Ability to see ghosts.

Thanks for the replies - all are appreciated equally!

While I am inclined to think that ghosts, spirits and other outwordly apparations are psychosocial phenomenas to a certain degree, there's definately more on it.

The phenomena itself is of course quite likely real, but what in essence are these things? Hard to tell, no doubt about that. It seems as if it has lot do our individual qualities and funtioning of our senses - as pointed out by several posters. I am thinking that perhaps these experiences are related on interpretation. We are experiencing something, but it is our cultural and social backgrounds which determines how they are interpret.

Some see ghost, some feel something, another may see aliens, ufos, pixies, demons or alike. Along the thoughts of gnosticquasar, it seems as if some people are just more sensitive to certain affections. Think about for allergy for instance. Allergic symptoms for same substances can vary: Some get rash, other breath difficulties and so on. So it leads me to assume that these experiences are caused by some "invisible" factor whether it be magnetic fields or other external stimuli which effect cannot be easily determined. All these people experiencing something in various situations are affected, yet their sociocultural background (along with nerve structure and general biology) defines how these things are interpret.

So, as Tarotmaster notes, the type of experience varies depending on one's characteristics both physical and psychological.

Made any sense?

-v

As for hereditary, my father said he could see ghosts and aura's.
My mother said he was good at seeing a person and knowing the past about them, but was
way off on the future of that person.
One day siting in the car waiting for it to warm up before he took me to school(freshman yr), he told me that he saw the angles.
I said ok, you see them every day. He said no I saw the angles and they are going to come and take me away.
He told me his will.(and that's a fact) I joked and told him mine.
A week later he died(heart) while we were watching our varsity football team play.
For the next thirty years, I've been trying to see just one ghost just so I know my dad was telling the truth in which I believed as a kid. I have not seen one, I even worked in an old morgue converted to my office for over a year and nothing.

Do I think people can see ghost? I don't know. But so far I have not been convinced even with my own experiences that they exist.

As for hereditary, my father said he could see ghosts and aura's.
My mother said he was good at seeing a person and knowing the past about them, but was
way off on the future of that person.
One day siting in the car waiting for it to warm up before he took me to school(freshman yr), he told me that he saw the angles.
I said ok, you see them every day. He said no I saw the angles and they are going to come and take me away.
He told me his will.(and that's a fact) I joked and told him mine.
A week later he died(heart) while we were watching our varsity football team play.
For the next thirty years, I've been trying to see just one ghost just so I know my dad was telling the truth in which I believed as a kid. I have not seen one, I even worked in an old morgue converted to my office for over a year and nothing.

Do I think people can see ghost? I don't know. But so far I have not been convinced even with my own experiences that they exist.

reply to post by v01i0


If you want to develop your supernormal(inborn) powers in a righteous way(by becoming a good person and not for showing off) try studying the book Zhuan Falun. You will get what you deserve in the end, but the journey is not easy, that I can tell you.

My wife´s family has third eye open and they can see many things, it has been inherited by my kids too. It is all about having lots of virtue and less karma(against the laws of the universe). There are plenty of other dimensions and one must be good enough to be able to enter them. It is like a pyramid, the higher dimension the better world.

I did not have these things but after practicing self-cultivation for some time now I can see things in meditation when I enter tranquillity. Demons, ghosts, angels, deities - they are all there.

Read the book Zhuan Falun: www.falundafa.org...

Third Eye stories: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Reincarnation stories: www.abovetopsecret.com...


/Zhen-Shan-Ren(Truthfulness, Compassion, Forbearance) is good, Falun Dafa is good

This is actually a pretty complicated thing to try and explain without the proper background information established, but I'll see what I can do. By the way, I'm like you, and have never seen a ghost. I have, however, experienced a lot of shared auditory phenomena (others heard it too), and have experienced object manipulation events (again, that were also experienced by people along with me, so I know it wasn't either hysterical or a subjective experience). I consider the proof I've experienced to be akin to watching the breeze move leaves in the trees. You can see the wind by way of what the wind affects; the impact it has on the visible environment.

What it takes to see ghosts is a faulty input filtering structure within the brain itself. That sounds serious, but it's not. In fact, it's probably the most common brain abnormality that exists, with Chronic Depression a close second. The issue involves the information generation center (where consciousness is generated), and the fact that human consciousness (we'll call it Intellect to delineate it from general consciousness) is information that is sophisticated to the point of being literally dynamic and having an active interest in its own ongoing development. This dynamic Intellect can't be personified because it is the person that results from the human brain's activity. Each burst of Intellect that is generated from the brain is experienced by the corporeal whole as the present tense, then replaced by the next burst of Intellect (as an ongoing Now) as that previous burst gathers with every previous burst to form the developing human being - a dynamic informational being. Yes, that makes corporeal life a 2nd stage of human gestation.

This gathering mass of eternal information (Intellect) affects the brain's data triage effort (developing and implementing weighting protocols for all input and output information sets, in an overall process we refer to as the emerging personality) by way of a regulated feedback loop - like an RF transmitter's standing wave, where the transmitter's output pre-radiated signal reflects back from the antenna load into the output circuit, only in this case, it's beneficial, and not simply the result of unavoidable slop in the system. Now, in RF transmitter technology, this reflected signal is called the standing-wave-ratio (SWR), and technicians tune the output stage to minimize this SWR. Too much and the transmitter can be damaged. In the case of the brain's Intellect generation, too much SWR and extraneous information can slip through to the brain's input channel, and what results is close proximity stimuli that the normally functioning brain is not designed to detect.

Some brains are severely malformed but in an extremely finite manner, and we see results like genius, Savantism, and if the damage involves this area of the brain, powerful psychic ability. Ghosts - as generated dynamic Intellect that has naturally survived the death of the authoring brain - are masses of information that the malfunctioning brain detects as the abnormally high SWR allows an exaggerated amount of what its own generated Intellect can readily detect to spill back into the authoring brain's data collection circuitry. For some of these brains, the stimuli is routed to the optic decoding part of the brain, and those brains see dead people. For most of these folks, this occurs sporadically, since it's not intentionally channeled and directed information. Kind of like an epileptic fit, only without the drama. If the auditory input area of the brain is also affected, then the translated communication between the lingering dead and the person's gathered Intellect mass will be decoded as sound that only the "psychic" person can hear. This is not the same phenomenon as sound-wave manipulation, as in the case of sound that can be recorded as EVP or simple auditory phenomena.

Basically, to see dead people, you have to have a brain that's not working properly. The same is true about being a genius, so it's not as if I'm trying to denigrate those who can see "spirits". We celebrate disfunctionality if we benefit from it, and some people feel that they benefit from seeing dead people. My brain works properly, so I don't get to experience the fun.

Now, as far as photographs or video clips of spirits, that's an entirely different set of physics, and I'm not even talking about the physics involved with Residual Hauntings, which opens an entirely separate data file.

reply to post by Gaussq

Originally posted by Gaussq
reply to post by v01i0

 

I did not have these things but after practicing self-cultivation for some time now I can see things in meditation when I enter tranquillity. Demons, ghosts, angels, deities - they are all there.

I kinda understand what people see when they see demons, angels etc. I can "see" these things with my thoughts, but I cannot have visual glimpse of them except in dreams. To see these things, one needs to have developed skill for visualizing (if you know, visualizing is the critical part of any occult method that include apparations), and then they are only visualizing their own thoughts unconsciously or not (at least this is what I suspect). So they see an angry fella and they see a demon in him - they see a peaceful and tranquil fella, they see saint and auras of splendour. In the end, it is most likely visualization based on imagination.

Thanks for the recommendations, but I have lately began to think that maybe it is not so important skill at all. Of course it would be fancy, but would I want to spend my time to practise visualize what I otherwise understand is another question...

-v

reply to post by NorEaster


Thanks for joining the conversation! I was kinda waiting for your reply as I saw your discussing in another thread. I guess that since you've written book about the matter, you know something about it.

I have also read your replies in that other thread (and somewhere else) and I am in kinda same lines with you. Ability to see non-physical apparations is based on nervous structure and type of mind and the skill of visualization. I like to quote C.G Jung here, who has also pondered this issue:

Among primitives, for instance, the imago, the psychic reverberation of the sense-perception, is so strong and so sensurously coloured that when it is reproduced as a spontaneous memory-image it sometimes even has the quality of an hallucination. Thus when the memory-image of his dead mother suddenly reappears to a primitive, it is as if it were hes ghost that he sees and hears. We only "think" of the dead, but the primitive actually perceives them because of the extraordinary sensuousness of his mental images. This explains the primitive's belief in ghosts and spirits; they are what we quite simply call "thoughts". When the primitive "thinks", he literally has visions, whose reality is so great that he constantly mistakes the psychic for the real. (The Collected Works of C. G. Jung, part 6: Psychological types.)

It is also notable that all "mystic traditions" that teach these abilities to see unseen and astral or whatnot, emphasize the importance of ability of visualization and give out certain techniques for their disciplines to practice that skill. I guess this somehow builds a bridge in brains, so that one is capable to see things while awake, when they normally have visions only in dreams or dreamlike states (like trance and such)..

This morning I actually tested my theory when lying on the bed after I woke up. It was easier to imagine and visualize than it is normally during the hours of vigilness. And of course lucid dreaming is also decent pointer towards this hypothesis. I've had few and I was pretty much capable of controlling my dreams and what I see.

The residual haunting is of course interesting phenomena and I tend to think it is related to certain extrasensitiveness. There may be something in the environment that causes some people to feel or see something, which they attribute on ghosts due social and cultural adaptation.

So I kinda agree with you that this ability (or flaw) is based on our individual nervous structure, imagination and sociocultural factors.

-v

to the op.

depends on goals,motivation and effort. perhaps you could think of WHY you want to see a ghost and perhaps WHO you would like to see. then reaffirm 'i'd like to see so and so because...' a few times through out the day and as you drift off asleep. if you MEAN it,you will. and you will KNOW that the experience was genuine.

reply to post by ewokdisco


Thanks for the reply.

I am not questioning the authenticy of these phenomenas and experiences, I am merely exploring their nature.

What you propose reminds me of autohypnosis (=self suggestion).

-v

yes, it is auto suggestion but its WHERE this inner convo is leading to...the REAL you. if you want that experience, try it. it worked for me,but i saw people in dreams. the visit will usually be fast and the last 'dream' you have before you wake. a good book for this is by dale e graf. tracks in the psychic wilderness or the end of materialism by charles t tart. both are men of science.

reply to post by ewokdisco


I've been building the bridge between the brothers (consciousness and unconsciousness) for several years already.

Wrote a thread about it once...

-v

Re NorEaster

as always I enjoyed your post, but this time I'm hampered by a total ignorance about this RF transmitter technology you use as example. An educated guess leads to, that you're talking about a kind of self-reinforced/feed-back amplifying, where some kind of external stimulus is gestalted into what allegorically could be said to be an equalent of an 'inner dialogue' or giving a form to something, which has no form in mankind's visible universe.

But I'm not really competent to draw too farreaching conclusions from your example, and I would be grateful, if you 'downgraded' to a level of pedagogical instruction for the layperson. It's not that I'm unfamiliar with technology or science, it's just this special part of it being a white spot on my map.

But I have a few comments/questions, where I'm on more safe ground. I'm completely aware, that you don't take a derogative attitude, when you talk about proper/not-proper brain functioning (to compress your various ways of expressing it), but I wonder what measure-tape/relative reality/level of existence etc you use as canvas for evaluating proper/not-proper, functional/dysfunctional. E.g.: Is 'functional' relating to a specific relative-reality external environment, or some overall principles like cosmic, cosmogonic or transcendent, or is 'functional' aim-directed.

My next question is: My own experiences of anomalies encompass visual, tactile and auditory; simultaneously, and somewhat unusual for this kind of situations, with my daily-usage perception fully operational and incorporated in a totality, where the 'normal' physical world interacted with the non-corporeal entities I met. Entities I communicated, verbally and in 'body language' with for hours at a time (on several occasions).

Now as I said above, I find gestalting a very likely part of such experiences, bit I'm certain, that it doesn't cover the whole situation. Almost identical to the questions implied in a context of solipsism, external and very specific information reached me. Information my own former life-experiences couldn't have cooked up. The entities I had contact with had distinct identities, belonged to separate species and performed acts, which often were completely beyond my understanding. Some very bizarre, some surrealistic, and then again some 'rational' from a human perspective.

It could be postulated, that I tapped into some 'sub-consciousness' of my own or at a collective level, but this was too detailed, too complex, so even 'subconsciously' the anti-solipsistic argument is valid. It's like spending 12 years in school, arriving at college mathematics and saying, that you had it inside you all the time; no 'external' tutoring was ever needed. Well, I have problems with that model; no matter what, with my present knowledge capacity, I'll never be able to build a nuclear powerplant or 're-invent' quantum-physics on my own.

Disregarding the consequences of a cosmic holographic model (at which cosmic level I definitely wasn't, most of it was very 'mundane' so to speak), and staying at a level of fragmented relative reality, with standard subject/object perception, I would give the option: "There's something out there" 99,99% support. And also that there is a myriad of various types of what we call individual complexities. Precisely like human beings with awareness, but being non-corporeal (as from the human perspective).

'Ghosts' only being a minor part of the whole thing, and on which the model of a 'recording' probably is true, but that doesn't explain the rest.

reply to post by bogomil

Originally posted by bogomil
It's like spending 12 years in school, arriving at college mathematics and saying, that you had it inside you all the time; no 'external' tutoring was ever needed. Well, I have problems with that model; no matter what, with my present knowledge capacity, I'll never be able to build a nuclear powerplant or 're-invent' quantum-physics on my own.

Forgive me making remarks on the post that was meant to another individual.

I am not totally certain, but are you saying that progress in spirituality needs guidance? If that is the case, I disagree to some extent. Spirituality is not like sciences that require vast amounts of information to be succesful in achieve something. I think that when it comes to spirituality (=subjective truth) everyone is on same line. No one is, in a sense, more advanced in spirituality compared to you . Maybe some instructions and pointers may be given, but the instructor has to be extraordinary careful not to tell too much, as we all have somewhat distinct inner realities, except perhaps the archetypical ones.

When guidance in spirtuality exceeds boundaries of decency, it becomes suggestion.

-v

Re v01i0

I'm only grateful for any quality communication I meet, so feel free to comment any time and in any connection.

In mundane contexts I'm all for teacher/student situations. At the level of the relative reality this happens in, it's possible to control the pragmatic outcome, and when you eventually can grasp the overall principles in what you've learned, you can go back and examine the basic assumptions the whole line of teaching rests on, with the possibility of pointing out shortcomings there.

In a 'spiritual' context I agree with you practically all the way, except that there to my knowledge do exist some slight variations between people concerning their 'spiritual' acchievements. Not so big differences that anyone possesses anything even close to 'ultimate reality', making him/her THE guru (and D-g knows I been searching for 45 years), but some of the runner-ups can give good inspiration and suggestions. And for me suggestions aren't a problem, I have personal methods of disarming excessive 'persuasion'.

I believe, that I basically share what I think is your general attitude of both uniqueness and a potential for 'ultimate reality' in us, but I also recognize, that somewhere/somehow our visible universe contains smokescreens, which influence us deeply. Most likely to the extent of actively making us spiritual morons or zombies.

I'm very attracted to the idea in zen-buddhism about instant satori. But in reality it isn't so instant as it seems. The students spend preliminary years being chased by half-mad monks with big sticks or burning intellectual fuses on koans.

If a metaphor of spirituality being imprisoned is worth anything, then it's not a question of whether to get out or not, but rather HOW to get out.

reply to post by bogomil

Originally posted by bogomil

[S]ome of the runner-ups can give good inspiration and suggestions

That is true, in the case that suggestions are not suggestive that is

Indeed advices can be given and I hope that's all. If I am lost, I'd appreciate directions to my destination, yet I don't need instructions how to walk. While I also tend to learn from multiple viewpoints and "schools", I (think that I) have recognized the dangers of suggestion (meaning hypnotisms in a sense). When they began to tell you what you should encounter in your journey, what the things look like and so on, there's a stench of suggestion already included. And those who are inclined to believe, may fall in the trap of suggestion and be misled away from the real destination of understanding.

Originally posted by bogomil
I believe, that I basically share what I think is your general attitude of both uniqueness and a potential for 'ultimate reality' in us, but I also recognize, that somewhere/somehow our visible universe contains smokescreens, which influence us deeply. Most likely to the extent of actively making us spiritual morons or zombies.

I agree. The living dead are horrible, yet I have to pity them. And there's a "harlot" in every corner that attempts to seduce gullilble one in meaningless activity. But then again, how life should be lived? Isn't happiness enough as long as you don't harm others (people, nature and environment in general)? If one is happy whatever he does (with mentioned conditions), why to bother with anything else? Many will of course warn one about the condition of one's eternal soul, but I don't know about that, for I have no experience about that!

Originally posted by bogomil
If a metaphor of spirituality being imprisoned is worth anything, then it's not a question of whether to get out or not, but rather HOW to get out.

Exactly! Unless you are happy in your imprisonment But then one wouldn't be wanting out.

Cheers for your reply

-v

Originally posted by v01i0

The residual haunting is of course interesting phenomena and I tend to think it is related to certain extrasensitiveness. There may be something in the environment that causes some people to feel or see something, which they attribute on ghosts due social and cultural adaptation.

So I kinda agree with you that this ability (or flaw) is based on our individual nervous structure, imagination and sociocultural factors.

-v

Good to see a fellow realist that's interested in this sort of thing.

One thing that I found interesting while doing research for one part of the book (related to historical and cultural indications of evidentiary aspects of the premise - AutoGenesisism - that have created their own legend) was that the more primitive the culture the more available the dearly not-so-departed, and that the more modern the culture, the more departed the dearly departed become. Of course, I had some fun with it, and imagined the motivation for doing a little cultural conditioning that compels the departing person to keep on going and to not linger after the ceremonies have concluded. Here's part of the lead up to my examination of the tradition of Reincarnation. It suggests a motive for teaching people to "go to the light".

Like I said, I had some fun with the book here and there.

Game Over – Thanks For Playing

In some of the most primitive cultures, the dead linger. Not only do they linger, but they are included as active members of the community. Of course, this is viewed by the modern world as superstition and the pagan worship of a glut of spirits that have been assigned to everything from rocks to bird droppings. Still, this idea of the lingering and interactive dead did not spring from animal behavior. This was a truly innovative idea when it appeared, and as I have already noted, there is nothing inherent about corporeal existence that naturally inspires the notion of non-corporeal intelligent life. There’s certainly nothing natural about the notion that the corporeal being will become a non-corporeal being once it has died. In fact, the entire premise is absolutely counterintuitive. And still, the primitive cultures revere their dead and serve them with a full understanding that these dead people are present and aware of this effort on their behalf.

It’s the theologies that emerged during times after the advent of cities and large population concentrations that feature The Crossing Over concept, and one has to wonder if this event is culturally imposed upon the living, by the living, with the view toward making sure the departed stay departed, and for any of a host of good reasons.

*Speculation Alert* Okay, so we are speculating here, and while I am not going to deny the adventurous nature of this particular speculation, it can’t hurt to just have a little fun with a few thoughts as we explore this whole Crossing Over issue. After all, we’ve just acknowledged a speculation alert, so we can go nuts on this next idea if we want to.

So, let’s pretend that there was once a small business owner, and let’s suggest that the business he owned had a chance to grow into a much larger business. The only thing standing in the way of this guy’s business getting this much-needed boost, was the fact that to start this small business originally, he had to partner with another guy, and with that partnership came the requirement that he gain this other guy’s approval for any and all major business decisions. And this expansion was one major business decision.

So let’s say that the partner was not onboard with this decision, and in fact, he really, really was not on board with this decision. It might even be fair to say that this partner was actively opposed to this decision. Since we’re just speculating, let’s say that the business owner decided that this partnership has run its course, and that the till-death-do-us-part clause in the contract was now vulnerable to exactly the kind of option that had suddenly presented itself for immediate execution.

Now, taking his partner from the corporeal realm would solve the legal issues (concerning the partnership itself), but unless this particular departed could be convinced to physically (and permanently) depart, the de facto aspects of the original dilemma would remain. With the advent of laws and law enforcement, the whole situation could become even more problematic for the partner who dispatched the decreased. Especially with all that newly released dynamic information (in the form of the dead partner’s lingering IDI presence) hanging about, with revenge likely on its own agenda.

*Digression Alert* Yes, this is speculation, and maybe even a bit of irresponsible speculation at that, but what we do know is that the newly departed have been sighted, and that they’ve been heard, and that this has happened again and again for thousands of years, and within the confines of every culture on the entire planet. To make the claim that the departed have no existence – in the face of all that empirical evidence – is to go even further in the direction of raw speculation. Then again, it’s not as if there weren’t sensible men and women roundly dismissing the possibility of heavier-than-air human flight as one of the new flying contraptions sailed right past them in broad daylight. Humans are gifted at dismissing the obvious if it doesn’t align properly with their personal view.

So, back to the dilemma facing the business owner who’d dissolved his partnership (having done so with extreme prejudice). If the ex had been raised to firmly believe that once he died, he would be expected somewhere else – anywhere else, in fact – and that the success of his afterlife depended on his being wherever that somewhere else was, then the business move that his surviving partner executed (no real pun intended) would have had a better chance of being a successful business move. (since this specific dearly departed would indeed depart forever, instead of sticking around and mucking up things for the surviving partner) Maybe it’s just the way that I see things, but doesn’t that whole Crossing Over concept suddenly seem like a real breakthrough for managing difficult personal relationships?

I also find it interesting that the more modern and sophisticated the culture, the more removed from the corporeal realm the departed become once they’ve departed. The latest incarnation of distancing the departed has them gone for good in a perfect heavenly paradise, where it’s always a “better place”, and earthly concerns are either forgotten or placed magically into proper perspective. The kind of perspective where forgiveness flows freely – exclusively from that side to this side here on Earth – and all is made right regardless of how horribly wrong it all actually was. Does anyone else see the distinct advantage for the winners of these most deadly of corporeal conflicts in any of this?

Of course, we’re simply speculating here.

One inventive notion, conceived during a period of human history when there were plenty of people living in close quarters, with multiple family groups interacting with one another as larger societal units (either towns, cities or city states), involved the idea of departed people being required to begin new lives – as either animals or new infant humans – once their Crossing Over was completed. This seems to almost have the feel of a compromise between the more primitive idea of the lingering, interactive dead, and the more modern dearly (and completely) departed dead, with these departed folks resurfacing within the family as a newly born child. Or possibly a newly purchased cow. Either way, the dead have departed in one sense, and yet they linger in another very real sense. But is there more to this curious combination than merely folks wanting their dead departed and yet actively present at the same time? Maybe so.

reply to post by awake_and_aware


It's not just a matter of seeing ghosts, but things moving by themselves, hearing someone walking when there's no one there etc. And trust me, the few times that I have seen a ghost, it certainly wasn't wishful thinking. It frightens me and I don't enjoy when unexplainable things happen.

Re v01i0

You wrote:

"When they began to tell you what you should encounter in your journey, what the things look like and so on, there's a stench of suggestion already included."

Sure, that's a closed system, where the initial assumptions automatically lead to given answers.

And the general agreement between us continues, so there's no need to comment more on your post.

Re v01i0

You wrote:

"When they began to tell you what you should encounter in your journey, what the things look like and so on, there's a stench of suggestion already included."

Sure, that's a closed system, where the initial assumptions automatically lead to given answers.

And the general agreement between us continues, so there's no need to comment more on your post.

i can sense/feel auras. not super well, not in color but sometimes as a small blurry area halo around a person. but mainly as this vibrating odd feeling that varies, from person to person and moment to moment. feeling this auras makes it possible to read a persons energy patterns. its as natural as reading body language and tone of voice. and i truly believe all people are capable of developing this ability. but i am not sure why it i more prominent in others. i think a lot of people do it subconsciously and just think of themselves as highly observant of human behavior.

and how this relates to spirits.
im skeptical to their existence, i think many ghost stories have non paranormal explanations. but sometimes, especially when i was younger.ill have this intense feeling like another person is in the room. like an aura with out a body, and.....like static. its really hard to explain but the patterns arent moving.
if i tried to focus on where this unsettling feeling was coming from sometimes my eyes would be drawn to a localized area. and its like you could almost see something there. like your mind wants to see something but you just cant.
which im pretty happy about. i dont wanna see things "manifest".
im already torn between the idea of having a spiritual awareness or a mental illness