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Can China Invade Taiwan?

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posted on Nov, 15 2004 @ 09:57 PM
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The reason IMO that China has not attack Taiwan is that china doesn't know what the US response would be. If the US said categorically that they would not intervene I think we'd see the invasion force being assembled right now.




posted on Nov, 15 2004 @ 10:00 PM
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Originally posted by rogue1
The reason IMO that China has not attack Taiwan is that china doesn't know what the US response would be. If the US said categorically that they would not intervene I think we'd see the invasion force being assembled right now.


If US says so, there is no need for China to attack Chinese people in Taiwan, they will know that it is impossible to go independent and will turn to dialogue.

China is still trying everything before resorting to force.



posted on Nov, 15 2004 @ 10:20 PM
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i saw a bit in the print media the other day which said that 20% of taiwanese want independence declared right now. Apparantly this is the highest ever percentage. So it looks like there is atrend away from reunification.



posted on Nov, 15 2004 @ 11:42 PM
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Originally posted by zcheng
China is still trying everything before resorting to force.


:shk: are you for real??

Missiles aimed at Taiwan
The interception of the Taiwanese Presidents plane
etc etc

They seem bent on provoking a responce to give them an excuse. Well, they keep it up, the further they drive the Taiwanese away



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 12:50 AM
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Originally posted by aryaputhra

So, if one says the other is bluffing, surely the stronger one with all the ties should be taken seriously. US will definitely NOT instigate a war in the name of Taiwan. However, it will be deeply immature to 'assume' that if China does invade, the US will just sit back as several times US has warned that it will protect Taiwan. And the US will not bluff. If they say it, they mean business. (as in history, the cuban missile crisis proves, US was literally minutes away from a nuclear attack with Russia)

If Taiwan and Japan are under a potential attack from PRC, which is highly doubtful as it would certainly mean suicide for the PLA and the communist regime

This unfortunately, however as much as the PRC might want to interfere, is something the Taiwanes themselves will have to decide. Not the PRC.

If you look at North Korea and South Korea, both countries like to be united but the US will not let them unite.


Good listing, it is all the functional methods that US could use.

US won't sit back and just sell weapons for sure, but we know China is going to go all out for Taiwan, US won't, it is a fact that no one could deny. Expect US to pull majority of its forces to Taiwan to defend and severely weaken their international military influence, I think not, Taiwan is not that big of a chip. However for China, Taiwan means the total control of the borders and first step out of unification issues, it is a different standing point. Japan's economy is influenced by import and export prices, their cars have been a serious competition to many domestic auto sellers in western countries, Henry Ford even wrote a letter to Arnold suggesting banning the Japanese cars in CA (Hybrids in particular) proves it. I am not saying that US hates Japan, I am saying it will risk no more for Taiwan than it will risk for Japan, for European and mid-east interests, and for Hawaii, and then for Alaska, at last for the homeland America.

China is a country with the highest population, low comsumption, 4th largest territory, internationally influential and has the largest arm forces in the world with decent technology+the power to literally destroy the world.
Compare China to NK would be a bad idea.
You are also right about it is up to Taiwan to decide, whether it wants to go back to the homeland in peace, or in coffins.

[edit on 16-11-2004 by plutonian]

[edit on 20-11-2004 by plutonian]



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 01:05 AM
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Originally posted by twchang
I think there are a few reasons why US helps Taiwan defending against China.
1. to deny China direct access to the pacific ocean, and to protect the strait from falling under China's control (because it is a sea lane for the oil tankers going to Japan)
2. economic interests. Taiwan has strong economic relation with US, especially in electornic and computer sectors.
3. maintain its strong influence in Asia. Just to show that no one can be the aggressor to a democratic nation and dispute its power.

I don't know if this stuff is really important, this is for the US government and people to decide, but so far the US has worked hard to maintain the peace in Taiwan Strait.

I think if both Japan and Taiwan are under attack, US will have priority for Japan. However, Japan has a well trained and well equiped naval and air forces that are quite capable. If US is going to help, it is more likely that Japan and Taiwan defend themselves, and US pounds the source of attack with bombers and missiles, pushing the frontline into the enemy territories.

I don't think Japan is only a money generating machine or a puppet nation of US. The nation clearly has its own agenda. It just so happen now that Japan and US have the same interest.

I don't think China will attack US with nuclear weapon, that would be like suicide because US has a lot more nukes. Nukes from terrorists are more likely....


If you call selling weapons to Taiwan as "maintain peace", or sell it in full price as "help", of course.

Taiwan has always been a competition to S. Korea on electronics, US would like coordinate the two. If Japan is ever attacked by China, US has its full rights to help defending it, but for Taiwan? Give me a break, that is what we called "look for trouble".

Japanese doesn't want to be a puppet, it is try to get a security council seat to get some respect.

The number of nukes doesn't make a difference on this level, capable of destroying the earth 1 time and 20 times is the same thing, because we only have one earth.



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 01:37 AM
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Originally posted by plutonian

Not necessarilly an event, but a status, Japan is the only US watch tower in the north region of far east Asia, which has a almost direct access to Russia, NK and China, it defines the US interest and influence in Asia, without it, US will lost control over anyone in Asia, therefore lost their power in UN and world community, and since Eurasia is one continent and America is not a part of it, I think the chance is pretty big.

If Taiwan and Japan both under attack, which one do you think US is going to save or put in priority? What I mean is that if Taiwan get under US's wing, the Taiwanese will be considered to be second-class citizens anyway, no respect of their opinion whatsoever, just sucking their economy dry, that's what Japan is: US's money generating machine. Japan's WWII flip-flop policy didn't give a good impression to the world community, so I wouldn't bet a chip on Japan getting the seat, and US didn't give a damn about the UN's decision in the terrorism war would give US no credit, disregard the financial support from US (capitalists are powerful aren't they?
)and its military power, I would say Japan has not much chance, but you never know.

Either way, US won't put their land in danger of radiation because of little Japan, why so different for Taiwan?



Woah there!! So are you saying that China views Japan as "attackable" or are we just hypothesizing here?


Because IMHO in realistic terms China does view Taiwan as "attackable."



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 01:42 AM
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Maybe the word "if" just is just not appealing enough, if your intention is to shift the subject, that is another case.

I am stating US would not put Taiwan's priority over Japan. How much US could risk for Japan, will be the theoretical max support for Taiwan.



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 02:05 AM
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Originally posted by plutonian
If you call selling weapons to Taiwan as "maintain peace", or sell it in full price as "help", of course.

Taiwan has always been a competition to S. Korea on electronics, US would like coordinate the two. If Japan is ever attacked by China, US has its full rights to help defending it, but for Taiwan? Give me a break, that is what we called "look for trouble".

Japanese doesn't want to be a puppet, it is try to get a security council seat to get some respect.

The number of nukes doesn't make a difference on this level, capable of destroying the earth 1 time and 20 times is the same thing, because we only have one earth.


Oh, I don't mean selling weapon to Taiwan with full price as "help". It is kind of a mutual exchange. And actually US sold Taiwan an older cruiser for 5% of its original price...but I don't know if that counts as help because it is kind of like a garage sell. But there are other types of "help" such as intelligence. And long time ago, when Taiwan is still under Nationalists control, US gave Taiwan 3 giant stationary canons during "823 Artillary War" between China and Taiwan, and they are still operational today. Later, US gave Taiwan civilian aid such as medicines...etc.

However, I think US selling arms to Taiwan is a kind of maintaining the "peace," because without it, China would probably invade already.

But my original point on US trying to maintain peace is not about arm sell or helping Taiwan, but about US keeping its policy and communicate with both sides. Without US intervention, a war might broke out already. If China wins, it will have its reunification but it will be against the will of people in Taiwan, so that is not a true "peace" in a sense. If Taiwan wins, Taiwan will just declare independence, but many lives will probably be lost.

I am not saying that US is a Mr. Nice Guy or a dude looking for trouble. It always acts with its own interest in mind and in this case it seems to help the situation so far.


[edit on 16-11-2004 by twchang]



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 02:54 PM
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BUt the thing is, the CHinese population in China WILL STOP AT NOTHING to get Taiwan back, 1 billion people's wish outrules 16 million Taiwan citizens wish. As I said before, Chinese citizens will DEMAND a war with Taiwan if they go independant, if the government denies, then CCCP's have got a crisis on their.



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 03:43 PM
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Cowlan,
1 billion people in china want Taiwan back
.

They've done surveys in China and out and the average chinese peasant doesn't even know where Taiwan is, or if they know where it is they don't care at all about Taiwan.



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 04:09 PM
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I have to agree with you there. Its the CHiCOm governemnt that wants Taiwan back. How many people even care? And how accurate are polls if there is a gun to your back?



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 07:24 PM
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Originally posted by bodebliss
Cowlan,
1 billion people in china want Taiwan back
.

They've done surveys in China and out and the average chinese peasant doesn't even know where Taiwan is, or if they know where it is they don't care at all about Taiwan.



Well may I see proof of that or are you just ASSUMING. I already took five hundred million off the population just to compromise the some people who really don't care about the situation because there are people like that in every country. Its like not everyone votes for president kind of thing. But all the rest, yeah, they WANT TAIWAN BACK.



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 07:26 PM
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Well if you think the people doesn't want Taiwan back then WOW are you wrong. Go to any forum that has Chinese people in it and I mean mainland Chinese people and you'll find the answer.



posted on Nov, 16 2004 @ 11:26 PM
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Originally posted by plutonian
Maybe the word "if" just is just not appealing enough, if your intention is to shift the subject, that is another case.

I am stating US would not put Taiwan's priority over Japan. How much US could risk for Japan, will be the theoretical max support for Taiwan.



Agreed. It is not my intention to shift the topic as well. I am just trying to weasel out the inherent secretive desire that the chinese hold: they view Japan as annexable. As any conflict with Japan in the near future cannot involve Japan as the aggresor, nobody will allow that, hence by deductive logic, if Japan is involved in any conflict, it will be purely defensive in nature.

So much for China's isolasionist and xenophobic ambitions!!



posted on Nov, 17 2004 @ 03:12 AM
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COWlan wrote:Well if you think the people doesn't want Taiwan back then WOW are you wrong. Go to any forum that has Chinese people in it and I mean mainland Chinese people and you'll find the answer.


Why can't you just state your views and not drag the tortured minions of China w/ you.

The only people who care about the status of Taiwan are the freedom lovers around the world.

The CCP uses Taiwan as a justification to continue to build up of it's military, to take an island of questionable strategic importance. This is while 100's of millions of peasants suffer from health, pollution, education, unemployment problems.

I see delusion and propaganda in your statements.

I understand this has been the worst year ever for riots for food, employment, and unfair treatment in China. 10's of thousands of riots China-wide.

I don't see 1 billion chinese willing to risk their lives to 'TAKE BACK TAIWAN!!!!!'

I do see 1 billion chinese getting ready to kill every CCP magistrate and commie sympathizer. So watch out, COWlan.

VIVA THE REVOLUTION!!!!!!!!!!



posted on Nov, 17 2004 @ 09:38 AM
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Originally posted by bodebliss

COWlan wrote:Well if you think the people doesn't want Taiwan back then WOW are you wrong. Go to any forum that has Chinese people in it and I mean mainland Chinese people and you'll find the answer.


Why can't you just state your views and not drag the tortured minions of China w/ you.

The only people who care about the status of Taiwan are the freedom lovers around the world.

The CCP uses Taiwan as a justification to continue to build up of it's military, to take an island of questionable strategic importance. This is while 100's of millions of peasants suffer from health, pollution, education, unemployment problems.

I see delusion and propaganda in your statements.

I understand this has been the worst year ever for riots for food, employment, and unfair treatment in China. 10's of thousands of riots China-wide.

I don't see 1 billion chinese willing to risk their lives to 'TAKE BACK TAIWAN!!!!!'

I do see 1 billion chinese getting ready to kill every CCP magistrate and commie sympathizer. So watch out, COWlan.

VIVA THE REVOLUTION!!!!!!!!!!


US has people suffering as well, farmers forced to sell their lands to the banks, crime, drugs, school violence, AIDS, abortion, political corruption, pollution, unemployment...I can list as much as I want, but why didn't US take care of the problems first, then think about sticking its nose into everyone else's business? I think you are the answer. Despite the absence of supporting material and proofs, just your logic is contradicting. Tell me, who could represent the Chinese people if he is not Chinese himself? You? No wonder you "don't see".



posted on Nov, 17 2004 @ 01:27 PM
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Originally posted by Hawkssss
Kashmiris are proud inidans??? This is really funny and is that why they keep killing indians and attack your partliament in your capital??? What about the northeast region where the mongloids people are revolting agatinst indian landgrabbing and aggression for years. Hum, also the Khalistan problem is still well live. What about the dalits, aka untouchables who are converting to muslims and christians in mass due to ill-treatment by the 3% of Brahmins which you must have been. Funny, you are making india appear to be the only heaven on earth while chinese is twice richer and live 10 years longer than an indian on average.

Well let's see how our indian friend spin this website and it seems we chinese are small potatos compared with the kind of atrocities committed by the peace-loving indians.

Mass Murder in Kashmir

"Whether or not one agrees with President Clinton's policy in Kosovo, we went there to stop the `ethnic cleansing' of the Kosovars by the Serbian government. Yet we have averted our glance from a similar campaign throughout India , a situation the Indian Supreme Court described as `worse than a genocide.' This ethnic cleansing has taken the lives of over 250,000 Sikhs since 1984, over 200,000 Christians in Nagaland since 1947, over 60,000 Muslims in Kashmir since 1988, and thousands upon thousands of Dalits, Assamese, Manipuris, Tamils, and other minority peoples."

indianterrorism.bravepages.com...

[edit on 14-11-2004 by Hawkssss]



Umm...I dont want to go off topic again but I was reading this post again when I somethign dawned upon me....

You say that India is carrying out ethnic cleansing an opressing the minority community right?
Well chack this out commie:

Our Prime Minister Dr. Manmohan Singh is a Sikh!!
Our President Dr. A.P.J. Kalam is a Muslim!!.
And the most powerful political personality in the country now who is rumored to possess the "reins" of the government in power,
Sonia Gandhi is of foreign origin( Italy) an is a Christian!!

Not a single Hindu up there!! Thats the power of democracy.
The will of the many can overcome the albeit loud rantings of the the few religious fanatics, which ever religion they may be from..

I doubt China, even the US, can ever exhibit such unity in diversity esp at the political level.



posted on Nov, 17 2004 @ 02:14 PM
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Actually the Chinese government is very diverse. Lots of the representitives speak different dialects or have different accents.

10's of thousands of Chinese riots? man you gotta read the news and do some research.

Bad year for CHina because of "food riots"? Whats that? We just grew another 10% in GDP how do you say thats a "bad" year. We love the government and we are working to correct the places where improvements are needed.Then I guess America's depts are very "good" right now eh.
No body feels like war with Taiwan? here a link jczsbbs1.sina.com.cn... thats a link in a forum with over 1400 replies saying they would die to fight for Taiwan without any compensations except for honour. Man you are wrong bodebliss.



posted on Nov, 17 2004 @ 03:17 PM
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Based on Chinese government statistics quoted by Newsweek magazine, in 1993 China only had 8,700 mass protests, but last year it recorded 58,500. If social inequality isn't remedied, there will be serious problems in China's future development.

I don't think 58,500 protests is nothing.

Anytime 1400 brainwashed commies get together I'm sure they'll find someone to blame for their loser's complex besides themselves.

Why don't they jump and shout about the millions of acres given Russia

Oh, I forgot Russia has nukes. So China turns around and picks on some little island.


BULLY for you!

[edit on 11/17/2004 by bodebliss]



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