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To China and the world - We do NOT apologize

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posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 07:37 PM
Thanks, I wasnt happy with the other thread. We dont owe China any apology, nor the rest of the world.

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 07:47 PM
reply to post by Misoir


Clearly you must be blind!

China oppressed it's people?! USA is trying to oppress the world!

China limits children? HA! USA is trying to reduce populus of the world!

National Security Study Memorandum 200

China kills its citizens? You truly have no eyes sir.

This Dana Priest article is interesting for the way it fleshes out the way the US is working in Yemen (primarily), Pakistan, and Somalia. But note this line, which she kind of buries in there.

As part of the operations, Obama approved a Dec. 24 strike against a compound where a U.S. citizen, Anwar al-Aulaqi, was thought to be meeting with other regional al-Qaeda leaders. Although he was not the focus of the strike and was not killed, he has since been added to a shortlist of U.S. citizens specifically targeted for killing or capture by the JSOC, military officials said. [my emphasis]

That is, somewhere there’s a list of Americans who, the President has determined, can be killed with no due process

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 07:47 PM

Originally posted by Misoir
So a member (whom shall remain nameless) creates a thread apologizing to an oppressive, tyrannical, totalitarian, mass murdering, dictatorial nation on behalf of a country and a people who love, defend, and celebrate liberty. No sir we darn sure do not apologize to China!

The international diplomatic version of that has recently happened.

Have you forgotten about Tiananmen Square event?

What happened at Tiananmen was appalling but it was not an isolated event. The Wall had come down and there followed a global uprising of the common man against the oppressions of their ruling classes. Gross infringement of civil liberties resulted and at Tiananmen the state murdered protestors. In the UK, the same period led to the exponential growth of surveilance culture.

Have you forgotten that they force limitations on the number of children a woman can have?

The one child policy has now been extended to a one dog policy. Anyone who owns a bitch that whelps a litter that is not sold within a fixed period face heavy fines and the bitch being destroyed.

Regimes restrict the free choice of the individual. Not everyone needs reminding of this, some are aware they live this reality every day.

Have you forgotten about the oppression, torture, and brutality against the Tibetan people?

Shock and Awe?

I will not apologize to China for one thing that the United States of America does. We have made mistakes in our path such as torture, suppression of equal rights, placed ethnic groups in camps, and torture terrorists. We are not and never have been a perfect nation but what has made the USA so special is that we find an answer to all of these crimes and we solve them without mass violence or martial law or following some leader to our deaths.

One of the mistakes America has made recently was to set the print run for a $1trillion. American protectionism spinning a twist on the Monroe Doctrine, effectively attempting to take complete control of global fiscal policy.

Your government resolves its mistakes without mass violence, or martial law by ensuring that the average American is sweating his balls off for the slave system. But make no mistake, Americans are as behaviourly indoctrinated as those who follow their leaders to their deaths.

The USA is a special nation for us always upholding our liberty, constitution, and freedom. People from across the world and even some here do not understand why Americans are so different. With ever adversity we are faced with we respond with force that is rooted in justice and backed by moral courage.

The reality of the situation is that the rest of the western world has not been subject to such strict editorial control of our education, media and all forms of public information systems. I am British and we are simply not as heavily censored as you are, still. When we see our media dumbing down, we know it as Americanisation and many people do not like it.

Every nation believes their position is the moral position rooted in justice. It is the impetous for conflict and disagreement turning to war.

The United States is great and it does not need a president running around the globe bowing to murderous kings and apologizing to tyrants. If China wants to challenge us it will be M.A.D. and they know it.

Your international relations people seem to disagree and have been diplomatically pro-active in the run up to G20.

The USA has given China little to no reason to bomb us.

No actual competitive growth, just a sudden make-believe extra $trillion that is expected to be accepted as legal tender. As I understand it, Chinese cultural norms and etiquette would take this as an insult.

Do you hear this China? We Americans have better things to worry about then what you think.

You cannot be sure of that.

I could list several things more important like making sure I don’t miss House, or getting some milk at the grocery tonight, or preparing for Thanksgiving. I know a celebration of values, peace, and family is beside you lot

Every day matters are important to everyone. Why are you not concerned about the family values of the Chinese peoples?

but in America morality is important and China is not.

Is that view typical in America? That not caring about another nation's interests is not immoral?

Go ahead and call me ignorant, sure I may not have said everything in the best possible way but I am sick and tired of this constant apology from people like Obama and the other anti-Americans.

I think you are misguided.
edit on 17/11/2010 by teapot because: edit

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 08:30 PM
reply to post by Misoir

Starred and flagged.

It turns my stomach to see some ignorant SOB apologize to the stinking Chinese dictatorship, when that person probably never wore the uniform of this country and wouldn't know sh*t about a damned thing if it hit him in the face.

I just cruised on by that original post by mr. numb-nuts - I figured it wasn't worth the time to refute that fool. But I had to stop on this one to say "Amen".

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 08:30 PM
I guess by the logic of some of the posts to this 'that we will never forget of forgive', Americans better watch out for Africa then for its plundering of its people for slaves?

Or I guess of an internal revolt of unforgiving descendents of former slaves?

Perhaps 'we' in Australia who NEVER NEVER had slaves (sure we had convict chain gangs, * gave our original peoples a very rough deal) but we never went so far as to enshrine in any legal government document that a man can 'own' another man) should now all re-evaluate our opinions of ALL Americans and forever and never forgive or forget that even your so called great founding fathers were slave owners???

Don't you know you win more friends with honey?

Be patient, give them time, The Brits placed a naval blockade on the African slave ports to'discourage the slave trade, but didn't head over to start bombarding American salve entry ports...

And given time, you saw the 'light', worked out what those words ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL meant in your founding document...

And don't be so high and mighty and self righteous that predjudice ended with the Civil War.... But then I guess you really did realise 'Something was blowing in the wind" as Martin Luther King was wandering about the country and your military in Vietnam need negro/ African Americans soldiers to fill out the depleting ranks of good old boy US warrior stock. And some of you more enlightened thinkers pondered what would happen if returning African Amercian soldiers with dead eye combat glaze were coming home to be treated like dirt.

Give them time, give them time what was China before Mao was able to even organise it as a single state? a hotch pot mix of warring fuedal warlords treating the peasantry like dirt.

he united them, gave them a national identity.

Are you people so ignorant of even your recent history that the Soviets and Chicoms were going at it hammer and tongs in border skirmishes... and had nukes pointing at each other.

You hear the word communism, and you see red, communism was just a tool to unite China as nothing else was available both Mao and Chiang Kai Chek attended the same military academy (Wu Poa military academy) taught by Sun Yat Sen, they then ran off we differing philiosphies on how to unite China and went for each others throats like only brother fighting each in anger do.

Give them time to 'emerge', give them time to absorb the greater world, sort through good ideas from bad, find systems for managing a population of over 1 billion whilst maintaining national hegemony (chinese people internally speak many different languages and identify themselves in many racial differnt groupings.)

Name one war of aggression started by an involving modern Chinese troops...come on one? show me one country modern crazy chinese communism has invaded?

Or shall we compare lists of how many places around the world there are where the United States thought sending in troops, invading another nation would further its national agenda?

Sure, they came screaming across the border once UN troops crossed the Yalu river from North Korea into China and pushed the entire UN forces back to the original demarcation line....but did they push any further?

Those were white guys with blue eys flying those MiG's over Korea, not ChiCom pilots

Sure in 1979 Vietnam and China had a bust up on the border, but that all that was, settling down into the new arrangement...The Vietnamese and Chinese have been having at each other for over a thousand years.

Sure, I agree, they are starting to 'play' now exporting missiles to Iran, supplying arms to Zimbabwe, sniffing around the Sudan... but what do the "Made in" labels say on most of the gear in Taiwan.

But I dare any American to tell me that their own government hasnt played the war by proxy game of supplying nations with Made in USA weaponry...where did those Israeli F-15's and F-16's come from?

Heck even here in Australia we have a few 'Made in USA F/A-18's although the majority were liscense manufactured locally.

Its like the distorted history you have been taught about the Cuban missile crisis...that somehow it was some plot to install missiles in your back door as a challange to your machismo.

Study your history. Kennedy insatlled Titan II's in Turkey right in the former Soviets Union front door with no possible reaction time to respond if they were launched. No other European NATO state was so insane as to allow US ICBM's to installed on their turf, so the militart industrila complex picked the weakest and poorest link in NATO.

As soon as the USAF set up the Turkish Titans, the Soviets ordered ICBM's to Cuba...

And don't believe that phony baloney version of history that Kurschev 'blinked first' he did not. He only gave the order to bring the ICBM's home after Kennedy ordered the Titan II's out of Turkey...

Don'tyou guys know your own history, self examine yourself.

Im mean us Aussies are famous for taking the mickey out of ourselves, I think you guys need to get back to getting those marijuana laws eased again, and all going and take a few puffs and relax a little inseatd of running around buying into your own military industrial complex crap that you need a 'bogeyman' to continue your massive military programmes whilst denying your own citizens such simple things as access to affordable health, better eduaction for your children etc etc.

tell you what fellas, us Aussies have stuck by you where others haven't...mateship IS our national creed and WE NEVER let a mate down.

But China is our major trading partner, which we trade with in surplus, Japan next again who we trade in surplus with, our newspapers have been full over the last couple of years of lots of 'what ifs' if China and the US decide to have a little go at each other, even if it is just maybe a little naval skirmish around Taiwan just to remind the United States Navy that they are a long way from home now, kicked out of Okinawa, access to the Phillipines gone and your closest resupply port is now Guam which is not much of a base.

We recently just did a joint naval exercise with China in which 'they' invited us to operate with them and give us a chance to check out their procedures (but we kept the faith, sent one of our German designed MEKO2000 Anzac Class frigates, and made sure they saw nothing of US origin) except well known weapons systems like evolved Sea Sparrow and Harpoons.)

Whats your record in this part of the world fellas?

One win (with two atom bombs), one draw, Korea, and one loss Vietnam? perhaps yoiu need to think about your percentages again in a crap shoot... ...

And no you want to take on the worlds largetst population who are quietly locking down non aggression treaties with its neighbours?

What is it with you guys?

Maybe the aliens have polluted the waters, and maybe you are under the influance of HAARP after all.

And dont take me for an anti american Australian, I have been battling away for you guys to everyone I know as the majority of our population becomes turned off to you...but then I have to...

My lady is an ex US citizen, now naturalised Australian, and ex USAF and I tell you every single bloody day she has to put up with ignorant Australians getting in her face blaming her for all the ills caused by and in the name of the United States, but then its ignorant Americans advocating war with China that give them food and ammunition.

I assure you fellas, kick it off with China, you'te on your own. and expect every single nation armed with nuclear weapons, even the French retargeting your nation to hold you in 'check' to stop you employing your nuclear option...

And don't think we in Australia won't be held hostage by those same people who will employ their nuclear deterent to keep you from employing yours on China...we're stuck, we supply most of them with uranium and will have the same gun held to our heads to stay out of it.

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 08:33 PM
I was hoping someone would start this thread. I will never apologize for being American.

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 08:46 PM
You're all acting daft..

Our societies are reflection of the human mentality. We lie, cheat and steal in our own service and we honestly believe that most of the time it is perfectly justified.. All nations do it.

If Australia had been the preeminent, military, economic, political and scientific power instead of the U.S. it would have crapped on the world just the same. When the U.S. no longer sits on the thrown the new king(s) will serve themselves too, at the expense of the rest of us.

Don't kid yourselves, none of your nations are above behaving like humans do....

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 09:13 PM
I will never say sorry for america o what agreat nation yous are pearl harbour we didnt see that coming hitler we didnt see that coming vietnam we didnt see that coming. Do tell me then why was your nation involved then pearl habour if you didnt see whats been going on for the past couple of years was that the goverment new what was going to happen and let it do so that you could get in to the war and and make money. Vietnam yor country thaught hay we will go in there and sort it out well that was a big mistake another war which had f all to do with you. Hitler was funded by american banks on till yous seen what he was doing which what the american goverment wanted to do bring in the new world order but there was no way they where letting him do it. America built an greed suffering blood and money for what to say where american and where proud fool

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 11:00 PM

Originally posted by Misoir

Have you forgotten about Tiananmen Square event?

My Lai masascre, 347 - 507 dead,by US troops.

The USA is a special nation for us always upholding our liberty, constitution, and freedom.

This is a joke right?You have been progressively losing your freedoms over the years, maybe you just aren't aware of it.

Sorry to anyone who thinks we need to apologize to bloodthirsty dictators you don’t apologize for me

Perhaps your government shouldn't as they are lies anyway, your government has given many nations of the world reasons to bomb the # out of the real victims (you, the civilians) ranging from religious sociopathy, to vengeful acts.

Let's not forget your government have put people into positions of dictatorship too or atleast sponsored them, remember your government's butt-buddy Pinochet? Yeahh.. Very freedom-loving person that guy was,saving us all from the horridness of socialism! Causing the 'disappearances' of many. Remember Saddam? Yeahhhh, saving us all from the evil town of Halabja.

You're a bit naive, mate. Your country is just as cold and ruthless as China. Yours just does a better job of swiping the evidence under carpet. Both are superpowers, being superpowers, they tend to become decrepit, arrogant, and assholes. It seems to be a trend throughout history.
edit on 17-11-2010 by Somehumanbeing because: (no reason given)

edit on 17-11-2010 by Somehumanbeing because: (no reason given)

As to 'OmegaLogos' saying the US should apologise to Australia for getting us involved in their wars, that is bull#. I know soldiers, always talking about aching to get deployed to the ME "to kill #s". Don't pretend to know what you think is best for them. Those kids over there are having a ball running and gunning people and taliban.
edit on 17-11-2010 by Somehumanbeing because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 11:02 PM
Why worry about self loathing Americans? As they enjoy all that this system has given them these same people demand more and give nothing. Many though are just children not yet accustomed to their adult minds and critical thought.

I just saw China's total worth and its a fraction of ours with 4 times the workforce. Much of the hype about China is a myth and nothing more. Their poor still starve and live on under $2 per day in household income. Their Prisons are still used for forced labor camps to make products we buy. They still have no Free Press. They still go to Prison if they question the Dictatorships commands. They still limit what outsiders can see as they have much to hide from the world. Their sky is still a giant brown cloud of smog and it's still growing. Their rivers are still cesspools of sludge.

In fact if we were to buy China tomorrow, we would still have enough equity to equal China as it is now. We stop buying their products they go back into abject poverty over-night. They still steal our products as stealing has no meaning to a government who has no care for morality or honesty.

Those who fall for their false face they present to the world are still naive fools. China will never free it's people. Nobody in China will ever have even basic needs met unless they are favored by the Party. The fake Middle-Class they fabricated to show the world is still fake.

We have our problems with our Leaders as all countries will always have. Yet, we are still the best this world has to offer even with our flaws. No society of this size and scope has ever done so well and still maintained a free people. These little flash in the pans with tiny populations who manage to prosper in the short term with a Communist or Socialist systems are just aberrations.

The real question is, can China keeps it's population dumb enough to continue their allegiance to an Aristocracy who could care less about them? At what point does their more than half a billion citizens who are still suffering and starving revolt? They better keep them away from any sources of learning and information as they are doing now, or their Leaders won't last. Eventually their Armies will revolt also as they see the real world around them.

We still have control of our Leaders when push comes to shove due to our education and system. Right now is not yet as bad as the 1960's and we survived intact and came out better in the end. China will never see that. They will soon have to crack down on their own citizens to control them and it will be bloody I'm sure. Economies rise and fall and theirs is due for a crash. Hyper-Inflation is around the corner for them at any moment. Why do you think they are throwing out threats and propaganda. Their Elite are not making as much money and its starting to crumble. They built there house on a bad foundation and it's starting to fail under them. Not really to hard to understand if a person wants to. You can't have half your population living in abject poverty and prosper. You can't give part of your population riches and ignore the others like they are meaningless robots which is what their society is all about.

Ask yourselves what will happen when that $2 per day will only buy what a dollar used to just weeks ago. That is what is going on there now. Don't envy them, pity them. I can live well on half what I earn now by real world standards, can they? Of course not. Our poor are still among the worlds wealthiest. Only those who choose to here go without. It's a shame so many Americans choose to lie, those same Americans who think the system should just give them everything. If anything brings us down it will be those we are allowing to teach our children.

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 11:31 PM
Why does this thread sound a bit like someone cursing at his bank for having to pay back loans?

Also, it's not only about current GDP output, but also about GDP GROWTH. And in that respect, China/India are WAY stronger than the US. In fact, by 2050, China will have overtaken the US from incredible low level at the beginning of the last century.


No one's gonna argue that human right's wise they're bad...but it isn't as if everything's peachy in the US either (although it is obv better).

Also, regarding "oppression"...think about it next time a TSA employee cups your balls

edit on 17-11-2010 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 18 2010 @ 01:18 AM
reply to post by Misoir

Amen brother

posted on Nov, 18 2010 @ 01:25 AM
and this is the kind of trivial garbage that makes the front page of ATS *shakes head*

we apologize, we dont apologize........ here is the news flash NOBODY BUT SELF OBSESSED AMERICANS ACTUALLY CARE WHAT AMERICANS THINK. stop making stupid threads like this. the first one was pointless enough.

who cares if you apologize or not your nobody and nothing, the real people in power dont actually care what you think. this makes you worthless. the only power you have is the power to disobey. get that through your brain. voting is a farce and a joke. free will to choose your leaders is an illusion. its like everyday is primary school in here. how can you NOT understand the basic fundamentals of how modern society works? if you really want to promote your country and fly your flag enroll in the military and die for a corporation but leave this site free to discuss real issues. if you dont agree with the way things are being done go form a militia and get burned alive by the FBI.

either way stop talking about it and go do it.

posted on Nov, 18 2010 @ 01:36 AM
reply to post by Misoir

Misoir, you and I have had our differences in the past. But on this I proudly stand at your side. I was appalled to see that post the other day, and even more appalled to witness so many agree with the author of that post.

I attempted to interject my opinion, and even suggested that the OP just leave this country, rather than complain and apologize. If life is so bad here, and if you are that embarrassed by your home, just leave I said. Tis sentiment caught much pushback from the more liberal minded ATSers.

Thank you for providing the other side of the coin. We may not be a perfect nation, far from it, but we are a nation of people who would risk our lives to help another country. How many other nations out there do the same?

posted on Nov, 18 2010 @ 01:36 AM
reply to post by Misoir

Should have taken MacArthur's advice and taken care of them when we had the chance. It's going to be much messier now. And it is only a matter of time, IMO...

posted on Nov, 18 2010 @ 01:43 AM
I simply don't understand why America tries...I highly recommend isolationism for our overall treaty for the world.
keep every bit of our military home, stop all foreign aid programs, slap heavy tariffs on any imports, and focus on the building of the countries scientific progress...this trying to police half the world and hug the other half only accomplishes lots of death, loss of economy, and not a single nation even liking the states for the effort.

I can think of about 2 other nations total outside of the US I would go fight and die for...otherwise, the rest of the world can shove our crap if you want, or buy cheap knock offs from china...and otherwise, your on your own, good luck..come visit our cities

I think the world would celebrate if the US withdrew all power beyond simple economic trade from the world and let everyone sort it out..and frankly, if the rest of the world does erupt into wars...well, thats fine also, they will eventually need to sort out their differences through words or bombs standing in the middle will not solve the problem...just delay the solution.

Well done ops...another good thread. I dont give a rats arse what the chinese government thinks of the same way they dont give a rats arse what our government thinks of them.

I do however like the chinese people...but people get the government they deserve...if they wanted something different, they would rise up.

Pity I can't flag this thread more...and bigger pity is that anything antiamerican will always get far more notice than someone whom stands for their country. People love being self loathing..then blaming the phantom government for all their sins (not realizing the government we have here is simply a reflection of who we are as a people)

posted on Nov, 18 2010 @ 01:57 AM
My God! what a sad thread this is! This really shows how stupid and primitve we are. China has not asked for an apology!!!!! It was some poster's opinion, and you people turn it into something it is not!

Patriotism is a complete joke, and i can't wait for the day when people see the world for what it really is, and not look at another country as if they are not human. Patriotism is just another part of our primitive mind, and brings alot of problems into this world. I find it quite creepy the way Patriotism is in America. I don't know why, i just do.

America is not perfect. In fact, as a super power, they are most prob the most brutal in the world. They have done truely horrible things. They have tried to control the world, they have invaded countries for oil, and saying BS why they invaded the country. Yes, they have seemed untouchable. But things are catching up with them now, and alot of people are begining to open their eyes.

Yes, China has done some terrible things too, but i see so much BS about China, its annoying! I have lived in China (beijing) and travelled China, and while i have seen some places that are poor, its not as bad as people make out on here.

My wife is Chinese. She lived near the boarders of north Korea and Russia. My wifes family were considerd poor. Her dad worked in the mines, and have to retire early because of a bad back. While poor, they were never starving. They always had food, good education, and a roof over their heads. My wife has been browsing through this thread, and while she knows that their are problems in China that needs sorting, she can see alot of BS being posted too!

All this crap about America is great! best place in the world stuff. Why can't people open there eyes and see the bigger picture. While people around the world have this way of thinking, these problems will always be here, and we will always be on a brink of a war.

posted on Nov, 18 2010 @ 02:00 AM
reply to post by Misoir
You are a sad individual. Yes China has caused problems, but not in as many countries as America has. Pathetic how your are so proud of the genocide/crimes against humanity your country has caused. Don't believe me look at the death toll from the illegal war on Iraq.

posted on Nov, 18 2010 @ 02:07 AM
Wow, one person represents a whole nation now?
I don't think this thread should even have been created, this is just as bad as the Government trying to represent everyone in their country.
I personally don't mind if the US doesn't apologize.
Doesn't make anyone else look bad apart from themselves.


posted on Nov, 18 2010 @ 02:10 AM
I would apologize anyway, because eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind.

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