Can China Invade Taiwan?

Originally posted by wrtworthy
Can China re-take twain?

This question is being asked in many Western countries at the moment, the main reason for this is because of the consequences could lead to a third world war?

This is a real possibility. For China, there is no way to back down when it concerns the territorial integrity of China. Taiwan is part of China, and China will defend the claim at any cost. If US is determined to intervene, it will leads to destruction of both US and China.

the one thing you may get is another Chechnya, with gorilla warfare being mounted against Chinese troops.

There is a possibility, but not likely. You have to understand the PLA is the king of all Gerilla affairs. You also have to note that the majority of people in Taiwan consider themselves as Taiwanese and Chinese at the same time. We can tell who is correct when we look back in 20 years.

The problem is for the Chinese, I don�t think they could do it (in terms of military, not political) first of all, U.S has been surrounding China with the Missile Defence programme, EU, Australia, Japan etc, slowly a ring is being formed around China, therefore if the Chinese was to use a Missile strike to open the war, they would be shot down, also would like to use the fact that the US has developed Laser Technology that shoots down incoming missiles, which they sell to twain and other Allies.

The problem of US intended intervention is the lack of concrete place to launch sizable forces. If those bases in Japan, Korea, Singapore, Australia etc are used to attack PLA, they will be attacked and destroyed. Carriers are the main targets of recent exercises. From the information I have acquired, China has the ability to take out US carriers near Chinese coast (within 1000 km). Without carriers or airfields, US good airplanes are just a pile of junks.

With respect to Laser technology, I believe China is actually leading US. US airplanes and missiles will soon find themselve need to confront J10, Su-27, Su-30, etc, various kinds of anti-airplane missiles, and powerful lasers as well.

... American would take out Chinese ships, Aircraft carries, Transport Boats before they would even reach Twain, and to be honest I think any Air-war between China and the US, The US would win simply because they have the better Aircraft.

You are actually assuming that US carriers are invincible. In fact, they will face the greatest danger near the coast of China, as they are the most valuable target, and face the possible attack from land-based missiles, submarines, land aircrafts, etc. US will wage a huge bet in intervention with US carriers.

US has good aircraft. You also have to admit that Su-27, Su-30, J10 are good too. By the ways, there are potentials thousands of un-manned aircrafts converted from out-dated fighters.

China could take Twain but would suffer heavily and it would become a another Chechnya, While the rest of the world would put trade blocks are China and screw over Chinese economy, so china might win the battle but by moving against Twain could cost china the second cold war before its fully started.

Yes, in such a war, Taiwan will be in rubbles, and will still belong to all Chinese people. The problem need to be answered is : What will be the cost of China, and US, and which one can and will endure such loss for Taiwan. You may alway think that US can hit anyone hard, and no one can hit US severely. Today at least two nation can do that: Russia and China. When you do intervene in Taiwan, please do figure out the consequences first.

[edit on 5-9-2004 by zcheng]

Originally posted by devilwasp
firstly what is the role of the government? to serve the people ,elected by the people for the people. also IF those people dont want to be part of that government then they can leave. now when taiwan declared independace it made a statement "we will not be ruled by you!" now why dont you just face it they dont want you!

Seems you are very happy with the "elected" (by "Supreme Court" )president Bush Misadministration, since it is for your interest, and for the interest of US people, for those died in Iraq, for those died in Afganistan, and those out of work. Face it, you love Bushy.

Originally posted by devilwasp
so your saying your willing to nuke taiwan JUST to get it back to the mainland? your crazy! that is not comunist thinking! they should not be called that! its more right winged than left winged.

China will trying everything to avoid the war in Taiwan. We Chinese understand that it will be the greatest tragedy imaginable for Chinese to attack and kill Chinese. We also understand when it comes to defend the territorial intergity and sovereignty, all options are on the table including nukes. US declared to the world, that US would use nukes if Saddam dared to use chem weapons in first gulf war. When China is facing live and death, no option should be left unconsidered.

Originally posted by zcheng
We also understand when it comes to defend the territorial intergity and sovereignty, all options are on the table including nukes. US declared to the world, that US would use nukes if Saddam dared to use chem weapons in first gulf war. When China is facing live and death, no option should be left unconsidered.

So are you implying that China would use WMD in a first strike scenario? Im really hoping that you have fallen prey to your governments propaganda and that they have a more benign view. That being said. Taiwan's WMD is fairly limited and I doubt that they would use what they have 1) in a first strike scenario and 2) I doubt they would use CBW's over thier own territory.

Well, zcheng and Victorwoo have drawn a pretty picture of their own destruction and how it will come about. Your nationalistic leanings (heil,Hu!)will not save you when the bombs fall.

Your payed agents of the CCP, right?






[edit on 9/6/2004 by bodebliss]

Originally posted by VictorWoo

What a simple guy you are. What a BIGGEST joke it is.
let's construct a scene:
suppose a California family doesn't like the US. goverment
so one day , it announce: "we want to independ! "
and the family hold a vote, and the result is to independ.
so, the father take up the post of president, the mother to be foreign mission, uncle to be the premier.
brother indites the national anthem, sister embroider the national flag.
then select a day to be "independance day"..
and the living room to be the goverment office place.
So , DO you think this California family is within the law.

it's only make a laughingstock of themself before their neighbor.

i'll take that as a complament before i go and flame your ass to Bardiel and back.
exscuse me is taiwan on the mainland? NO. it can leave if it wants. i mean look at the rep of ireland they faught for thier independance and now thier free of the UK gov.

Taiwan, oh Beautiful Island!

You have won your freedom with your constant effort toward democracy and rule of law.

You are a true example to the downtrodden souls of the asian people across the world. May their deliverance come soon so they might join you in the celebration of this newfound liberty. Any other outcome would be travail. Any other outcome would be tragic for all.

Last week we learned that a law mandating Taiwan's unification has been drafted in Beijing.

Perhaps it is simply to persuade Chinese that they should risk their lives in the dubious enterprise of stopping their Han brethren on Taiwan from enjoying the freedoms that they long for themselves.

Taipei Times

Or maybe it's easy to persuade the enslaved to enslave others.

We only have to look at Hitler's Germany!

[edit on 9/6/2004 by bodebliss]

Originally posted by VictorWoo
i've to remind the discuss friends that:
not the vote can decide everything.
at first, you must have a impersonal judge if the goverment is legal, if the vote is legal.
the answer directly decides whether the result of vote is leagle.

let's come back to this Taiwan problem
unfortunatelly, Taiwan "goverment" is a unlawed goverment.
about this, i think there is not much problem.
anyone not very clearly can red some literature about UN. or ask bush.

so , if a vote held by an unlawed goverment is legal ?
perhaps the vote is too weak because it has no root.

maybe, it collide with some American logic.
indeed, it doesn't.
American logic insist vote to decide everything.
but, any wise people will notice the validity of the vote.

so, i think American and Chinese can educe the same answer about this Taiwan problem.

what so its an illegal goverment, sowhats the law that says that you cant have your on goverment? eh? tell me!
the fact of the matter is that china want that country to show that thier not prepared to allow seperatist's to break up their country. i mean its like the NI situation, why doesnt china leave them alone?

Originally posted by VictorWoo
Taiwanese have no right to vote, from juristical angle.

thats called opression and funny how thats very common trade in comunist rip off states.
and also if you want to gt right about the party then you should say its maoism not comunism.

Originally posted by zcheng


Seems you are very happy with the "elected" (by "Supreme Court" )president Bush Misadministration, since it is for your interest, and for the interest of US people, for those died in Iraq, for those died in Afganistan, and those out of work. Face it, you love Bushy.

who said i was american?
secondly i would rather have a democrocy than a comunist rip off, like you have. also that thing in afganistan it was justified but NO you just had to say they died in vain. well let me ask you something. where was china when the UN went into afganistan to destroy the tailiban? huh? oh wait you didnt care about international terrorism because you can gain from it.
you didnt care over several thousand people died ,some of your own citizens i believe as well. seems a bit suspisios.
also i hate bush if you actually read my posts.

Originally posted by zcheng
China will trying everything to avoid the war in Taiwan. We Chinese understand that it will be the greatest tragedy imaginable for Chinese to attack and kill Chinese. We also understand when it comes to defend the territorial intergity and sovereignty, all options are on the table including nukes. US declared to the world, that US would use nukes if Saddam dared to use chem weapons in first gulf war. When China is facing live and death, no option should be left unconsidered.

actually i doubt the US would use nukes that was just a braganing chip.
china faceing life and death? china is in no danger from taiwan unless somehow the taiwanese have nukes.

Originally posted by bodebliss
Well, zcheng and Victorwoo have drawn a pretty picture of their own destruction and how it will come about. Your nationalistic leanings (heil,Hu!)will not save you when the bombs fall.

Your payed agents of the CCP, right?






[edit on 9/6/2004 by bodebliss]

i wouldnt call them comunists more like some right winged monsters on steriods

Originally posted by zcheng


This is a real possibility. For China, there is no way to back down when it concerns the territorial integrity of China. Taiwan is part of China, and China will defend the claim at any cost. If US is determined to intervene, it will leads to destruction of both US and China.

dont just think it is just the americans we british im sure would stand with america.

There is a possibility, but not likely. You have to understand the PLA is the king of all Gerilla affairs. You also have to note that the majority of people in Taiwan consider themselves as Taiwanese and Chinese at the same time. We can tell who is correct when we look back in 20 years.

oh really? care to exsplain. also your not thats more like the veitenamese.

The problem of US intended intervention is the lack of concrete place to launch sizable forces. If those bases in Japan, Korea, Singapore, Australia etc are used to attack PLA, they will be attacked and destroyed. Carriers are the main targets of recent exercises. From the information I have acquired, China has the ability to take out US carriers near Chinese coast (within 1000 km). Without carriers or airfields, US good airplanes are just a pile of junks.

oh really with what? outdated rusian rockets even the russians think their outdated. china has the ability to swarm them BUT you forgot to remember something, most of the US surface fleet is designed to take out aircraft as well as the RN. now are you prepared to take on ships specificallt designed to destroy enemy planes?
and also one thing you gota rem we dont need to sail up to your coast. just need to put a net around taiwan then move slowly in.

With respect to Laser technology, I believe China is actually leading US. US airplanes and missiles will soon find themselve need to confront J10, Su-27, Su-30, etc, various kinds of anti-airplane missiles, and powerful lasers as well.

oh wow the j10 now let me see what its equal to? my my the F-16 which to my information ,please correct me americans if i am wrong, is no longer in service in the US airforce and now they have F-18's which are superior. also the US does have probably a squadron of F-22's now and by the time the PLA get ready they would have a fully working squadron of the most advanced plane in service todate.

You are actually assuming that US carriers are invincible. In fact, they will face the greatest danger near the coast of China, as they are the most valuable target, and face the possible attack from land-based missiles, submarines, land aircrafts, etc. US will wage a huge bet in intervention with US carriers.

no we're just assuming that chinese ships are rusty russian hulks. oh wait they ARE.
also if your subs can penetrate a carriers net system while its suface fleet is pounding away with sonar then the RN will be called in, the masters of anti sub warfare, over 60 years of exsperience we have the best anti sub helicopters in the world. also your top sub is a kilo. stealthy BUT is not undetectible.

US has good aircraft. You also have to admit that Su-27, Su-30, J10 are good too. By the ways, there are potentials thousands of un-manned aircrafts converted from out-dated fighters.

unmanned air craft? please tell me when the PLAA managed to aquire unmanned tceh cause the most advanced companies have just finished working on small planes now if you can get a fully operational plane to be unmanned then you must of stolen one massive load of tech info.

Yes, in such a war, Taiwan will be in rubbles, and will still belong to all Chinese people. The problem need to be answered is : What will be the cost of China, and US, and which one can and will endure such loss for Taiwan. You may alway think that US can hit anyone hard, and no one can hit US severely. Today at least two nation can do that: Russia and China. When you do intervene in Taiwan, please do figure out the consequences first.

[edit on 5-9-2004 by zcheng]

the chinese cant hit the US severely because they dont have any tech possible of doing it, they havent got the ICBM's to do the job. they havnt got the long range bombers to do it, they dont have the subs to do it. face it you dont have the range.
russia ,who i respect greatly great country, have not got the monet but if they got money they could BUT they dont want to, they've tried the coldwar and i think both sides agree that it was not fun.
also if YOU invade taiwan prepare for the counter attack of the centuaryy, nothing will be as big as this would be. not even overlord.

Devilwasp

what so its an illegal goverment, sowhats the law that says that you cant have your on goverment? eh? tell me!

First off China has no leaders.

The only illegit government is the CCP.China does not have a government. What they have is a mofia , a criminal gang the CCP is China . It dictates to all . The CCP rides the tigers shoulders and if they ever dismount China will rip them to pieces.The CCP cares nothing about the chinese people only carting off wealth and holding on to power. Just like the illegit KMT in Taiwan, but that is now history. Some day the CCP will also be history.When that happens and the chinese are their own masters China will break-up like the old USSR .

Ha, Ha!

I understand the Scots have taken up devolution. Some say the movie BraveHeart had a hand in the awakening of Scottish nationalism, but the Scots didn't turnaround and attack England, did they?

Originally posted by bodebliss

I understand the Scots have taken up devolution. Some say the movie BraveHeart had a hand in the awakening of Scottish nationalism, but the Scots didn't turnaround and attack England, did they?

thanks for exsplaining it tome mate but please tread VERY softly on the ground your on.

Originally posted by devilwasp
who said i was american?
secondly i would rather have a democrocy than a comunist rip off, like you have. also that thing in afganistan it was justified but NO you just had to say they died in vain. well let me ask you something. where was china when the UN went into afganistan to destroy the tailiban? huh? oh wait you didnt care about international terrorism because you can gain from it.
you didnt care over several thousand people died ,some of your own citizens i believe as well. seems a bit suspisios.
also i hate bush if you actually read my posts.

If you are not american, I do not care much for what you think, because you can scream anything, and has nothing on the line. I am intended to talk to American friends and tell them the severe consequence fo US intervention in Taiwan strait.

By the way, if you think "Democratically Elected" government will represent the interest of people, why then you hate Bush? Are you against Democrazy? I know Hitler was also democratically and overwhelmingly elected, do you support him and admire him?

Originally posted by bodebliss
Taiwan, oh Beautiful Island!

I bet you home is also beautiful, why do not you declare Indepedence and elect you as the president?

Originally posted by devilwasp
dont just think it is just the americans we british im sure would stand with america.

Who cares what Brits like you think. To most people, UK is only a dog diligently licking the ass of US, and patiently waiting for US to pass some favor.

If you have ball, why not protect your interest in Hong Kong? In todays world, not many care you brit anymore, and only consider you a barking dog of US.

Originally posted by bodebliss
The only illegit government is the CCP.China does not have a government. What they have is a mofia , a criminal gang the CCP is China . It dictates to all . The CCP rides the tigers shoulders and if they ever dismount China will rip them to pieces.The CCP cares nothing about the chinese people only carting off wealth and holding on to power. Just like the illegit KMT in Taiwan, but that is now history. Some day the CCP will also be history.When that happens and the chinese are their own masters China will break-up like the old USSR .

Just wait for your pipe dream to come true, till you become dust. US hegemony in the world will soon become what Brits is today.

Originally posted by devilwasp
Who cares what Brits like you think. To most people, UK is only a dog diligently licking the ass of US, and patiently waiting for US to pass some favor. If you have ball, why not protect your interest in Hong Kong? In todays world, not many care you brit anymore, and only consider you a barking dog of US.

Well Devilwasp, be warned you are about to go on ZChengs Ignore List. Welcome. You have posted effective arguments, he cannot counter, so he add you to the ignore list.


[edit on 6-9-2004 by FredT]