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No one is free.

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posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 04:59 PM
A lot of people on this forum, talk about freedom. How the government is taking it away. How these scanners are intruding on our freedom.But you are not free.

To have complete and absolute freedom ,one would need to have complete control of their own destiny. This is something we as humans lack. Spiritually we are no more free than the man on D-block.

But you don't want freedom. At least not the true form of it. Freedom is a double edged sword. Freedom means having no friends, because friends are commitments. Freedom means no family, no kids, no job, no home. All these things that you have such as children and friends and family, take away your natural freedom. You don't mind because you are happy.

We just like to have an illusion of freedom. We enjoy the illusion of choice. We don't have these things and we don't need them.

Of course there physical freedom (jail vs. outside world), but what good is it if your trapped in a different cage. A cycle that you follow day in and day out. Wake up, go to work, come home, play with kids, sleep.

We are all prisoners, some of us just don't see the bars.

I no longer wish to be freed.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 05:08 PM
reply to post by Dr. Strange

Freedom in a concept created by great politicians and corrupted by the system.

I agree with you though, true freedom is death and even then some will argue. . .

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 05:14 PM
I believe there is a pursuit of happiness involved with freedom? As in, friends, family, a car? You know, that old chestnut.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 05:23 PM
Your right, if you really think about it, their is no freedom that we can attain at this juncture in humanitys long road.
And maybe freedom isn't what we've been searching for either.
edit on 23-11-2010 by leemann123 because: spelling fail

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 06:01 PM
Maybe, just maybe, any primal level of freedom is illusion. Primal levels include shame, guilt, grief, apathy, fear, desire, anger, and pride. Once pride is reached, people believe they are truly free.

I believe in the end, true freedom comes from having absolute courage, absolute neutrality, absolute willingness, absolute reason, absolute love, absolute oneness, and Christ consciousness.

Of course, continue playing the games of the jungle, stay at your primal level(all primal games are based on sex urges), and you will never be free, of course, the illusion of freedom makes you "free". Duality is lord it seems.

Either way, its all up to you. Yes, you.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 06:08 PM
reply to post by Dr. Strange

hehe Freedom= Electronic Jail bars. We can only be free if they know what
we are doing, thinking, saying 24/7. That is not freedom. Time to redefine
what freedom means again.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 06:09 PM
It all depends on your point of reference. How do you see the universe?

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 06:22 PM
reply to post by leemann123

That is exactly what I am trying to get at. We don't need freedom to be happy, quite the opposite actually. True happiness can only come from lack of freedom.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 06:37 PM
Screw freedom - I just want to be left alone. Is it too much to ask to not have some glorified security guard sticking his grubby hands up your scrotum? Is it too much to ask to not want some corrupt cop pulling you over and violating your rights? Is it too much to ask to not have some intrusive Government or sleazy corporation sticking their nose into your business?

Since when did it become okay to have these basic human rights taken away and violated on a consistent basis? If I was interested in safety, comfort and complacency, I would have left this hell hole of a planet a long time ago. As far as I can see, the only living creatures on this planet who do not want freedom are humans. Why is this?

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 07:01 PM
Imprisonment is not the opposite of freedom, slavery is. What you refer to as "you" is the slavery. The question shouldn't be: "how can the prisoner be free?", it should be: "how can the prison be free?"

One thing that defines a prison is repetition. The same habitual processes into which no unknown element or mystery can enter. Predictability is another element. Time is another - doing your time - caught inside time constraints, economizing time into assigned units.

The physical body and the mind comprise a type of prison really and that is why so many people are frustrated with life.But most people do not become completely frustrated though, due to hope... due to perceived remaining time and hope.

The real meaning of slavery is compulsion. The design of human biology and it's affect on psychology create only the power to react as opposed to act. In the same way a computer is unable to act.

Real freedom can only be possible where a separate reality is created at the point of total dis-identification with the human form and mind (bio-computer) Then a prisoner is created who is separate from the prison who is then able to see the gate and walk straight out of it at will.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 07:14 PM
Often poetry provides more clues than logic:

Desperado, why don't you come to your senses?
You been out ridin' fences for so long now
Oh, you're a hard one
I know that you got your reasons
These things that are pleasin' you
Can hurt you somehow

Don't you draw the queen of diamonds, boy
She'll beat you if she's able
You know the queen of hearts is always your best bet

Now it seems to me, some fine things
Have been laid upon your table
But you only want the ones that you can't get

Desperado, oh, you ain't gettin' no younger
Your pain and your hunger, they're drivin' you home
And freedom, oh freedom well, that's just some people talkin'
Your prison is walking through this world all alone

Don't your feet get cold in the winter time?
The sky won't snow and the sun won't shine
It's hard to tell the night time from the day
You're losin' all your highs and lows
Ain't it funny how the feeling goes away?

song lyrics - the Eagles.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 07:22 PM
reply to post by Dr. Strange

I agree. I was talking with someone the other day and they said almost exactly what you stated. They said "I live in a really nice prison." When I asked exactly what they meant they said they cannot afford to do anything they really want to do, but they did have a nice place to watch tv in and a nice tv. However, all of their dreams and desires were not inside the house, or at work. Their dreams and desires were blocked by financial ability to do what they wanted. All they want to do is create pictures and frames for pictures and they cannot do so.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 07:32 PM
reply to post by Dr. Strange

You are as free as you believe you are (perspective). Life is about choices and you ultimately do have quite the plethora of choices to make in a lifetime. One can always chose to move remotely and tough it out living a very basic lifestyle. You will be charged taxes and fee's and be expected to contribute something back (in trade for fee so that you can "live" legally [unless you have amassed enough fortune to support yourself]) which is only fair.

As a society we can not cherry pick the likes and dislikes, sit on the fence and throw stones both ways. Many I find get wrapped up in that and the conflicts of interest that arise which essentially tares a society apart imho.

Weigh the options under the conditions and circumstances; ie. Is the flight worth the potential of having my person touched by a stranger?

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 07:42 PM
Man was not ment for unconditional freedom
For instance you have the bonds of love as an essential factor in the life of the average person...
you have the bounds of having to breath, to eat, the weather...etc

But if you are DEPT free then you have the option of freely choosing your obligations within the due mean,...
which IS freedom

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 07:44 PM
I don't believe any of us are free. Not just because of the government(s) but because I feel we all have a destiny we must fulfill.

I believe that our future is set in stone, that we're all doing what we're doing because it's what we were meant to do. And the only freedom we have is if we want to make a left or right turn to get there.

Starred and flagged OP, I enjoy these threads.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 07:48 PM
reply to post by Danbones

You can be debt free all you want, you will still never have the freedom to do what you wish. To achieve true freedom, you must lose everything. As long as you have something, anything, whether it be a material possession, or a loved one you can not be truly free.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 07:51 PM
reply to post by Frontkjemper

Ah, the old Free will Vs. Determinilism.

You are obviously pro-determinilism, so I ask you, if our future is set in stone and we have no choice in the future, then how can there be crime or criminals?

If they must commit a crime, then it is not their fault. They are simply following the path they MUST follow. In this kind of world punishment would be uncalled for. Maybe they didn't want to kill that person, but they had to.

That is my one problem with determinilism. It washes away responsibility of our actions as well as any things we achieved, we achieved them because we had to, not because we wanted to.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 08:05 PM
You, me, we are free.
Unless you are shackled in a cage, you are free.
Think about it.
Right now, I can walk out the door, and I assume you can too, and do whatever I want.
That is freedom.

Consequences? A whole nuther thang.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 08:43 PM
Your freedom is restricted by everyone else. As a collection we entwine a hundred million different opinions, thoughts, beliefs and actions, to create an ever morphing, ever shaping, ever collapsing and evolving net of humanity.

We craft our own realities. If we strive for freedom the net will grow, if we desire conflict, the net will tighten.

posted on Nov, 23 2010 @ 09:30 PM
There are two typs of freedom.
Physical freedom and spiritual freedom.
You can only lose spiritual if you let them take it.
The problem is the people have let them take all of your freedom.

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