China has found something shocking on the Moon?

reply to post by Sanjaya



Sorry, Sanjaya.

That photo was discussed a while back, here.

The manipulation done was NOT by NASA. It was someone (forget her name, someone will remember, and the thread title)....she took some Cassini photos of Saturn's moons, and composited them to make a pretty image.

The "controversy" arose because whomever is in charge of uploading the NASA "Picture of the Day" saw it, and used it, because she thought it looked nice.

It in no way was ever represented, by NASA, as a "factual" or "realistic" image.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I visited the NASM here in D.C. last month, a beautiful exhibit of many photos from all over our Solar System opened recently (I hope it's permanent).

BUT, I can probably name quite a few ATS'ers who would have heartburn over them, because they HAVE been enhanced, to be more stunning. to "pop" in color, contrast, etc. They are factually correct, as to surface feature detail (when there is any), and not all needed any "popping"...I was telling my friend how they had to have been altered a bit, and he thought I was being the cynic!!!

What I pointed out was the possibility that, say, the photo of Saturn needed to be brightened (I'm guessing) because, at the distance from the Sun where it orbits, the natural sunlight is much, much dimmer than we're used to, here on Earth. I'm guessing ( since I've never actually been there.. ).

I'm saying that, IF you or I were there, looking with unaided eyes at the sunlit side of Saturn, through a spacecraft window....I don't think the ambient direct sunlight would be bright enough, for your eyes, to see the more vivid colors. (Just as in your bedroom, or other room, when dusk approaches and the light dims, the most vivid colors you see begin to fade, eventually we only see shades of gray, in dim or darkness).

reply to post by Arken


SIGH'´ Why nobody try China Daily..? the translation is wrong ..!

The same event 09-11-2010 from China Daily!

The relaying back of the pictures shows that the Chang'e-2 mission is a success," Zhang Jiahao, director of the lunar exploration center under the China National Space Administration, said.
Unveiled by Premier Wen Jiabao, the photos highlighted part of the moon's Sinus Iridium, or Bay of Rainbows, the area proposed for China's first unmanned soft-landing around 2013.
One of the pictures, taken on Oct 28 from 18.7 kilometers above the lunar surface, shows an 8-km-wide, 15.9-km-long area of the Bay of Rainbows.

It shows the surface is "quite flat" with craters and rocks of different sizes and a large hole with a 2-km diameter, a statement by the administration said.
The bay was formed by a massive impact billions of years ago, and is considered one of the moon's most beautiful landmarks.
But the bay is only one of the proposed spots for the unmanned landing attempt, as Chang'e-2 has also taken images of other possible landing areas, said Yan Jun, chief scientist of China's lunar exploration project.

"The exact spot for a soft-landing has not been decided yet," he said.

The Chang'e-2 probe was launched on Oct 1 and went into orbit eight days later. It first circled the moon at a distance of 100 km, and then dropped into orbit about 15 km above the lunar surface. After taking the images it will return to a 100-km orbit to conduct a study of the lunar surface.
The probe was designed to test technology for Chang'e-3, which will land on the lunar surface and release a moon rover around 2013.
The lunar pictures have a resolution of up to 1.3 meters, much clearer than images taken by its predecessor Chang'e-1, with a resolution of 120 meters.
"With such a high resolution, it means that from the pictures you can tell a pit of 4 meters in diameter on the moon or a rock with a diameter of 3 meters," Yan said.

reply to post by expat2368

Explanation: Starred!

I dont have a private space ship like zorgon alluded to but I do have Google Earth app and here is what I came up with after doing a bit of research etc...

1stly for those who dont have it already, then here...

www.google.com...

2ndly ...

Clementine_(spacecraft) [wiki]

On January 25, 1994, Clementine was launched from Space Launch Complex 4 West at Vandenberg Air Force Base, California using a Titan II launch vehicle. The mission had two phases. After two Earth flybys, lunar insertion was achieved approximately one month after launch. Lunar mapping took place over approximately two months, in two parts. The first part consisted of a five hour elliptical polar orbit with a periapsis of about 400 km at 30 degrees south latitude and an apoapsis of 8300 km. Each orbit consisted of an 80 minute lunar mapping phase near periapsis and 139 minutes of downlink at apoapsis.

After one month of mapping the orbit was rotated to a periapsis at 30 degrees north latitude, where it remained for one more month. This allowed global imaging and altimetry coverage from 60° south to 60° north, over a total of 300 orbits.

3rdly ... Periapsis [freedictionary]

periapsis (pr-pss)
Plural periapsides (pr-ps-dz)
The point at which an orbiting object is closest to the body it is orbiting. This point is sometimes given a name that is specific to the body being orbited. For example, the periapsis of an object orbiting Earth is its perigee (from gaia, the Greek word for Earth), and the periapsis of an object orbiting the Sun is its perihelion (from hlios, the Greek word for Sun). According to Kepler's laws of planetary motion, an object is at its greatest velocity at the periapsis. Compare apoapsis.

The American Heritage® Science Dictionary Copyright © 2005 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

4th So now I know I must be oriented in GE with the Moon map function enabled with North at top of the screen [polar orbit] with a 90 degree inclination [facing directly downwards] to the luna surface at an approximate height of 400km whist in the southern hemisphere [specifically at 30 degrees south of the luna equator (i.e. periapsis of Clementine spacecraft) ] when observing Zeeman Crater [which I sourced in a roundabout way from james404 post here! [this thread page 7 ATS] which is the apparent location of the US Navy Clementine picture anomaly that is apart of the ongoing discussion and is the object about whose size you inquired about and I hope these pictures I produced help answer that question etc!

90 degree inclination at 400km altitude GE screen grab/capture [North towards top of pic]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/625837289774.jpg[/atsimg]

Now cropped...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/570fa600931e.jpg[/atsimg]

And edited to try to artificially reproduce the anomaly in mspaint.exe...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/97edd0134292.jpg[/atsimg]

And edited again in mspiant.exe to try cover up [poorly] the original edit to artificially reproduce the anomaly...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/a627308c83c8.jpg[/atsimg]

How we might see Zeeman Crater from polar orbit at 80km altitude whilst facing north...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/895e08682d72.jpg[/atsimg]

How we might see Zeeman Crater from polar orbit at 80km altitude whilst facing south...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/4365f5f61436.jpg[/atsimg]

Looking NW at 45 degree inclination at 16km altitude [approx] and with GE ruler line elements added...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/fd03eff19d94.jpg[/atsimg]



Personal Disclosure: I hope that helps!

P.S. Note all pictures provided by me were edited by me after being screen grabbed and before being uploaded to ATS!

Originally posted by ajax_andy
Please can you give me some background info on the pic? I've never seen it before and its a remarkable photo!!!

Well not much background really..

It was taken by the NAVY satellite Clementine in 1994 (NOT NASA )
You can find it yourself at the NRL browser
www.nrl.navy.mil...
coords Lat 64 ~ Long 265

Unfortunately the browser is not that user friendly... takes a bit of getting used to

Originally posted by boondock-saint
Now, can anybody speculate as to the
size of that thingy that's brushed out???

Yeah I could but would take some time. I would need to ID that crater then remember what the pixel resolution was on that image. Would take some time. Haven't worked with the old Clementine stuff for years. Someone could look up the coords on the Lunar Orbiter map though and get a crater name

Lat 64 ~ Long 265

been to china ages ago, picked up some basics of the language, never learned to read though.
what i learned though; they are writing/speaking in pictures.

the word for cinema/movies translates somethin like: "moving light and shadow"
a computer: "brain with electricity" or "electrical brain"

if i had to translate "rice bird" i would think:

bird - flying, wings ?
rice - (jiangshi) litterally "stiff corpse" but also "zombie"

birds in chinese mythology are often the "messengers" sending informations.
often you see birds a a sign of unity, as in man/woman
and there is another myth, you use to scare lil kids; sort of: if you don't do your homework, the birds are gonna catch you.

reply to post by weedwhacker


Thank you for your reply Weedwhacker , I understand your point of view and sorry about mentioning the same photo already discussed (didn't knew about that). But you must agree they could be a bit more careful on their "official websites" , that way they would save a lot of excuses and discussion , unless they are doing it with that specific intention.

Another weird example this time from SOHO note the time stamp.


Peace

P.S. (the name is Emily Lakdawalla)

Originally posted by wavemaker
The laugh is on you. lol

Not really no...

Besides the term 'bird' is even used by our pilots to refer to a plane or a spacecraft

But since that site is basicly more like a tabloid... and there is nothing odd posted on the CSNA website I would say this will go nowhere.

But WHY do they have to plaster Chinese writing over all the images? And why can we only get a small version of them?

Oh well...

Originally posted by Havick007
Also if you check out my post above you will see the actual pictures from the OP article... that greyscale has been photoshopped OMG.... yeah with the Chinese logo and writing ha

Well those you posted are the press release versions..

The originals are here
www.cnsa.gov.cn...

But you cannot get a high res copy... at least not that I can find on the English page

Originally posted by Arken
The word "Pigeon" translate " bird" in the chinese article. EXIST.
It is a term coined to describe detection of ANOMALIES on Lunar soil.

From James Oberg web site www.jamesoberg.com...

"Moon Pigeon" is a term coined by MSC structural engineers to describe unexpected objects seen in operational photography

AWESOME... good ole Jim I need to keep that handy

reply to post by Tholidor


hi guys I have been following ATS for more than a year now, but never felt the urge to sign in
But this time I couldnt resist and help out.

I am Chinese born in Europe.
I speak Chinese and am currently learning to write Chinese too.

I can help a bit with understanding the article.

They didn`t find a ricebird on the moon, whatever that is.
They found something unbelievable there just as NASA did.
the bird is some kind of typo i guess. Nothing to do with birds.
Chinese is a complicated language with all our stripes and dots.
If you forget to write 1 part it has a complete different meaning.

Edit: info on the ricebird Taken straight from the article: 不可思议的东西鸟 (鸟 stands for bird but 吗 means "what")
Its a very weird sentence anyway: unbelievable things bird.... couldn`t be right!
but its a strange typo anyway. i will try asking my teacher for more info!!!

Also the end of the article says that some people in the state want disclosure but a lot of powerful people are opposed to that.

Hopefully I can help out again!
Take care everyone and keep us informed about our world!

I have tried looking over at forums over this. Not much information beside queries over this article.

But note, that this article is not limited to this site link given in OP post but rather all over the chinese web forums. I think we would have to revisit this after a while given the nature of this "news". After all, it do take time for things to leak even if there are things to be uncovered. Not as if there would be a sudden disclosure over this.

Originally posted by DJW001
The point is that there have been rumors in China that CNSA has been altering or faking their photos, just as there are rumors that NASA does the same thing. The article in the OP seems to be alluding to this.

yes that old ChangE-1 image was covered here at ATS... The image was so close to the Clementine image... exact location, angle etc... that within hours of the release the web screamed FAKE.

The Chinese did an immediate press release saying.. no it's not fake... see the new crater?

Well Lakdawalla did a study on it and found the new crater was created by an error in overlapping sections.

It caused so much embarrassment we never heard anything else from ChangeE-1 until this new launch.

I can pull the thread if anyone is interested.. I have it on my site anyway

I like how the smallest bit of info can completely throw you guys off lol.. The reason China unveiled the image "with no bird in it" is because that is where they will be landing their first manned mission.. The media, which China's gov. controls, was using the old NAVY image as an example of a cover-up.. They never said the pictures they released to the public had something amazing in them. They simply said they found something that NASA had already discovered. Also, just because you can see an image today that has no smudges really means nothing.. the NAVY and NASA also decide what gets covered up on google earth. Look up some of the barracks and bases that have been covered up on google earth the past few years. You wont see smudges because they aren't that dumb these days lol. They cut images of terrain that match the surrounding area and and cover things up.

Originally posted by weedwhacker
They don't.

Prove it... just because YOU say it ain't so doesn't make it so

Kinda cruel, if you ask me. It's like taunting a child for believing in Santa Claus. Cruel.

NASA believes in Santa Claus They say so in many transcripts... Either that or its a term they use for UFO

Originally posted by weedwhacker
I know of at least an Eagle, and a Falcon also up there.

Those are just rumors

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by blaenau2000

 

Why does NASA airbrush anything out?

They don't.

It is yet another Internet Urban Myth, and some people get their jollies by repeating it, and watching the really gullible people wet their pants getting excited about it.

Kinda cruel, if you ask me. It's like taunting a child for believing in Santa Claus. Cruel.

WHAT there's NO SANTA CLAUS Yes its amazing thanks to the internet we can see how gullible people are before that it was books, newpapers,radio and TV and lets not forget the biggest of them all RELIGION!

What is this in this image?

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/86dc1da4e09a.jpg[/atsimg]

Originally posted by weedwhacker
They didn't "airbrush out" anything in the Earth pics, not in the way it is constantly suggested by those who seem to fear NASA for some reason.

Well in the old days 'airbrush' was not an option. If they HAD an airbrush, they would be able to do a better job than a fuzzy blob over the image

They did it the old fashioned way...







And when they had it the way they wanted you to see it... they took a new photo

Colors were enhanced, yes, to make it "prettier"....

Okay So we can put you down as "NASA edits photos to make them pretty"

Nice to see you are finally getting it

I mean, even nature documentaries got slammed just a few months ago, because they enhance the sound tracks...it might be marketing, art and a few other things, but NOT intentional attempts at deceit.......

Grasping at straws now, eh? Since when is marketing not an " intentional attempt at deceit"

The photo linked below is ridiculous, to say the least. But, I share it because, as ridiculous as it is, so is the image being shared by NASA. Why would they put this 'smudged' picture out there with no explanations? Do they just sit and revel at our speculations of what it could be? Maybe this is the only way for them to maintain the publics interest in space? To me, it's just annoying.

Do you think they photographed the american moon lading sites and found nothing ? is that why they are so happy, lol,