Is the madhi the coming Antichrist? (video's included)

Originally posted by inforealOne reason Islam was given to the world was to balance the negative energy the Christian culture was initiating through the false doctrines of Christianity

so Islam is bringing positive energy into the world?

www.cbn.com...

Originally posted by works4dhs

Originally posted by inforealOne reason Islam was given to the world was to balance the negative energy the Christian culture was initiating through the false doctrines of Christianity

so Islam is bringing positive energy into the world?

www.cbn.com...

Put it this way, Muslims didn't cook up the Holocaust, the Inquisition, the TransAtlantic Slave Trade, the slaughter of 500 million native Americans in South and North America, the Heart of Darkness African colonialism, the Australian Aboriginal genocide...etc.

Could it be that Christianity is really a from of satanism or it has satanic influence? Just asking on account of the Christian made body counts.

reply to post by Ilovecatbinlady


Put very well but it is more to it than that.
Imagine the world without Islam in the middle ages when Christianity was in the dark ages. It was Islam that revived the religious sciences and the natural sciences where the Catholic Church would destroy any thing outside of its own doctrinal dogma.

Not only is it that Christian doctrine is just outright falsehood with no basis in historical, intuitive, religious, metaphysical or mystical fact, but the over concentration on the christ figure is perverted and has a bad effect on the human consciousness--it is imbalanced and abnormal.

God has and doesn’t need a son nor does the universe require some kind of sacrifice on a cross as the primitive doctrine of Christianity claims without foundation anywhere.

Indeed, everyone who has studied the history finds out that this pagan doctrine of a lamb was taken from many existing cults that were around at the time of the foundation of the idea of Christ as God incarnate.

Here is the common sense proof:

What in the universe requires that a man of god has to be tortured on a cross for human redemption?

What is the metaphysical basis of that doctrine?

reply to post by inforeal

What in the universe requires that a man of god has to be tortured on a cross for human redemption?

That is a perversion and suggests that God is merciless. It is the kind of pervesions you will get from a wife beater, ie; I did it because I love you...!

"Christianity = negative to Islam" or "Islam = negative to Christianity" both are you just a perception of views of what religion you have. I am not religious but I keep an open mind for everything.

Originally posted by Ilovecatbinlady

Originally posted by works4dhs

Originally posted by inforealOne reason Islam was given to the world was to balance the negative energy the Christian culture was initiating through the false doctrines of Christianity

so Islam is bringing positive energy into the world?

www.cbn.com...

Put it this way, Muslims didn't cook up the Holocaust, the Inquisition, the TransAtlantic Slave Trade, the slaughter of 500 million native Americans in South and North America, the Heart of Darkness African colonialism, the Australian Aboriginal genocide...etc.

Could it be that Christianity is really a from of satanism or it has satanic influence? Just asking on account of the Christian made body counts.

edit on 16-1-2011 by Ilovecatbinlady because: typo

(lol) kinda figured a response like this!
do we give Christianity any credit for hospitals / modern medicine, public education, charities, the Golden Rule, the beatitudes, ENDING slavery (pre-Christian origins), DEFEATING naziism and the holocaust (nazis were NOT Christians), famine relief, etc?
is it Christianity's fault that communicable diseases (unknown to the science of the time) took such a toll?
did you know the Conquistadors were hailed as liberators in Meso-America as the Aztecs etc routinely captured neighboring peoples for their human sacrifices?
might we consider Hendel, Milton, Michaelangelo and a great many other artists in various fields as positive contributions to humanity? Newton, Mendel and other scientists?
pls don't blame Christianity for the actions of some so-called Christians. if Christianity is this bad, how did it become so popular?
sorry, Mods, I know this is off-topic, but had to respond to the response.

This thread is about the possibiltiy if the Mahdi in the Koran is the same as the antichrist in the Bible, I don't think it is a good idea to question here wich religion is better.

reply to post by works4dhs


The same thing people are doing to Muslims.

reply to post by works4dhs


You really put a wonderful spin on things. Once again I will mention the genocides and holocausts perpetrated by Christians that amounts to a slaughter of at least a billion human beings.

This claim of scientific, enlightment and advancement being exclusively brought about Christians and Christian cultures is chauvinistic. Human development is a procession of memes across the planet from one culture to another. A thousand years ago, when the Arabs were developing optics, higher maths, medicine, hospitals, mass literacy, etc, Christians were in the midst of a dark age that lasted several hundred years.

Christians/Westerners have only been ascendant for 400 years and we are now witnessing it spasmodic and murderous decline. We are entering a new age where brown and black people will feel safe and prosper and the decedents of the neanderthals will become unimportant.

Shoebat might be a shill, but his explanation is sound. How on Earth would a secular/atheist demagogue be able to convince people to take the mark of the beast? People would see right through him, even the atheists would be able to see that the Christians were right. However, if the anti-Christ comes as the Mahdi the masses will follow, even the atheists and agnostics will follow, they will say, "Finally! Here is the proof we demanded of God all this time! Allah Akbar!". Meanwhile the Christians will reject this perfect man who ushers in an era of peace and they will be seen as ignorant, hateful bigots for not following such a wonderful man. Furthermore, what if Ya'hshuah comes back and contrary to the popular belief that he was a beautiful man (completely unscriptual) he is exceptionally ugly and has one eye?

"no form nor comeliness"-"no beauty that we should desire him"-"despised and rejected of men", and "as one from whom men hide their face, he was despised and we esteemed him not" (Isaiah 53)

Ya'hshuah says "you will know them by their fruits" he doesn't say we will know them by their appearance. Revelations also speaks of the Beast of the Earth working in subordination to the Beast of the Sea and making all the Earth worship the image of the Beast. The Beast of the Earth is supposed to have "the voice of a lamb" so one can make the assertion that he will claim to be Ya'hshuah whil blaspheming him and tearing down all that he says. Ya'hshuah according to Islam will bear witness to the Mahdi and will work with him in these seven years of peace.
If this is true it will be the Quran vs. The Bible, not Unbeliever vs. Believer. The question will be: which one is the truth and which comes from the devil? The muslims will side with the Quran and make war with any who dare oppose the Mahdi, and the former non-believers will stand with the muslims because they will be the only ones with any evidence. Meanwhile, Christians shall have no affirmation of their faith, because the Beast has reign over the Earth and many will be fooled due to weak faith or ignorance of the texts. The faithful must persevere persecution and (the scriptures aren't ambiguous at all about this) will be decapitated if they do not take the mark. Who still decapitates? Speaking of the mark, I found this description of the actions of the Mahdi:

In their book, Al Mahdi and the End of Time, Muhammad ibn Izzat and Muhammad Arif, two well-known Egyptian authors, identify the Mahdi in the Book of Revelation, quoting the hadith narrator Ka'ab al-Ahbar. In one place, they write, “I find the Mahdi recorded in the books of the Prophets… For instance, the Book of Revelation says: “And I saw and behold a white horse. He that sat on him […] went forth conquering and to conquer.” Ibn Izzat and Arif then go on to say: “It is clear that this man is the Mahdi who will ride the white horse and judge by the Qur’an (with justice) and with whom will be men with marks of prostration (zabiba) on their foreheads.”

This might be specualtion on these authors part, but a knowledgeable Christian will squirm at this idea.
I'm not entirely sure about this guy but he makes a very good case.

Originally posted by Ilovecatbinlady
reply to post by works4dhs

 

You really put a wonderful spin on things. Once again I will mention the genocides and holocausts perpetrated by Christians that amounts to a slaughter of at least a billion human beings.

This claim of scientific, enlightment and advancement being exclusively brought about Christians and Christian cultures is chauvinistic. Human development is a procession of memes across the planet from one culture to another. A thousand years ago, when the Arabs were developing optics, higher maths, medicine, hospitals, mass literacy, etc, Christians were in the midst of a dark age that lasted several hundred years.

Christians/Westerners have only been ascendant for 400 years and we are now witnessing it spasmodic and murderous decline. We are entering a new age where brown and black people will feel safe and prosper and the decedents of the neanderthals will become unimportant.

edit on 17-1-2011 by Ilovecatbinlady because: typo

I'd like to comment here...

the genocides and holocausts perpetrated by Christians

Most if not all of these acts have been from the hands of puppeteers and impostors. Christ taught us to love, forgive and turn the other cheek... This means there are only two options:
1. Christ really was legit and then all of them are faking to be Christian.
2. Christ was made up to sooth the powers that be in their best interests. There is actually a third option but this would be a combination of the two.

It's true a 1000 years ago Islam was a shining beacon of science and philosophy. For 400 years Islam was way ahead.
Before this the ball was in the other court with the Romans and Macedonians or Greek. Islam filled with enlightenment after the Ottomans took over Byzantine / Constantinople and now known as Istanbul. it was almost completely destroyed by a Mongol warlord, a descendant from a dynasty that ruled with an iron fist. Luckily the invading force turned to Islam.

What I'm trying to say here is that neither the western world and the Arabic world is free from the crimes against humanity that are spoken of here.

Genetic evidence shows that there are indeed Neanderthal genes still living in us, but the same counts for African Mediterranean people. Of course Europeans are descendants of an ancient race Indo-Arian people who originally came from Babylon and beyond...

My biggest issue with your post is that you ( once again ) divide the world into two groups of people, with silly reasoning, like mentioning crimes committed by people who actually are the opposite of what they have told the world ( regarding Christ ).
Don't get me wrong here because I really would love black and brown people to feel save, always and everywhere. As a matter of fact, there are countless that al;ready do just that.

Neither do I feel good with being blamed for crimed committed by generations before me. I'm totally aware of what has been done and I strongly oppose the system that made it possible. I'm all for a system breakdown


Of course I'm all for that to happen but it means that our system needs to be changed rebuild from the ground up. This will only work out if we cooperate or it will only result in a shift of power that will be waiting for the next time to happen again. leaving us in ongoing spiral.

Forgive me if I misunderstood your post ? This one is not to be taken offensive in any way, shape , or form.

Why tarnish a presently non-existant figure, be it the jewish Messiah, the islamic Madhi, or the world teacher Matreya?

If you do not believe in his existance, and yet heap blame or aspersions on him, it only goes to show and proof your sanity, or the lack of it, for dealing in mythical beings.

But giving one the benefit of doubt, perhaps such actions were meant to warn others of duplicities by TPTB that will attempt to put a figurehead to mislead mankind again.

Then again, do realize that we humans are far more educated than our ancestors had been. In our ancient past, it was easy to pass off anyone as anyone. But no longer today, as we all know where the MSM and our puppet leaders' integrity and loyalties lies.

Questions will be raised and have to be answered, but at least there will be someone in present to answer them, not when such elevated are not even here, or at least not yet. Any questionings or answers derived are purely prejudical bordering on insanity, and evidences of further duplicities by TPTB and those who are unwilling to relinquish their power or share their wealth.

As for believers of such elevated beings, they would know who and what he represents, and will have their doubts and queries answers. Such a being is no ordinary mortal, but a divine Teacher, and has the mental capacity that is far beyond the age of our planet or solar system, to help and guide us out of the morass we are currently living in. His ministry would have aleady began, as we see more are awakeining daily.

And it is never about the messenger, but his message, to guide us back onto the better path our Creator has designated for us to achieve our common aspirations in life and fulfillment of our collective destiny.

Then who is or are the Anti-Christ?. They are already here, and had been corrupting mankind with greed for centuries, turning us away from our designated path due to our apathy and busy fighting and killing fellow brothers and sisters for a crumb from the masters tables.

They are the ones who are seeking ways and means to corrupt mankind further with more deceptions, sowing our doubts on that path to enlightment. As you stare out of the window and see how corrupted and chaotic our world had become, you will realized that these are the seeds sown by the antichrists.

The masks had fallen upon your awakening, and a new path in the light awaits all, guided by the truth that lays in all mankind's hearts and minds - christians, jews, muslims, hindus, toaists, atheists, black or white, young or old, male or female, etc. regardless of our differences. We are one race - humans, with common ground of aspirations fully capable of achieving it within our lifetime if we but persevere and a destiny to fulfill, leaving none behind.....

Sometimes I think the AntiChrist has already come and gone....and we are led to believe he is on his way, instead.

But I have no sources to cite or a youtube video to link to.....just an opinion

reply to post by DutchBigBoy



The Dajjal is the same as the anti-christ in the bible because..

a) the anti-christ description in Islamic prophecy closely matches that of biblical prophecy...That the Anti-christ will be blind in the right eye and have a damaged arm as mentioned in Zechariah 11:17.

and

b) the dajjal will meet his end at the hands of a certain virgin born messiah called "Isa al-Masih" by muslims and "Jesus Christ" by christians. Both translating into Isa/Jesus the messiah.

^
This is the 4th time Im bringing this point up. If no one from the "other side: responds over the next 48 hours.... it only means they dont have an answer they are willing to post up here. Oh well..... same response from the mahdi=AC crowd.... cant blame 'em.

Warm regards.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
The Dajjal is the same as the anti-christ in the bible because..

a) the anti-christ description in Islamic prophecy closely matches that of biblical prophecy...That the Anti-christ will be blind in the right eye and have a damaged arm as mentioned in Zechariah 11:17.

and

b) the dajjal will meet his end at the hands of a certain virgin born messiah called "Isa al-Masih" by muslims and "Jesus Christ" by christians. Both translating into Isa/Jesus the messiah.

I usually stray away from "Anti-Christ" threads my friend. I find them as a curiosity more than anything else. However, you keep bringing this point up and are begging for a rebuttal, so I will offer my thoughts on this.

This is my view point on the whole "Anti-Christ" fad and you may not like what I have to say about it. Please bear in mind that I am not out to change your mind, I am simply sharing mine. You do not have to agree.

First, what is the "Anti-Christ"?

Christ brought a new doctrine to a world that was divided between judaism, mithraism, Roman Paganism, and many other small cults. Where as these other doctrines that were flourishing at the time were defining God as this or that, causing division based on cultural norms, and causing great iniquity based on ones compliance to the dominant doctrines and their ability to rise up the pyramidal structure of the Judaic Priesthood, or the Roman Bureaucracy, Christ taught something that threatened the whole false paradigm.

What Christ taught was equality. He taught that God was found within. He taught that we are ALL children of God. He taught that heaven is a state which loves and values all as equals. This was an obvious threat to those who preferred to exalt themselves above others, so he was put to death and in willingly going to his death, he gave his final teaching on love of ALL.

So, the Anti-Christ is not hard to find my friend. He has grown into one hell of a dragon. The Anti-Christ is anyone who does not accept Christ's doctrines. You can find him everywhere you look. He formed the Roman Catholic Church which stripped Man of his right of finding God within when they deified Christ. He lead the Crusades which slaughtered many thousands of people in the name of this false deity. He tortured many thousands more during the Inquisition. He pushes his faithful today to blow themselves up and fly into towers to destroy one another. He stands at the pulpit and fires up his followers to blow up abortion clinics. He denounces homosexuals and rejoices in their torment. He delights in oppressing the masses and offers many false idols to worship - money, fame, power, material destractions of every kind. He blinds his followers with the power of evil by making everything evil to them - Don't smoke marijuana, Don't grow your own food, Don't feed the homeless, Don't heal the sick without a license, Don't drink water without paying your taxes, Don't look at that man in the other country he is the enemy, Don't talk to that man he is evil. Follow ONLY ME!!!!!!!!!!

The Anti-Christ is EVERYWHERE my friend. I suspect he is even within you. Do you keep Christs commandments? Do you love all? Do you judge others? Do you heal them? Are YOU the Anti-Christ?

I do not make the statement to mock you, to judge you, nor to call attention to you. You asked a question and I answered.

This is the opinion of a Man who is blind in one eye which floats like a grape. It has been that way since birth. It is called a lazy eye. This is the opinion of one who is slightly crippled. I have a joint disorder which affects my feet, knees, and hands. This is the opinion of one who Loves God, Who Loves Mankind, who has judged no one, and would give his life to seeing Mankind make this world the heaven we are capable of making it, if we would only stop looking for a scape goat and face the Anti-Christ within us.

Judge not, Love all, Be at peace.

With Love,

Your Brother

Originally posted by RizeorDie

Originally posted by DutchBigBoy
Pity you haven't seen the video's bc he explains with the bible why he makes the claim about the mahdi.

the bible was modified by tptb to make it seem like the mahdi is the antichrist.

the mahdi will have one eye, the mahdi will not claim to be god.

if he does then he is not the awaited mahdi...

I think it is all a set up. Mabus is not a description of a person but a family name. Ray Mabus here is the one discussed and was not allowed to be Obama's VP here so you would keep going with the superstitions and do something stupid. After all, I've said over and over - the PTB put Obama in office so this time they didn't have to use an manchurian candidate to take him out. You guys will do just fine.

i watched all the vids, what the guy says is a joke, he is selling books and dvds for allah sake , i am originally Palestinian, i live in Jordan, and i am an ex-mulsim, i know where this guy is coming from, he is over reading and over thinking scripture, to me it is as obvious as the sun that Mohammad stole from every religious scripture he could put his hands on, mostly from Judaism, he used to change the stolen texts to sound genuine, but jews knew it and didn't buy his Islam, they mocked him when he was waiting for thier support, so he hated them and killed them whenever he could.

Dajjal is the same anti-christ in the bible, Mohammad stole the character, called it Dajjal, gave it some descriptions not found in the bible like he has one healthy eye and a defect one.

the other guy called Mahdi isn't mentioned in Quran (the first and most important reference in Islam), but in Hadith, comes second to Quran, Muslims started writing Hadith at least 100 years after Mohammad's death, a huge amount of myths and fiction was added to Hadith, Mahdi is one fictional character you find in Hadith.

Originally posted by h_jordan
i watched all the vids, what the guy says is a joke, he is selling books and dvds for allah sake

, i am originally Palestinian, i live in Jordan, and i am an ex-mulsim, i know where this guy is coming from, he is over reading and over thinking scripture, to me it is as obvious as the sun that Mohammad stole from every religious scripture he could put his hands on, mostly from Judaism, he used to change the stolen texts to sound genuine, but jews knew it and didn't buy his Islam, they mocked him when he was waiting for thier support, so he hated them and killed them whenever he could.

Thanks for elaborating this

Dajjal is the same anti-christ in the bible, Mohammad stole the character, called it Dajjal, gave it some descriptions not found in the bible like he has one healthy eye and a defect one.

I also heared before about Dajjal

the other guy called Mahdi isn't mentioned in Quran (the first and most important reference in Islam), but in Hadith, comes second to Quran, Muslims started writing Hadith at least 100 years after Mohammad's death, a huge amount of myths and fiction was added to Hadith, Mahdi is one fictional character you find in Hadith.

Maybe you can tell me more about this Mahdi character and why, if he is really fictional, the islam is waiting for him.

Originally posted by DutchBigBoy
Maybe you can tell me more about this Mahdi character and why, if he is really fictional, the islam is waiting for him.

hello DutchBigBoy,

people from outside Islam tend to see Islam as one religion and one nation, Walid deliberately talked about Shiites and Sunnis (the biggest groups in Islam) quickly, taking the advantage that his audience are christian americans who are not educated on the subject he is presenting.

Shiites among all other muslim groups are the only hard core believers of Al Mahdi, the story of Jesus and his return was such an inspiration for all religion people. everybody wanted a Jesus that will return someday and give rewards. Shiites are no different, they made up a story about Mahdi about 1000 years ago, written some Hadiths and claimed that they have been said by Mohammad, it is said that he is "stuck or hiding" in an underground cellar and they are waiting for his return, he is a god to them, Shiites don't announce this but it is well known that they consider him a god like character.

Sunnis actually completely reject this Mahdi of Shiites, they have few Hadiths about some Mahdi too, but these Hadiths are considered weak (Hadiths with no very credible source, claimed Hadiths) not taken seriously by Sunni Scholars, i believe they were added to Sunni books by some Shiites or find thier way to Sunni books in a way or another.

why didn't Walid say anything about all Muslims are waiting for the return of Jesus, to Sunnis, the return of Jesus is much more believed than Mahdi, Sunnis beleive Jesus will come and support Islam as the truer religion, he will break the Cross and show christians that he was not a god or the son of God but just a human prophet.

you need to know that in Islam there are two sources, Quran, widely beleived by all muslims and Hadith which was written at least 100 years after the death of Mohammad, hundreds of thousands of Hadiths were claimed to be said by Mohammad, after a lot of filteration done by some scholars investigating the integrity of the chain tellers of Hadiths (x tells Hadith heard from y heard from z heard from Mohammad) the number of true Hadith was cut down to few thousands, you need to know that Sunnis has few Hadith books that are not considered by Shiites and vise versa.

to this date Sunni Muslims in particular are still seeing flaws in Hadith because it was filtered in most cases according to the integrity of the tellers and not the content, it is not uncommon to find Hadiths that contradict Quran, these remain (i don't know why) in the books but are not considered, Quran is the first source and most important, Quran mentioned nothing about Mahdi, only Shiites interpret some verses in a way (playing with words) to show that Quran talked about Mahdi indirectly.

i say it is all BS, i don't believe any one will ever return including jesus.

ah by the way, shame on Walid as a palestinian not to differentiate between Jews and Zionists, and he stupidly says he was a terrorist, how can anyone beleive someone like him, i was muslim killing jews and now i realized i was wrong, i have to be a christian killing muslims