rich you will find him..


In an e-mail, dated July 29, 1999, apparently addressed to Lindemann, McDonald referenced an excerpt of a discussion with Harold Puthoff, founder of the highly classified U.S. “remote viewing” program.

McDonald said: “Well Hal, you asked for it! Now that legendary Lockheed engineer and chief model kit designer for the Testor Corporation, John Andrews, is dead, I can announce that he personally confirmed the design connection between the Roswell Spacecraft and the Lockheed Martin Unmanned Combat Air Vehicles (UCAVs), spyplanes, Joint Strike Fighters, and Space Shuttles.


Funny that, all these sudden deaths by cancer... shortly after 'retirement' Werner von Braun too... at age 66, after he complained about NASA's involvement with arming space

Hal Puthoff and Bigelow go way back, The Aviary and NIDS connection
Hal Puthoff's name comes up so many times in stuff I research that I am beginning to think he is to me like the smoking man is to Fox Mulder


Smoking man



Hal Puthoff



I would say Dang good casting job



edit on 1-12-2010 by zorgon because: ArMaP did it!!



posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 01:58 PM
link   
I remeber reading a paper some time ago about the possiblity of warp drive. the science of Star Trek is not even close to what you need to make it work:

The paper stated taht you would need to create a warp bubble around your ship this warp bubble would them move through space at normal speeds but due to its composition it would actually move faster than light. the relativiey effects that happen when you approach the speed of light will not happen becasue teh ship never breaks the light speed barrier.

This is all from my memory but I wouldn't rule out warp drive yet.



new topics

top topics



 
16
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join