Leaving America As The “Most Effective” Way To Fight The Battle With “The Mob-Installed Govern

Zero Hedge reports:

And now for some very provocative, “out of the box” views: Simon Black, better known as Sovereign Man, presents some disturbing thoughts which are sure to get the broader spirits elevated. Instead of continuing to fight what some see as a losing ideological battle with a government which no longer even remotely represents the broader population’s interests, Black says simply to walk away:

“When you think about it, what we call a ‘country’ is nothing more than a large concentration of people who share common values.Over time, those values adjust and evolve. Today, cultures in many countries value things like fake security, subordination, and ignorance over freedom, independence, and awareness. When it appears more and more each day that those common values diverge from your own, all that’s left of a country are irrelevant, invisible lines on a map. I don’t find these worth fighting for…

The government beast in your home country feeds on debt and taxes, and the best way to win is for bright, productive people to move away with their ideas, labor, and assets. This effectively starves the beast and accelerates its collapse. Then, when the smoke clears, you can move back and help rebuild a free society.“

Perhaps Black is right and this is the best, and possibly only, non-violent way to fight the political-financial plutocracy?

Black is right that this is a highly effective way to starve the beast. As things continue to deteriorate into socialist chaos, this is the natural course of action individuals with means take. We saw this occur in East Germany to the point where the government put up walls to prevent its own citizens from leaving.

One other way that I personally like even more is for enough freedom lovers to move to New Hampshire and take over the state government; thereby forcing the state either into secession or nullification of federal law. Thereby creating a “free state” within the system of several states.

Learn more about the free state project here.

reply to post by mnemeth1


I was considering moving out of the US, still am too. But now that Ireland, Portugal, and Spain look doomed, I don't know. I may have to go to South America for an extended period of time.

I was really dreading having to move to a very rural place or desert to avoid what could be our pending doom. Then I discovered what might be one of the greatest locations: Micronesia! Anything short of a World War 2 Pacific Battle and you will be fine, not to mention the most beautiful climate and islands on the planet.

I can't leave the US legally or else I would be in violation of probation. The system has me by my nuts right now and all I can do is be a good sheep or go to jail. I am also suppose to work full time but I can't work outside the state of Florida or take a job on a boat, lost my security clearance so I can exactly work on avionics anywhere. I do believe the US has become a police state.

Originally posted by jrod
I can't leave the US legally or else I would be in violation of probation. The system has me by my nuts right now and all I can do is be a good sheep or go to jail. I am also suppose to work full time but I can't work outside the state of Florida or take a job on a boat, lost my security clearance so I can exactly work on avionics anywhere. I do believe the US has become a police state.

I'm sure leaving out the reason you are on probation will make people not agree with you.
I'm sure you did something that deserves punishment

Originally posted by WashingtonGrewHemp
reply to post by mnemeth1

 

I was considering moving out of the US, still am too. But now that Ireland, Portugal, and Spain look doomed, I don't know. I may have to go to South America for an extended period of time.

Yeah, part of the goal of globalists/socialists is to create a world where there is no where to run to, which they have been highly effective at.

Normally when States break down, people had the ability to flee to somewhere relatively free. Today, there aren't many such places.

I would argue that Singapore is a good place to move to. While they are an authoritarian state, they have a lot of economic freedom. This will prevent you from starving or losing your property during the implosion of the mega-states.

However, I still think the best solution is for freedom lovers to move to New Hampshire and install a government that will secede from the feds.

reply to post by mnemeth1

“When you think about it, what we call a ‘country’ is nothing more than a large concentration of people who share common values.Over time, those values adjust and evolve. Today, cultures in many countries value things like fake security, subordination, and ignorance over freedom, independence, and awareness. When it appears more and more each day that those common values diverge from your own, all that’s left of a country are irrelevant, invisible lines on a map. I don’t find these worth fighting for…

My thoughts exactly! When I opened up this discussion last week I was met with both support and open hostility. I guess that "Berlin Wall" mentality is here in America too. Some people got so upset with the discussion of me leaving the U.S., and they don't even know me!



Which Country Is A Better Alternative Than The U.S.?

reply to post by mnemeth1


New Hamshire sounds lovely, it really does. I've never been up there but after reading the facts it seems like a very attractive place to move to. No sales tax, no permits required to carry a weapon and so forth. Sounds like the perfect state, but then again I would assume these factors are circumstantial. A state the size of New Hamshire compared to New York, I'd say there are different environmental and community factors. Bring in say another 9 million folks (hypothetical) and I'd bet my bottom dollar the economic structure will change.

I don't think New Hamshire would want any gatecrashers considering the circumstances, but it should really be interesting as to the results if this project were to be successful. I don't think though that leaving one part of the united states for another will solve the issue. We must remember that the people are part of the problem. Many conservatives as well as democratic voters supported the actions of the government for years before the economy tanked. It's about mindset and I don't think running away from the problem and pitchin' a tent up north is going to solve anything.

Originally posted by Anttyk47

Originally posted by jrod
I can't leave the US legally or else I would be in violation of probation. The system has me by my nuts right now and all I can do is be a good sheep or go to jail. I am also suppose to work full time but I can't work outside the state of Florida or take a job on a boat, lost my security clearance so I can exactly work on avionics anywhere. I do believe the US has become a police state.

I'm sure leaving out the reason you are on probation will make people not agree with you.
I'm sure you did something that deserves punishment

I am on probation for a DUI that I got over two years ago, my first. It cost me my Navy career, a month of pay, a paygrade, my GI bill, did 45 days restriction for the Navy, have paid over $10,000 towards it, lost my Driver's liscence twice for that one offense, can't get one now until I have a car with a breathlyzer.

This was the first time in my life I ever had a run in with the law.

I think I long ago paid for my crime. I was pulled over for not using a turn signal after a college football game, like that matters.

Originally posted by WashingtonGrewHemp
reply to post by mnemeth1

 

I was considering moving out of the US, still am too. But now that Ireland, Portugal, and Spain look doomed, I don't know. I may have to go to South America for an extended period of time.

There are really little choices for libertarians and tea partiers for leaving the United states. Socialist healthcare is already well in place in most countries aside from those that cannot afford it. Sales tax is also well in place in most countries other than the few smaller ones that are able to afford to function without it.

When we look at it, there is no real true libertarian state in the world at this moment. In the past? Well maybe in the 18th and 19th centuries and prior. Not now though,

Leaving is always an option when you’re getting the short end of a stick. That’s exactly what the US powers that be want! That’s why our government had opened its doors to Mexico, I have personally NEVER seen INS pulling up and rounding up all the illegal workers in my home town, which helped ruined the US economy and forced millions of US citizens out of work and their multi generational homes. The people who are working in
Government are acting like sheep, exercising orders on their own kind because they can’t afford to lose their jobs and still implement foreclosures they know are wrong and downright disgraceful. So now you have Six families living in one government owned rental house and everyone looks the other way. I would rather revert back to sleeping in the woods and wait for the next US revolution then give in to this bully government! I’m staying right here thanks!

reply to post by mnemeth1


Well I dunno about moving overseas, This is still a great country and
worth fighting for. Just because crooked thieves are stealing everything
that isn't nailed down doesn't mean we have to turn tail and run. All we
have to do is see where the money is going. The old saying "Follow
the Money" is true and will lead us to the thieves in question. Now
about what to do about it, I say.........

Online complaining will do nothing to solve the problem. At the bare minimum every single person in the U.S. that is against anything in debate or policy should be writing letters to elected officials. Next is spreading the word, then gathering like minded people together, then protesting. But most people are not even on step one yet! I see the trend of petty online complaining with no intention to act in the least.

Yeah, leaving is dumb. You may be able to tuck your tail between your legs and hide for now. Heck you might even be able to hide in the dark your whole life but what kind of existance is that? And there certainly is not any places in the world that are really free anymore. Maybe a few places that you can hide, but none are free. And if we don't find a way to stop this, they will eventually micro manage every corner of the world.

So yeah you can run and hide, but I like my home. I would rather do what I can to make it a better place than hide and be a non-factor when it was my time in this world. This is our world not theirs. Don't just give it to them without a fight.

Let me put it to you like this: travel at some point may become highly restricted. If you're going to make your move,do it soon before they close the gates. Why would they do that,you ask?

My theories as to why this might happen are:

1) For security reasons.. This is a likely scenario particularly if large-scale wars begin in multiple theatres. It looks like we might be heading in that direction.Very few,if any places, would be willing to risk having their shores flooded with refugees or tourists who wind up getting stuck there during conflict. Also, many warring states tend to curtail or severely limit things like travel and tourism anyway.


2) To preserve the tax base. I've been hearing stories about people,particularly the wealthier ones, selling off their things and setting up camp outside the U.S. for a few years now. They tend to take their business and/or wealth with them leaving a vacuum. Also,a growing number of Americans are heading overseas and giving up their passports every year. Not a good thing for annual tax receipts.


That's just my two cents,for what it's worth. I could be wrong,but then again...

The problem with this is it isnt just an issue with America.

reply to post by mnemeth1


I actually know someone who is doing that right now, living in New Hampshire I mean, growing his own food, raising chickens, and basically getting ready for doom. I've heard that you need to be above the 30 degree line of latitude though, and 300 miles inland if a tsunami were to hit the East Coast (bare with me as I go off on slight tangent and incorporate various ATS subjects). That would mean that the closest safe house would be somewhere around Toronto, Ontario. The 30th parallel separates Vermont from Canada. Speaking of which, I think Vermont already tried to break away from the Fed but were unsuccessful. Anyway, it's time for all of us to start practicing our basic carpentry, plumbing, and electrician skills. Because I've been convinced since 2006 that a war with Iran is imminent, and/or a North American catastrophe will hit. I could be completely wrong and nothing will happen, but I kinda doubt that time line will pan out because China and Russia just "quit the dollar" which means the Fed will probably try to start a war to "fix" the econ....

or I could be waaaaay off base here...

reply to post by Southern Guardian


There were lots of experiments with much freer markets in the 19th Century, mostly due to the effects of the Industrial Revolution, however most of these ended with the population demanding more controls and oversight by government.

In the United States for example, the publishing of "The Jungle" really lead to a populist desire for controls on production standards and quality. The thing that cannot be forgotten here is that in the 1800s business did abuse their power and the public. Labor laws, safety agencies and protection for the consumer were pushed forward by votes and public opinion.

In the United States, with the notoriously short political memories of the people, there is a (small) movement to go to a form of Corporate Anarchism now, as we've seen from the dear OP many times over. In Europe, we tend to look more to the past for guidance too. Especially in England, while we romanticize Victorian London, not many would ever want to go back to that, ever. It was a filthy, dangerous, unhealthy and largely uncaring place and time to be living in.

Europe will endure, communally, as the majority of us value our standard of living over our nationalism. There will be growing pains, we're having a few right now, but we'll make it together. If that's not your bag, well there are other places more friendly to corporatist ideologies.

The United Arab Emirates comes to mind, as does the previously mentioned Singapore and South America has potential, but it's not yet realized.

In the end though there has never been a truly laissez-faire nation. Britain tried a lot of the ideas, and if the libertarians here had their way a lot more of us would have died from famine or being worked to death.

In the end though, as a socialist, I do not believe my political philosophy is about government control of the citizen, but of shared goals and shared prosperity with a strong safety net as well.

Socialism is about freedom and unity to me. As such, if it's not your preferred system and you'd rather form a real laissez-faire anarcho-libertarian state somewhere, I wish you the best of luck!

I am quite curious to see how it turns out myself.

reply to post by ProjectJimmy


Its funny that you mention the meat packing industry. Sinclair's work is a well documented work of fiction. It's a book of lies.

A 1906 report by the Bureau of Animal Industry refuted Sinclair’s severest allegations, characterizing them as “intentionally misleading and false,” “willful and deliberate misrepresentations of fact,” and “utter absurdity.”

mises.org...

Most of the "muckrakers" were also socialists. For example Upton Sinclair is famous for his 1906 book, The Jungle, which, among other things, described what were supposedly horrific conditions in the meat packing industry in Chicago. While most history books treat his depiction of rats and even humans being processed into meat sold to consumers as gospel truth, his book was simply untrue and represented a crude attempt to convince Americans that socialism was their only hope. (Investigation after investigation of the meat packing industry showed Sinclair’s claims to be false.)

Sinclair admitted afterward that his book was an attempt to change the "American heart," but instead managed only to affect "its stomach." Historians often say that The Jungle led directly to the passage of the Pure Food and Drug Act of 1906. As usual, the truth is more complicated.

Of course, the "Pure Food and Drug Act of 1906" was heavily lobbied for by the meat packing industry because they wanted to pass the expense of inspection on to the tax payer rather than paying for it themselves.

I wrote a very detailed and sourced article on it here:
fascistsoup.com...

reply to post by Anttyk47
Spoken like a true slave.

Truly.