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Can China Invade Taiwan?

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posted on Aug, 16 2005 @ 07:16 AM
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Originally posted by Daedalus3
are you saying that the chinese wouldn't mind the infrastructural loss at Chengdu??!!


there will be retailation if they attack chengdu. eg. japan okainwa

america "entered" this war to protect taiwan not to widening the war.



Chengdu is fightertown, China..Don't lessen the importance of chengdu..


Chengdu aircraft company headquarters might be located there but diffinetly not the production areas.




posted on Aug, 16 2005 @ 07:36 AM
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Not much to it but interesting..

Tiwan - Normandy comparison



posted on Aug, 16 2005 @ 07:58 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite
is this meant to be sarcastic?

No.



any links to a german/french officer stating that fact or are you looking at some book of their ranges?

this is completey a waste of my time trying to convince you that they cant.

No need to look for officers, german planes are just as good as british or american ones.
Look up the EF and mirage.



not with the planes you said you are deploying

Yes we have, we used the RN task force in iraq.



yes a airplane flying non-stop with as much re-fuels as it needs can reach china.

I didnt say thats what they would do, you said that.


now why didn't the british do that in the falklands war? its pretty much the same distance.

Because there isnt enough fuel and enough endurance, but I never once said they would be based out of france or germany.




but the thing is their all doing something

No thier not.



in 24hours the US 7th fleet is going to sail from japan and somehow win air superioty over chinese forces and stop a chinese invasion force which has already landed. sounds pausible. (lol)

and i said that a follow on of the rest of the 100,000 troops could be ferried over. on chinas massive maritine fleet

maybe in your fairy land but this is the ral world.

Uhh yeah chinas massive fleet...



By the beginning of 2002, China had over two dozen amphibious landing ships and could transport a brigade of marines at one time, but could not carry enough supplies. China continued to build Landing Ship, Tank designs, although this type of ship had been largely abandoned by other countries.

www.globalsecurity.org...


A brigade is smaller than a division and roughly equal to or a little larger than a regiment. Strength typically ranges between 1,500 and 3,500 personnel

en.wikipedia.org...
Hardly 100,000 men...
They dont need to stop it, they would retake the island.



well not according to you its doesn't. deploy a airforce to be there in 24hours and win air superioty. hahaha

I said they could be in range within 24 hours. Never said they would be able to win it in 24.




what allies? anything that doesn't have any vested interest in china?

The US has many allies, china would lose several BIG customers if it angered them.


[edit on 26/02/2005 by devilwasp]



posted on Aug, 16 2005 @ 02:35 PM
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Originally posted by Daedalus3
are you saying that the chinese wouldn't mind the infrastructural loss at Chengdu??!!


Chengdu is fightertown, China..Don't lessen the importance of chengdu..

That is a stalemate.. whatever you're talking about Odium..But I would think that the Americans would try and screw china over by flanking them from Afghanistan, Bay of Bengal, Sea Of Japan and the Phillipines.. Now the tactical advantage that comes with such a wide variety of theatres is immense..
China's S-400s, FT-2000 etc.. etc..cannot stop B-2s and F-22s..And B-1bs also if im not mistaken.. The B-2s,accompanied by F-22s will be followed by B-52s and F-117s.. Targets will include infrastructural sites that will reduce china's ability to continuously supply forces in Taiwan..
They can take the Island.. but I'm not so sure they could hold it..
PACOM wouldn't go on an all out assault.. China definitely has the seige advantage in Taiwan..I presume they(PACOM) would be involved in "occupying" China's forces deployed to respond to the US..

I suspect the major thrust would come from The west..Aerial bombardment..

I may not like the US that much, but one's got to respect their sheer deployability and strike options.. They're innumerable..

They can't attack mainland China without declaring war, and having all out war between countries that big and powerful, it's gonna be one hell of a mess. It might even escalate into a nuclear war.

Like I said before, if any country wants to help Taiwan, the most they can do is defend Taiwan against PLA forces trying to attack, because Taiwan is disputed territory and not 100% soverign land of China so it's somewhat ok to have military units there. They cannot attack mainland China without declaring war. Declaring war against a soverign nation would make a lot of mess and I doubt any country, even the US, wants to go through the trouble of doing that just for the sake of a little island.



posted on Aug, 16 2005 @ 03:10 PM
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They can't attack mainland China without declaring war, and having all out war between countries that big and powerful, it's gonna be one hell of a mess. It might even escalate into a nuclear war.


There’s one little thing, once China attacks our forces then that singles their decleration of war upon the United States. Therefore as a retaliatory response the US has every right to respond and attack any part of china.



posted on Aug, 16 2005 @ 04:46 PM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23
There’s one little thing, once China attacks our forces then that singles their decleration of war upon the United States. Therefore as a retaliatory response the US has every right to respond and attack any part of china.

Um... no, that can happen without declaration. Only if China enters US territory or airspace does it have to declare war. Remember the Korean War and countless other "Cold" War era wars where the USSR fight with US via proxy states? No war was ever declared between USSR and USA or China and USA in the case of the Korean War.



posted on Aug, 16 2005 @ 05:51 PM
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Um... no, that can happen without declaration.


No it can not, when its a direct attack by forces of the Chinese with the intent to kill and destroy US forces in the area then its a declaration of war. What's this nonsense about needing to invade airspace to declare war on the US?



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:02 AM
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yeah.. I have to agree with westpoint on this one..
Any firing of a weapon or missile is a declaration of war.. where ever it may be..



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:12 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite


yes a airplane flying non-stop with as much re-fuels as it needs can reach china.

now why didn't the british do that in the falklands war? its pretty much the same distance.


They did.



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:17 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp

No need to look for officers, german planes are just as good as british or american ones.
Look up the EF and mirage.


you need training for flights llike these. you cant just hope on a plane on go to china.




Yes we have, we used the RN task force in iraq.


how many aircraft




I didnt say thats what they would do, you said that.


how would they make it in 24 hours then?



Because there isnt enough fuel and enough endurance, but I never once said they would be based out of france or germany.


exactly. it will take about 1 month to get there. and by the time they do the war will be over





Uhh yeah chinas massive fleet...


maritime fleet. i said that.






I said they could be in range within 24 hours. Never said they would be able to win it in 24.


from britian to china how long is it going to take to launch these planes?





The US has many allies, china would lose several BIG customers if it angered them.


they might be american allies but they have priority's.

they will lose more going to war with china then to stay out. countries like jaan or south korea are chinas largest trading partners.

22.4% for south korea and 13.1% for japan.

lost of nearly a quarter of their exports is going to have a huge affect on korea. and 13.1% for japan is even more larger because of their already huge debt. 164.3% of their GDP

[edit on 17-8-2005 by chinawhite]



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:20 AM
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Originally posted by Daedalus3
yeah.. I have to agree with westpoint on this one..
Any firing of a weapon or missile is a declaration of war.. where ever it may be..


examples of this are korean war and vietnam war.

the chinese an americans never declared war in either of these wars.

the korean war. you guys should know.

and the vietnam war the chinese mainly used the SAMs and AA guns shooting down american planes.



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:21 AM
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Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV


They did.



which planes.?



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:27 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite
Johnny doesn't own the country he represents us. we have to pass this vote in parliment first.

Australias deployments to afganistan and iraq are nothing. these countries do not do any sizable amount of trade with australia. they were deployed because of australias fear of terrorism not because america asked us to.


Australia? Fear terrorism from Afghanistan and Iraq? What planet are you living on?

Neither deployment was because Australia feared terrorism.

Australian deaths at the hands of terrorists have all come in Indonesia (except for two tourists killed by the IRA in the Netherlands) post the liberation of Afghanistan. And those terrorists were Indos, not Afghanis or Arabs. Do you know where Bali or Jakarta are and when the bombs went off?

We went to Afghanistan because Johnny was determined to show Australia mattered (and it was the right thing to do) and we went to Iraq because Johnny was determined to stand shoulder-to-shoulder with George and Tony (and he believed it was the right thing to do). We went to Gulf War 1 and Somalia because traditionally where the yanks have gone, we've followed (and it was the right thing to do).

We went to Korea because it was the right thing to do and we were determined to show the UN could work. We went to VN because we were in bed with the Yanks (and there were Reds under it, the Libs said so!) and we'd bought into the whole commie paranoia problem, not too difficult to understand when you consider we'd only just been fighting them in Korea and Malaya.

And perhaps you haven't been watching the news lately, but Johnny does own the country now, the ALP has a minority in the senate. Therefore, with a little party and coalition unity, Johnny can pass any legislation he wants. As for declarations of war, read the constitution.



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:29 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite

Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV


They did.



which planes.?


Vulcans.

They even did it with C130s so David Chaundler could parachute into the ocean and take command of 2 Para after H Jones was killed winning his VC.

[edit on 17-8-2005 by HowlrunnerIV]



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:42 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp

Hardly 100,000 men...
They dont need to stop it, they would retake the island.




It is estimated that the large and medium amphibious ships in service with the PLA could lift a whole heavy armour division, or 1.5 to 2 light infantry divisions and their some equipment in the first wave of a regional amphibious assault. However, if take the sealift capabilities of smaller landing crafts and merchant ships into account, the aggregate lift of China’s amphibious forces could reach as many as five divisions (60,000 troops and their equipment).

www.sinodefence.com...

this is in the first wave but in 24hours the ships could sail back to pick up more troops and arrive. and more un-armoured ships could be used for Logistics.

this does not include the PLAAF. airborne forces. which could carry a whole airborne division into taiwan. that is 70,000 troops in the first wave.

this would that 3-4hours to cross the taiwan strait and roughly the same time back. they still have 16hours to get organized for the second wave before the US Kitty Hawk comes. the US Kitty Hawk is the only forward deployed carrier in the pacific. with 85 planes. not all fighters.

the other US carriers are not located near taiwan and would take time to get there. or you going to tell have have teleportation?



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:44 AM
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Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV
Vulcans.

They even did it with C130s so David Chaundler could parachute into the ocean and take command of 2 Para after H Jones was killed winning his VC.


in the falklands?.

anyway why are we talking about the vulcan. we are talking about fighters.



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:47 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite

Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV
Vulcans.

They even did it with C130s so David Chaundler could parachute into the ocean and take command of 2 Para after H Jones was killed winning his VC.


in the falklands?.

anyway why are we talking about the vulcan. we are talking about fighters.


Yes. Read any history of 2Para.

Irrelevant. You asked the question. The question was answered. You did not specify fighters.



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:59 AM
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Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV
Australia? Fear terrorism from Afghanistan and Iraq? What planet are you living on?


muslim extremist.



Neither deployment was because Australia feared terrorism.


not according to the newspapers. fear of saddam giving chemical weapons to terriost.



Australian deaths at the hands of terrorists have all come in Indonesia (except for two tourists killed by the IRA in the Netherlands) post the liberation of Afghanistan. And those terrorists were Indos, not Afghanis or Arabs. Do you know where Bali or Jakarta are and when the bombs went off?


they might be indonesians but they haev "links" to al-Qa'ida.



We went to Afghanistan because Johnny was determined to show Australia mattered (and it was the right thing to do) and we went to Iraq because Johnny was determined to stand shoulder-to-shoulder with George and Tony (and he believed it was the right thing to do). We went to Gulf War 1 and Somalia because traditionally where the yanks have gone, we've followed (and it was the right thing to do).


any links or proof of the reason we went to iraq or afganistan. because your way is not what the news reports?



We went to Korea because it was the right thing to do and we were determined to show the UN could work.


no, to stop the spread of communism.



We went to VN because we were in bed with the Yanks (and there were Reds under it, the Libs said so!) and we'd bought into the whole commie paranoia problem, not too difficult to understand when you consider we'd only just been fighting them in Korea and Malaya.


no, to stop the spread of communism. the domino effect. they were thinking if we let vietnam fall then cambodia would fall then the rest of south-east asia would to. by that time the commies would be at out door-step.

your reason of why we went into vetianm because of the americans is absurd.



And perhaps you haven't been watching the news lately, but Johnny does own the country now, the ALP has a minority in the senate. Therefore, with a little party and coalition unity, Johnny can pass any legislation he wants. As for declarations of war, read the constitution.


he might have the majority of the seats but he hasn't got his way in telstra yet. and the new legitimation on workers rights.

remeber recently the truckers riding into Canberra



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 02:02 AM
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Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV


Yes. Read any history of 2Para.

Irrelevant. You asked the question. The question was answered. You did not specify fighters.


sorry about that. i throught devilwasp said that. because me and him were talking about fighters

[edit on 17-8-2005 by chinawhite]



posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 02:07 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp

Because there isnt enough fuel and enough endurance, but I never once said they would be based out of france or germany.



you never said based out of germany or france because we were talking about the german and french airforce. but i mentioned that if you could do that the british would have done that in the falklands.




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