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Noticing a great deal of Islam-related topics

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posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 08:36 PM
My query is... are people seriously trying to understand the Quran and other teachings of the nation of Islam or are they mainly trying to make a mockery of it or otherwise demean it?

Personally, I am largely unfamiliar with the Quran, but from my understanding, the writing and stories are somewhat (at least) related to other famous religious texts like the Old and New Testaments, as well as the Torah and Talmud. Obviously there are significant differences, but many of the ideas and principles appear to be similar to one another. Many of the forces depicted and written about appear to be the same kinds of forces, but written in different formats and perspectives.

Now for some of you who may get upset at my query, please cool your jets. I am well aware of the control-mechanisms instilled within these kinds of religious texts. Meaning, I am not promoting this idea nor am I preaching it. I am just trying to understand the nature of these threads and the intentions of the people.

[edit on 7/1/2004 by AlnilamOmega]

posted on Jul, 1 2004 @ 11:02 PM
To answer your question and not to start a long thread on who is right and who is wrong......

True Christians (those that actually follow the teachings of christ) believe that the Ten commandments are the foundation of truth. I understand that not all and not even a majority of muslims condone the acts that we see everyday now, but in the end, it is from islam that the extremist condone their own actions. It is the terrorists that are quoting their own holy book while they prepare another beheading or suicide bombing. It is because of Jihad and the fact that osam actually has people calling him the enlightened one, that people have negetive feelings for Islam. Christians do not judge other people, but we are concerned about those that we believe are being decieved. We don't want Satan to corrupt any of Gods children and what we see in the Islamic religion is a lot of truth mixed with what we believe is some deception. Its good enough to seem right, but its bad enough to allow some people to use it in a negetive way. I keep saying "we" and I don't mean to sound like I am speaking for the group, this is my opinion. If I had it my way, no one would be tricked into violence or corruption, but things are as the bible said they would be and I imagine they will end the way the bible says they will end.

posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 06:40 AM
I don't think you have to read the Islamic threads for long, AlnilamOmega, to see that there is little or no serious discussion of the religion or it's tenets. Due to ignorance and deliberate lies by the popular media and politicians, Islam is public enemy number one at the moment, and these threads, even if they begin with good intentions, rapidly degenerate into sub-FOX hatemongering.

Some people, it seems, lack the discipline or objectivity to discuss such a difficult topic rationally. To invoke Islam as a cause of terrorism is utterly disgusting - Christians would be quick enough to object to members of their religion being depicted as a bunch of Arab-slaughtering Crusaders, or bible-thumping Klansmen - but it's a simple solution for the simple mind. I guess that some people, in order to deal with the fear and uncertainty of the modern world, need someone to blame, and someone to hate.

All we can do is try and challenge this ignorance whenever it arises, and remind people of the truth - Islam doesn't commit terrorism, terrorists commit terrorism.

posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 06:49 AM

Yes, but I would also argue that that is the Muslim's lack of input, not the non-Muslim's fault.

I can't speak for the Islamic faith...and even in the public arena the Muslims don't speak for the Islamic faith. And I can't figure out why that is the mess out of me. It is as if they consider that speaking their beliefs is not the proper way to spread the faith - which tends to lead people on the outside to accept what could possibly be false accusations against the faith - that they are intent on FORCING their beliefs on the world - as being true.

We have Muslim believers here on the board and they do the same darned thing as the Muslims in the real world are doing. They come on and they say to some statement concerning Islam "that's not true"...but then they go no further. They don't say "what is true".

This apparent unwillingness can be taken as, instead, an inability. And what I mean by this is sometimes I get the gut feel that the average Muslim doesn't know what the "true teaching" is himself. There are enough contradictory statements, movements and doctrines floating about attached to Islam - that I think the average Muslim doesn't know which he should say and have confidence he is saying the right one.

Now, let's see if a Muslim will come on and address the issues with more than - "you apparently know nothing about Islam"...which usually is about all we get.

[edit on 7-2-2004 by Valhall]

posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 06:52 AM

Now, let's see if a Muslim will come on and address the issues with more than - "you apparently know nothing about Islam"...which usually about all we get.

Obviously you havent been reading the latest few discussions in Religion forum. Very extensive and detailed explanations of many things have been offered there, as well as dozens of very useful links.

Now, if anyone still wants to ignore it, thats their problem.

posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 06:56 AM
Nope, haven't been in that forum in a while...I will admit that. Could you please provide a link to the thread (or threads) you are referencing. I WILL visit.

posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 07:02 AM

posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 07:03 AM
That is an excellent point, Valhall. I think we would all benefit from the tutelage of an informed, rational Muslim. I too have seen the "you know nothing" posts, but, to be fair, you see the same number of posts from Christians in defense of their beliefs - and, if I'm honest, the same number of posts from atheists too!

Generally, the pro-Muslim comments found here on ATS aren't very convincing, but I would contend the same could be said for any minority group - particularly, if the mighty Admins and Mods will forgive the implied criticism, since religious and theological discussion is relegated to a BTS board.

I do still believe, however, that the burden of proof should still be on the prosecution, not the defendant - I will believe that the followers of Islam are no better or worse than you and I, until I am proved wrong.

posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 07:23 AM

Originally posted by StrangeLands
I will believe that the followers of Islam are no better or worse than you and I, until I am proved wrong.

hmmm that sentence holds a lot of truth. Muslims are indeed *gasp* only humans just like everybody else ( that means they can kill, just like christians can, and jews, and black people and white people and chinese etc, etc ), and I seriously doubt that anyone is trying to convince you into believing something else.
The topic of religion-related discussions is something else actually: are extreme followers of one religion the real representatives of tha religion or not? Does inqusition represent the true face of Christianity? Was Pizzaro the "true" christian? Is Falwell a true christian? Does Bin Laden represent true Muslims or not? Is he Muslim? Is his version of Islam the right one?

Just because someone SAYS that it is ok to kill according to some religious book, it doesn't mean it really is. It means he is a psycho and is not to be trusted. At least I wouldnt believe a single word a mass murderer says. I would rather look for some other normal and rational source of information, specially regarding such complex matter like religion.

posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 07:43 AM

Thanks for the links.
I'll start reading these this evening after work.


I agree. I believe that anyone that attacks another's religion - irrespective of what religion that is - is the one in the wrong...not the believer of the religion under attack. And I look forward to reading in the threads linked whether Islam is in the attack position or the defense position...because I'm still unclear about that.

Long story short - I have to defend my belief against people of no belief and different beliefs - and I shouldn't have to do that. And people of different beliefs and no belief have to defend their posiiton/beliefs against others who believe differently - and they shouldn't have to do that...and hence the great big fat mess the world stays in all the time.

I simply have never understood why we can't believe how we choose and then live side by side...basically, can't we all just get along? *

lol...I mean it. It's a weird weird deal when you have hatred and intolerance due to a religious belief...pfffft. Not me, mr....I'm in this for what I can do for you, and I can't do for you when I'm busy hating you.

posted on Jul, 2 2004 @ 08:41 AM
I can think of a great number of muslim speakers that would like nothing more that to talk about their beliefs. Some are in Cuba, some in Iraq, Iran,Saudi Arabia etc.... but thats not the speakers we want to hear.............. or is it?

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